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Wallstreetjournal-Felix incident.

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)
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Ostroeuropa
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Wallstreetjournal-Felix incident.

Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:28 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTCDfE_sKnM
source (10:06)
(Read or watch to the end. It's interesting, I promise.)

Okay, so a journalist from the wall street journal Ben Fritz
( https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ben+f ... sQ_AUIBygC )
He's the Professor Chaos butters with all the tweets showing racist jokes.


Anyway, he and two of his colleagues, acting on behalf of the wallstreetjournal, decided to write a progressive hysteria article calling pewdiepie a nazi because he told some racist jokes and how this was a sign of blah blah blah blah blah you get the idea, usual nonsense.

With me so far?
That wasn't enough of an eye-roll.

Before he released it, he and two of his co-workers secretly contacted all the businesses, sponsors, and affiliates of pewdiepie, as well as youtube itself, and pressured them to disassociate from him, demonitize his channel, etc.
They did this before reaching out to Pewdiepie for comment, or alterting him that they were writing the article. They were actively trying to generate news. (Remember, Ben Fritz also tells racist jokes on twitter. Keep that in mind. It casts the entire thing as it actually is, the whole virtue signalling progressive hysteria piece they were preparing was just an excuse to generate clicks and controversy, and they actively set out to ruin a mans lifes work in order to make it a bigger headline.)

None of pewdiepies business associates were prepared to ditch him despite the upcoming article, except disney. (Which, coincidentally, Ben Fritz's girlfriend works at.)

So the WSJ publishes it's thing. I'm not linking to it.
Following this, the rest of the barely-still-living media drones on nazinanzianzinainzianainzin because it's all they can muster the energy to do at this point.

Pewdiepie releases his first video (Not up there, that's the second) going over the incident, talking about how his respect for the media has declned the longer he paid attention, yada yada, we all know this, the media is shit these days. He apologizes for the racist jokes, says he thinks it's a learning experience doing comedy, and he's happy to continue improving. The video is maybe 1/3rd apology to any fans of his he may have upset, and 2/3rds mocking the media and some of their stupider articles.

Following this, Fritz and his coworkers re-emerges and starts once again with his colleagues trying to get businesses to distance themselves.

It's around this time, Pewdiepies fans discover fritz's racist jokes, the rest of the media is still droning on about nazis and bitching that his apology didn't count because he was meaaaaannn to the media, so he can't be sincere.

This time, after being contacted by Wallstreetjournalists again, Pewdiepies business associates let him know that, hey, they're trying to get us to ditch you behind your back. They did it before too.

The second video gets released.
In it, he quotes the journalistic ethics charter or whatever at the wallstreetjournal, and mocks them some more.
He notes they've been actively agitating to destroy his channel, and notes since Fritz the racist works there, and apparently that's how the game is played, maybe they should go after WSJ's sponsors and business associates.

So he puts the list up.
For his 54,000,000 fans to see.

Fritz and the other two are currently AWOL. I expect they'll have to keep their head down, or Fritz might be fired to maintain the ability of WSJ to have a progressive sneer. (I don't buy it. It's a farce. It's a farce for all these rags).

Notably, as pewdiepie points out, nothing they did to him actually hurt him. He has lots of money, doens't need disney, and as soon as people saw SJWs were attacking him, he got a spike in the number of subscribers.
He pointed out the media is dying, has no idea what its doing, and nobody trusts them.

So.

This incident.
It kind of summarizes a lot of stuff wrong with the media in my opinion. What'll be interesting is whether the blatantly unethical practices the WSJ engaged in here will be commented on by the other press.
PewDiePie was too big a fish for them. But they've probably done this before, even though part of the ethics they swear to uphold is to minimize harm.

My bet?
If they don't, it's normal for them to just ignore journalistic ethics and ruin an individual just so they can report on it.
Further, the hypocrisy of Fritz and what he did is worth a look at for what it says about virtue signalling, and progressive hysteria articles.

Notably, pewdiepie also linked at the bottom of his second video to a few political commentators on youtube who are anti mainstream media. (Netting them potentially millions of new subscribers.)

Also, shit.
54,000,000 people might eventually see that, and decide to have a crack at getting the WSJ's businesses to ditch them, presumably over poor ethics.
Last edited by Ostroeuropa on Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:42 am, edited 4 times in total.
Ostro.MOV

There is an out of control trolley speeding towards Jeremy Bentham, who is tied to the track. You can pull the lever to cause the trolley to switch tracks, but on the other track is Immanuel Kant. Bentham is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Critique of Pure Reason. Kant is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Principles of Moral Legislation. Both men are shouting at you that they have recently started to reconsider their ethical stances.

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The Interstellar Federation
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Postby The Interstellar Federation » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:32 am

I laughed as I saw the ignorance of the writer.
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Ostroeuropa
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Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:36 am

The Interstellar Federation wrote:I laughed as I saw the ignorance of the writer.


Hm?
Ostro.MOV

There is an out of control trolley speeding towards Jeremy Bentham, who is tied to the track. You can pull the lever to cause the trolley to switch tracks, but on the other track is Immanuel Kant. Bentham is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Critique of Pure Reason. Kant is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Principles of Moral Legislation. Both men are shouting at you that they have recently started to reconsider their ethical stances.

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Postby San Marlindo » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:44 am

If I liked this YouTube guy's content, then I'd keep watching it regardless of what else he did.

Same reason I would keep watching the World Cup and supporting my preferred national team even if they're involved in a major corruption scandal.

Same reason I still watched Tonya Harding back in the day - because I could appreciate her talent - regardless of her horrific sportsmanship and complicity in assaulting her #1 rival.

Judging from the man's popularity, I would hazard a guess that the majority of his fan base isn't going to drop him because he made a few racist comments. If they once found him entertaining for other reasons, they'll continue to do so.

Very few people get turned off to their favorite comedians, athletes, and actors for making the occasional, perfectly human mistake.
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Ostroeuropa
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Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:47 am

San Marlindo wrote:If I liked this YouTube guy's content, then I'd keep watching it regardless of what else he did.

Same reason I would keep watching the World Cup and supporting my preferred national team even if they're involved in a major corruption scandal.

Same reason I still watched Tonya Harding back in the day - because I could appreciate her talent - regardless of her horrific sportsmanship and complicity in assaulting her #1 rival.

Judging from the man's popularity, I would hazard a guess that the majority of his fan base isn't going to drop him because he made a few racist comments. If they once found him entertaining for other reasons, they'll continue to do so.

Very few people get turned off to their favorite comedians, athletes, and actors for making the occasional, perfectly human mistake.


I don't think the racist jokes are what's important about any of this tbh.
They seem a moot point.
What's interesting is that the media is starting to really get into trouble lately, and they're getting more reckless, as well as the fact this incident is highly embarrassing for the WSJ in my opinion, they look like hacks.
What'll be interesting to see as the events continue is how many of pewdiepies fans take up his suggestion they go after the wall street journals revenue stream.
I know the usual suspects elsewhere are on board. When this video hit, Gamergate, the donald, etc, were well up for it.

It also reveals yet another progressive journalist who didn't actually have any principles in the end, and just wanted to be nasty to people and pretend it was morality.
Last edited by Ostroeuropa on Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:51 am, edited 2 times in total.
Ostro.MOV

There is an out of control trolley speeding towards Jeremy Bentham, who is tied to the track. You can pull the lever to cause the trolley to switch tracks, but on the other track is Immanuel Kant. Bentham is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Critique of Pure Reason. Kant is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Principles of Moral Legislation. Both men are shouting at you that they have recently started to reconsider their ethical stances.

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San Marlindo
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Postby San Marlindo » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:50 am

Ostroeuropa wrote:
San Marlindo wrote:If I liked this YouTube guy's content, then I'd keep watching it regardless of what else he did.

Same reason I would keep watching the World Cup and supporting my preferred national team even if they're involved in a major corruption scandal.

Same reason I still watched Tonya Harding back in the day - because I could appreciate her talent - regardless of her horrific sportsmanship and complicity in assaulting her #1 rival.

Judging from the man's popularity, I would hazard a guess that the majority of his fan base isn't going to drop him because he made a few racist comments. If they once found him entertaining for other reasons, they'll continue to do so.

Very few people get turned off to their favorite comedians, athletes, and actors for making the occasional, perfectly human mistake.


I don't think the racist jokes are what's important about any of this tbh.
They seem a moot point.


I understand that your OP focuses explicitly on the angle of media over-sensationalism, and what is perceived as an unjust crusade against one individual due to that.

However: none of this would've happened if it wasn't for the jokes in question being made.
Last edited by San Marlindo on Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:52 am

San Marlindo wrote:
Ostroeuropa wrote:
I don't think the racist jokes are what's important about any of this tbh.
They seem a moot point.


I understand that your OP focuses explicitly on the angle of media over-sensationalism, and what is perceived as an unjust crusade against one individual due to that.

However: none of this would've happened if it wasn't for the jokes in question being made.


Fair enough. I agree with you by the way.
Ostro.MOV

There is an out of control trolley speeding towards Jeremy Bentham, who is tied to the track. You can pull the lever to cause the trolley to switch tracks, but on the other track is Immanuel Kant. Bentham is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Critique of Pure Reason. Kant is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Principles of Moral Legislation. Both men are shouting at you that they have recently started to reconsider their ethical stances.

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Postby Bulgar Rouge » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:53 am

This one incident just proves that they've long crossed the line and have done something no media should ever do - and that is to be proactive and set up events they can report. We live in an era of ubiquitous access to information and verification tools, it's about time the centralised media fossils like the WSJ or the NYT die off. They've become toxic.

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Postby The Interstellar Federation » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:56 am

Ostroeuropa wrote:
The Interstellar Federation wrote:I laughed as I saw the ignorance of the writer.


Hm?


The video you linked where Pewds at the start reads a Wall Street Journal article.
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Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:01 am

The Interstellar Federation wrote:
Ostroeuropa wrote:
Hm?


The video you linked where Pewds at the start reads a Wall Street Journal article.


Ahh, yeh. I've become a fan i'll admit. 6:45 - 7:15 with the ben fritz anti-semitism bit is hilarious.
Ostro.MOV

There is an out of control trolley speeding towards Jeremy Bentham, who is tied to the track. You can pull the lever to cause the trolley to switch tracks, but on the other track is Immanuel Kant. Bentham is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Critique of Pure Reason. Kant is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Principles of Moral Legislation. Both men are shouting at you that they have recently started to reconsider their ethical stances.

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Postby Herskerstad » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:18 am

WSJ completely tanked on this. Lost all credibility.
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Postby Agadar » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:18 am

San Marlindo wrote:
Ostroeuropa wrote:
I don't think the racist jokes are what's important about any of this tbh.
They seem a moot point.


I understand that your OP focuses explicitly on the angle of media over-sensationalism, and what is perceived as an unjust crusade against one individual due to that.

However: none of this would've happened if it wasn't for the jokes in question being made.


"He wouldn't have been robbed and murdered if he hadn't been seen having a wallet on him."

"She wouldn't have been dragged off and raped if she hadn't worn that dress."

The blame is not on the victim, but on those who unjustly targeted him.
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Postby San Marlindo » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:24 am

Agadar wrote:
San Marlindo wrote:
I understand that your OP focuses explicitly on the angle of media over-sensationalism, and what is perceived as an unjust crusade against one individual due to that.

However: none of this would've happened if it wasn't for the jokes in question being made.


"He wouldn't have been robbed and murdered if he hadn't been seen having a wallet on him."

"She wouldn't have been dragged off and raped if she hadn't worn that dress."

The blame is not on the victim, but on those who unjustly targeted him.


Not the point I was trying to make. Read my post previous to that one.

I was not blaming the YouTube commentator for what happened, merely explaining to Ostro why I chose to focus on that aspect of the case rather than his.
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Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:29 am

Agadar wrote:
San Marlindo wrote:
I understand that your OP focuses explicitly on the angle of media over-sensationalism, and what is perceived as an unjust crusade against one individual due to that.

However: none of this would've happened if it wasn't for the jokes in question being made.


"He wouldn't have been robbed and murdered if he hadn't been seen having a wallet on him."

"She wouldn't have been dragged off and raped if she hadn't worn that dress."

The blame is not on the victim, but on those who unjustly targeted him.


Sure, although Felix knew those jokes were of bad taste after he made them and he apologized for them once before. He actually understood that those jokes went a bit too far even for his channel, but he acknowledge it on his own and he admitted that when the anti-Semite spiel about the Fiverr video came out and managed to boot out a bunch of people who were selling services on Fiverr for delivering anti-Semite messaging.

So the problem is not "none of this would've happened", as people disagree with the content of the jokes being made, including some of his close associates, as innocent and stupid as they were. The problem was that the media did not focus on that, and rather went out of their way to paint him as an anti-Semite.

However, Marlindo is correct in pointing out that if he hadn't make those jokes, or at least kept up the videos after the Fiverr incident, none of this would have happened, considering even he thought the joke went too far. I understand why he kept it, because it wasn't a divisive video and it was generally agreed upon within his community that the video was hilarious, but he understood the joke went too far. None of his subs have dropped him, by the way. Instead, he gained subs following the incident, so he got free publicity. Now, you might think the media was nasty at him, and I agree, but he won revenue from it, even when these three guys hounded YouTube to also demonetize his channel (and failed at it).
Last edited by Soldati Senza Confini on Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:34 am

Soldati Senza Confini wrote:
Agadar wrote:
"He wouldn't have been robbed and murdered if he hadn't been seen having a wallet on him."

"She wouldn't have been dragged off and raped if she hadn't worn that dress."

The blame is not on the victim, but on those who unjustly targeted him.


Sure, although Felix knew those jokes were of bad taste after he made them and he apologized for them once before. He actually understood that those jokes went a bit too far even for his channel, but he acknowledge it on his own and he admitted that when the anti-Semite spiel about the Fiverr video came out and managed to boot out a bunch of people who were selling services on Fiverr for delivering anti-Semite messaging.

So the problem is not "none of this would've happened", as people disagree with the content of the jokes being made, including some of his close associates, as innocent and stupid as they were. The problem was that the media did not focus on that, and rather went out of their way to paint him as an anti-Semite.

However, Marlindo is correct in pointing out that if he hadn't make those jokes, or at least kept up the videos after the Fiverr incident, none of this would have happened, considering even he thought the joke went too far. I understand why he kept it, because it wasn't a divisive video and it was generally agreed upon within his community that the video was hilarious, but he understood the joke went too far. None of his subs have dropped him, by the way. Instead, he gained subs following the incident, so he got free publicity. Now, you might think the media was nasty at him, and I agree, but he won revenue from it, even when these three guys hounded YouTube to also demonetize his channel (and failed at it).


The way he handled the incident has been pretty classy tbh, It's not something you see often. I've seen a lot of people decide to subscribe based on these two videos. I did too :p
Last edited by Ostroeuropa on Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
Ostro.MOV

There is an out of control trolley speeding towards Jeremy Bentham, who is tied to the track. You can pull the lever to cause the trolley to switch tracks, but on the other track is Immanuel Kant. Bentham is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Critique of Pure Reason. Kant is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Principles of Moral Legislation. Both men are shouting at you that they have recently started to reconsider their ethical stances.

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Postby Agadar » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:35 am

San Marlindo wrote:
Agadar wrote:
"He wouldn't have been robbed and murdered if he hadn't been seen having a wallet on him."

"She wouldn't have been dragged off and raped if she hadn't worn that dress."

The blame is not on the victim, but on those who unjustly targeted him.


Not the point I was trying to make. Read my post previous to that one.

I was not blaming the YouTube commentator for what happened, merely explaining to Ostro why I chose to focus on that aspect of the case rather than his.


I'm on my phone, so flags/names are teeny tiny on my screen. Didn't recognize you as the author of that other post.

Anyhow, is there anyone here that is not a WSJ shill that finds their actions justified and wants to argue for their case? Without opposing voices, this thread is really just reddit an echo chamber.
Last edited by Agadar on Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:37 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:36 am

Agadar wrote:
San Marlindo wrote:
Not the point I was trying to make. Read my post previous to that one.

I was not blaming the YouTube commentator for what happened, merely explaining to Ostro why I chose to focus on that aspect of the case rather than his.


I'm on my phone, so flags/names are teeny tiny on my screen. Didn't recognize you as the author of that other post.

Anyhow, is there anyone here that is now a WSJ shill that finds their actions justified and wants.to argue for their case? Without opposing voices, this thread is really just reddit an echo chamber.


Is it happening?
The media finally has a 0% approval rating?
Ostro.MOV

There is an out of control trolley speeding towards Jeremy Bentham, who is tied to the track. You can pull the lever to cause the trolley to switch tracks, but on the other track is Immanuel Kant. Bentham is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Critique of Pure Reason. Kant is clutching the only copy in the universe of The Principles of Moral Legislation. Both men are shouting at you that they have recently started to reconsider their ethical stances.

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Postby Agadar » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:38 am

Ostroeuropa wrote:
Agadar wrote:
I'm on my phone, so flags/names are teeny tiny on my screen. Didn't recognize you as the author of that other post.

Anyhow, is there anyone here that is now a WSJ shill that finds their actions justified and wants.to argue for their case? Without opposing voices, this thread is really just reddit an echo chamber.


Is it happening?
The media finally has a 0% approval rating?


Yesh, the fyre rises.
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Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:40 am

I do have to disagree, somewhat, with the assertion that the WSJ has lost credibility over this, though.

While the WSJ has some internal cleanup to do, I don't consider them too far out there in regards of journalistic integrity. I do think these three journalists did have their credibility destroyed, though, over a clickbait article.

The WSJ has a tech section where those three people work on, so I wouldn't put ALL of WSJ under the same umbrella as the tech section of WSJ. Tech journalists are hardly insiders about technology, which is a gripe I've had with how traditional media covers technology for a long while now, including emerging media which makes their field more dynamic like YouTube. To paraphrase Felix, the traditional media doesn't understand the emerging media market.
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Postby Atlanticatia » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:43 am

WSJ didn't lose credibility over this - their reporting was factual. It is also understandable that a brand wouldn't want to be associated with controversy. That's kind of how corporate endorsements work? If a person has a chance of offending paying customers, they're going to get dropped. It's not 'PC culture' or 'virtue signalling'.
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Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:44 am

Ostroeuropa wrote:
Soldati Senza Confini wrote:
Sure, although Felix knew those jokes were of bad taste after he made them and he apologized for them once before. He actually understood that those jokes went a bit too far even for his channel, but he acknowledge it on his own and he admitted that when the anti-Semite spiel about the Fiverr video came out and managed to boot out a bunch of people who were selling services on Fiverr for delivering anti-Semite messaging.

So the problem is not "none of this would've happened", as people disagree with the content of the jokes being made, including some of his close associates, as innocent and stupid as they were. The problem was that the media did not focus on that, and rather went out of their way to paint him as an anti-Semite.

However, Marlindo is correct in pointing out that if he hadn't make those jokes, or at least kept up the videos after the Fiverr incident, none of this would have happened, considering even he thought the joke went too far. I understand why he kept it, because it wasn't a divisive video and it was generally agreed upon within his community that the video was hilarious, but he understood the joke went too far. None of his subs have dropped him, by the way. Instead, he gained subs following the incident, so he got free publicity. Now, you might think the media was nasty at him, and I agree, but he won revenue from it, even when these three guys hounded YouTube to also demonetize his channel (and failed at it).


The way he handled the incident has been pretty classy tbh, It's not something you see often. I've seen a lot of people decide to subscribe based on these two videos. I did too :p


Oh the way he handled it was the most sportman-like way he could have handled it, so kudos to him for that.

I've liked his videos since at least last year when he became more of an angry/sarcastic-y YouTuber as his humor. I actually like what he has done with the direction of his channel since last year. I thought it was a bit dumb before then because it was like "you can't be this derpy all the time. Fuck".
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Tekania wrote:Welcome to NSG, where informed opinions get to bump-heads with ignorant ideology under the pretense of an equal footing.

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Postby Uiiop » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:46 am

I can't make an actual judgement on all this until i actually see the article(Past the paywall i mean) in question but....
In terms of the videos themselves even the maker concedes they were in poor taste or at least(And perhaps more accurately) done poorly. So all what's left is the how the media allegedly handled it.
Though from what remains in front of the pay that article doesn't actually seem to say what OP says it is. All it talks about is imagery. Nothing yet about his intentions or calling him a nazi personally. Neither is actually wanting him to get kicked out over. They could get their feelings of importance or whatever you call what they might have felt from just him issuing a apology.
It's not like the paywall doesn't reveal so all this crap isn't final.
Now this is just my subjective experience but most of what i saw from media was mostly "Even if you're not a anti-Semitic your jokes are dumb and you should recognize" The thing my perspective is probably different than his and until some statistics actually appears it's probably no more provable than his. After all I'm sure stupid ass news talking about yourself are probably more memorable than neutral news i'd guess. Still the different experiences i think gives a better answer on the doubts other than "You're mean to me therefore you must be lying" when someone sees themselves targeted for something they haven't perceived them or do it's understandable though not necessarily wrong right to think the ones doing it are making it up.
I believe him but that doesn't mean the other side is that simple.
Last edited by Uiiop on Sat Feb 25, 2017 3:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:47 am

Atlanticatia wrote:WSJ didn't lose credibility over this - their reporting was factual. It is also understandable that a brand wouldn't want to be associated with controversy. That's kind of how corporate endorsements work? If a person has a chance of offending paying customers, they're going to get dropped. It's not 'PC culture' or 'virtue signalling'.


Pretty much this. I know I'm personally getting sick of how everything gets spun as some sort of SJW feminist conspiracy to oppress white males.
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Soldati Senza Confini
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Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:47 am

Atlanticatia wrote:WSJ didn't lose credibility over this - their reporting was factual. It is also understandable that a brand wouldn't want to be associated with controversy. That's kind of how corporate endorsements work? If a person has a chance of offending paying customers, they're going to get dropped. It's not 'PC culture' or 'virtue signalling'.


Well, the WSJ didn't lose credibility. Fritz, on the other hand, has, as well as the other two reporters.

The problem is not with the fact that his reporting was factual, it was all the actions they took -- including going to Felix's sponsors first -- before publishing the story.

I don't know about you, but I have never heard of journalists having the ethical duty to ruin a man's reputation to his brands before something is published. In this, the three authors seemed to have dropped the ethical ball.
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Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:49 am

Atlanticatia wrote:WSJ didn't lose credibility over this - their reporting was factual. It is also understandable that a brand wouldn't want to be associated with controversy. That's kind of how corporate endorsements work? If a person has a chance of offending paying customers, they're going to get dropped. It's not 'PC culture' or 'virtue signalling'.


They didn't lose credibility over actively trying to generate news and agitate for business partners to drop him, and didn't reach out to him for comment before doing so?
Mmkkay.

I'd say yes, it's virtue signalling and pc culture to write the article in the first place when one of the writers themselves tells racist jokes and such.
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