Agenor Coalition (OOC thread)

[North Defese]

Flag of the Agenor Coalition

This is the OOC thread for the AC, since our one IC thread is progressing slower than anything, leaving the prospect of them being finished in a timely manner to coincide with events nearly impossible.

So in the interest of speeding up the diplomatic process, we will be bombing Lanos discussing our matters here in OOC form!

The Agenor Coalition History

Formed in the wake of the Otulian and Anglican interventions and counter-intervention respectively, the Agenor Coalition existed as an idealistic concept when Defese publically challenged the right of the rest of the region to involve themselves in Agenor matters. It dispatched a fleet with the intention of steaming past what it called an Anglican blockade, and in a show of solidarity it was joined by fleet from Estoni and a small contingent from Cestyr.

On Feburary 13th, 2015, Defese invited officials from across Agenor to meet in its coastal City of Odka, where it converted a high-rise into the Headquarters of the new organization.

Agenor Coalition Members

So far Gvozdevsk, Estoni, Poldania, and Mizuyuki are the current members of the Agenor Coalition, all of which were gobbled up into it when it originally, officially formed on Feburary 13th.

Organization Goals and Methods

Dipomatic, economic, and military cooperation are the ideals of the AC. These are the tie-in to its main, overbearing purpose: To keep Agenor sovereign, and allow it to operate in its own sphere while denying non-Agenor nations or blocs any room to operate without the approval of Agenor nations.

The methods of facilitating cooperation are the standard for such organizations. It has diplomatic and economic forums and assemblies, where nations in the bloc come together, discuss, and work out agreements. The philosophy hoped to be established is that even if no firm agreements are made, the mutual understanding between members will allow better relations and policy-management from members.

One quirk of their assemblies is that nothing is recorded, and no cameras or film are allowed in conference rooms during meetings between delegates. They are all completely private unless pre-arranged to be recorded, and anything delegates speak on or about are kept within the sealed halls of the Headquarters.

Current Matters to Discuss

1. The Segland Question.

After Esperance's Roadmap to Peace expires, do we allow a Segland into the Agenor Coalition, if they ask? Defese is firmly in the "no", but could be persuaded. Anyone have ideas?

2. Economic Matters.

Defese desires to build a natural gas pipeline network through Agenor. It would carry-on from the pipeline into Cestyr, and allow them to pipe the goods through Segland into Estoni and Poldania. What other economic cooperation is possible? Who has proposals?

3. Military Cooperation.

Defese's domestic law has explicitly outlawed foreign armies establishing a presence on Imperial soil. Nevertheless, cooperation is still possible. Poldania is working on a new generation jet with Defese and Estoni(?), what else can we do?

4. Bomb Lyncanestria.

They've had it too good for too long.

Members:
Defese - Founder
Cestyr - Founding Member
Estoni - Founding Member
Poldania - Founding Member
Mizuyuki - Signatory
Gvozdevsk -Signatory
Rietumimark - Signatory

Conference History

1st Agenor Conference - Feb 14, 2015
Officially founded AgCo. Economic and military cooperation discussed; integration of Estoni and Defesian markets, joint-4th gen jet project between Defese, Estoni, Poldania.

2nd Agenor Conference - March 14th, 2015 -Emergency Summit
Discussion and vote on the Segland civil war and anthrax issue. In session.

[Estoni]

AGENOR STRONK!

Also I think we need to make friendship agreements with outside powers to keep world support for our actions in keeping them out. Like a mutual non-intervention pack, we leave them alone and let them do what they want outside Agenor as long as they let us do what we want within.

Also when bombing the Lanos perhaps we could work on a STANAG like agreement within Agenor.

As to Segland if his new government wants in and apologises for the past wrongdoings then it can only make us stronger. Nothing worse than a large power within working against us.

[Gvozdevsk]

I could definitely host some joint military exercises. Maybe not naval exercises, but air and land exercises for sure.

[Estoni]

I think something important for us to do is to try and work out where we all rely on extra-Agenorian nations for resources or whatever and to wean ourselves off them. As soon as we become self sufficient we can truly keep foreigners out of our continent.

Also I feel we should come up with a word for non-Agenorians for use in propaganda and the like. I mean it's all when and good spray painting "Bumface" or the like on the walls of the Lanosian embassy but having a set word for them would be nice.

[Poldania]

We could have naval exercises off the southern coast (which I propose naming the Gulf of Agenor).

Also I think we need to make friendship agreements with outside powers to keep world support for our actions in keeping them out. Like a mutual non-intervention pack, we leave them alone and let them do what they want outside Agenor as long as they let us do what we want within.

Wouldn't we run into problems if we had conflicting interests in their region?

1. The Segland Question.

After Esperance's Roadmap to Peace expires, do we allow a Segland into the Agenor Coalition, if they ask? Defese is firmly in the "no", but could be persuaded. Anyone have ideas?

Agree with Estoni here. In the nearer future, we could take advantage of the line in the Roadmap that says "mediated by Esperance International or by another neutral party" and establish an Agenor Humanitarian Organization, then use that as a proxy to nudge negotiations in our direction.

2. Economic Matters.

Defese desires to build a natural gas pipeline network through Agenor. It would carry-on from the pipeline into Cestyr, and allow them to pipe the goods through Segland into Estoni and Poldania. What other economic cooperation is possible? Who has proposals?

Poldania would support the pipeline. As for other things, they'd also like a free trade agreement among the coalition members, though they'd be against any kind of Schengen Zone-type thing or a currency union.

3. Military Cooperation.

Defese's domestic law has explicitly outlawed foreign armies establishing a presence on Imperial soil. Nevertheless, cooperation is still possible. Poldania is working on a new generation jet with Defese and Estoni(?), what else can we do?

We could try to run joint peacekeeping missions on the continent. Like in the troubled parts of Estoni.

[Mizuyuki]

In the interest of full OOC disclosure, I'm just going to come out and say that Mizuyuki's primary role in the Agenor Coalition is to play the spoiler.

Despite ours being full members of the AC, the empire's primary objective vis-à-vis the AC is to manipulate the organisation's deliberations and decisions such that the AC is rendered incapable of taking internationally meaningful action. Kirayuki is particularly wary of the possibility of a united Agenor destabilising the region via its actions, and this will be reflected in repeated attempts to halt significant AC action on some pretext or other. IC, however, this is all secret - and Mizuyuki's representatives will put on a front of being entirely willing to cooperate.

However, we are of course amenable to participating in schemes or projects of mutual benefit. In short, the empire is more than willing to work together with the AC under appropriate circumstances.

Regarding the Segland question, firm no. The empire has no wish to allow a wolf into the house, to quote a Chinese proverb; nor does it have any pressing desire to see its resources tied up in a war-torn wasteland. A Seglandic presence, for one, can only serve to disrupt the AC's workings - which is a good thing from the imperial perspective - but on the other hand, the introduction of a strong, unified Segland into the AC might prove to be volatile, in the sense that they would be extremely unpredictable, and liable to raise an almighty fuss at any time.

Economics-wise, nay to the pipeline. Between us we already have unchallenged dominance of the Livean, and there's absolutely no reason why we couldn't continue transporting our natural gas/petroleum products/crude oil via the seas. Besides, the pipeline would likely cause a degree of environmental damage in the countries concerned, and that's something we would not like to see happen at any cost. A free trade agreement is probably out of the question if you're expecting quid pro quo from Mizuyuki, what with us being strongly protectionist and all.

Military cooperation is one area where the empire would be happy to participate. While we already have our own fighter jets thanks to the efforts of the Institute of Strategic Research, Kirayuki would only be too pleased to contribute design and engineering expertise to the project, provided we receive domestic production rights and a cut of the royalties for every jet manufactured. We could also accommodate naval and air exercises, likely in the Straits of Shana, and perhaps some war games. It's all open for discussion.

Insofar as a non-intervention pact is concerned, don't expect Mizuyuki to sign on. It has a multitude of interests scattered throughout Aeneas, especially in Aurinsula, Phonox, Regnum Albion, Lanos, and to some extent, Chonburi; you can appreciate why the deal is a non-starter for us.

I like the idea of an Agenorian humanitarian organisation to counterbalance Esperance; seeing as plenty of us AC members have skeletons in our closets, it would no doubt be a good idea to have a rival organisation which we can feed information to and manipulate as needed. The international community might harbour doubts over the credibility of the organisation, given our links to them, but I'm sure we can find a workaround for that particular problem; either by paying off unscrupulous Aurinsulan journalists or establishing this organisation in such a way that there's nothing to link it to the AC. I'm afraid we wouldn't be as keen on joint peacekeeping missions - as far as we're concerned it's no different than sending the empire's subjects to die in some foreign hellhole. We'd only participate if we actually stood to gain some tangible reward for our efforts.

[Estoni]

So response to the latest escalation of the Seglandic Civil War?

Me and Poldania are thinking of a little intervention to secure our borders. Would we get support for that from the coalition or would we be condemned in the same way as before the use of anthrax?

Also maybe it is time for some sort of joint Agenor special forces operation to neutralize Seg's chemical weapons?

[North Defese]

The decision is thus:

Allow Otulia to commit a carrier, and bring foreign intervention alongside AgCo intervention in Segland.

The alternatives:

Have Mizuyuki commit their own carrier battle group instead.

Defese will vote for Mizu to intervene instead. Our air force is crap, utter crap, and can't operate outside friendly SAM coverage. Seglandic aces are infamous here. But Otulian intervention would undermine AgCo, when Mizu has perfectly good carriers lying around.

[Gvozdevsk]

So response to the latest escalation of the Seglandic Civil War?

Me and Poldania are thinking of a little intervention to secure our borders. Would we get support for that from the coalition or would we be condemned in the same way as before the use of anthrax?

Also maybe it is time for some sort of joint Agenor special forces operation to neutralize Seg's chemical weapons?

This is exactly what I was thinking the moment I read the post.

[Gvozdevsk]

Will there be an IC thread for negotiations on our response to the Segland issue?

[North Defese]

Will there be an IC thread for negotiations on our response to the Segland issue?

Those are so sloooooooow and I've yet to see an assembly thread actually be active and conclude in a timely manner. I think OOC will be fine.

Second Agenor Conference, Emergency Summit:

We need to vote on two matters, which the Defesian ambassador would lay out:

Agenor Coalition Intervention in Segland
Justification:
Dismantle his chemical and biological weapon stockpiles and launch sites. That's the base proposal.

We will vote in favour of this, obvs.
So far:
1 for, 0 against, 0 abstain.

Second:

A vote on allowing Otulian intervention
Justification:
Otulian air power through the use of one of his carriers.

We will vote against this, citing the fact Mizuyuki both has carrier fleets and a willingness to use them... If they want.

We vote for Otulia assisting, which we are against on the condition Mizu helps. That makes:

0 for, 1 against*, 0 abstain.

[Gvozdevsk]

The Gvozdevski delegate will be voting for an intervention to eliminate Segland's WMD threat and recommend an SOF task force and airstrikes if conditions permit. They'll be voting against allowing Otulian intervention, citing the same reasoning as the Defesian ambassador, as well as pointing out that air power can be projected into Segland via Defese and Estoni, and will offer to station Gvozdevski aircraft as well as long range surface to air missiles in Estoni.

[North Defese]

The Defesian diplomat will cough nervously and insist that while our army is unstoppable, professional, and a sledgehammer of epic proportions, our air force is.... Lacking. As in, utter garbage. Complete crap compared to Segland. Our air force is whatever wikipedia tells me the Sovet Union flew in the 70's, with a handful of late 90's and an even smaller handful of actual modern tin buckets, but those are rare.

Segland's air force is way too much for our own. It will refuse to operate in areas outside friendly SAM coverage.

So unfortunately, we'll be reliant on Mizu or Otulian air power projected from the sea or Estoni.

[Estoni]

The Eesti delegate will be voting in favor of military intervention in Segland especially to target WMDs and will be allowing the use of airbases within Estoni to support AgCo air units for this purpose. Estoni will also act as a staging area for any Special Forces raids into Segland.

On the carrier issue Estoni will abstain on the understanding that Mizu will be providing one of theirs for the task ahead.

[Poldania]

Poldania's ambassador will point out that our air force has been recently refurbished and is already in position to hit targets in Segland. However, we will not be able to spare many of our ground-based defenses because they are deployed elsewhere in case of an opportunistic Merrinan attack.

He'll also vote for intervention, and against Otulian assistance on the condition that Mizuyuki provides ships instead.

[North Rietumimark]

The Rietumish delegate will vote in favour of military intervention in Segland to prevent future WMD attacks which could threaten AgCo member states. However, Rietumimark won't participate in any military action in Segland, subtly saying that the Revolutionary Air Force isn't powerful enough to take on the Seglandic air force. Rietumimark will also vote against allowing the Otulia to intervene into the conflict citing the same reasons as the Defesian ambassador and the Gvozdevski delegate.

[Mizuyuki]

Mizuyuki will be abstaining on AgCo intervention in Segland and voting against Otulian intervention, on the understanding that Mizuyuki will commit no more than one carrier battle group to AgCo expeditionary forces.

[North Defese]

AgCo Intervention vote:

6 - 1 - 0

We only have Cestyr's vote, but even if he's against it, the motion passes and Cestyr has the option of 'opting out' of Agenor's joint intervention.

We've now legalized a joint-intervention in Segland, and can start working on that IC'ly through whatever RP's n' stuff are available.

Otulian intervention vote:

0 - 1 - 6

In a polar opposite vote, we've decided against Otulian intervention. Unless Cestyr does something drastic, I think we can call this one as well and go ahead and keep this within Agenor. Applause all around, the system works! We'll start mobilizing right away.

What else should we discuss during this emergency summit?

Edited to include Cestyr's vote.

[Poldania]

The incident in Lanos, maybe?

[Cestyr]

Cestyr will vote in favor of the AgCo intervention and vote against in the Otulian intervention.

[North Defese]

The incident in Lanos, maybe?

The unfortunate terrorist attacks in Lanos, which we condemn with the strongest of words, is a tragedy of our generation. The Defesian-immigrants who allegedly perpetrated this act, while they may have a point in the manner of unfair treatment, nevertheless do not at all represent the Empire. We've never associated with terrorists, and never shall.

I think these two votes can conclude the emergency summit; our next summit can be called if we need something to vote on, but otherwise we're back to chatting and dialogues.

Now! Let's all gather for brunch. We brought Otullian muffins and cheeses from Albion!

[Gvozdevsk]

I take it we'll be RPing the intervention in the Seglandic Civil War IC thread, correct? I'm kind of itching to get this going.

[North Defese]

I take it we'll be RPing the intervention in the Seglandic Civil War IC thread, correct? I'm kind of itching to get this going.

Yes, we'll be doing it through the Seglandic civil war IC thread. I suggest shooting Segland a TG of what action you'll be taking, and clear any specifics with him.

I doodled a real quick little sketch of where we'll all be during an IRC chat with other members.



The Agenor Coalition Intervention Force (AgCoF) will be led by Supreme Commander [blank] [blank], of Poldania, since he's supplying the majority of men and equipment.

[Gvozdevsk]

I need to be in the IRC more often it would appear. I can still have troops somewhere though, right?

[Estoni]

I need to be in the IRC more often it would appear. I can still have troops somewhere though, right?

Pop on now if you can the main interveners are on.