Oppose the Unification of Europe?

[Theodoran]

tell me you were being sarcastic..

...

..?

Yes.

yes?

Do you not understand a 3 letter word?

cat.

[Call to power]

EDIT: Good cheese though on the isles. French cheese is over rated. Still, fully joining the EU collective would allow more Spanish cheeses, the underdog of European cheeses, in.

pfft surely you mean Dutch cheese...course we would need to do something to quietly suppress the Polish cheese >_>

Untrue, churchill wouldn't let millions of East Inidans starve to death. That's what Japan would do.

No Churchill would deprive the Eastern reaches of India under the guise of not allowing the food to fall into Japanese hands

is it any wonder he was a famous racist towards Indians?

Until you can inject somemodicum of sense and tolerance into this debate then you'll get nowhere.

go move to Russia comrade

We could trade with the Commonwealth to a more greater extent.

how so? you seem to be living in a world where India would magically start trading with us more for no reason other than tradition

though I'm intrigued by how you think the eurozone hampers the commonwealth I really am

It would rather have been the Japanese that would starve the East Indians.

yes that logic is water tight why bother feeding a nations citizens when the Japanese sure wouldn't

[North Suran]

I could consider myself to be American; it doesn't make it anymore true.

The fact is, Great Britain refers to the landmass of Wales, Scotland and England.

Ireland is not geographically a part of Great Britain.

As such, NIrish should consider themselves to be "United Kingdomers" (terrible term, but whatev), rather than British.

"The British (also known as Britons, informally Brits, or archaically Britishers) are citizens of the United Kingdom,"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_people
Wrong

By that same article, people who live in Overseas Territories could call themselves British.

To state that being a citizen of the UK is synonymous with being British is a legacy of the days of the British Empire.

[RoI2]

I could consider myself to be American; it doesn't make it anymore true.

The fact is, Great Britain refers to the landmass of Wales, Scotland and England.

Ireland is not geographically a part of Great Britain.

As such, NIrish should consider themselves to be "United Kingdomers" (terrible term, but whatev), rather than British.

"The British (also known as Britons, informally Brits, or archaically Britishers) are citizens of the United Kingdom,"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_people
Wrong

By that same article, people who live in Overseas Territories could call themselves British.

To state that being a citizen of the UK is synonymous with being British is a legacy of the days of the British Empire.

And?

[RoI2]

cat.

Another pointless post. Great.

[Call to power]

Okay, I am fine with an EF (European Federation) Just as long as the United Kingdom and Ireland is out of it. At least we will get some freedom.

yes because its not like the EU hasn't forced the UK armed forces to say treat homosexuals like normal human beings or anything

[North Suran]

I could consider myself to be American; it doesn't make it anymore true.

The fact is, Great Britain refers to the landmass of Wales, Scotland and England.

Ireland is not geographically a part of Great Britain.

As such, NIrish should consider themselves to be "United Kingdomers" (terrible term, but whatev), rather than British.

"The British (also known as Britons, informally Brits, or archaically Britishers) are citizens of the United Kingdom,"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_people
Wrong

By that same article, people who live in Overseas Territories could call themselves British.

To state that being a citizen of the UK is synonymous with being British is a legacy of the days of the British Empire.

And?

If a Northern Irishmen considered themselves to be "British", they have essentially accepted the subjugation that the British Empire thrust upon them during the '30s.

If you consider yourself to be British if you come from Ireland or an Overseas Territory, you are insinuating that Great Britain is somehow 'superior', or integral to the United Kingdom.

[RoI2]

If a Northern Irishmen considered themselves to be "British", they have essentially accepted the subjugation that the British Empire thrust upon them during the '30s.

If you consider yourself to be British if you come from Ireland or an Overseas Territory, you are insinuating that Great Britain is somehow 'superior', or integral to the United Kingdom.

So? It doesn't matter.

Besides - NI is in the British Isles.

[Pure Metal]

Do you oppose the Lisbon treaty? The soon coming: United States of Europe and the European Union?
Please debate.
Personally, I despise it.
Here is my reason:

The EU's dream has been to take our independence away from each European country right from the start. This can cause outrage from patriots. (like me)
The made the British people be depressed by showing the speech by Winston Churchill saying there should be a United States of Europe. However, the EU does not show that Churchill also stated Britain should not be part of it.
Dosnt it ever make you angry that about over 50% of nations rules are made in Brussels instead of our own government?
And also, the police have the right to shoot without prosecuting the criminal!

Does any of those wage you in the way to support the EU?

actually, i'm all for a Federal Europe.

arguments about national sovereignty are outdated, i don't care about patriotism, and i don't care what Churchill had to say about it 50 years ago. the short, short version of my reasoning is that there's strength in numbers. plus, being closer to Paris than i am to London (as the crow flies, at least) actually makes me feel that these arbitrary boundaries are rather pointless.... even if we are an island.

[Milks Empire]

The EU's dream has been to take our independence away from each European country right from the start.

Prove this.

The made the British people be depressed by showing the speech by Winston Churchill saying there should be a United States of Europe. However, the EU does not show that Churchill also stated Britain should not be part of it.

Surely a copy of such an important speech is out there for you to link?

Dosnt it ever make you angry that about over 50% of nations rules are made in Brussels instead of our own government?

Let's see some proof for this too.

And also, the police have the right to shoot without prosecuting the criminal!

The last time I checked, there was (in most cases) a shitstorm after every occurrence of such a thing.

[Hating-Silly-Fascists]

"You get your own say in allot of things. And the English have no say in it. But, the scots get a say in our business...funny that."
I know it was ages ago now, but yeah, I don't actually believe that Scots should have a say in English matters like education, health eg all the things devolution has given us control over.
I think that the English deserve (if they want it of course) their own parliament, their own devolution. I believe we have started down a trail that will eventually lead to the total break up of the UK.

[Call to power]

If a Northern Irishmen considered themselves to be "British", they have essentially accepted the subjugation that the British Empire thrust upon them during the '30s.

lol wut?

British is the demonym of a citizen of the UK

[Southern Americama]

The EU is a bureaucratic morass run by French and German people. It would be a sad day if the EU united.

[Dzvasdvsdv]

If a Northern Irishmen considered themselves to be "British", they have essentially accepted the subjugation that the British Empire thrust upon them during the '30s.

No actually, 6 counties of Ulster voted to remain with the UK.

If you consider yourself to be British if you come from Ireland or an Overseas Territory, you are insinuating that Great Britain is somehow 'superior', or integral to the United Kingdom.

What a pile of horseshit. And just so you know, Great Britain is integral to the UK. It's where most of the people live and where the laws get passed etc.

[North Suran]

If a Northern Irishmen considered themselves to be "British", they have essentially accepted the subjugation that the British Empire thrust upon them during the '30s.

If you consider yourself to be British if you come from Ireland or an Overseas Territory, you are insinuating that Great Britain is somehow 'superior', or integral to the United Kingdom.

So? It doesn't matter.

Besides - NI is in the British Isles.

I'd say preventing your nationality and country from being umbrella'd under an Imperialist term does "matter".

And furthermore, I see you've neatly evaded the earlier point about the fact that you complained about Americans asserting stereotypes about Britain, when you yourself stereotyped the Scots.

I didn't agree with the post you were responding to; but you took an ignorant, minority opinion and stretched it over the whole of the Scottish race, before proceeding to make racial slurs and stereotypes - equally as reprehensible.

[RoI2]

I know it was ages ago now, but yeah, I don't actually believe that Scots should have a say in English matters like education, health eg all the things devolution has given us control over.

You think you have a right to say how my country is run, but I have no right to have a say in how your country is run?

I think that the English deserve (if they want it of course) their own parliament,

Then you wouldn't get a say in our business.

their own devolution. I believe we have started down a trail that will eventually lead to the total break up of the UK

That's not a good thing for you or us.

edit- tho, better for us than for you

[Call to power]

I believe we have started down a trail that will eventually lead to the total break up of the UK.

I've never really seen all the point in this myself it just seems like a huge headache when you already have regional autonomy (along with a cash flow that flows into Scotland not out) and would presumably function under the EU at any rate

[Joltonia]

Towards the issue of what the people of Northern Ireland call themselves according to my former teacher, who is a Northern Irish man, the people within the region simply call themselves Northern Irish. I think that term is used to imply the populace in general and the Northern Irish who call themselves British are Unionists and Loyalists, whereas the Nationalists and Republicans just call themselves Irish.

[Dzvasdvsdv]

I've never really seen all the point in this myself it just seems like a huge headache when you already have regional autonomy (along with a cash flow that flow into Scotland not out) and would presumably function under the EU at any rate

In the words of Mel Gibson; "FREEEEEEEEEEEDOOOOOOOOOM!"

[United Russian State]

Let them form their Europe Federation, it makes no differnce.

[RoI2]

Let them form their Europe Federation, it makes no differnce.

To what?

[Call to power]

In the words of Mel Gibson; "FREEEEEEEEEEEDOOOOOOOOOM!"

painting yourself blue and running around in a skirt should be a universal human right

...maybe not the whole exterminating the Jews part though

[Hating-Silly-Fascists]

nd o dear me I just read the rest . . . I never meant to start a whole Scottish v English thing! Everyone always assums that cause I'm a nat, I'm anti-english. I'm honestly not! I just think that inevitably our cultural differences and historical bitterness (can anyone say highland clearances?!) will drive us apart and as history is cyclical, probably back together again in a couple of centuries.
But I am amazed at and offended by the anti-Scottish feeling from particular members. I don;'t even want to start a fight with them, but merely let their own retarded comments (barbed with popular stereotypes (which, by the way, makes us one of the worlds most popular tourist destinations and best-known small nations)) speak for themselves.

know it was ages ago now, but yeah, I don't actually believe that Scots should have a say in English matters like education, health eg all the things devolution has given us control over.


You think you have a right to say how my country is run, but I have no right to have a say in how your country is run?

I think you kinda missed my point . . . I dont want a say in english matters.

their own devolution. I believe we have started down a trail that will eventually lead to the total break up of the UK


That's not a good thing for you or us.

One word - oil.

[Dzvasdvsdv]

To what?

TO SUPER PUTIN! He's a pretty cool guy eh, kills tigers with his bare hands and doesn't afraid of anything.

[Dzvasdvsdv]

painting yourself blue and running around in a skirt should be a universal human right

...maybe not the whole exterminating the Jews part though

Eh it's all good. You know what they're like, hoarding gold and stealing our freedoms from behind the scenes.