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US General Election Thread IV: The Beginning of the End

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Who Won Tonight's Townhall in Your Opinion?

Hillary Clinton (Democrat)
81
61%
Donald Trump (Republican)
41
31%
Draw
11
8%
 
Total votes : 133

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The United Territories of Providence
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US General Election Thread IV: The Beginning of the End

Postby The United Territories of Providence » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:36 pm

Previous Poll Results...
Who started the Birther Issue, and What is your view?

Donald Trump/Trump Supporters/Right Wing Started It (I believe Barack Obama was born in Kenya): 1%
Donald Trump/Trump Supporters/Right Wing Started It (I believe Barack Obama was born in Hawaii): 50%
Hillary Clinton/Clinton Supporters/Left Wing Started It (I believe Barack Obama was born in Kenya): 5%
Hillary Clinton/Clinton Supporters/Left Wing Started It (I believe Barack Obama was born in Hawaii): 11%
Someone Else Started It (I believe Barack Obama was born in Kenya): 2%
Someone Else Started It (I believe Barack Obama was born in Hawaii): 12%
I don't Know Who Started It (I believe Barack Obama was born in Kenya): 2%
I don't Know Who Started It (I believe Barack Obama was born in Hawaii): 15%
Undecided/Other: 3%


Who Won Tonight's Debate In Your Opinion?

Hillary Clinton: 83%
Donald Trump: 17%


24 Hour Poll: Who Won Monday's Presidential Debate?

Hillary Clinton: 71%
Donald Trump: 15%
Draw: 14%


Ahead of the VP Debate: Which Vice Presidential Candidate has Most Helped the top of the ticket?

Mike Pence (Donald Trump): 31%
Tim Kaine (Hillary Clinton): 29%
Bill Weld (Gary Johnson): 19%
Ajamu Baraka (Jill Stein): 4%
None Have Added to the Ticket: 14%
All Have Added to their Respective Tickets Equally: 3%


SNAP POLL: Who Won Tonight's Vice Presidential Debate?

Tim Kaine: 39%
Mike Pence: 24%
There Was No Clear Winner: 36%


Is There Enough Time Left in The Campaign For Donald Trump to Make a Comeback and Win the Election?

Yes, there's still time for Trump: 38%
No, Trump is too far behind: 48%
I Don't Know: 12%
Other: 2%


We Have, At Long Last...Entered the Home Stretch of The General Election.

On the Republican side, Donald Trump has accepted the resignation of his former team in favor of Kellyanne Conway, noted Republican poster; and more controversially Steve Bannon, of Brietbart. Mr. Trump has double downed on the positions that lead him to victory in the primary, much to the chagrin of national republican figures. After a much discussed "softening" on immigration, it appears that Trump will not pivot but rather stick to his hard line positions. Trump's campaign has seen significant improvements since the convention, and by the anniversary of September 11th, he was only 3 points behind Clinton in the RCP polling average. However, it appears that even if Mr.Trump can grasp victory from the jaws of defeat, he will almost certainly have a Democratic Majority in the Senate. Mitch McConnell and the RNSC are combating what they expect to be heavy amounts of split ticket voting which could end up costing them their slim majority. Trump's running mate, Governor of Indiana Mike Pence, has been able to help Mr.Trump consolidate Republican support and donors in spite of their disagreements on several policies. Trump in the last several weeks has attempted outreach to communities of color, especially African Americans. He has received endorsements from some leaders of color and has given a number of speeches directly addressing the issues affecting people of color such as poverty. However he has not found much support from Latinos or African Americans, instead he has found increasing levels of support from a group of Americans who could be placed in the ideology of the Alt-Right. The Alt-right can be characterized by right-wing populism, xenophobia, misogyny, and white nationalism. This phenomenon has been deeply discussed by both the media and Trump's opponent.

On the Democratic side, Hillary Rodham Clinton's polling lead has been diminished in the weeks following the convention. Questions have been raised, re-raised, and re-re-raised about Clinton's use of a Private E-mail server as Secretary of State, possible pay-for-play within the Clinton Global Initiative, and her health (by Republicans). Clinton has begun holding press conferences, something that she had not done previously in the campaign, in order to combat claims that she is closed off. Clinton has reconciled with most of the Bernie Sanders constituency, however certainly not all. Some on the far left, including academics and activists, have insisted that she is a neoliberal who champions destructive policies and therefore shouldn't be President. These voters have gravitated towards the campaign of Jill Stein, who acknowledges that she intends to serve purely as a spoiler. However, not all is bad with the Clinton campaign. She has received a number of endorsements from Republicans, mostly members of the foreign policy community. Her support among women only continues to improve, especially white women who seem to be disturbed by the GOP campaign. Fundraising and Organization, Clinton has the clear edge, and she continues to out raise and outspend her opponent. Clinton's running mate, The Senator from Virginia Tim Kaine, has been campaigning in several red states. The Clinton campaign believes, that in spite of their current loses, they could make inroads into red states like Arizona, Georgia, and Missouri. Clinton has made it a point to attack her opponent now instead of his lack of political experience, but on his alleged fondness for Vladimir Putin and his connection to the so-called "Alt-Right".

It appears that neither candidate will reach 50% of the popular vote in November given their historically high negatives. America is in a rather unique position, which has allowed for 3rd party candidates like Gary Johnson of the Libertarian Party to seize on a unusually large block of disaffected voters. He is currently polling in the low teens, and if he reaches a certain threshold, he could be the first third party to enter a Presidential Debate since Ross Perot in 1992. Johnson and his running mate William Weld are both former Republican Governors of Heavily Democratic states, and their biggest challenge has been name recognition. Johnson has begun airing ads in a number of states but has seen little improvement in his poll standing. The effects of a gaffe about Aleppo made by a campaign was widely covered in the media, but the effects have yet to be seen. Dr. Jill Stein of the Green Party has also shown some growth in polling which places her in the low single digits. She has been trying to reach out to angry Bernie Sanders voters, presenting herself as the progressive alternative to Hillary Clinton. Stein has adopted a Ralph Nader type strategy, proclaiming that there are no safe states and she plans to campaign across America. Stein has been seen at protests at the Standing Rock Reservation to oppose a pipeline, and currently has a warrant for her arrest given her conduct. The Green Party, more so than the Libertarian party, has had trouble electing candidates to state or national level government. Jill Stein, and her running mate Ajamu Baraka, however, remain undeterred and have earned ballot status in most states. Many view both parties as fringe movements, many more see these outsiders as the answer to two party politics. Stein and Johnson were the nominees of their respective parties in 2012.

The major party nominees remain divisive figures who present two very different visions for the United States. Trump with his America First Policy and "Make America Great Again" philosophy vs Clinton's commitment to expanding on the legacy of President Obama while adopting more progressive reforms from Bernie Sanders. Hillary is the odds on favorite to win in November, but given the anger of the electorate and unpredictable nature of this cycle...nothing is guaranteed.

Personally, #ImWithHer. But if you're on the TrumpTrain or you're FeelingTheJohnson or you're feeling more like JillNotHill or something like BernieOrBust or NeverTrump or NeverHillary...well, that's democracy. And regardless, America will make a choice. As we inch closer to November, it becomes more apparent what is at stake in this watershed moment in our history.

The Tickets as of Today:

Donald Trump/ Mike Pence
Hillary Clinton/ Tim Kaine
Gary Johnson/ Bill Weld
Jill Stein/ Ajamu Baraka
(Updated With Semi-Regularity) Polls-Only Model, Electoral Odds according to Five Thirty Eight
A simpler, what-you-see-is-what-you-get version of the model. It assumes current polls reflect the best forecast for November, although with a lot of uncertainty. Polls-plus combines polls with an economic index; polls-only does not. Polls-plus will include a convention bounce adjustment; polls-only will not. Polls-plus starts by assuming that likely voter polls are better for Republicans; polls-only makes no such assumption. Both models revise this assumption as more data becomes available. Polls-plus subtracts points from third-party candidates early in the race, while polls-only does not. Both models employ a regression that is based on demographics and past voting history. But polls-only weights the regression less and places less emphasis on past voting history. Polls-only accounts for more uncertainty than polls-plus. Polls-plus and polls-only will tend to converge as the election approaches. The polls-only and polls-plus models discount polls taken just after the conventions, whereas the now-cast will work to quickly capture the convention bounce.

All versions of the model proceed through four major steps:

Step 1: Collect, weight and average polls.
Step 2: Adjust polls.
Step 3: Combine polls with demographic and (in the case of polls-plus) economic data.
Step 4: Account for uncertainty and simulate the election thousands of times.

Almost all state and national polls are included. If you don’t see a poll, it’s for one of these reasons:
The poll is very new, and we haven’t had a chance to add it yet. The poll was conducted directly on behalf of one of the presidential campaigns or an affiliated PAC or super PAC. The pollster is on FiveThirtyEight’s banned pollster list (pollsters we think may be faking data or engaging in other blatantly unethical conduct). Sometimes, there are multiple versions of a poll. For example, results are listed among both likely voters and registered voters. We prioritize polls as follows: likely voters > registered voters > all adults. If there are versions with and without Gary Johnson, we use the version with Johnson.

We calculate a weighted average in each state, where poll weights are based on three factors:

FiveThirtyEight’s pollster ratings, which are based on a firm’s track record and methodological standards. Sample size. A larger sample helps, but there are diminishing returns. Recency, which is less important early in the campaign and becomes more important later on. When a firm polls a state multiple times, the most recent poll gets more weight, but the older polls aren’t discarded entirely. The trend line adjustment (see Step 2) also helps to put more emphasis on recent data.

There are five adjustments, listed here in the order in which the model applies them. (The trend line and house effects adjustments are generally the most important ones.)

Likely voter adjustment
Convention bounce adjustment (in only the polls-plus model)
Omitted third-party candidate adjustment
Trend line adjustment
House effects adjustment

Instead of using one regression model, we take three strategies, which range from more simple to complex, and blend them together. The reason for this is that the more complex methods (especially strategy 3) are subject to potential overfitting. Hedging the complicated methods with simpler methods produces a better result.

Strategy 1: Pure PVI. This works by taking the national popular vote estimate and adding a state’s PVI to it. For example, if Clinton’s up 4 percentage points nationally, and a state’s PVI is Democrat +5 percent, she’d be projected to win the state by 9 percentage points.

Strategy 2: Regional regression. The adjusted polling average in each state is regressed on PVI and on dummy variables indicating which major region the state is in (Northeast, South, Midwest, West). Historically, this is the most effective approach. It can capture major changes in voting patterns from one election to the next, but doesn’t suffer from much overfitting. Regions are based on a combination of Census Bureau regions and political regions, as defined by FiveThirtyEight. Where they differ, a state is considered split between two regions. For example, Maryland is considered half Southern and half Northeastern by the model.

Strategy 3: Demographic regression. We regress the adjusted polling average in each state on PVI and several other variables, mostly related to race and religion, that are pertinent in this year’s election. (This includes the percentages of voters who are black, Hispanic, Asian, non-Christian, evangelical Christian, Mormon and college graduates. It also includes an economic index for each state, showing change over the last 12 months.)

The regression employs a technique designed to remove spurious variables. Still, it’s vulnerable to some degree of overfitting. That means the regional regression gets the most weight. Polls-only and now-cast do not use pure PVI, and instead use a 70/30 blend of strategies 2 and 3. So far, our regressions suggest that the electorate is slightly less polarized than in 2008 or 2012. Red states aren’t quite as red, and blue states aren’t quite as blue.

The adjusted polling average in each state is combined with the regression. The regression estimate gets more weight early in the race and when there’s less polling. The regression gets 100 percent of the weight when there’s no polling in a state. The polling average can get as much as 95 percent of the weight late in the race in a state with abundant polling. Polls-only and now-cast give slightly less weight to the regression than polls-plus does. As a final step, the regression is recalibrated so that the overall national popular vote is unchanged. If a candidate gains ground in one state because of the regression, the model will necessarily have her lose ground in another. In other words, the purpose of the regression models is not to say the country’s demographics inherently favor Trump or Clinton. Instead, it’s to create a more realistic distribution of the projected vote across each state, especially in states with limited polling. We don’t want to have Clinton winning Kansas based on a single poll there, for instance, while she’s badly losing Nebraska.

We usually run at least 20,000 simulations for each version of our model each day. That’s a lot, but it still produces a small amount of sampling error. You shouldn’t worry too much when win probabilities change by less than a percentage point. We simulate the vote by congressional district in Maine and Nebraska, which award one electoral vote to the winner of each district and two electoral votes statewide. Where available, district-level polling is used in these forecasts. If no candidate receives a majority of electoral votes, the model assigns the election to Trump half the time (because Republicans are very likely to control a majority of congressional delegations if the election is close) and to the winner of the popular vote the other half of the time

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Last edited by The United Territories of Providence on Sun Oct 09, 2016 9:36 pm, edited 30 times in total.
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Postby Socialist Nordia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:38 pm

Yay! New thread!
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Postby PaNTuXIa » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:39 pm

Can't Shill the Jill.
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Postby The Portland Territory » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:40 pm

On the Trump Train, choo choo bitches, we be charging through your towns
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AiliailiA
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Postby AiliailiA » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:48 pm

In Megathread III the poll with over a thousand responses had Jill Stein at 10%

So there's 104 Green supporters on General?? They don't seem to come out in support of their candidate much do they?

There was Merizoc, but I can't think of any others.

Pantuxia wrote:Can't Shill the Jill.


Not a supporter I'm guessing. Firstly, because you're not a lefty, and secondly because last I checked, Stein had 0 votes.
Last edited by AiliailiA on Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Thermodolia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:50 pm

I love the new thread smell
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Postby Ulg » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:53 pm

Gary!


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Postby AiliailiA » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:57 pm

I voted "don't change the poll" ... only because I don't know what "change the poll" would be a vote for. What is proposed?

If the intention is for people to use one vote among candidates/other/undecided, and the other vote for change/don't-change, that should be made more explicit. As it is, some people will do that while others will vote their first and second preferences of candidates (which absolutely is going to inflate the Johnson, Stein and McMullin figures). Messy that, because there's no way to distinguish a first preference vote which would count in a real election and a second preference vote which wouldn't.

The way I'd change the poll is to get rid of the last two options (change/don't-change) and go back to one vote per user. Unambitious of me perhaps.
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Postby Jerzylvania » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:57 pm

Thermodolia wrote:I love the new thread smell

Kind of like napalm in the morning. Smells like .... VICTORY!
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Postby Galloism » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:58 pm

Ailiailia wrote:I voted "don't change the poll" ... only because I don't know what "change the poll" would be a vote for. What is proposed?

If the intention is for people to use one vote among candidates/other/undecided, and the other vote for change/don't-change, that should be made more explicit. As it is, some people will do that while others will vote their first and second preferences of candidates (which absolutely is going to inflate the Johnson, Stein and McMullin figures). Messy that, because there's no way to distinguish a first preference vote which would count in a real election and a second preference vote which wouldn't.

The way I'd change the poll is to get rid of the last two options (change/don't-change) and go back to one vote per user. Unambitious of me perhaps.

Some people might vote for both Trump and Stein.
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Postby Thermodolia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:58 pm

Ailiailia wrote:I voted "don't change the poll" ... only because I don't know what "change the poll" would be a vote for. What is proposed?

If the intention is for people to use one vote among candidates/other/undecided, and the other vote for change/don't-change, that should be made more explicit. As it is, some people will do that while others will vote their first and second preferences of candidates (which absolutely is going to inflate the Johnson, Stein and McMullin figures). Messy that, because there's no way to distinguish a first preference vote which would count in a real election and a second preference vote which wouldn't.

The way I'd change the poll is to get rid of the last two options (change/don't-change) and go back to one vote per user. Unambitious of me perhaps.

Maybe we could change the poll after two weeks or so?
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Postby Socialist Nordia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:59 pm

Galloism wrote:
Ailiailia wrote:I voted "don't change the poll" ... only because I don't know what "change the poll" would be a vote for. What is proposed?

If the intention is for people to use one vote among candidates/other/undecided, and the other vote for change/don't-change, that should be made more explicit. As it is, some people will do that while others will vote their first and second preferences of candidates (which absolutely is going to inflate the Johnson, Stein and McMullin figures). Messy that, because there's no way to distinguish a first preference vote which would count in a real election and a second preference vote which wouldn't.

The way I'd change the poll is to get rid of the last two options (change/don't-change) and go back to one vote per user. Unambitious of me perhaps.

Some people might vote for both Trump and Stein.

Ew, that's disgusting
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Postby Galloism » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:00 pm

Socialist Nordia wrote:
Galloism wrote:Some people might vote for both Trump and Stein.

Ew, that's disgusting

They split the "fuck it! FUCK IT ALL!" vote.
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The United Territories of Providence
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Postby The United Territories of Providence » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:00 pm

Ailiailia wrote:In Megathread III the poll with over a thousand responses had Jill Stein at 10%

So there's 104 Green supporters on General?? They don't seem to come out in support of their candidate much do they?

There was Merizoc, but I can't think of any others.


Right? I can think of plenty of posters who are very much anti-Hillary and say that it should be Bernie...but I don't know if those folks supported Stein.
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Postby MERIZoC » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:00 pm

*googles Evan McMullin*

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Jerzylvania
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Postby Jerzylvania » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:01 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Ailiailia wrote:I voted "don't change the poll" ... only because I don't know what "change the poll" would be a vote for. What is proposed?

If the intention is for people to use one vote among candidates/other/undecided, and the other vote for change/don't-change, that should be made more explicit. As it is, some people will do that while others will vote their first and second preferences of candidates (which absolutely is going to inflate the Johnson, Stein and McMullin figures). Messy that, because there's no way to distinguish a first preference vote which would count in a real election and a second preference vote which wouldn't.

The way I'd change the poll is to get rid of the last two options (change/don't-change) and go back to one vote per user. Unambitious of me perhaps.

Maybe we could change the poll after two weeks or so?


We are a bit under two months out. Maybe on October 9th reset the poll and get a last 30 day look?
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Thermodolia
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Postby Thermodolia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:02 pm

The United Territories of Providence wrote:
Ailiailia wrote:In Megathread III the poll with over a thousand responses had Jill Stein at 10%

So there's 104 Green supporters on General?? They don't seem to come out in support of their candidate much do they?

There was Merizoc, but I can't think of any others.


Right? I can think of plenty of posters who are very much anti-Hillary and say that it should be Bernie...but I don't know if those folks supported Stein.

You did forget the ironically named Constitution Party guy
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>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
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Ambassadors to the WA:
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RIP Dya

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Galloism
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 65825
Founded: Aug 20, 2005
Father Knows Best State

Postby Galloism » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:03 pm

Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
The Parkus Empire: Being serious on NSG is like wearing a suit to a nude beach.
New Kereptica: Since power is changed energy over time, an increase in power would mean, in this case, an increase in energy. As energy is equivalent to mass and the density of the government is static, the volume of the government must increase.


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The Liberated Territories
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11826
Founded: Dec 03, 2013
Capitalizt

Postby The Liberated Territories » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:03 pm

Jerzylvania wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Maybe we could change the poll after two weeks or so?


We are a bit under two months out. Maybe on October 9th reset the poll and get a last 30 day look?


It's likely we'd still fit in one more thread by November.
"Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig."
—Robert Heinlein

a libertarian, which means i want poor babies to die or smth

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Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59619
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:03 pm

Jerzylvania wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Maybe we could change the poll after two weeks or so?


We are a bit under two months out. Maybe on October 9th reset the poll and get a last 30 day look?

Change it to a three way race at that point?
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

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Socialist Nordia
Senator
 
Posts: 4275
Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Socialist Nordia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:03 pm

Trump is losing to Gary Johnson and tied with Jill stein in the poll. Wow.
Internationalist Progressive Anarcho-Communist
I guess I'm a girl now.
Science > Your Beliefs
Trump did 11/9, never forget
Free Catalonia
My Political Test Results
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Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59619
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:04 pm

The Liberated Territories wrote:
Jerzylvania wrote:
We are a bit under two months out. Maybe on October 9th reset the poll and get a last 30 day look?


It's likely we'd still fit in one more thread by November.

Depends on the debates, if they happen at all.
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

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Socialist Nordia
Senator
 
Posts: 4275
Founded: Jun 03, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Socialist Nordia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:05 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
The United Territories of Providence wrote:
Right? I can think of plenty of posters who are very much anti-Hillary and say that it should be Bernie...but I don't know if those folks supported Stein.

You did forget the ironically named [srike]Constitution[/strike]Bible Party guy

That's more like it.
Internationalist Progressive Anarcho-Communist
I guess I'm a girl now.
Science > Your Beliefs
Trump did 11/9, never forget
Free Catalonia
My Political Test Results
A democratic socialist nation located on a small island in the Pacific. We are heavily urbanised, besides our thriving national parks. Our culture is influenced by both Scandinavia and China.
Our Embassy Program

User avatar
Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 59619
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:05 pm

Socialist Nordia wrote:Trump is losing to Gary Johnson and tied with Jill stein in the poll. Wow.

It won't last his supporters will come
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

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