NATION

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NS PMC Guild (Industry Guild - OOC/Sign up)

A meeting place where national storefronts can tout their wares and discuss trade. [In character]
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Neu Engollon
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Founded: Aug 13, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

NS PMC Guild (Industry Guild - OOC/Sign up)

Postby Neu Engollon » Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:36 pm

THE NATIONS STATES PMC GUILD

IC THREAD IS HERE

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Logo courtesy of the player behind Sarlsvert





There is a proliferation of PMCs and 'mercenary' companies out there, for better or worse. For the benefit of closer solidarity in the industry and for prospective clients shopping for PMC services, we have formed The Guild that licenses and bonds PMCs. There are standards in the form of a Charter that all members must sign. Also, we ask that our seal for the NSPMC Guild be put on all members storefronts that maintain one, enabling potential customers to see that and know that the company was properly licensed and recognized by the Guild. A member does not necessarily have to maintain a storefront, and RP links in lieu of a storefront are acceptable for admittance to the Guild.

The NSPMC Guild connects clients with PMCs, as well as encourages promotion of the PMC industry in general, both in an OOC and IC manner. Guild members are given preferential treatment when trying to assist potential clients that seek help here.

Some members base their operating regulations off WA legislation, (or say they do, anyway). We monitor the WA legislating and licensing situation, but leave it up to the discretion of members whether they choose to adhere to them. However, members found to be in violation of our Charter can face ejection and possible sanctions.

Questions towards any of the members or Guild operations can be directed and posted here, including who best to hire for certain operations or how to form your own NS PMC. If you must TG me, please try me at USG Security Corporation first, which I'm using for all PMC business, but if you need a prompter response than 2 days, go ahead and TG my main account. Thanks and enjoy!


CURRENT MEMBERS OF THE GUILD


1. USG Security Corporation/Regiments

2. Axalon PMC

3. Shalumite Security International PMC

4. Salamander PSE

5. Blackwood Company

6. Bushido Solutions Ltd.

7. Varangian Guard

8. Mymidon Security Services

9. Musashi Security Services

10. Covenant Security Concerns

11. Lourens Consortium

12. SternGuard

13. Global Security Solutions


** Placement on the Member list in no way denotes hierarchy or ranking, only chronology of applying for membership. All members are considered equal.




INTROS TO THE GUILD MEMBERS



The USG (Uli-Schwyz-Galien) Security Corporation was founded in the 15th Century by descendants of Wilhelm Tell, the infamous sharpshooter and Neu Engollian rebel hero who led rebellions against the Austrak invaders. Today, it is run by an executive board of undisclosed membership and led by General Pieter van Aardel, the first non-Neu Engollian General in the history of the organization, who took over from his mentor, Nelson Tell (a descendant of Wilhelm). Tell was forced out by the Board amid some controversy.

In early days, it was known simply as the Uli-Schwyz Mercenary Regiment. The Regiment fulfilled many contracts during this early history, most notably, coming to the aid of its host country during a Gaulic Imperial invasion at the end of the 18th Century. It also has played a crucial part in other Teremaran conflicts throughout the centuries, as well as outside the region. While some informal links are maintained with the NEDF and they are a registered Neu Engollian corporation, the USG Security Corporation proclaims to not be slaved to the interests or dictates of Neu Engollian foreign policy.

The tactical regiments were originally made up of mostly Neu Engollian nationals, but over time, the balance shifted to include a wide variety of other represented nationalities from around the globe. At present, less than a third of the USG ranks are estimated to be made up of Neu Engollian ex-service personnel, with most personnel sourced from outside the Confederacy and even the region.

During the 1930's, the Air Wing was added to expand the Uli-Schwyz mobility and rapid response capability. Innovations ran to a smaller scale, but higher technology ratio from there. It was only in very recent history that the size of the Corporation/Regiment(s) expanded to four regiments. For two years of their most recent history, the USG was committed almost entirely to the Hutanjian War in Wishtonia. It was a cataclysmic time for the corporation, as well as in the politics of the several nations involved in that conflict.

Today, The USG Security Corporation is world renowned for getting the mission accomplished in some tight situations. They have served in a variety of global regions and climates. The Regiments are outfitted with the latest NS military gear and the personnel have been trained in the best advanced military special operations training programs throughout the multiverse. Considering the starting caliber of recruits, and the gaps filled by training, many specialized and elite commando/special warfare operations are handled with great finesse and success.


Axalon, as a PMC, is authorized to sell military and security-related goods and services under the (Aquitaynian) Freedom of Enterprise Act of 1988. While the Aquitaynian government monitors the services of Axalon, such records remain anonymous and are kept discreet and confidential with the customer.

Axalon is a highly professional and well-trained and experienced firm which has over 35 years of experience in foreign conflict, VIP security, and many other fields of Security. Axalon employs over 5,000 ex-military Tier 1 and Special Forces Operators from over 30 countries worldwide, and has over 47,000 years experience combined (for an average of 9.7 years active duty). Axalon offers a wide range of services, from simple building security to more classified operations such as training foreign operatives and assassinations. Axalon keeps all records secured and under guard 24 hours a day and 7 days a week, and keeps no digital copies to prevent any sort of DDoS or phishing attack be applicable against Axalon computer servers. While we provide security to others, we keep our own security at the forefront of our minds.

Axalon saw its inception from an Aquitaynian ex-special forces officer during the mid-1970’s. During its early days, Axalon was promoted through ads in the back pages of mercenary trade magazines before developing into a more reputable, professional PMC.


SSI (Shalumite Security International) is not in affiliation with the government of Shalum and is in fact, a privately owned company. SSI follows the regulations and articles stated within the Geneva Convention of 1949.
SSI is adept in the training, supplying weapons, transportation, logistical aid and specialization of militarized soldiers and forces
SSI can perform the duties of Patrol/Border Units, protection and rescue of VIP (Very Important Persons), hostages. SSI also is skilled in reconnaissance missions and a myriad of other missions which may be requested by a client.


Salamander Private Security Enterprises has a trusted history, and has been rewarded for their work with numerous sensitive contracts. While the offers have escalated, their expected price remains the close to the same, allowing most clients the ability to afford their own force of Salamander operators. The company was founded in 2006 by Lieutenant Colonel Aruk Ogunwe, who sought to deliver a disciplined force to the Third World that could easily contend with the militias and roving marauders and insurgent bands he had once faced. Since then, Salamander PSE has strove to uphold that honor, and they constantly raise the bar with each contract completed.

Their operators come from a wide variety of nations, though the majority are from Azurlavai, Lilliput, and Voyostok. The operators have served in all branches, from armies, to navies and Marine Corps and even some specialized law enforcement tactical veterans.

Salamander Private Security Enterprises is based out of Millennium Park, a former Allied Army urban combat course that was decommissioned due to lack of use and sold off on the private market. Within weeks, the course was turned into a compound, from which all operations are now managed from the Millennium Park offices. Salamander contractors keep in a constant state of training and readiness for any type of contract. A full modern armory and motor pool constantly maintain the stocks of weapons and equipment for Salamander's every need.


Blackwood Company personnel carry modern tech weapons and are equipped with the proven cutting edge of the military gear industry. They specialize in small missions and their heaviest deployments involve nothing heavier than up-armored commercial vehicles. Individual operators tend to field cutting-edge equipment along with tried-and-true standbys.

In the gray world of Argonian mercenary work, everyone is a 'bad boy' to a degree. There's a paper-thin bit of legislation protecting the major groups from war crime accusations domestically, and as is known, no notable World Assembly legislation to keep them in check, like most other modern PMCs. Due to their close association with the Argonian intelligence community, it is rare Blackwood experiences anything more serious than token harassment from law enforcement agencies.

Blackwood gladly undertakes despicable contracts, often from the Argonian government, but they also conduct the bulk of their business legitimately on the greater market. Blackwood can do pretty much anything, so long as it's not clean or subtle. Blackwood is known for heavy-handed operational doctrines, strenuous recruitment programs and their 'blacker than black' operations. They are essentially the cream of the Argonian private military crop. Full-time operators on permanent retainer, like the infamous Special Missions Team-13 'Vapor', enjoy the choice assignments and hefty day-rate compensation over their peers. These full-time personnel are grouped into teams and are issued a mission parameter description as well as a numerical identifier and team-specific call-sign to further distinguish themselves.

Domestically, the Argonian government uses private contractors to undertake just about every dark fantasy a lawmaker could envision, from assassinating troublesome gang leaders to performing raids that end in blood-baths simply to eliminate the need for fair trials for those that would otherwise be arrested. They undertake similar operations out in the marshlands at the behest of the insurgency element that still wages an uncoordinated guerrilla campaign against the Modernist Argonian government, taking their payments in raw narcotics or dirty cash.

More conventional scenarios can also be fulfilled by Blackwood’s personnel. Dignitary protection, site security operations, or the tried and true merc staple of overthrowing an existing regime. They can play the hero or the villain, or somewhere in between, depending on the needs of the client. Blackwood also operates the largest privately owned training facility in the Argonian Republic and frequently trains military and government personnel on a number of disciplines.

The true 'dog soldiers' are the indentured troops from the 'Janissary Clans' that have been cut loose from regular Argonian service or recruited by other means. Janissary Clans frequently take contracts that oppose one another, wagering bragging rights and paying with lives. Lacking Blackwood Company's polish and expertise, these groups undertake a variety of generalist combat missions and can be found rounding out the ranks of local urban gangs as often as they can be seen participating in legitimate security contracts. What the JC troops lack in overall quality they make up for in diversity, where former tribal warriors and disenfranchised former military stand shoulder-to-shoulder and common troopers can have specialty training ranging from operating a main battle tank to constructing a wetlands-capable IED or piloting a helicopter gunship on rare occasions.

While the Clans lack any affiliation with Blackwood Company proper, it isn't uncommon for Blackwood to pirate promising talent from their ranks or sub-contract some of the less complicated dirty jobs out to such organizations where Blackwood's sometimes extortion-worthy price-tag isn't justified.


Bushido Solutions Ltd. is ready to answer your problems and perform any mission at any time, whatever the demand. They are a group of professional private military/security contractors founded by a group of elite veterans from the Nifonese Naval Special Landing Forces Recon, and recruited mostly from various kinds of Tenshinhei and ex - servicemen, as well as foreigners who share their values and stand with them as honorable comrades in arms. Multiple units belonging to their company can operate at the same time in various regions, wherever danger appears. They perform multiple diverse operations such as piracy suppression, EOD, HVT personal protection, large combat operations, or national force training.


The Varangian Guard is the unofficial official security and defense unit of the Falkasian megacorporation Universal Defense. While its existence is not formally recognized nor recorded in any published document, the Guard’s primary directive is to provide asset protection and force projection to best secure the interests of its parent company. Oftentimes, the Guard is deployed to particularly dangerous areas of the world wherein Universal Defense facilities are at risk of direct attack, or more sinisterly as a paramilitary force tasked to directly impose the firm’s corporate whims wherever they’re deemed to be in contradiction to less-than-receptive local governments.

The Guard itself derives its name from the 9th Century mercenary group which served the Byzantine Empire as elite guards and commandos. Unlike the Guard of yore, the modern Varangian Guard are well-paid and loosely disciplined corporate employees and maintain loyalty only to Universal Defense, much to the chagrin and concern of their Falkasian benefactors. An unwritten gentleman’s agreement between the Falkasian Premier and UD CEO however allows the group to exist, despite its’ violation of Falkasian law, in exchange for a variety of political and economic kickbacks.

The Varangian Guard does not, nor Universal Defense by extension, align itself to any particular international mercenary group. However, it does aim to maintain cordial relations with as many of them; so long as the environment created remains conducive to continued business operations.


Myrmidon Security Services is an international Private Security Firm, headquartered in the Republic of Port Ember.

Myrmidon Security Services is serious about its core values: Professionalism and Experience, therefore recruiting only from members of the Port Ember Security Forces (specifically Task Force 79 Special Forces) and Port Ember Secret Service Operators, all with a minimum of 6 years of active operational experience.

Myrmidon Security Services provides upmarket security services to its clients, with an emphasis on professionalism and experience - aims to become "The name and face" of the industry.


Musashi Security Services Ltd. leverages the international experience of Allaneans, Imerians, and others, to provide high-quality security services to your business, government facility, or even your home or gated community. They are there to protect a client's hotel, restaurant, warehouse or shipyard from threats ranging from terrorist attacks, to robberies, to the humble shoplifter.

For this purpose, they have a range of different services available to the client. One will find a number of types of services and qualifications possessed by Musashi Security personnel in their catalog.


Covenant Security Concerns (CSC) is the umbrella organization promoting the large private security firms, mercenary organizations, individual guns for hire and freelancers that operate inside of the Romani-Mar'si Union, follow Marshite theology outside of it, or are otherwise friendly to such things. Rather than being one group on its own, CSC instead takes on the contract making details, command and control duties, and logistical responsibilities of dozens of small groups.

The most common of these groups owe their birth to ages long past, in the time of Marshite Theocratic City-States around 900 BLW (1000 BCE). Each City-State looked to its own defense but often times hired out the Wa'dar Boukush, or the War Blooded, often times member of the Warrior Shrine. These soldier bands were prized as elite fighters and lifelong professionals and were paid handsomely for such efforts. Even after the Long War began it would take some time for the Theocracy to completely militarize the nation-state and the Wa'dar Boukush played a vital role in safeguarding the Theocracy itself. Over time such soldier bands were subsumed into the ever growing military machine of the Theocracy. and by 800 LW such groups had ceased to exist entirely.

Not until 1500 LW, when the Theocracy was in one of its darkest periods of the Long War and underwent a planned diaspora, did such groups return. Unable to spend its primary military forces on the security of these people, Warrior Shrine bands were tasked with protecting groups of such colonies and settlers abroad. Once cut off from the Theocracy, such bands were forced to make hard choices. Settlements would once more pay the newborn Wa'dar Boukush, though this time with manpower, material, food, or gold where possible. Over time those that could not pay would fail and Marshites would integrate into newly emerging nationstates, the Wa'dar Boukush having done their jobs long enough to secure Marshite security abroad and finally being absorbed back into surviving communities.

Marshite militancy would lead to larger-than-average military turnouts from populations abroad. Where possible they became excellent members of a national military. Where such things were unlikely however they would join growing Wa'dar Boukush bands, who often times sold themselves across the world to fight in wars of righteousness. They would inspire others to join, many to convert, and still others to follow their militant example. By 1900 LW, many such bands were operating along the Lardite Coast, raiding Cultist shipping, ports, and inflicting crushing losses on the diminishing Lardite fleet. It was a Wa'dar Boukush led-operation in 1950 LW that secured the Mushroom Islands once and for all and led to the Wa'dar Boukush making contact with Theocratic forces for the first time in hundreds of years. By 1965 LW, the Wa'dar Boukush were bolstered by legions of naval veterans who wanted to attack Slaver shipping across the world and were unable to due to the crippled Marshite navy.

Wa'dar Boukush bands- operating under any number of names by this point- earned fame and renown. Of course, as they spread, many lost contact and spun off in new directions- even as the Long War ended (2100 LW-O ALW). Only after the Prophecy Conflict (8-10 ALW) and with untold millions of Progressives wishing to atone by striking out at evil on their own did the need for this status quo to change emerge. During a meeting in Vesta, it was decided that an overarching organization would be needed to bring the untold number of soldier bands and groups together to better refocus the various Wa'dar Boukush bands. Covenant Security Concerns was formed from the leading members of ten such organizations officially on December 21st, 15 ALW (2015 CE).

Leadership of the CSC is given to the Leadership Council, which is made up of the heads of ten organizations that exist within the CSC. Five organizations have permanent seats at the council, while the other five seats are filled by other organizations. These non-permanent seats change on an annual basis, and by CSC law all organizations must have had their time in the council before non-permanent members get a second chance to sit on the Council. The Leadership Council must okay all contracts with deployments of over 25,000 and debate the merits of contracts if the Contracting Department raises any issue with a potential contract. They also make all appointments to the Logistics Support Department, Intelligence Department, Contractor Support Department, and Public-Government Relations Department.


The Lourens Consortium is named after Michel Gepard Lourens, the audacious and impulsive Cerfonlandean mercenary warlord who comes on as Chief Executive Officer. The Lourens Consortium is currently composed of four member firms:
Canus Security, the first, specializes in base, event, and other security roles.
Huron Authority, second, specializes in air, electronic, and cyberwarfare.
Third, Tarn Defense Solutions is the senior partner, specializing in ground and air operations.
Finally, the fourth partner is Orange-Stoner, another senior firm that is somewhat unique in its offer of large tonnage naval combat support services.
Lourens Consortium was formed as a common storefront for extra-regional contracts secured through membership within the PMC Guild, with deliverable responsibilities defined within the consortium charter and explicitly specified by firm.


SternGuard is one of the largest and leading providers of security, training and specialist solutions in Central Greater Dienstad, with diversified operations that span the entire region and the world. SternGuard is committed to delivering to its clientele a bespoke service to address any and all security concerns; from VIP escorts and installation security, to kinetic close support and frontline battlegroup combat. We also provide diverse training packages that can be tailor made to fit any operational need. We are also one of the world leaders in information security and exploitation, providing experts in the fields of data analysis, signals (Civilian and Military) SIGING and HUMINT, and battlespace C4SIR.


The permanently changing Security situation world wide requires today undyingly new solutions. It is of our highest priority to continuously observe the never ending and changing environment, the equipment, tactics and techniques of the simplest thieves upon to the most sophisticated terror organizations.

Therefore our partners, colleagues and us develop, adjust or implement new security methods and modern techniques constantly. These give us the possibility to run successful missions in all our fields of operations and to update our employees and operators with the most recent protection methods permanently.

Our Network

Global Security Services (Huukach Taalogekhec Taagelaan - GSS) is not a fixed entity but a database network, which can deploy as many operators as required to a mission. This assures to select only the most qualified and professional for each mission specifically.

We select our personnel out of former Takhisian Legionnaires, Takhisian Foreign Legionnaires, Police units and that of the Knighthood. These specialists have the ability to adapt to any culture, situation and environment instantly, this is due to their extensive operational experiences, multi lingual and general knowledge they have gained over many years. These broad capabilities of our operators allow us to provide the highest quality security advise and assistance to our clients and projects.

Our Partners

GSS has excellent relations and partnerships with military training schools, police and governmental institutions within it's own homeland of the Takhisis Order. Building upon this sort of repor, GSS shall take this experience to foreign soil.

Our Teams in foreign countries will eventually be comprised of nationals out of the local communities and international operators and staff. These relations are also a benefit for our clients to integrate rapidly in the local communities and to establish a functioning and successful business.





GUILD LICENSING & BONDING


The Guild is licensing and bonding private military and security firms. Direct membership in the Guild is not a requirement in order to be licensed and bonded.

There are 3 types of licensing available to applying contractors:
Officially Licensed & Bonded Military Contractor
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Officially Licensed & Bonded Security Contractor
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Officially Licensed & Bonded Contractor (For those that do not seem to fit into the previous security or military contractor categories)
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The licensed contractor will pay their bonding fee as part of their licensing that is the sum of the largest contract fee they would possibly charge a client, including standard incidentals. This bonding fee will be made out to the PM/SC Guild Licensing Board and deposited or transmitted electronically into Guild escrow accounts.
The interest yielded will go towards Guild Board operating costs and salaries of the members of the Guild Licensing Board. Bond retainers will be held with the prestigious Engol Banc in Neu Engollon, in interest accruing escrow accounts. [Until such time that we may decide on another GE&T bank that is run by a sturdy player, is well functioning, and suits our needs.]

The licensed contractor may display the appropriate badge (Military/Security/Other) on their website (storefront OP). If they do both military and security contract work, they can display all, or whichever one they feel better represents their main focus. ‘Other’ contractors might include privateers, intelligence/cyber warfare contractors, or logistical/support contractors.


Making a Claim for a Bond or Broken Contracts


A client may make a claim to a bond fee held in escrow for a contractor they have hired, if they can prove that they have been the victim of a broken or incomplete contract, malfeasance or other unprofessional action by said contractor that would affect the client, such as the contractor being a willing participant in war crimes or civil rights violations. [OOC: Claimant client should either post to this thread, or write an IC letter to the Guild IC thread. IC letters will be given more consideration for claims.]

The Guild Licensing Board will review the case and make a decision, which may include a rejection of the claim, a censure of the contractor, probation, a partial payment of the bond fee, depending on the severity of the established damage done to the client, or the whole bond fee paid to said claimant client. Actions may include more than one of these results.

If the Guild has to pay out a partial or full bond fee to a client the contractor has legitimately wronged, then the licensed contractor must replace that full or partial bond fee once again in entirety immediately, or face the stripping of their Guild licensing. If the Guild pays out 1 more bonding full or partial fees to justified claimants (clients), the licensed contractor accused of malfeasance will be stripped of their licensing until a stipulated time to which they can re-apply and be reviewed again for the restoration of their license. A transgression may be deemed so egregious and in poor standard by the Board that a contractor may be stripped of their license, even if only the first offense against their Guild license.

A contractor may appeal this initial decision. The Board may decide that they have recourse, but may also decide not only that they do not have recourse, but might not be eligible to ever apply for licensing again to the Guild Board. This would be deemed a lifetime revocation of license without appeal.


Removal of License and False Licensing Representation


Should a contractor be stripped of their licensing, they will be notified that they can no longer display Guild badges on their website. Legal action will be taken towards non-licensed contractors that continue to use the Guild logo on their website. [website aka storefront, or if they are an RP'd contractor only, they cannot claim they are licensed when they are in fact no longer holders of a Guild license. Take note that a contractor stripped of license would be using IP content on their thread that they no longer have permission to use, in such case that they would ignore calls to remove it.]

The Guild will maintain lists of both those who are licensed [In case they don't maintain a storefront] and those who are no longer licensed in the possibility of a former Guild contractor falsely claiming current license or the failure to take down the Guild Licensing Badge(s) off of the contractor’s website [storefront].

Inversely, a client that has employed Guild licensed contractors and filed false or misleading claims for bond compensation from the Guild may find itself on a boycott list, in which case no Guild or Guild licensor contracts will be served for that client. Any Guild licensed contractor that serves a contract for a boycotted client may find itself under review and censured by the Guild.

The benefits of a Guild license are the prestige of being recognized by your peers, and the confidence and security of the client in knowing that they are employing a reputable contractor over one without any guarantees to follow through providing quality service, or at all. There is strength in a group. The Guild considers itself a well established professional group that represents the highest quality of industry standards. Being licensed by the Guild is to be recognized for accomplishments in the fields of private military, security, and related field contracting and measuring up to the standards expected by discerning clients.


Criteria For Licensing [All OOC]


The Board will be looking for certain criteria from applicants. For instance, not so much listed fees as descriptions of how these fees are assessed and types of additional fees, or incidentals, that might be assessed.

What types of services and levels of services does your company offer?
What types of personnel are available?
What is the history/background of your company? When and how was it established and by who? How has it evolved over time? This adds to the quality of the story of your brand, and your company.

Graphics can add some worth to a storefront and quality work can attract customers. Relevance to the content is important. If there is little content to a storefront and it mostly consists of flashy graphics and standard stock contractors pics being badass in action, then what is really being conveyed to the customer? You are one of multitudes that can fill a niche in their needs for contracted security or military help without really offering quality or substance. You don’t need to be recognized by the industry to do that.

If an applicant does not maintain a storefront and is not on GE&T and only RPs or factbooks/wikis their company, then we must review material relevant to the PMC on a deeper level to make sure that the above qualities are conveyed to future clients through all conceivable means by the applicant for licensing. Be forewarned that this might take more time than storefront review, as we review RP threads, factbooks, etc. to make a determination.


Current Sitting Guild Licensing Board


Who decides licensing, bonding, and arbitration in client/contractor disputes?

The Guild Licensing Board consists of several leaders of the Guild membership, as well as corporate leaders from other industries with experience in dealing with client relationships. They meet at a secret location, but more often use the convenience of video conferencing when discussing licensing and arbitration matters for the Guild.


* While the PM/SC representatives are listed first, with other industry leaders second, there is no other hierarchy order to this list.


How to Start the Process on Becoming Licensed and Bonded with the Guild [All OOC]


Submit an IC letter from either your named company leadership, or an appropriate official, addressed to the Guild Licensing Board, describing briefly why you feel your company should be licensed with the Guild and what it has to offer to the industry. In a spoiler attachment below the body of the letter, include storefront or RP links and any other information you feel may be relevant to us. Notice that we are not providing an actual application to copy and paste. Some applicants would only fill out such an app and ignore the first part of the requirements in the Guild licensing process. These applicants would not be licensed with the Guild, and so we are simply weeding them out early on so as not to waste our time and clutter our thread.
Last edited by Neu Engollon on Mon Mar 01, 2021 9:58 pm, edited 27 times in total.
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Aquitayne
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Ex-Nation

Postby Aquitayne » Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:49 pm

I'd be interested in placing Axalon PMC within this Guild, as well as being a participant. The very WA bill you've cited is also cited within the OP of my own Storefront. Axalon tries to make everyone happy. Well, everyone except the people they're contracted against. ;)

EDIT: Oh, I see you've already put me in the OP! I feel special.
Last edited by Aquitayne on Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Common Territories
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Postby Common Territories » Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:30 pm

Before I choose, who would head or run this guild? Second, what specifically will this guild be limiting that hasn't been stated above? Like specific things I would like to know.

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Shalum
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Postby Shalum » Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:30 pm

Shalumte Security International Private Mercenary Company is interested but we are currently under development but we would like to join.
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Neu Engollon
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Postby Neu Engollon » Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:32 pm

Aquitayne wrote:I'd be interested in placing Axalon PMC within this Guild, as well as being a participant. The very WA bill you've cited is also cited within the OP of my own Storefront. Axalon tries to make everyone happy. Well, everyone except the people they're contracted against. ;)

EDIT: Oh, I see you've already put me in the OP! I feel special.


Cool! Yes, I had you in mind, along with a few others, plus I glaringly left out some other poor RP examples and plagiarizers, but I'm sure they'll respond anyway. Then I will deal with that, leaning towards the side of tolerance right now.
The link you have for WA mercenary legislation is different from the one I'm referring. I was not aware of that one, plus it seems to have been dead stopped, held up by the author.
You can't make everybody happy all the time, am I right? :p
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New Roman Empire
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Postby New Roman Empire » Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:34 pm

The Vordic Suns are interested
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Aquitayne
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Postby Aquitayne » Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:41 pm

Neu Engollon wrote:
Aquitayne wrote:I'd be interested in placing Axalon PMC within this Guild, as well as being a participant. The very WA bill you've cited is also cited within the OP of my own Storefront. Axalon tries to make everyone happy. Well, everyone except the people they're contracted against. ;)

EDIT: Oh, I see you've already put me in the OP! I feel special.


Cool! Yes, I had you in mind, along with a few others, plus I glaringly left out some other poor RP examples and plagiarizers, but I'm sure they'll respond anyway. Then I will deal with that, leaning towards the side of tolerance right now.
The link you have for WA mercenary legislation is different from the one I'm referring. I was not aware of that one, plus it seems to have been dead stopped, held up by the author.
You can't make everybody happy all the time, am I right? :p


Hmm, I guess that's why I tell myself not to assume things (even though I go off and do them anyway). Regardless, any WA-legislation this Guild decides to adhere to, Axalon will do so willingly.
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The Wheat Isles
Diplomat
 
Posts: 776
Founded: May 25, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby The Wheat Isles » Sat Jun 01, 2013 5:58 pm

The Wheat Elite are interested in this agreement, as we are a growing PMC company ourselves. OOC wise, I'm going to try and spruce up my company's logo and add other stuff like what the typical Wheat elite soldier is like now that I just got Photoshop. I hope it at least works....

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Neu Engollon
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Founded: Aug 13, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Neu Engollon » Sat Jun 01, 2013 9:09 pm

Common Territories wrote:Before I choose, who would head or run this guild? Second, what specifically will this guild be limiting that hasn't been stated above? Like specific things I would like to know.


The Guild would be run by quorum of all the members. Voting Yeah or Nay for agenda items to put together a charter, new rules, approve new members, vet new PMCs for guild membership, discuss new issues effecting the industry, and also helping to settle differences when two or more PMCs find themselves on opposite sides of a conflict.

The guild wouldn't be so much worrying about limiting anything, other than maybe bad RP - business or warmaking. Actual legislation and rule making is done by national governments and the WA resolutions that have been listed above.
Although, with the signing of a charter, members will agree to abide by certain guidelines or 'agreements', those that don't sign or are refused membership, do not get guild approval, so they are not vetted and...I don't know, miss out on potential business, but probably not even that. There's more than plenty of business to go around in II. The debatable quality of it is another matter.

So...Great, glad to hear you all have some interest. I will list people up in the OP. Eventually I will get to making an IC thread, with a working draft of a charter for all to sign, maybe some background history on the industry (I'm pretty well versed on it and have a mini-library on it.) An application for membership, to make it official, and applications to review the actions of a member or an outside PMC by clients. Also, I would list all the members, with links to storefronts, or to TG them if they didn't run a storefront.
Input on what else you'd like to see within the guild is welcome and encouraged.


The Wheat Isles wrote:The Wheat Elite are interested in this agreement, as we are a growing PMC company ourselves. OOC wise, I'm going to try and spruce up my company's logo and add other stuff like what the typical Wheat elite soldier is like now that I just got Photoshop. I hope it at least works....


Great! I'd like to see it. I need to add more graphics to my own store, too.

Aquitayne wrote:Hmm, I guess that's why I tell myself not to assume things (even though I go off and do them anyway). Regardless, any WA-legislation this Guild decides to adhere to, Axalon will do so willingly.


It's confusing, but there are several attempts at WA legislation on the PMC/mercenary issue. I will link them all now:

World Mercenary Convention.

On Mercenaries.

Mercenary Regulation Act.

The Mercenary Accord.

Mercenary's Profession Act.

PMC and Mercenary Regulation
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Eternally Warring Spartanians
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Founded: Mar 24, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Eternally Warring Spartanians » Sat Jun 01, 2013 9:35 pm

The E.W.S. are interested.

Be aware storefront link will be changed soon. I'm getting around to making a new one as the current one is very sub-par and no where near my Coeli Standard.

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Common Territories
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Common Territories » Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:12 pm

Well look. First off I do not despise this idea. It's a nice idea for people who need it and who are interested in the idea itself. I however am not interested. The idea is great but there are factors that I do not like about it that are IC based mostly. For starters, I see in the future if I did join this organization it would limit my storefront in some way. In some way somehow I know it will do this and my senses are telling me this as well. Secondly, my storefront would never let foreigners run how they operate their company. We do business with anyone and we serve the customer fully; this organization appears to be preparing ways to stop possible sales. I sell to anyone including those who have less then good tastes, bad IC, and questionable requests. IC'ly, my storefront does not like being controlled by foreigners in any shape or form so that's just how it is. Even if this is not the case (which I doubt because my senses are usually spot on), I still do not trust the situation. Nothing personal but my companies will not be joining this guild.

Also, the WA is not cannon to me nor do I care one brain cell that they pass laws against them or regulating them. Im not afraid of them one bit nor am I of the random bleeding hearts who declare war over something small.
Last edited by Common Territories on Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Neu Engollon
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Neu Engollon » Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:38 pm

Common Territories wrote:Well look. First off I do not despise this idea. It's a nice idea for people who need it and who are interested in the idea itself. I however am not interested. The idea is great but there are factors that I do not like about it that are IC based mostly. For starters, I see in the future if I did join this organization it would limit my storefront in some way. In some way somehow I know it will do this and my senses are telling me this as well. Secondly, my storefront would never let foreigners run how they operate their company. We do business with anyone and we serve the customer fully; this organization appears to be preparing ways to stop possible sales. I sell to anyone including those who have less then good tastes, bad IC, and questionable requests. IC'ly, my storefront does not like being controlled by foreigners in any shape or form so that's just how it is. Even if this is not the case (which I doubt because my senses are usually spot on), I still do not trust the situation. Nothing personal but my companies will not be joining this guild.

Also, the WA is not cannon to me nor do I care one brain cell that they pass laws against them or regulating them. Im not afraid of them one bit nor am I of the random bleeding hearts who declare war over something small.


Well, ultimately, I understand your decision and respect it. I think in part I'm either not fully explaining things or you are misinterpreting something.
Especially with the WA, do what you want, they really have no way to enforce anything on us, other than it gives a decent set of guidelines, as I previously stated.

Neu Engollon wrote:As well, we would try to adhere, or at least keep as guidelines, some WA legislation, such as this one coming up for review.


So, even with the guild, I wouldn't think it would be so oppressive that we threaten to come after any non-complying PMC, or sick the WA on them, who again, have no way to come after anyone or enforce anything, but rather, the greatest measure taken would be dis-association. No one can really stop anyone else's sales, but they might find some sales in poor judgement.
In regards to WA Resolutions:
The guy writing the current debated legislation was originally going to go for total ban on mercenaries and PMCS, which clearer heads prevailed on. Had that happened, I would firmly be in the non-WA compliant camp and not giving a fig. But it didn't, and I think regulation is not a horrible thing. Ultimately, we're looking at creating a business community to set standards and expectations, that's really the bulk of what a guild does.

Another thought: Sometime down the line, it could be an interesting RP to have a pro-guild faction of PMCs vs the Anti-guild, led by Commoner Leagues.
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Republica Newland
Minister
 
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Founded: Oct 19, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Republica Newland » Sun Jun 02, 2013 6:19 am

How about a PMC rating system?

EDIT: Disregard that,this is way too involved. I'm gonna do a PMC rating myself.

On another note,if this were more economically and politically oriented (a lobby group that could push for favorable legislation,etc) and less ethics-based I would have liked it
Last edited by Republica Newland on Sun Jun 02, 2013 6:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Neu Engollon
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Founded: Aug 13, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:06 am

Republica Newland wrote:How about a PMC rating system?

EDIT: Disregard that,this is way too involved. I'm gonna do a PMC rating myself.

On another note,if this were more economically and politically oriented (a lobby group that could push for favorable legislation,etc) and less ethics-based I would have liked it


You have a point, and usually a guild is mostly economically based. I do feel that there should be some minimum accountability and some regulation as to how a PMC would act, (no matter how their actions are RP'd OOC, the IC consequence of those actions is what matters here). Since this would be democratically run by all the members voting, I most certainly could be voted down and the guild could very well be turned more strictly to being an economic aid for all parties involved, rather than a regulatory body.

EDIT: Also, another point. You would want a guild to push for favorable legislation, but not be ethics based. That seems sort of contrary to me. In order for the guild to even care about legislation, they would have to be prepared to somewhat follow that legislation, whether it was favorable or not. Legislation is going to inherently try to influence the IC ethics of the industry, so I don't see how the two issues are separate.
Last edited by Neu Engollon on Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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New Roman Empire
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Founded: Nov 23, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby New Roman Empire » Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:09 am

The Guild could set up its own guild lines. I believe that would benefit everyone in the guild.
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Neu Engollon
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Neu Engollon » Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:22 am

New Roman Empire wrote:The Guild could set up its own guild lines. I believe that would benefit everyone in the guild.


Yes, I'm thinking you typo'd and meant 'guide' lines. They would be beneficial and that would be part of the main purpose. They may parallel WA Resolutions, but they might go against them, too. That totally depends on member participation, which is why I hope people don't get driven away by even the mention of the WA. They have to be aware that WA legislation is out there and has some bearing, whether one chooses to follow it or not.

Another note, I saw that you applied to be a subsidiary linked company to Commoner Leagues. If they end up not being in the guild, how exactly would that effect Vordic Suns and the relationship between the two of you?
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New Roman Empire
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Founded: Nov 23, 2011
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Postby New Roman Empire » Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:48 am

Neu Engollon wrote:
New Roman Empire wrote:The Guild could set up its own guild lines. I believe that would benefit everyone in the guild.


Yes, I'm thinking you typo'd and meant 'guide' lines. They would be beneficial and that would be part of the main purpose. They may parallel WA Resolutions, but they might go against them, too. That totally depends on member participation, which is why I hope people don't get driven away by even the mention of the WA. They have to be aware that WA legislation is out there and has some bearing, whether one chooses to follow it or not.

Another note, I saw that you applied to be a subsidiary linked company to Commoner Leagues. If they end up not being in the guild, how exactly would that effect Vordic Suns and the relationship between the two of you?

Wont effect a thing, is just more of a profits thing.
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Common Territories
Senator
 
Posts: 4325
Founded: Nov 08, 2011
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Common Territories » Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:56 pm

Neu Engollon wrote:
Common Territories wrote:Well look. First off I do not despise this idea. It's a nice idea for people who need it and who are interested in the idea itself. I however am not interested. The idea is great but there are factors that I do not like about it that are IC based mostly. For starters, I see in the future if I did join this organization it would limit my storefront in some way. In some way somehow I know it will do this and my senses are telling me this as well. Secondly, my storefront would never let foreigners run how they operate their company. We do business with anyone and we serve the customer fully; this organization appears to be preparing ways to stop possible sales. I sell to anyone including those who have less then good tastes, bad IC, and questionable requests. IC'ly, my storefront does not like being controlled by foreigners in any shape or form so that's just how it is. Even if this is not the case (which I doubt because my senses are usually spot on), I still do not trust the situation. Nothing personal but my companies will not be joining this guild.

Also, the WA is not cannon to me nor do I care one brain cell that they pass laws against them or regulating them. Im not afraid of them one bit nor am I of the random bleeding hearts who declare war over something small.


Well, ultimately, I understand your decision and respect it. I think in part I'm either not fully explaining things or you are misinterpreting something.
Especially with the WA, do what you want, they really have no way to enforce anything on us, other than it gives a decent set of guidelines, as I previously stated.

Neu Engollon wrote:As well, we would try to adhere, or at least keep as guidelines, some WA legislation, such as this one coming up for review.


So, even with the guild, I wouldn't think it would be so oppressive that we threaten to come after any non-complying PMC, or sick the WA on them, who again, have no way to come after anyone or enforce anything, but rather, the greatest measure taken would be dis-association. No one can really stop anyone else's sales, but they might find some sales in poor judgement.
In regards to WA Resolutions:
The guy writing the current debated legislation was originally going to go for total ban on mercenaries and PMCS, which clearer heads prevailed on. Had that happened, I would firmly be in the non-WA compliant camp and not giving a fig. But it didn't, and I think regulation is not a horrible thing. Ultimately, we're looking at creating a business community to set standards and expectations, that's really the bulk of what a guild does.

Another thought: Sometime down the line, it could be an interesting RP to have a pro-guild faction of PMCs vs the Anti-guild, led by Commoner Leagues.



No you explained it fine, I just will not allow my storefront IC or OOC to be regulated by other storefronts. You may find regulation dandy but I do not and I will not allow others to regulate my business for any cause they have. Im not afraid of the WA, like you said, they have no power over me or my business. I personally laugh at the WA people who think their laws are of God's origins even though they cannot be enforced.


Secondly. I would hope that this guild does not interfere with my business or acts irrationally as you explained. Stunts like that will not be tolerated as it should be. It is good they didn't put that up to vote like you said but I don't condone any regulation by those people in the WA. Ultimately, my corporation already has basic standards in force and my storefront already has many of the ideas you pledged to do. Good luck with your guild though.

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Eternally Warring Spartanians
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Posts: 268
Founded: Mar 24, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Eternally Warring Spartanians » Sun Jun 02, 2013 9:47 pm

Ive got the new storefront going up, page by page. So its slow and a WIP, buts it getting there. Tell me what you all think.

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Aquitayne
Senator
 
Posts: 3883
Founded: Jun 24, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Aquitayne » Mon Jun 03, 2013 4:32 am

Eternally Warring Spartanians wrote:Ive got the new storefront going up, page by page. So its slow and a WIP, buts it getting there. Tell me what you all think.


It looks good so far, but I would shorten up that entire "BASIC CONTRACT, TERMS OF HIRING E.W.S. CONTRACTORS AND ASSETS" part. It's very long and very confusing, and not many people are going to actually stop and read it all. I would keep it to something short and simple but still what you want to say - you can use the one in my thread as a guide if you like. Just a suggestion.
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Neu Engollon
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Founded: Aug 13, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Neu Engollon » Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:45 am

Common Territories wrote:No you explained it fine, I just will not allow my storefront IC or OOC to be regulated by other storefronts. You may find regulation dandy but I do not and I will not allow others to regulate my business for any cause they have. Im not afraid of the WA, like you said, they have no power over me or my business. I personally laugh at the WA people who think their laws are of God's origins even though they cannot be enforced.


Secondly. I would hope that this guild does not interfere with my business or acts irrationally as you explained. Stunts like that will not be tolerated as it should be. It is good they didn't put that up to vote like you said but I don't condone any regulation by those people in the WA. Ultimately, my corporation already has basic standards in force and my storefront already has many of the ideas you pledged to do. Good luck with your guild though.


I don't think we're planning on acting irrationally, or pulling stunts. Most of the PMCs, including your own, have standards already, yes. I already said we would use the WA Regulations as guidelines, not as hard, fast rule. This is an interest thread and nothing really has been set in stone or truly decided, yet. I think you have made up your mind about this no matter what results we come up with, or what we say otherwise.

For us here, stuff has just been brainstormed. It sounds to me that whatever we decide to do, whether it's set standards, make an economic pact, influence just OOC or just IC decisions of a member and/or the industry, or whatever else, you are opposed. You want no part of this guild and you have your own guild, so to speak, (Having taken in Vordic and Akuma) with your own rules that your subsidiaries must abide by. Got it. Thank you for your input.
Last edited by Neu Engollon on Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:31 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Neu Engollon
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Founded: Aug 13, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Neu Engollon » Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:04 am

Aquitayne wrote:
Eternally Warring Spartanians wrote:Ive got the new storefront going up, page by page. So its slow and a WIP, buts it getting there. Tell me what you all think.


It looks good so far, but I would shorten up that entire "BASIC CONTRACT, TERMS OF HIRING E.W.S. CONTRACTORS AND ASSETS" part. It's very long and very confusing, and not many people are going to actually stop and read it all. I would keep it to something short and simple but still what you want to say - you can use the one in my thread as a guide if you like. Just a suggestion.


I think the difference is if you RP your own PMC troops, or only sell them as a commodity. For EWS, I think, like myself, that it's mainly for RP purposes to cover your bases to have a longer basic terms contract. If you're just selling your services solely as a GE&T commodity and nothing more, with no II or Nationstates overlap, then it probably isn't necessary to have a longer basic contract.

I personally do both, with hiring out for training, I don't RP the advisers/trainers in most cases, but for purposes of actual conflict, I won't let others RP my PMC operators. I may make an exception down the road, but I would have to seriously trust that someone understands their whole canon, will use them effectively and wisely and can RP them well. That's my personal OOC standards for my PMC.

The other difference is if you're trying to attract people on NS to your storefront and sell something like you would sell a flashy car, you would make it less wordy. If you're trying to shoot for MT realism, RL PMCs have a contract that's like a book, they're a business and they have to cover their asses, so the more legalese thrown in to make a contract solid and not debatable after the fact, the better. People are getting shot at, after all, and national integrity is on the line.
Again, this is just me, I don't want clients that just want to hire my PMC because mercs are cool and they go shooty bang bang and win your one-liner RP war. I want to join story/character driven RPs, so I will turn those prospective clients down in most cases. I'm less picky when it comes to simple training or VIP protection contracts.

Hopefully, we have room for PMCs in the guild that RP all the different ways. I'm not trying to be overly critical or elitist, but explain where someone might be coming from. Through TG, me and EWS have pretty much established that we're trying to find a balance on NS between a flashy storefront that brings in customers, and one that is realistically MT playable in an RP. That's hard to do, and not turn off potential business.

EDIT: PS I do like your storefront, Aquitayne. It strikes a pretty good balance in those things I mentioned.
Last edited by Neu Engollon on Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Common Territories
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Founded: Nov 08, 2011
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Common Territories » Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:08 am

I am only against regulations that can come from this guild, of which you said were possibly in the future. Until otherwise proven wrong, I will have to abstain from participating.

I do not run a guild of any sorts. I run a corporation that owns subsidiaries who have willingly partnered with my company. So I wouldn't say it's a guild but a corporation made up my company as the parent and subsidiaries that are daughter/son companies. I have nothing against the guild idea because it's a great idea tbh, it just simply crosses our ideals in some way in the future possibly.

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Neu Engollon
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Founded: Aug 13, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Neu Engollon » Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:29 am

By definition pulled off of Google, A guild is: An association of persons of the same trade or pursuits, formed to protect mutual interests and maintain standards or the pursuit of a common goal.

So, you, Commoner Leagues, see yourself as merely a parent company, and Akuma might see themselves as your subsidiary, I don't know, but Vordic Suns, one of your new 'subsidiaries', however, might not see it that way:

New Roman Empire wrote:
Neu Engollon wrote:...I saw that you applied to be a subsidiary linked company to Commoner Leagues. If they end up not being in the guild, how exactly would that effect Vordic Suns and the relationship between the two of you?

Wont effect a thing, is just more of a profits thing.


So, he might not see Commoner Leagues as a parent company, but rather as a tool in pursuit of a common goal, that goal being to make money. You, as the parent company, might say, we will have no association with that guild, because they might set industry standards in the future that interfere with the ideals of our company. Your subsidiary assumes they aren't bound by your parent company rules, and will join the guild if they please. You think of it as a parent to subsidiary company relationship, but your subsidiary seems to view it as more of a mutual association.
Last edited by Neu Engollon on Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:32 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Eternally Warring Spartanians
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Posts: 268
Founded: Mar 24, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Eternally Warring Spartanians » Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:02 am

Neu Engollon wrote:
Aquitayne wrote:
It looks good so far, but I would shorten up that entire "BASIC CONTRACT, TERMS OF HIRING E.W.S. CONTRACTORS AND ASSETS" part. It's very long and very confusing, and not many people are going to actually stop and read it all. I would keep it to something short and simple but still what you want to say - you can use the one in my thread as a guide if you like. Just a suggestion.


I think the difference is if you RP your own PMC troops, or only sell them as a commodity. For EWS, I think, like myself, that it's mainly for RP purposes to cover your bases to have a longer basic terms contract. If you're just selling your services solely as a GE&T commodity and nothing more, with no II or Nationstates overlap, then it probably isn't necessary to have a longer basic contract.

I personally do both, with hiring out for training, I don't RP the advisers/trainers in most cases, but for purposes of actual conflict, I won't let others RP my PMC operators. I may make an exception down the road, but I would have to seriously trust that someone understands their whole canon, will use them effectively and wisely and can RP them well. That's my personal OOC standards for my PMC.

The other difference is if you're trying to attract people on NS to your storefront and sell something like you would sell a flashy car, you would make it less wordy. If you're trying to shoot for MT realism, RL PMCs have a contract that's like a book, they're a business and they have to cover their asses, so the more legalese thrown in to make a contract solid and not debatable after the fact, the better. People are getting shot at, after all, and national integrity is on the line.
Again, this is just me, I don't want clients that just want to hire my PMC because mercs are cool and they go shooty bang bang and win your one-liner RP war. I want to join story/character driven RPs, so I will turn those prospective clients down in most cases. I'm less picky when it comes to simple training or VIP protection contracts.

Hopefully, we have room for PMCs in the guild that RP all the different ways. I'm not trying to be overly critical or elitist, but explain where someone might be coming from. Through TG, me and EWS have pretty much established that we're trying to find a balance on NS between a flashy storefront that brings in customers, and one that is realistically MT playable in an RP. That's hard to do, and not turn off potential business.

EDIT: PS I do like your storefront, Aquitayne. It strikes a pretty good balance in those things I mentioned.


He said it all. Its for roleplay reason, that and with the fact that I'm one of the few PMCs that will probably openly advertise assassination, for now, you know I defiantly need to cover my ass.

Like Commoner League I'm willing to sell to anyone. Mob bosses, illegal arms dealers, the works. The real difference between me and him is that fact that I'm willing to bring the storefront in line with "regulations" in order keep my thread from accumulating "I condemn you spam." That's another reason I'm really down with the whole guild thing. RP wise it will make my storefront still look like a golden apple, even if its rotten underneath.

I'm also not opposed to the political RP that may or may not come from me getting caught and found out. I'm not opposed to roleplaying the "bad" guy so long as its in a good roleplay.

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