Why a God must have created the universe.

[Karinzistan]

The universe. How did it get here? It couldn't have gotten here on its own. That would be an example of spontaneous generation, a theory disproved a long, long, time ago. It couldn't have always been here. That to, would be impossible according to science. Therefore, the only possible answer would be that something else would have had to have created it. What's the only thing that could do that? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God.(or many, but that's a discussion for another time.) Well you might be thinking, how did God get here, then? Well, what's the only thing with the ability to create itself? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God. Therefore, a God must have created the universe.

[Divair]

And who says the universe didn't create itself? Who says the universe had to have a beginning?

[Laerod]

The universe. How did it get here? It couldn't have gotten here on its own. That would be an example of spontaneous generation, a theory disproved a long, long, time ago. It couldn't have always been here. That to, would be impossible according to science. Therefore, the only possible answer would be that something else would have had to have created it. What's the only thing that could do that? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God.(or many, but that's a discussion for another time.) Well you might be thinking, how did God get here, then? Well, what's the only thing with the ability to create itself? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God. Therefore, a God must have created the universe.

A logical argument requires the premise to be true. Not only is your premise not true (when and how would spontaneous creation have been disproven?), it's irrelevant. Whatever happens in the universe happens under the universe's rules. Whatever happens beforehand is not beholden to this universe's laws and requirements.

[Karinzistan]

And who says the universe didn't create itself? Who says the universe had to have a beginning?

Basic science.

[Ceannairceach]

The universe. How did it get here? It couldn't have gotten here on its own. That would be an example of spontaneous generation, a theory disproved a long, long, time ago. It couldn't have always been here. That to, would be impossible according to science. Therefore, the only possible answer would be that something else would have had to have created it. What's the only thing that could do that? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God.(or many, but that's a discussion for another time.) Well you might be thinking, how did God get here, then? Well, what's the only thing with the ability to create itself? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God. Therefore, a God must have created the universe.

Wait, no. Your entire post fails at the point where you stated the underlined. Something cannot create itself from nothing, even using your own twisted logic. If everything must have a creator, a premise you accepted at the beginning of your post, then so must god. And god cannot have created himself, because that would mean he had already existed.

Your circular reasoning is not appreciated.

[Avenio]

The universe. How did it get here? It couldn't have gotten here on its own.

Why not? God apparently did.

That would be an example of spontaneous generation, a theory disproved a long, long, time ago.

That is not spontaneous generation. Spontaneous generation has to do with maggots popping into existence in rotten meat, not the creation of the universe.

It couldn't have always been here. That to, would be impossible according to science.

What does 'always been here' mean? The Big Bang was the beginning of time, so the universe has 'always' existed, in that time didn't exist before it. Besides which, there are all sorts of theories associated with cosmogony.

Therefore, the only possible answer would be that something else would have had to have created it. What's the only thing that could do that? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God.(or many, but that's a discussion for another time.) Well you might be thinking, how did God get here, then? Well, what's the only thing with the ability to create itself? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God. Therefore, a God must have created the universe.

Circular reasoning works because circular reasoning works, etc.

[Tlaceceyaya]

The universe. How did it get here? It couldn't have gotten here on its own. That would be an example of spontaneous generation, a theory disproved a long, long, time ago. It couldn't have always been here. That to, would be impossible according to science. Therefore, the only possible answer would be that something else would have had to have created it. What's the only thing that could do that? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God.(or many, but that's a discussion for another time.) Well you might be thinking, how did God get here, then? Well, what's the only thing with the ability to create itself? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God. Therefore, a God must have created the universe.

You do not know how the universe got here, therefore... god? And if you believe so, how did god get there?

[Threlizdun]

Which is more complex, the universe, or something that can create the universe? Something with the power to form the universe is more unlikely than the universe itself.

[Ceannairceach]

And who says the universe didn't create itself? Who says the universe had to have a beginning?

Basic science.

Wrong. Time as we know it started with the big bang and the rapid expansion of the universe from its starting point. Thus, the universe theoretically has always existed because it existed before time.

[Genivaria]

And who says the universe didn't create itself? Who says the universe had to have a beginning?

Basic science.

Clarify.

[Divair]

And who says the universe didn't create itself? Who says the universe had to have a beginning?

Basic science.

Alright. So science says that nothing can exist forever, correct?

Then why does a god get to break those rules? Why can't I simply say "Well, the universe is itself, so it gets to break the rules."

[Nude East Ireland]

There is no scientific evidence to show that God magically waved his hands and caused the universe to 'happen.' Therefore, it is false.

/thread

[Karinzistan]

The universe. How did it get here? It couldn't have gotten here on its own. That would be an example of spontaneous generation, a theory disproved a long, long, time ago. It couldn't have always been here. That to, would be impossible according to science. Therefore, the only possible answer would be that something else would have had to have created it. What's the only thing that could do that? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God.(or many, but that's a discussion for another time.) Well you might be thinking, how did God get here, then? Well, what's the only thing with the ability to create itself? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God. Therefore, a God must have created the universe.

A logical argument requires the premise to be true. Not only is your premise not true (when and how would spontaneous creation have been disproven?), it's irrelevant. Whatever happens in the universe happens under the universe's rules. Whatever happens beforehand is not beholden to this universe's laws and requirements.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_generation "spontaneous generation is an obsolete principle..."
It's true. I just proved why it had to be. No, because the universe would have to follow its own rules in its creation. Also, it is an abstract concept. It doesn't think or create. It's just a space.

[Karinzistan]

There is no scientific evidence to show that God magically waved his hands and caused the universe to 'happen.' Therefore, it is false.

/thread

Nope. It is the only possible explanation.

[The Orson Empire]

Basic science.

Wrong. Time as we know it started with the big bang and the rapid expansion of the universe from its starting point. Thus, the universe theoretically has always existed because it existed before time.

I do not believe in the Big Bang. And humans do not know everything. we barely know anything about our own galaxy!

[Karinzistan]

Basic science.

Alright. So science says that nothing can exist forever, correct?

Then why does a god get to break those rules? Why can't I simply say "Well, the universe is itself, so it gets to break the rules."

Science does not say something can exist forever.

[Impius Gentes]

The universe. How did it get here? It couldn't have gotten here on its own. That would be an example of spontaneous generation, a theory disproved a long, long, time ago. It couldn't have always been here. That to, would be impossible according to science. Therefore, the only possible answer would be that something else would have had to have created it. What's the only thing that could do that? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God.(or many, but that's a discussion for another time.) Well you might be thinking, how did God get here, then? Well, what's the only thing with the ability to create itself? Something with ultimate power. What's the only conceivable thing with ultimate power? God. Therefore, a God must have created the universe.

1. Your logic is incredibly flawed
2. Troll harder.

[Samuraikoku]

There is no scientific evidence to show that God magically waved his hands and caused the universe to 'happen.' Therefore, it is false.

/thread

Nope. It is the only possible explanation.

Says who?

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

I really wish people would stop making these sort of threads because it makes people take me less seriously as a consequence.

[Rethan]

There is no scientific evidence to show that God magically waved his hands and caused the universe to 'happen.' Therefore, it is false.

/thread

Nope. It is the only possible explanation.

Except, you know, all those other explanations backed up by scientific hypotheses and evidence, right?

[Divair]

There is no scientific evidence to show that God magically waved his hands and caused the universe to 'happen.' Therefore, it is false.

/thread

Nope. It is the only possible explanation.

"Something I made up can break all the rules of physics. Why does he get to break them? Because I gave him the imaginary power to do so!"

No. This is not science.

[Imsogone]

What a wonderful invitation to infinite regression!

So there had to be a first cause to the universe. But what created the first cause? And what created that which created the first cause. And so on ad infinitum. Somewhere, sometime, you're going to have to hit on something that wasn't created but simply existed without beginning and without end. You'd like to call it God. I'll call it the universe.

[Nude East Ireland]

There is no scientific evidence to show that God magically waved his hands and caused the universe to 'happen.' Therefore, it is false.

/thread

Nope. It is the only possible explanation.

O rly?

[Nightkill the Emperor]

Before the Big Bang, we obviously had the Big Foreplay.

[1000 Cats]

Spontaneous generation is actually completely possible. Steven Hawking was instrumental in showing that, and he gives a good account of it in A Brief History of Time.