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[PASSED] Repeal "Liberate Free Thought"

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Revert
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[PASSED] Repeal "Liberate Free Thought"

Postby Revert » Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:45 pm

OBSERVING that the Liberation was intended to protect Free Thought from griefing by returning its control to a native;

NOTING that since the Liberation of Free Thought, [nation=short+noflag]Luna Amore[/nation] (the last remaining native) has re-founded the region;

FURTHER NOTING that since the region has been re-founded this resolution no longer affects Free Thought;

AWARE that since Free Thought now has a founder, raiding groups such as The Land of Kings and Emperors are no longer a threat to Free Thought, its WFE or its flag;

RECOGNIZING that Luna Amore desires to have this resolution repealed;

CONCLUDING that this resolution is now obsolete;

WISHING to keep the Security Council's resolutions up to date;

HEREBY Repeals 'Liberate Free Thought'.


*2nd Draft*
Last edited by Sedgistan on Fri Sep 16, 2011 9:32 am, edited 6 times in total.

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Connopolis
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Postby Connopolis » Tue Aug 30, 2011 3:11 pm

I'm just curious, but they're not longer liberated anyways, are they?I can see myself supporting this repeal, because as of now, the liberation is blatantly useless.

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Last edited by Connopolis on Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Black Marne
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Ex-Nation

Postby Black Marne » Tue Aug 30, 2011 3:25 pm

You'll need testimony of Luna Amore, I believe, if you want this proposal to go any further. Otherwise you may not get support for this. Also, you might want to make a few more drafts of this proposal, because your current argument seems rather weak.

-The Allied States of Black Marne
Defense, Liberation, Bacon: UDL

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World Assembly Delegate of New Dinosaurtopia

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Sedgistan
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Ex-Nation

Postby Sedgistan » Tue Aug 30, 2011 3:31 pm

As I said via TG, you need to address the original resolution a bit more - say why the reasons for passing it (to protect against griefing, and to restore the region to native control) are no longer valid, as the region was freed from invader occupation, and then re-founded by a native.

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Revert
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Postby Revert » Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:39 am

I added a bit more to try to reference the original resolution.

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Sedgistan
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Ex-Nation

Postby Sedgistan » Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:43 am

Revert wrote:NOTING that since the Liberation of Free Thought, [nation=short+noflag]Luna Amore[/nation] (the last living native) has re-founded the region;

Change 'living' to something like 'remaining', so you don't violate Rule 4.

FURTHER NOTING that since the region has been re-founded this resolution no longer affects Free Thought;

Well technically, the resolution is still in effect - if the founder CTEd, the delegate wouldn't be able to password the region.

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Revert
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Postby Revert » Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:47 am

Sedgistan wrote:
FURTHER NOTING that since the region has been re-founded this resolution no longer affects Free Thought;

Well technically, the resolution is still in effect - if the founder CTEd, the delegate wouldn't be able to password the region.
Hmm, but it doesn't have a Liberation badge anymore. Would that reappear if Luna CTEd?

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Sedgistan
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Ex-Nation

Postby Sedgistan » Wed Aug 31, 2011 7:17 am

The Liberation badge should be there, but none of the Game Mods/Admins have yet got around to restoring it.

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Omigodtheykilledkenny
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Postby Omigodtheykilledkenny » Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:09 am

Are you sure Liberations apply to re-founded regions? Try having the Delegate impose a password and see what happens.
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Luna Amore
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Postby Luna Amore » Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:23 am

Omigodtheykilledkenny wrote:Are you sure Liberations apply to re-founded regions? Try having the Delegate impose a password and see what happens.

I've asked the delegate to try and throw a password up. I always assumed since the badge was gone, the Liberation effects were gone.

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Omigodtheykilledkenny
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Postby Omigodtheykilledkenny » Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:12 am

The resolution liberated the old region, not the new one, so it'll be interesting to see if it would even work. :p
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Luna Amore
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Postby Luna Amore » Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:52 am

Luna Amore wrote:
Omigodtheykilledkenny wrote:Are you sure Liberations apply to re-founded regions? Try having the Delegate impose a password and see what happens.

I've asked the delegate to try and throw a password up. I always assumed since the badge was gone, the Liberation effects were gone.
In the meantime, I threw up a password, tried to enter the region with a puppet, and was denied access. So as founder I can still password the region.

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Improving Wordiness
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Postby Improving Wordiness » Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:10 pm

Founders can still password even after a region has been liberated. It is the Delegate that is restricted. You may want to test if the Delegate can password :)
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Unibot II
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Ex-Nation

Postby Unibot II » Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:39 pm

Omigodtheykilledkenny wrote:Are you sure Liberations apply to re-founded regions? Try having the Delegate impose a password and see what happens.


Technically the liberation will not stick:

[violet] wrote:
But, what if let's say, Democratia died, and then was later refounded. Would it still be 'liberated'?

Nope, it would be a completely new region that happened to share the same name as an old one.


But admins may consider this a circumvention of the game -- if you've been condemned, commended or liberated by the SC .. you're only option is supposed to be to repeal, not just trick out the server. Thus the admns could probably fix each case of circumventation manually. I dunno.
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Revert
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Postby Revert » Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:42 pm

Unibot II wrote:
Omigodtheykilledkenny wrote:Are you sure Liberations apply to re-founded regions? Try having the Delegate impose a password and see what happens.


Technically the liberation will not stick:

[violet] wrote:Nope, it would be a completely new region that happened to share the same name as an old one.


But admins may consider this a circumvention of the game -- if you've been condemned, commended or liberated by the SC .. you're only option is supposed to be to repeal, not just trick out the server. Thus the admns could probably fix each case of circumventation manually. I dunno.

So is it fair to say that the resolution no longer affects Free Thought in the repeal or should I leave that part out?

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Fratt
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Postby Fratt » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:03 pm

We'll have to wait until the Delegate has enough influence to try imposing a password before knowing that.
If the resolution does no longer affects Free Thought I think there's no point in repealing it.
A spambot wrote:
You said that the NPO should not change it's core culture.

Literally everyone else, including the NPO, realizes and understands that NPO culture is the problem.
I'm sure these are the best towel warmers and it will come in handy here.
So you either don't realize that the NPO's core culture caused a war and the subversion of countless regions, or you just don't care.

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Revert
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Postby Revert » Thu Sep 01, 2011 3:43 pm

Fratt wrote:We'll have to wait until the Delegate has enough influence to try imposing a password before knowing that.
If the resolution does no longer affects Free Thought I think there's no point in repealing it.
To clean up the resolutions. If it has no purpose, it should be repealed. Since there is a founder, it has no purpose.

Anyhow, I submitted. It's a pretty standard repeal of an obviously obsolete Liberation.
Last edited by Revert on Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Topid
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Postby Topid » Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:38 pm

Revert wrote:To clean up the resolutions. If it has no purpose, it should be repealed. Since there is a founder, it has no purpose.

Eh, not worth four days of tied up WA IMO. No one will even notice the resolution since the badge is not on the region and the effects don't apply to the region.

If it has no negative effects, there is no purpose to repeal it.
Last edited by Topid on Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Revert
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Postby Revert » Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:52 pm

Topid wrote:
Revert wrote:To clean up the resolutions. If it has no purpose, it should be repealed. Since there is a founder, it has no purpose.

Eh, not worth four days of tied up WA IMO. No one will even notice the resolution since the badge is not on the region and the effects don't apply to the region.

If it has no negative effects, there is no purpose to repeal it.

If there were a backlog of SC proposals I'd agree with you. But there isn't.

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Fratt
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Postby Fratt » Thu Sep 01, 2011 5:43 pm

Resolutions written for mere bookkeeping don't appeal me much. I'm against.
A spambot wrote:
You said that the NPO should not change it's core culture.

Literally everyone else, including the NPO, realizes and understands that NPO culture is the problem.
I'm sure these are the best towel warmers and it will come in handy here.
So you either don't realize that the NPO's core culture caused a war and the subversion of countless regions, or you just don't care.

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Black Marne
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Ex-Nation

Postby Black Marne » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:07 pm

Also against.

-The Allied States of Black Marne
Defense, Liberation, Bacon: UDL

FUS RO DAH!
World Assembly Delegate of New Dinosaurtopia

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Revert
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Postby Revert » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:43 pm

Black Marne wrote:Also against.

-The Allied States of Black Marne
Out of curiosity, why?

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Anime Daisuki
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Ex-Nation

Postby Anime Daisuki » Fri Sep 02, 2011 3:13 am

[violet] wrote:
But, what if let's say, Democratia died, and then was later refounded. Would it still be 'liberated'?

Nope, it would be a completely new region that happened to share the same name as an old one.

Thanks Uni for digging that up. I think this ruling should be clear enough for the natives that they have nothing to worry about.

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Sedgistan
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Ex-Nation

Postby Sedgistan » Fri Sep 02, 2011 5:52 am

It was actually discussed amongst the mod team, and the decision was made to re-apply the Liberation. Re-founding is not a way to escape WA-imposed badges, and thus regions that are Commended/Condemned/Liberated will have their badges restored, unless there is an inordinately long period of time between the region CTEing and it being re-founded.

The reason this Liberation hasn't yet been re-founded is because it's not something any Game Mod has done before - so they're not sure how to do it (and don't want to break the region in the process of trying). The Admins have extremely limited time at the moment, but when one of them is around, it'll be re-applied.

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Revert
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Postby Revert » Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:57 am

Sedgistan wrote:It was actually discussed amongst the mod team, and the decision was made to re-apply the Liberation. Re-founding is not a way to escape WA-imposed badges, and thus regions that are Commended/Condemned/Liberated will have their badges restored, unless there is an inordinately long period of time between the region CTEing and it being re-founded.

The reason this Liberation hasn't yet been re-founded is because it's not something any Game Mod has done before - so they're not sure how to do it (and don't want to break the region in the process of trying). The Admins have extremely limited time at the moment, but when one of them is around, it'll be re-applied.

All the more reason to repeal it.

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