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[DRAFT] The Art of Government Buildings

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Zongzi
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Ex-Nation

[DRAFT] The Art of Government Buildings

Postby Zongzi » Sun Oct 25, 2015 12:21 pm

ZONGZI DEPARTMENT OF ISSUES
Hello everyone ! Since we have reached the 500 million milestone, this is the first issue the newly-created Zongzi Department of Issues has drafted ! We have tried our best to avoid redundancies in this process. Please enjoy and maybe give suggestions for any improvement. Thanks !
~Premier Foreign Minister Zongjie Feng

Issue Name

The Art of Government Buildings

Description

After the recent arrest of a prominent artist for attempting to chisel the side of a particularly ugly courthouse into a sculpture, architectural firms and aspiring artists have petitioned you to renovate government buildings.

Validity

(currently no restrictions...)

Options

[option]"Our government buildings just aren't interesting enough!" says @@RANDOMNAME@@, an aspiring artist. "If you let artists like me redesign your buildings, I guarantee the future of our nation will be more colorful, creative, and interesting! All we need is your permission and lots and lots of paint!"
[effect] government buildings around @@NAME@@ tend to resemble a six-year-old's drawings
[stats] taxes increase, culture increases

[option]"Why trust these amateurs when you could hire real professionals?" asks @@RANDOMNAME@@, carrying several 3D-printed models of skyscrapers into your office. "As the head of the most experienced architectural firm in @@NAME@@, I must say that we are the best choice for renovating the government buildings of our nation. Not only will they have great designs, we'll only use the most modern materials as well. Of course there is some considerable money involved, but think of your new fiberglass palace!"
[effect] the nation's top architectural firms compete to redesign the restrooms of old government buildings
[stats] taxes increase, primitiveness decreases, Furniture Restoration increases

[option]"Considerable money involved? That's absolutely right!" retorts your financial minister @@RANDOMNAME@@ while narrowly avoiding a falling ceiling panel. "Look, I know our buildings aren't the prettiest, but at least they aren't falling apart! Or at least not that much, anyway. If we give our citizens a tax break instead, they wouldn't have to go to our ugly tax offices so much in the first place!"
[effect] the nation's government buildings are remarkable for being ugly concrete monoliths
[stats] taxes decrease, culture decreases

[option]"Even if our buildings are unattractive, does that make them unattractive targets?" one of your more paranoid ministers whispers. "Clearly not. You see, @@LEADER@@, there's a perfect solution to this - if we turn every single building of ours into a fully-equipped nuclear bunker, we'd be impervious to any kind of attack, and our mighty government would be invincible at last! Since they won't be visible underground, we can focus on important things like defending ourselves against the next psychotic dictatorship with a nuclear arsenal. If those pesky artists still aren't satisfied...well, let's just say aesthetics won't matter when we're still alive and they aren't!"
[effect] government officials struggle to get wifi while working in heavily fortified nuclear bunkers
[stats] taxes increase, defense spending increases, culture decreases
Last edited by Zongzi on Sat Nov 07, 2015 1:46 pm, edited 10 times in total.

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Trotterdam
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Left-Leaning College State

Postby Trotterdam » Sun Oct 25, 2015 3:42 pm

Zongzi wrote:Validity

Not for highly primitive nations
"Primitivity" is about having bad science and technology. I don't see what that has to do with this issue.

This issue seems like it would have to do more with the "Culture" stat, which is about how artistically sophisticated your nation is. (Which does count controversial forms of art.)

Zongzi wrote:[effect] government buildings around @@NAME@@ tend to resemble a six year old's drawings
I would recommend hyphenating "six-year-old's". You put the apostrophe in the right place, anyway :)

My nation is supposed to look like a cartoon drawn by adults for six-year-olds. Does that count? ;)

Zongzi wrote:[option]"Why trust these amateurs when you could hire real professionals?" asks @@RANDOMNAME@@, carrying several 3D-printed models of skyscrapers into your office.
*shifty look* I don't trust profesionals. They'll build some weird "modern art" that nobody except art critics actually likes.

Zongzi wrote:"In any case, we should be worrying about the government, not the government buildings!"
She says, but doesn't actually suggest anything she thinks should be improved about the government.

Overall, a pretty solid issue with a good premise and few mistakes, but you should think a little harder about what the difference between option 1 and option 2 is, and maybe make option 3 a little more interesting (either have the speaker be more explicit about lowering taxes, or suggest something else the money could be used for).

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Merconitonitopia
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Merconitonitopia » Sun Oct 25, 2015 5:32 pm

I have 3 issues with this issue:

1. Culture should increase for first two (mainly the first) and decrease for the last.
2. Why does the economy increase for the second? What industry would this help?
3. Kind of a bland name, but I'm not too bothered by that myself. Still, might want to consider that.
Last edited by Merconitonitopia on Sun Oct 25, 2015 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Sun Oct 25, 2015 5:50 pm

Merconitonitopia wrote:2. Why does the economy increase for the second? What industry would this help?
The architecture industry, obviously.

Which isn't actually one of the ones coded into NationStates currently, but it could be represented by Furniture Restoration or something.

Granted, the fact that the government is paying those architects using taxes levied from other industries might not help so much, but that's never stopped NationStates before.

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Zongzi
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Founded: Jul 22, 2015
Ex-Nation

Edits to Issue

Postby Zongzi » Sun Oct 25, 2015 6:50 pm

ZONGZI DEPARTMENT OF ISSUES

Hello everyone ! Thank you for your input on this issue. We have revised this issue to accommodate some suggestions !

For the first option we have added an increase in culture, since it involves artistic expression.

However for the second option it may be pertinent to decrease primitiveness instead, as the option states the buildings will be renovated with modern materials, which raises the technology level of the nation. Also, we think it makes sense for the Furniture Restoration industry to increase, since the companies will be renovating old buildings, which naturally includes the furniture and other such fixtures inside.

As for the third option we have revised it so the financial minister is suggesting lowering taxes, so taxes will decrease now. We also have the culture decrease because ugly concrete monoliths are not very cultural.

We are currently still thinking about an alternate name ...

In any case, any further suggestions for improvement are always welcome !

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Trotterdam
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Founded: Jan 12, 2012
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Postby Trotterdam » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:10 am

I think it's good to go.

My biggest disappointment with this issue is that I won't be able to get it because my nation already has very high culture, but that's appropiate given the premise. I'll find other ways to raise my culture even further.

Can't think of any better ideas for title, sorry.

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Araneidae
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Ex-Nation

Postby Araneidae » Wed Oct 28, 2015 1:03 am

Should this really be invalid for nations with high culture? There's always room for improvement, and there's always artists thinking that it's 'just not good enough'.

The threshold should be higher, at least. Most of my puppets seem to have 100+ culture. ...even the one puppet that's mainly focused on governmental efficiency has somehow managed to reach culture 50+. This would be a good issue for lowering it to more reasonable levels.

Also, seems like those choices might have some effect on Tourism. And maybe consider adding +Political Apathy for the third one. There's so few issues that modify that at all...
Last edited by Araneidae on Wed Oct 28, 2015 1:17 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Annihilators of Chan Island
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Postby Annihilators of Chan Island » Wed Oct 28, 2015 2:25 am

Very nice issue. Very well written. :clap:

I agree with Araneidae that tourism should be affected in all of those. In the first 2 it should increase, the third it should decrease. Usually I stubbornly maintain that stats don't matter, but they were calling.

I also think there should be no culture threshold. ( Controversial Maniac here?). Even in the most cultured, sophisticated nations on earth, there exist shockingly ugly buildings. In fact, if anything in highly cultured nations it is more likely that someone will take an artistic chisel to a government building, as it might not satisfy their aesthetics.
This nation is modeled on being my absolute worst dystopia imaginable. In no way do the Annihilators reflect my opinions, in fact I am totally against almost every single policy they enact.
I support insanely high tax rates, do you?

I honestly really like to write issues.

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Trotterdam
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Founded: Jan 12, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Trotterdam » Wed Oct 28, 2015 8:35 am

Araneidae wrote:Also, seems like those choices might have some effect on Tourism.
Yeah. Though I strongly suspect that's automatic to anything that affects Culture, though I haven't actually checked.

Araneidae wrote:And maybe consider adding +Political Apathy for the third one. There's so few issues that modify that at all...
Ha. "You want me to vote? In a polling station that looks like this?"

Annihilators of Chan Island wrote:In fact, if anything in highly cultured nations it is more likely that someone will take an artistic chisel to a government building, as it might not satisfy their aesthetics.
True. Culture rises when you legalize racist slur graffiti...

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Atomic Utopia
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Postby Atomic Utopia » Wed Oct 28, 2015 8:50 pm

I would recommend, if at all possible, an option to turn government buildings into massive nuclear powered bunkers at the advice of one of your more paranoid advisors.
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Note: I do not use NS stats for my RP, instead I use numbers I made up one evening when writing my factbooks.

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Annihilators of Chan Island
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Postby Annihilators of Chan Island » Thu Oct 29, 2015 4:40 am

Atomic Utopia wrote:I would recommend, if at all possible, an option to turn government buildings into massive nuclear powered bunkers at the advice of one of your more paranoid advisors.


I'm not sure about nuclear bunkers, but I was wondering about the paranoid advisor in this scenario. Why is there no option to beef up security around government buildings? After all, those artists might one day turn into saboteurs, right?
This nation is modeled on being my absolute worst dystopia imaginable. In no way do the Annihilators reflect my opinions, in fact I am totally against almost every single policy they enact.
I support insanely high tax rates, do you?

I honestly really like to write issues.

Proud member of The Anti Democracy League

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Trotterdam
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Posts: 10226
Founded: Jan 12, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Trotterdam » Thu Oct 29, 2015 8:53 am

I think this building looks better on fire! It's an artistic statement.

The relevance of defensive capability had occured to me, but I reasoned option 2 was kinda the defensive one because high-tech materials and cutting-edge construction techniques are probably fairly sturdy. But then, there's a big difference between civilian-standards robust construction and a bombproof bunker.

You could mix the bunker option with a suggestion to build government buildings underground. Better bomb resistance, and nobody will care how it looks because it's not in the skyline anyway!

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Zongzi
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Founded: Jul 22, 2015
Ex-Nation

Further Improvements

Postby Zongzi » Thu Oct 29, 2015 12:49 pm

ZONGZI DEPARTMENT OF ISSUES

Hello all ! Thank you for your further suggestions.

We have decided that perhaps the limitation on highly cultured nations is not necessary. After all, as it has been observed, in higher cultured nations there is even more of a chance for art critics and the like to find certain buildings unsatisfactory at least in terms of aesthetics.

As for the additional options, we think they have very much potential ! So the three main ideas are:

1. To turn the government buildings into nuclear bunkers (says paranoid minister)
2. To build the government buildings underground so appearance doesn't matter (says engineer? construction company?)
3. To just add more security to the government buildings (says police chief)

We are currently not sure which order they will go in due to the third option (lower taxes) which is essentially a dismissal of everything else. But we will be trying to integrate these three options somehow !

In any case, thanks everyone for the suggestions ! Again, any comments (too many options? want to change something??) are welcome.

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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Thu Oct 29, 2015 1:19 pm

Zongzi wrote:As for the additional options, we think they have very much potential ! So the three main ideas are:

1. To turn the government buildings into nuclear bunkers (says paranoid minister)
2. To build the government buildings underground so appearance doesn't matter (says engineer? construction company?)
3. To just add more security to the government buildings (says police chief)
I think 1 and 2 (if used) should be combined into one option. They're highly compatible, and it would justify a defense-related option being brought up as an answer to an issue about aesthetics.

3 is more distinct and should be a separate option if used. I'm not so sure about it. The idea has merit, but it'd be running a little high on options, and it's drifting away from the main issue of what your government buildings should look like. It'd feel like the token joke option if present ("yeah, let's ignore the main issue under discussion and go look at a technicality instead"), so I say only add it if it's funny. (To be fair, I have such an option in one of my own drafts...)

Zongzi wrote:We are currently not sure which order they will go in due to the third option (lower taxes) which is essentially a dismissal of everything else. But we will be trying to integrate these three options somehow !
The underground bunker option could go either at the very end, or between the current second and third options. Note that the bunker option has the main aspect that the finance minister is complaining about (being prohibitively expensive), but also isn't specifically about aesthetics as a top priority (so the "If we give our citizens a tax break instead, they wouldn't have to go to our ugly tax offices so much in the first place!" line - which I love - wouldn't scan as well).

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Zongzi
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Founded: Jul 22, 2015
Ex-Nation

Further Suggestions

Postby Zongzi » Thu Oct 29, 2015 1:59 pm

ZONGZI DEPARTMENT OF ISSUES

Hello ! Thank you Trotterdam for your input. We did attempt to differentiate the "bunker" and "underground" options (at least somewhat?) when drafting them. However, as you said, they are highly compatible and could be merged.

These are the two options we drafted which are to be merged:

[option]"Hold on a moment. Why do they have to see our structures anyway?" says an engineer measuring the dimensions of your office. "I'll tell you what - why not just build all of them underground? That'd make them hard to vandalize, and then you can focus on what's actually important, like fixing all the leaky pipes you have in the bathroom over there!"
[effect] the nation's newly underground 'Capitol Hill' has been renamed 'The Anthill'
[stats] taxes increase, youth rebelliousness decreases, culture decreases

[option]"Yes, yes, YES! Build them underground! ALL OF THEM!" one of your more paranoid ministers exclaims with wide eyes. "Don't you see the potential, @@LEADER@@? If we turn every single building of ours into a fully-equipped nuclear bunker, we'd be impervious to any kind of attack, and our mighty government would be invincible at last! This is a genius idea!"
[effect] government officials struggle to get wifi while working in heavily fortified nuclear bunkers
[stats] taxes increase, defense spending increases

This is currently our proposed merger, which will be edited into the original post:

[option]"But can the police arrest a nuclear missile?" one of your more paranoid ministers whispers. "Clearly not. You see, @@LEADER@@, there's a perfect solution to this - if we turn every single building of ours into a fully-equipped nuclear bunker, we'd be impervious to any kind of attack, and our mighty government would be invincible at last!"
[effect] government officials struggle to get wifi while working in heavily fortified nuclear bunkers
[stats] taxes increase, defense spending increases

Any suggestions or so forth from all concerning this merger would be appreciated.

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Trotterdam
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Postby Trotterdam » Thu Oct 29, 2015 2:17 pm

That "merger" is basically just the second option, with nothing from the first. I'd like the underground option to mention something about the "it won't matter what they look like if they're underground" aspect, even if just as a compromise / rationalization rather than the real reason the paranoid minister is suggesting it. The engineer has a decent point about focussing on keeping stuff working rather than looking pretty, which is also the kind of thing you'd want to combine with a bomb shelter (you don't want to go out to shop for a replacement part while bombs are falling). Basically heavy-duty function over form, and then shooting down cricicism by removing form as a factor at all.

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Zongzi
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Founded: Jul 22, 2015
Ex-Nation

Final Revisions for Issue

Postby Zongzi » Sat Nov 07, 2015 1:53 pm

Zongzi Department of Issues

Hello all ! Apologies for the long wait (the zombie apocalypse temporarily disabled Department of Issues headquarters in Beifan).

We have made the final revisions to the issue titled : "The Art of Government Buildings". Thanks everyone for the suggestions and reading. We would like to thank in particular Trotterdam, Annihilators of Chan Island, Atomic Utopia, Araneidae, and Merconitonitopia !

In the final revision we have removed the police / security option. We did not think it was pertinent to the actual issue at hand enough to justify its inclusion. Accordingly the wording of the last issue was modified somewhat as an adjustment, though its premise remains the same.

As there are no more changes currently being considered, we are submitting this proposal. We hope that someday, you may be able to enjoy the fruits of your labor on : "The Art of Government Buildings!"

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Annihilators of Chan Island
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Postby Annihilators of Chan Island » Sat Nov 07, 2015 4:07 pm

Zongzi wrote:Zongzi Department of Issues

Hello all ! Apologies for the long wait (the zombie apocalypse temporarily disabled Department of Issues headquarters in Beifan).

We have made the final revisions to the issue titled : "The Art of Government Buildings". Thanks everyone for the suggestions and reading. We would like to thank in particular Trotterdam, Annihilators of Chan Island, Atomic Utopia, Araneidae, and Merconitonitopia !

In the final revision we have removed the police / security option. We did not think it was pertinent to the actual issue at hand enough to justify its inclusion. Accordingly the wording of the last issue was modified somewhat as an adjustment, though its premise remains the same.

As there are no more changes currently being considered, we are submitting this proposal. We hope that someday, you may be able to enjoy the fruits of your labor on : "The Art of Government Buildings!"


You submitted this... without the security option? The whole issue is the fact that random artists are going up to buildings and redecorating them! And you can't see how the security option isn't central to that?

*Sigh*

Oh well, I wish you luck in this. :) I look forward to seeing this be implemented into the game. May your department of issues produce many more fine ideas such as this one for this forum to scrutinize.
This nation is modeled on being my absolute worst dystopia imaginable. In no way do the Annihilators reflect my opinions, in fact I am totally against almost every single policy they enact.
I support insanely high tax rates, do you?

I honestly really like to write issues.

Proud member of The Anti Democracy League


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