[DEFEATED] Commend Joe Bobs

[Apatosaurus]

This is in a much better state than I last saw it. I'd go to say that the current draft is probably convincing enough to me, although I'm not sure if it's convincing enough to the general SC voter pool. I also feel like there's a lot that can be more specified, and this resolution can use some smoothing over to flow better.

So my feedback:

Recalling Joe Bobs' beginnings as a member of Q102, where it already garnered praise for its admirable government policies, especially:
Having one of the most exemplary historians in NationStates, whose works are best displayed through the incredibly well-detailed documentation of the Bobbian Civil War, even documenting foreign aid to the same level of detail,
Running an extremely reliable News Agency that has recorded much of the history of Joe Bobs in astonishing levels of detail, from the attempted invasion by the neighbouring nation of Mweeha to a failed military coup d’etat attempt, and
Showing dedication to utopian policies, notably through its universal healthcare, strong opposition to the death penalty, support of the environment and extensive protections of animal rights,

While I personally think the roleplay is fine, you're probably going to face some difficulty in getting people to see this clause as commendable, given this isn't coming from a person relatively well-known today as an RPer or one that has an extensive history of on-site RP.

I don't think there's a way to fix that, just something to be noted.

Yeah, this was all off-site Q102 regional roleplay. That said, if people want the references for that; this, this (yes the entire thread) and this for the Bobbian Civil War, this for the News Agency and the utopian policies section as well as talking to old people around then like Pacifist Cowards and Orioni 2.

and its introduction of a formal alliance with Europa, which became a close ally of Q102 and was notable for its thriving community that encouraged international politics and scientific development,

Instead of detailing Europa was, it may be a better idea to focus on the two's relationship. How was it close? Did Europa end up helping out Q102 in certain situatiosn? Did they do anything together? etc.

Lots of cross-membership, the alliance literally got voted as the most important alliance for Q102 once (or something similar), overall extremely close allies.

I could possibly mention ^, but wouldn't that come off as filler?

Dignifying that Joe Bobs created the Q102 University, where national leaders in Q102 could learn about various subjects, then going on to teach various subjects there such as Philosophy, Literature and NationStates history, and was a central figure in the creation of the Q102 Hall of Fame, allowing the best contributors to Q102 to be officially recognised within the region,

Applauding Joe Bobs' founding of the Anti-Racism Coalition in 2006, once one of the largest inter-regional coalitions, that went on to aid in the fight against the reprehensible ideologies of Nazism and racism, and included over 500 individual members as well as noteworthy regions such as The New Meritocracy and Belgium,

These read a bit clunky and could use some rewording to flow better. "Dignifying" seems like a weird action choice here.

Is this better?

Acknowledging that Joe Bobs was a central figure in the creation of the Q102 Hall of Fame, allowing the best contributors to Q102 to be officially recognised, and created the Q102 University, a place for national leaders learn about various subjects, then going on to teach various subjects there such as Philosophy, Literature and NationStates history,

Applauding Joe Bobs' founding of the Anti-Racism Coalition in 2006, one of the largest historical inter-regional coalitions including over 500 individual members and several noteworthy regions such as The New Meritocracy and Belgium, which went on to aid in the fight against the reprehensible ideologies of Nazism and racism,

Also, did Joe Bobs actually do anything for the Anti-Racism Coalition? One can found something then let someone else do all the work (given everything in this thread that doesn't sound like Joe Bobs at all, but the resolution doesn't show that). It would be best to reword that clause to explain Joe's contribution the org.

Unfortunately, there's not really much that can be found about this, especially as most of the records from there are gone (for example the ARC forums were not transferred into Zetaboards when Invisionfree died and thus can't be accessed anymore). However, he was Chairman of the ARC, something I'll mention.

Impressed by Joe Bobs' significant contributions to the Global Right Alliance (GRA), working tirelessly to build its community, most notably by:
Helping start the “rotatorship” in 2008, an innovative form of government where each week a ruler would be chosen to have absolute power, helping increase regional engagement in an entertaining way,

Also a bit clunky and can be reworded a bit better.

Sure, I decided to make that its own clause actually and break up that list. How's this?

Impressed by Joe Bobs' significant contributions to the Global Right Alliance (GRA), working tirelessly to build its community and helping start the innovative form of government known as the "rotatorship" in 2008, where each week a ruler would be chosen to have absolute power; this helped increase regional engagement in an entertaining way,

Building diplomatic relations with many significant regions as Minister of Foreign Affairs, such as The East Pacific, Europeia and 10000 Islands,

As I've said before, this doesn't really tell me anything. You need to explain why these relationships matter besides these relationships being significant. Did GRA do anything notable with these relations?

Alternatively, you could consider nixing this clause and dedicating the characters elsewhere.

Yeah, good point (especially as I current have a lot of characters). Axed it.

Reorganising the Ministry of Internal Affairs as GRA President by dividing it into the Ministries of Culture and Activity, allowing for more focus on both departments and resulting in the creation of the GRA Economy program overseen by Joe Bobs, encouraging government participation by rewarding "cash" for participation, and

It may be a good idea to specify on the "more focus" part. Also IMO, the GRA Economy program sounds like a bit more noteworthy than a simple structural rehaul, so I'd personally replace this clause w/ a clause about the Economy program and specifying what Joe Bob did to create it, and how its success helped the region beyond government participation if anything.

I changed the part so it focuses more on the GRA Economy than the MoIA split. How's this?

Hailing Joe Bobs' pivotal role in the creation of the GRA Economy program as President, which encouraged government participation by rewarding regional "cash" for participation, as well as reorganising of the Ministry of Internal Affairs as President by dividing it into the Ministries of Culture and Activity, allowing for further focus on both departments,

Helping to rebuild the GRA Defence Forces from a relatively inactive state around 2010, making it a dominant force in defending again,

And how did they build up the GRA Defence Forces? Stating they helped isgreat but doesn't show the work the nominee put into making it happen.

Sure, how's this:

Acclaiming that Joe Bobs played an important role in rebuilding the GRA Defence Forces from a relatively inactive state around 2010 through both recruitment and structural reforms, soon making it a dominant force in defending again,

Acclaiming Joe Bobs’ work in helping get the GRA's Foreign Affairs set up after the region was relaunched in 2014 as Minister of Foreign Affairs, building diplomatic relations with many significant regions such as Capitalist Paradise, Spiritus and the Rejected Realms,

Explain what happened between GRA and these relations. For all we know, relations led to absolutely nothing and were inactive the whole time.

I'd also point out that while I personally think creating embassies can be commendable, others very much disagree... and dedicating two clauses to embassy building is probably not a good idea because of that. Up to you if you wanna remove this clause or the other embassy clause or keep them both or remove them both or whatever, just saying.

Axed it then, okay.

Cognisant that Joe Bobs also helped rebuild much of the region's infrastructure following the relaunch as Speaker and First Minister, most notably the Judiciary, World Assembly Delegate elections and Speaker succession, as well as restarting the rotatorship,

This clause is confusing. It should be mentioned exactly how Joe Bobs "helped rebuild" the region's infrastructure. This seems like it was through legislation, but that remains very unclear.

Also, I have no clue what a First Minister is and I'm sure many others will not know as well. Needs some clarification or removal.[/quote]
First Minister is just the equivalent of President or Prime Minister. Yep, was through legislation. Anyway, I entirely reworked that section:

Cognisant that Joe Bobs also helped rebuild much of the region's infrastructure through regional legislation, following the GRA's relaunch in 2014 after years of inactivity, most notably defining the Judiciary, World Assembly Delegate elections and Speaker succession,

Celebrating Joe Bobs’ work within the Founderless Regions Alliance (FRA), participating in countless defensive operations abroad, and more notably holding a very successful term as Arch-Chancellor in 2014, during which it took action to encourage the FRA to further help in stabilising regions during the chaos following invasions and hosted the third iteration of FRAVision, a worldwide singing competition that was widely successful and helped promote the FRA,

I think this clause is pretty great, but I'd delete the part about "participating in countless defensive operations abroad" unless you can substantiate that with a numerical statistic, and focus more on their Arch-Chancellor term and specify on their actions to help FRA stabilization policies instead of their participation in ops.

Sure, done.

Extolling Joe Bobs' compiling of the histories of various significant regions, notably by authoring the "General History of the GRA", an in-depth documentation of the history of the GRA, and creating a public library in the FRA of the history of multiple important regions such as United Kingdom while Arch-Chancellor, and

While the content seems good, this needs some rewording to flow a little bit better.

How's this?

Extolling Joe Bobs' compiling of the histories of various significant regions, ensuring the accessibility of regional histories for years to come, most notably by authoring an in-depth documentation of the history of the GRA known as the "General History of the GRA", and creating a public library in the FRA of the history of multiple important regions such as United Kingdom while Arch-Chancellor, and

Believing that while Joe Bobs' flag and national symbol, the penguin, is known largely for being cute and fluffy, Joe Bobs' achievements in various regions and the defending cause should not go unrecognised,

It'd be better to set up a proper juxtaposition here IMO. So say something like "Believing that while Joe Bobs' flag and national symbol, the penguin, is known largely for [insert value of penguins anthetical to region building], Joe Bobs' achievements in various regions and the defending cause only serve as examples of [insert value opposite to the penguins] and deserve interregional recognition,"

Or something like that.[/quote]
How's this? (I do really like the "Cute and fluffy" part and I really don't want to remove it :P)

Believing that while Joe Bobs' flag and national symbol, the penguin, is known largely for being cute and fluffy, Joe Bobs' achievements in various regions and the defending cause only serve as examples of hard work and dedication, and are worthy of interregional recognition,

[Apatosaurus]

Submitting this when I get onto my computer tommorrow morning :>

[Guess and Check]

Lots of cross-membership, the alliance literally got voted as the most important alliance for Q102 once (or something similar), overall extremely close allies.

I could possibly mention ^, but wouldn't that come off as filler?

Your explanation of Europa is already filler in this context

Maybe "and its introduction of a formal alliance with Europa, which became such a close ally of Q102 that Q102's community later designated the alliance as one of most valued regional relationships at that time,"

Or something like that, I'm not too good at wordsmithing.

Acknowledging that Joe Bobs was a central figure in the creation of the Q102 Hall of Fame, allowing the best contributors to Q102 to be officially recognised, and created the Q102 University, a place for national leaders learn about various subjects, then going on to teach various subjects there such as Philosophy, Literature and NationStates history,

Applauding Joe Bobs' founding of the Anti-Racism Coalition in 2006, one of the largest historical inter-regional coalitions including over 500 individual members and several noteworthy regions such as The New Meritocracy and Belgium, which went on to aid in the fight against the reprehensible ideologies of Nazism and racism,

Second clause seems good now, the first clause still reads a little wonky. May be a good idea to split the University thing into its own clause and just elaborate on the Hall of Fame.

Unfortunately, there's not really much that can be found about this, especially as most of the records from there are gone (for example the ARC forums were not transferred into Zetaboards when Invisionfree died and thus can't be accessed anymore). However, he was Chairman of the ARC, something I'll mention.

Then I'm not sure this will help the commend out. 500 members is no mean feat, but just saying "oh they created something and served as its head for some time" doesn't show if the nominee had an impact on growing the coalition. Sure, it's implied, but it's best practice to directly connect the nominee's work with the org to the org's growth or ability to engage in its mission.

Is there any older players you can talk to about this?

Impressed by Joe Bobs' significant contributions to the Global Right Alliance (GRA), working tirelessly to build its community and helping start the innovative form of government known as the "rotatorship" in 2008, where each week a ruler would be chosen to have absolute power; this helped increase regional engagement in an entertaining way,

I don't think splitting it into its own clause works, because now there's little mention of Joe's "contributions" besides the rotatorship. IMO it's better as a list, or focus explicitly on the rotatorship in this clause, rather than introducing the clause with Joe's overall GRA work then not specifying much on it.

I changed the part so it focuses more on the GRA Economy than the MoIA split. How's this?

It's a bit better, but I think elaborating more on the economy - how they helped build it, whether it had other effects besides raising government participation, and completely nixing the structural reform would be better. IMO.

Acclaiming that Joe Bobs played an important role in rebuilding the GRA Defence Forces from a relatively inactive state around 2010 through both recruitment and structural reforms, soon making it a dominant force in defending again,

Can you specify a bit more? What were the structural changes? How did they improve the military? What were the specific recruitment reforms? May benefit from making a list clause on this.

Cognisant that Joe Bobs also helped rebuild much of the region's infrastructure following the relaunch as Speaker and First Minister, most notably the Judiciary, World Assembly Delegate elections and Speaker succession, as well as restarting the rotatorship,

This clause is confusing. It should be mentioned exactly how Joe Bobs "helped rebuild" the region's infrastructure. This seems like it was through legislation, but that remains very unclear.

Also, I have no clue what a First Minister is and I'm sure many others will not know as well. Needs some clarification or removal.[/quote]
First Minister is just the equivalent of President or Prime Minister. Yep, was through legislation. Anyway, I entirely reworked that section:

Cognisant that Joe Bobs also helped rebuild much of the region's infrastructure through regional legislation, following the GRA's relaunch in 2014 after years of inactivity, most notably defining the Judiciary, World Assembly Delegate elections and Speaker succession,

Hm, I'd try: "Cognisant that following the GRA's relaunch in 2014 after years of inactivity, Joe Bobs helped rebuild regional infrastructure by writing legislation that defined judicial procedures, regulations for World Assembly Delegate elections, and Speaker succession - ensuring the region had integral procedures in place during its redevelopment."

Sure, done.

Hm, maybe reword "during which it took action to encourage the FRA to further help in stabilising regions during the chaos following invasions" to "during which it campaigned for the FRA to become further involved in the stabilizing of recently raided regions..."

Extolling Joe Bobs' compiling of the histories of various significant regions, ensuring the accessibility of regional histories for years to come, most notably by authoring an in-depth documentation of the history of the GRA known as the "General History of the GRA", and creating a public library in the FRA of the history of multiple important regions such as United Kingdom while Arch-Chancellor, and

Reads a bit better. Still feel the first two sentence clauses (extolling and ensuring) don't work too well with the rest of the clause though.

Believing that while Joe Bobs' flag and national symbol, the penguin, is known largely for being cute and fluffy, Joe Bobs' achievements in various regions and the defending cause only serve as examples of hard work and dedication, and are worthy of interregional recognition,

[/quote]You'll have to take a different angle here, then, if you don't wanna remove "cute and fluffy". Because again, cute and fluffy people can be amazing region builders. There's no real juxtaposition there even though you're trying to set one up, so this clause just doesn't work.

---

I think one thing you need to do in general is re-evaluate the resolution and see how it compares to your earlier drafts. While there is some new content since you pulled and reworked it, I still feel much of the content is similar to the previous resolution. Considering you pulled out because URA & TNP voted against and that TNP voted against because it didn't view the nominee as commendable, that doesn't necessarily bode well if you submit it now. At least that's how I'm feeling with this, although I can't think of something specific to fix it.

[Apatosaurus]

Lots of cross-membership, the alliance literally got voted as the most important alliance for Q102 once (or something similar), overall extremely close allies.

I could possibly mention ^, but wouldn't that come off as filler?

Your explanation of Europa is already filler in this context :p

Maybe "and its introduction of a formal alliance with Europa, which became such a close ally of Q102 that Q102's community later designated the alliance as one of most valued regional relationships at that time,"

Or something like that, I'm not too good at wordsmithing.

Actually, that's a very good suggestion! I've incorporated it.

Acknowledging that Joe Bobs was a central figure in the creation of the Q102 Hall of Fame, allowing the best contributors to Q102 to be officially recognised, and created the Q102 University, a place for national leaders learn about various subjects, then going on to teach various subjects there such as Philosophy, Literature and NationStates history,

Applauding Joe Bobs' founding of the Anti-Racism Coalition in 2006, one of the largest historical inter-regional coalitions including over 500 individual members and several noteworthy regions such as The New Meritocracy and Belgium, which went on to aid in the fight against the reprehensible ideologies of Nazism and racism,

Second clause seems good now, the first clause still reads a little wonky. May be a good idea to split the University thing into its own clause and just elaborate on the Hall of Fame.

I think that'd result in either 2 very short clauses, or filler? At least in my opinion.

Unfortunately, there's not really much that can be found about this, especially as most of the records from there are gone (for example the ARC forums were not transferred into Zetaboards when Invisionfree died and thus can't be accessed anymore). However, he was Chairman of the ARC, something I'll mention.

Then I'm not sure this will help the commend out. 500 members is no mean feat, but just saying "oh they created something and served as its head for some time" doesn't show if the nominee had an impact on growing the coalition. Sure, it's implied, but it's best practice to directly connect the nominee's work with the org to the org's growth or ability to engage in its mission.

Is there any older players you can talk to about this?

I tried talking to people like Dalimbar and Orioni 2, but didn't really get much as to ARC. :P I did reword that, however, to put more emphasis on Joe Bobs' efforts.

Impressed by Joe Bobs' significant contributions to the Global Right Alliance (GRA), working tirelessly to build its community and helping start the innovative form of government known as the "rotatorship" in 2008, where each week a ruler would be chosen to have absolute power; this helped increase regional engagement in an entertaining way,

I don't think splitting it into its own clause works, because now there's little mention of Joe's "contributions" besides the rotatorship. IMO it's better as a list, or focus explicitly on the rotatorship in this clause, rather than introducing the clause with Joe's overall GRA work then not specifying much on it.

I mean, when that was still a list people said it was too listy...

I changed the part so it focuses more on the GRA Economy than the MoIA split. How's this?

It's a bit better, but I think elaborating more on the economy - how they helped build it, whether it had other effects besides raising government participation, and completely nixing the structural reform would be better. IMO.

Currently not entirely convinced that's necessary, to be honest.

Acclaiming that Joe Bobs played an important role in rebuilding the GRA Defence Forces from a relatively inactive state around 2010 through both recruitment and structural reforms, soon making it a dominant force in defending again,

Can you specify a bit more? What were the structural changes? How did they improve the military? What were the specific recruitment reforms? May benefit from making a list clause on this.

I could try, but no real guarantees.

First Minister is just the equivalent of President or Prime Minister. Yep, was through legislation. Anyway, I entirely reworked that section:

Hm, I'd try: "Cognisant that following the GRA's relaunch in 2014 after years of inactivity, Joe Bobs helped rebuild regional infrastructure by writing legislation that defined judicial procedures, regulations for World Assembly Delegate elections, and Speaker succession - ensuring the region had integral procedures in place during its redevelopment."

Sure, done.

Hm, maybe reword "during which it took action to encourage the FRA to further help in stabilising regions during the chaos following invasions" to "during which it campaigned for the FRA to become further involved in the stabilizing of recently raided regions..."

All done.

Extolling Joe Bobs' compiling of the histories of various significant regions, ensuring the accessibility of regional histories for years to come, most notably by authoring an in-depth documentation of the history of the GRA known as the "General History of the GRA", and creating a public library in the FRA of the history of multiple important regions such as United Kingdom while Arch-Chancellor, and

Reads a bit better. Still feel the first two sentence clauses (extolling and ensuring) don't work too well with the rest of the clause though.

Extolling Joe Bobs' compiling of the histories of various significant regions, most notably by authoring an in-depth documentation of the history of the GRA known as the "General History of the GRA", and creating a public library in the FRA of the history of multiple important regions such as United Kingdom while Arch-Chancellor; this helped ensure the public accessibilies of regional histories for years to come, and

You'll have to take a different angle here, then, if you don't wanna remove "cute and fluffy". Because again, cute and fluffy people can be amazing region builders. There's no real juxtaposition there even though you're trying to set one up, so this clause just doesn't work.

Okay, I changed that clause entirely then:

Believing that while Joe Bobs' flag and national symbol, the penguin, being cute and fluffy is not necessarily enough for interregional recognition, Joe Bobs' achievements in various regions and to the defender cause serve as extraordinary examples of hard work and dedication, and are worthy of the honour,

---

I think one thing you need to do in general is re-evaluate the resolution and see how it compares to your earlier drafts. While there is some new content since you pulled and reworked it, I still feel much of the content is similar to the previous resolution. Considering you pulled out because URA & TNP voted against and that TNP voted against because it didn't view the nominee as commendable, that doesn't necessarily bode well if you submit it now. At least that's how I'm feeling with this, although I can't think of something specific to fix it.

To be honest, I never really imagined TNP changing their stance (though I'd definitely be happy if they did!); the point was more that other regions like TEP or TWP don't jump on the train of opposing this, which honestly seemed pretty likely. That said, I'll probably be leaving this for more open comments for about 2 - 3 more days before submitting.

[Apatosaurus]

After procrastinating a bit (>_>), submitted!

Good morning Delegate %NATION%!

I am Apatosaurus, a past WA author and I am asking you to approve my updated SC proposal to Commend Joe Bobs (for the record, this was previously submitted but pulled from queue for further drafting).

This is a nominee who contributed to multiple regions such as Q102 and the Global Right Alliance, to an outstanding extent, as well as being a famous defender at the time. Some of this nominee's many really cool achievements include:

- Helping build Q102 into one of the biggest and most significant regions,
- Founding the Anti-Racism Coalition in 2006, a large coalition against racism and nazism that grew to over 500 members,
- Helping build the Global Right Alliance, a famous defender region, both by building its military and building regional culture and infrastructure,
- For a while, running the Founderless Regions Alliance, which was once one of the largest, if not the largest defender alliances, both politically and militarily, and
- Compiling the histories of many regions, such as the Global Right Alliance and United Kingdom.

If you agree that this nominee has earned the award, then go approve this!

Feel free to telegram back if you have any questions ^-^

- [nation=long]Apatosaurus[/nation]

[Greater Cesnica]

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The Europeian Ministry of World Assembly Affairs recommends a vote AGAINST the Security Council Resolution, "Commend Joe Bobs".
Its reasoning may be found here.

---

[Joe Bobs]

I just wanted to say thankyou to Apatosaurus for this, whether it passes or not, I feel honoured and grateful to be considered.

[Qantai]

Wasn't boe jobs a good guy? Why are you voting against him?

[WayNeacTia]

Wasn't boe jobs a good guy? Why are you voting against him?

The proposal has more filler than a high school cafeteria meatloaf? That would be my guess…..

[Outer Sparta]

Not surprised to see the resolution tanking at vote after the first withdraw due to the author seeing the internal voting results.

[Amerion]

The South Pacific's World Assembly Delegation has cast the Coalition's vote AGAINST this proposed resolution, Commend Joe Bobs, and warmly encourages fellow member regions to vote AGAINST.

'No Rec' or No Recommendation indicates a vote where, in the absence of a recommendation from the Office of WA Legislation, the Admiral Delegate General voted according to the majority stance of World Assembly members in the South Pacific.

[WayNeacTia]

Not surprised to see the resolution tanking at vote after the first withdraw due to the author seeing the internal voting results.

Pretty sad when the author's own region is voting against and has given an against recommendation.

[Rick Perry]

It says it all. Joe Bobs needs to be Commented.


SUPPORT

[Bhang Bhang Duc]

It says it all. Joe Bobs needs to be Commented.


SUPPORT

I think you mean Commended not Commented and it’s not happening.

[The Island of Pussy Cats]

I think Joe Bobs is pretty innocent, doing more good than harm.