"Abortion is murder." Drink of choice y'all.
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by Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Sun Oct 24, 2021 10:53 am
by Genivaria » Sun Oct 24, 2021 10:55 am
by Ifreann » Sun Oct 24, 2021 10:57 am
Sundiata wrote:Ifreann wrote:Whether the unborn's existence is an act of intrusion, whatever that's supposed to mean, is irrelevant. They are not welcome, and they are not leaving, therefore they are not innocent.
No, the existence of the unborn, let alone the state of being welcomed, is not the fault of the unborn and no fault should be ascribed.
A zygote is an innocent human person.
by Godular » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:14 am
by Elwher » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:17 am
by Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:19 am
by Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:22 am
by Ifreann » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:25 am
by Sundiata » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:26 am
by The New California Republic » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:27 am
by The New California Republic » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:28 am
by Godular » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:31 am
by Godular » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:31 am
by Sundiata » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:39 am
by Grave_n_idle » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:46 am
by Grave_n_idle » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:48 am
by The New California Republic » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:49 am
by Sundiata » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:55 am
The New California Republic wrote:Sundiata wrote:The sense that human bodies are "property," is a figure of speech, a quirk of language. The human body is not really any person's property.
It isn't a quirk of language at all: that thing you are ignoring, "bodily sovereignty", implies ownership over one's own body as a form of possession, of property.
by Godular » Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:59 am
by The New California Republic » Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:03 pm
Sundiata wrote:the human body cannot be owned by one human being or the other. It's not a possession; it's not property.
by Godular » Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:05 pm
by Neanderthaland » Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:29 pm
by Sundiata » Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:47 pm
Neanderthaland wrote:Sundiata wrote:To remove it is actively choosing to kill it.
You're the one who is always stressing that only intentions matter, and that we should completely blind ourselves to the consequences. You cannot, therefore, consider what the consequences of removing the fetus will be. We can only consider whether it's just to remove it.
by Neanderthaland » Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:52 pm
Sundiata wrote:Neanderthaland wrote:You're the one who is always stressing that only intentions matter, and that we should completely blind ourselves to the consequences. You cannot, therefore, consider what the consequences of removing the fetus will be. We can only consider whether it's just to remove it.
To be clear, I've only ever said that intentions matter as much as the outcome. Unfortunately, good means can also be used towards evil ends.
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