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[PASSED] Condemn Wickedly evil people

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Giovanniland
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[PASSED] Condemn Wickedly evil people

Postby Giovanniland » Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:08 am

For the sake of a little introduction, this is another draft I've been working on since late July (when the now-passed Commend Halo went through last call) along with Condemn Dalimbar.

Wickedly evil people (a.k.a. Eli) has certainly been a notable member of TWP ever since the region's early history, and this can be seen by the fact they have held the delegate seat for seven times, along with serving as a Guardian multiple times (but that's not the point of the proposal, as their later delegacies were to aid in transitions, which is in fact something Commendable). This proposal focuses on their actions during TWP's early history, including the Triumvirate, their role in the Lots of Ants affair, and the January 2009 takeover; in summary, their first three delegacies.

Current Draft (4148 of 5000 characters):
The Security Council,

Recognizing Wickedly evil people (WEP), also known as Eli, as one of the oldest and most populous nations of the multiverse, yet saddened that they decided to constantly serve as an obstacle to achieving stability in the West Pacific for several years during its early history;

Beginning with the fact that WEP successfully claimed the delegacy of the West Pacific after the chaos that ensued in November 2005 when Minineenee's West Pacific Dominion was dissolved, creating the West Pacific Triumvirate together with other long-time members such as TAO the Watcher;

Recalling that, while the Triumvirate was initially driven by three nations, WEP later turned against the other two members and held onto power alone until June 2006 (when negotiations with the Government in Exile finished), committing various villainous actions while in control:
  • the establishment of a draconian endorsement limit of 50, giving residents only two days to comply or be removed from the region even though the previous limit was higher;
  • the banishment of over 70 long-term residents from the region, many of which had no political aspirations at all, as well as prominent members that would later become delegates, including Bhang Bhang Duc, Westwind, and Biteland;
  • the enlistment of nations from other regions, such as Unistrut and Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council), that held important roles like administering regional communication platforms in order to cement the Triumvirate's control of the region, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes;
Aghast that the West Pacific Triumvirate was not WEP's only subversion to the delegacy of the West Pacific, as the nation first worked closely with Gatesville, a region also condemned by this Council, to get the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants into the delegacy in March 2008 and then purposefully make that nation go into inactivity to destabilize the region; the leader of WEP was later given control of Lots of Ants towards the end of the delegacy and used this fact for their own benefit by posting a "farewell" address and resigning from the World Assembly as Lots of Ants only to assume the seat as WEP in April 2008, staying for around a month in the position;

Horrified that WEP again seized the delegacy of the West Pacific in January 2009, destabilizing the region by declaring the former Constitution void, disbanding the entire government including the notable West Pacific Liberation Force, and then building a committee-style government that again featured nations condemned by this Council such as Pierconium and Minineenee, actions that enabled WEP's delegacy to last for over 100 days until it was ousted in a counter-coup by ROLHEATH with the aid of Lone Wolves United in April 2009;

Appalled that in all three mentioned delegacies, WEP actively undermined the existing democratic institutions present in the region for most of its early history, replacing it with governments based on the authoritarian principle of delegate supremacy that goes against the democratic ideals of the Security Council, eventually serving as a basis for later West Pacifican governments to strengthen this principle and allow it to last to the present day;

Concluding that WEP’s role in overthrowing various iterations of a government, holding power for over a year across these three reigns, and undermining democratic ideals, even if concentrated in only one region, certainly changed the course of history, and sadly served as an inspiration or even a training ground for nations such as Durkadurkiranistan II, also condemned by this Council, to plan more coups in other major regions; and

Wishing to finally bring justice by highlighting WEP's wickedly evil deeds as an example that no nation should follow;

Hereby condemns Wickedly evil people.


Older Drafts:
The Security Council,

Acknowledging Wickedly evil people (WEP) as a nation that has subverted multiple regional governments throughout history;

Beginning with the fact that WEP successfully claimed the delegacy of the West Pacific after the chaos that ensued in November 2005 when Minineenee's West Pacific Dominion was dissolved, creating the West Pacific Triumvirate together with Biyah as Minister of Security and TAO the Watcher as Minister of Foreign Affairs;

Recognizing that, while the Triumvirate was initially driven by those three nations, WEP later turned against the other two members and held onto power alone until June 2006 (when negotiations with the Government in Exile finished), committing various villainous actions while in control:
  • the establishment of a draconian endorsement limit of 50, giving residents only two days to comply or be removed from the region even though the previous limit was higher;
  • the banjection of long-term residents from the region, many of which had no political aspirations at all, as well as prominent members that would later become delegates, for example Bhang Bhang Duc, Westwind, and Biteland;
  • the enlistment of despicable nations from other regions to hold important roles, such as Unistrut and the condemned Pierconium that aided in administering regional communication platforms;
Aghast that the West Pacific Triumvirate was not WEP's only subversion to the delegacy of the West Pacific, however, as the nation first worked closely with the condemned Gatesville Inc to place the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants as Delegate in March 2008 and was also given control to that nation, and later betrayed Gatesville for their own benefit, posting a "farewell" address and resigning from the World Assembly as Lots of Ants only to assume the seat as WEP in April 2008, staying for around a month in the position;

Horrified that WEP again seized the delegacy of the West Pacific in January 2009, destabilizing the region by declaring the former Constitution void, disbanding the entire government including the notable West Pacific Liberation Force, and then building a committee-style government that featured condemned nations such as Pierconium and Minineenee, actions that enabled WEP's delegacy to last for over 100 days until it was ousted in a counter-coup by Rolheath with the aid of Lone Wolves United in April 2009;

Appalled that, in all three mentioned delegacies, WEP actively undermined the previous existing democratic institutions present in the region for most of its early history, replacing it with governments based on principles such as meritocracy and delegate supremacy that go against the democratic ideals of the Security Council and that lasted for over a year across these three reigns, eventually serving as a basis for later West Pacifican governments to strengthen the concept of a meritocratic government that lasts to the present day;

Concluding that WEP’s role in overthrowing various regional governments, holding power for a long time, and undermining democratic ideals, even if concentrated in only one region, certainly changed the course of history and sadly served as an inspiration for many nations to plan more coups in other major regions, or even as a training ground for certain nations such as the now-condemned Durkadurkiranistan II, and

Wishing to finally bring justice by highlighting WEP's nefarious deeds as an example that no nation should follow;

Hereby condemns Wickedly evil people.

Thank you to several TWPers for their aid on my research, such as Bhang Bhang Duc, Darkesia, Dilber, Westwind, and Eli themself, as well as other nations such as Winnipeg.
Last edited by Goobergunchia on Wed Oct 20, 2021 9:16 pm, edited 21 times in total.
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Emodea
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Postby Emodea » Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:34 am

Giovanniland wrote:Acknowledging Wickedly evil people (WEP) as a nation that has subverted multiple regional governments throughout history;

Seems a bit misleading to me, considering that most of WEP's actions have been directed towards TWP. Perhaps consider changing this to;
Recognizing Wickedly evil people as a nefarious nation that has constantly served as an obstacle to achieving stability in The West Pacific since the dawn of time,


Giovanniland wrote:the banjection of long-term residents from the region, many of which had no political aspirations at all, as well as prominent members that would later become delegates, for example Bhang Bhang Duc, Westwind, and Biteland;

Would you be able to provide a specific number here? Nothing against this sub-point, just personally curious about it.

Giovanniland wrote:the enlistment of despicable nations from other regions to hold important roles, such as Unistrut and the condemned Pierconium that aided in administering regional communication platforms;

Definitely just me nitpicking and being weird, but the word "condemned" here doesn't refer to the meaning of "condemned by the Security Council" on its own, which is what you're probably referring to. Would recommend adding something like;
...Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very council) that aided...


Aghast that the West Pacific Triumvirate was not WEP's only subversion to the delegacy of the West Pacific, however, as the nation first worked closely with the condemned Gatesville Inc to place the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants as Delegate in March 2008 and was also given control to that nation, and later betrayed Gatesville for their own benefit, posting a "farewell" address and resigning from the World Assembly as Lots of Ants only to assume the seat as WEP in April 2008, staying for around a month in the position;

I'm confused, wouldn't the bolded part be considered a commendable action?

Appalled that, in all three mentioned delegacies, WEP actively undermined the previous existing democratic institutions present in the region for most of its early history, replacing it with governments based on principles such as meritocracy and delegate supremacy that go against the democratic ideals of the Security Council and that lasted for over a year across these three reigns, eventually serving as a basis for later West Pacifican governments to strengthen the concept of a meritocratic government that lasts to the present day;

Confused again, wouldn't forming a meritocratic government be considered commendable in the context here, especially when the said model has continued to impact TWP up until this day?

Similarly, you have to explain why delegate supremacy is a condemnable thing, since the term itself doesn't imply any negative things by itself without any additional context, at least to me.

Good luck with this, most of my critiques with this draft are nitpicks that my fussy brain picked out.
Last edited by Emodea on Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:40 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Bhang Bhang Duc
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Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:55 am

My only banjection to TRR was at the hands of Eli. Of course they must be Condemned! :)

Once again Gio my first read through is favourable - I’ll get back to you with a more detailed critique as soon as I can.
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Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

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Postby Outer Sparta » Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:38 am

Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:My only banjection to TRR was at the hands of Eli. Of course they must be Condemned! :)

Once again Gio my first read through is favourable - I’ll get back to you with a more detailed critique as soon as I can.

That surely must be a long story, wouldn't it?
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Bhang Bhang Duc
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Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:46 am

Outer Sparta wrote:
Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:My only banjection to TRR was at the hands of Eli. Of course they must be Condemned! :)

Once again Gio my first read through is favourable - I’ll get back to you with a more detailed critique as soon as I can.

That surely must be a long story, wouldn't it?

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Former Delegate of The West Pacific. Guardian (under many Delegates) of The West Pacific. TWP's Former Minister for World Assembly Affairs and former Security Council Advisor.

The West Pacific's Official Welshman, Astronomer and Old Fart
Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.

Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..

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Postby The Python » Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:10 pm

This... also looks very good, and I look forward to voting for this :blush:

Giovanniland wrote:Wishing to finally bring justice by highlighting WEP's nefariouswickedly evil deeds as an example that no nation should follow;

Hereby condemns Wickedly evil people.

^ semi-ironic feedback only because puns are nice :P
Last edited by The Python on Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Zukchiva » Wed Sep 15, 2021 2:00 pm

Support.

I don't have feedback of my own, mostly agree with Moon.
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Postby Goobergunchia » Wed Sep 15, 2021 2:35 pm

Not seeing the evidence to deem Unistrut "despicable". Other than that, support.
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Bhang Bhang Duc
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Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Wed Sep 15, 2021 11:09 pm

Goobergunchia wrote:Not seeing the evidence to deem Unistrut "despicable". Other than that, support.

I remember their behaviour on TWP’s forums during the coup - they’ve got off lightly with despicable.
Former Delegate of The West Pacific. Guardian (under many Delegates) of The West Pacific. TWP's Former Minister for World Assembly Affairs and former Security Council Advisor.

The West Pacific's Official Welshman, Astronomer and Old Fart
Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.

Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..

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Postby Giovanniland » Sat Sep 18, 2021 11:30 am

Draft 2 is up, in which I tried to address the comments made here and privately.

Emodea wrote:
Giovanniland wrote:Acknowledging Wickedly evil people (WEP) as a nation that has subverted multiple regional governments throughout history;

Seems a bit misleading to me, considering that most of WEP's actions have been directed towards TWP. Perhaps consider changing this to;
Recognizing Wickedly evil people as a nefarious nation that has constantly served as an obstacle to achieving stability in The West Pacific since the dawn of time,

Sounds fair, though I altered some parts of the clause since your suggestion made it sound like WEP still serves as an obstacle, when of course their last takeover was over a decade ago. Also, I was privately given the idea to add some flavour to the introduction clause by mentioning their status as one of the oldest players of NS still active (their nation Eli is 8th for population), so the result is a mix of both - hopefully it looks good for you.

Emodea wrote:
Giovanniland wrote:the banjection of long-term residents from the region, many of which had no political aspirations at all, as well as prominent members that would later become delegates, for example Bhang Bhang Duc, Westwind, and Biteland;

Would you be able to provide a specific number here? Nothing against this sub-point, just personally curious about it.

Sadly not, none of the records in the regional forums or people whom I talked to were able to provide a number. I do think the other details I put there make up for the lack of a specific number though.

Emodea wrote:
Giovanniland wrote:the enlistment of despicable nations from other regions to hold important roles, such as Unistrut and the condemned Pierconium that aided in administering regional communication platforms;

Definitely just me nitpicking and being weird, but the word "condemned" here doesn't refer to the meaning of "condemned by the Security Council" on its own, which is what you're probably referring to. Would recommend adding something like;
...Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very council) that aided...

Done.

Emodea wrote:
Aghast that the West Pacific Triumvirate was not WEP's only subversion to the delegacy of the West Pacific, however, as the nation first worked closely with the condemned Gatesville Inc to place the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants as Delegate in March 2008 and was also given control to that nation, and later betrayed Gatesville for their own benefit, posting a "farewell" address and resigning from the World Assembly as Lots of Ants only to assume the seat as WEP in April 2008, staying for around a month in the position;

I'm confused, wouldn't the bolded part be considered a commendable action?

I think this is one action that could be either seen as commendable or condemnable depending on how you see it. Working closely to place the nation in the seat and then make it suddenly go into inactivity (as also narrated in Darkesia and Gatesville's condemnations) is condemnable, then helping remove it could be commendable but not really since it was done more for their own personal benefit rather than restoring native control, from what I recall. I've tried to rework the clause and add some details as to make it more condemnable.

Emodea wrote:
Appalled that, in all three mentioned delegacies, WEP actively undermined the previous existing democratic institutions present in the region for most of its early history, replacing it with governments based on principles such as meritocracy and delegate supremacy that go against the democratic ideals of the Security Council and that lasted for over a year across these three reigns, eventually serving as a basis for later West Pacifican governments to strengthen the concept of a meritocratic government that lasts to the present day;

Confused again, wouldn't forming a meritocratic government be considered commendable in the context here, especially when the said model has continued to impact TWP up until this day?

Similarly, you have to explain why delegate supremacy is a condemnable thing, since the term itself doesn't imply any negative things by itself without any additional context, at least to me.

There's precedent to this, though: Condemn Pierconium mentions that Pierconium's aid in the Triumvirate "established a legacy of Delegate Supremacy and a Meritocratic government that continues to influence The West Pacific to this day." If it helps, though, I've altered the clause so it focuses more on the authoritarian way of delegate supremacy.

The Python wrote:This... also looks very good, and I look forward to voting for this :blush:

Giovanniland wrote:Wishing to finally bring justice by highlighting WEP's nefariouswickedly evil deeds as an example that no nation should follow;

Hereby condemns Wickedly evil people.

^ semi-ironic feedback only because puns are nice :P

I actually like this suggestion, now that I think about it, it adds to the flavour of the text instead of being a bland "concluding that nation X did bad things and deserves recognition" ending. So added that.

Goobergunchia wrote:Not seeing the evidence to deem Unistrut "despicable". Other than that, support.

Fair point, I've reworded the clause so it focuses more on enlisting foreign people to help the government against the region's wishes rather than calling these nations despicable.
Last edited by Giovanniland on Sat Sep 18, 2021 11:34 am, edited 2 times in total.
The Kingdom of Giovanniland

51st Delegate of the West Pacific
Former TWP Speaker of the Hall (x3), Guardian and Minister of Foreign Affairs


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Bhang Bhang Duc
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Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:55 am

Emodea wrote:
Giovanniland wrote:the banjection of long-term residents from the region, many of which had no political aspirations at all, as well as prominent members that would later become delegates, for example Bhang Bhang Duc, Westwind, and Biteland;

Would you be able to provide a specific number here? Nothing against this sub-point, just personally curious about it.

The actual number of nations was well over 70 if my memory serves correctly. However, the first batch to go which included me and Biteland was either 24 or 28. In reality any TWP active nation that might have opposed Eli was in that first group. The Government-in-Exile's slogan was "Remember the 24 (or 28)". Think it was 28 but I can't be sure - long time ago. :)
Last edited by Bhang Bhang Duc on Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.

Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..

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Giovanniland
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Postby Giovanniland » Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:31 pm

Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:
Emodea wrote:Would you be able to provide a specific number here? Nothing against this sub-point, just personally curious about it.

The actual number of nations was well over 70 if my memory serves correctly. However, the first batch to go which included me and Biteland was either 24 or 28. In reality any TWP active nation that might have opposed Eli was in that first group. The Government-in-Exile's slogan was "Remember the 24 (or 28)". Think it was 28 but I can't be sure - long time ago. :)

Thanks for the info BBD, I've updated the proposal with the number of over 70. Interestingly enough, via a search in the TWP regional forum archives, I was able to find a post by you mentioning "Remember the 28", so probably the first batch was 28 indeed.
Last edited by Giovanniland on Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Kingdom of Giovanniland

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Bhang Bhang Duc
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Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:04 am

Giovanniland wrote:
Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:The actual number of nations was well over 70 if my memory serves correctly. However, the first batch to go which included me and Biteland was either 24 or 28. In reality any TWP active nation that might have opposed Eli was in that first group. The Government-in-Exile's slogan was "Remember the 24 (or 28)". Think it was 28 but I can't be sure - long time ago. :)

Thanks for the info BBD, I've updated the proposal with the number of over 70. Interestingly enough, via a search in the TWP regional forum archives, I was able to find a post by you mentioning "Remember the 28", so probably the first batch was 28 indeed.

Oh good, senility has not yet crept in. :)
Former Delegate of The West Pacific. Guardian (under many Delegates) of The West Pacific. TWP's Former Minister for World Assembly Affairs and former Security Council Advisor.

The West Pacific's Official Welshman, Astronomer and Old Fart
Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.

Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..

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Postby Thousand Branches » Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:16 am

Hi! I just have some short somewhat long wording suggestions. Wonderful draft btw!

Giovanniland wrote:the banjection of over 70 long-term residents from the region, many of which had no political aspirations at all, as well as prominent members that would later become delegates, for example Bhang Bhang Duc, Westwind, and Biteland;

Okay two small things on this one. First of all, and this is 100% personal opinion, but I would change “banjection” to something less NSish like “exile” or “banishment”. I always think stuff like that helps a lot with making something feel more IC. Secondly, and more importantly, I would change “for example” to “including”. I think that just flows quite a bit better.

Giovanniland wrote: the enlistment of nations from other regions to hold important roles and cement the Triumvirate's control of the region, such as Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council) and Unistrut, that aided in administering regional communication platforms, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes;

“the enlistment of nations from other regions to hold important roles” This bit sounds really weird but for the life of me I cannot figure out why. That’s totally unhelpful I know. Maybe “to hold” should be “in holding”? I think that might be it. Keep in mind you’d also have to change “cement” to “cementing”.

Also I’m pretty sure a “such as” transition doesn’t work there mechanically, because in continuing that sentence you would then be referring to the Triumvirate’s control of the region, not the nations earlier mentioned. Admittedly I spent like 10 minutes trying to figure out how you could reorder that in the sentence and I came up with that you’d pretty much have to just separate them into a second sentence and/or completely rework the clause. Here’s my suggestion (hopefully this is somewhat helpful):

“the enlistment of nations from other regions in cementing the Triumvirate's control of the region by aiding in administering regional communication platforms and in doing so, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes. These nations included Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council) and Unistrut (something notably bad about Unistrut I know nothing about NS history so this one is on you);”

I’m sorry that I made this so dang complicated, please forgive me.

Giovanniland wrote:Aghast that the West Pacific Triumvirate was not WEP's only subversion to the delegacy of the West Pacific, however, as the nation first worked closely with Gatesville Inc, a region also condemned by this Council, to place the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants as Delegate in March 2008 and then purposefully make that nation go into inactivity to destabilize the region; the leader of WEP was later given control to Lots of Ants towards the end of the delegacy and used this fact for their own benefit by posting a "farewell" address and resigning from the World Assembly as Lots of Ants only to assume the seat as WEP in April 2008, staying for around a month in the position;

I don’t think the “however” at the beginning is necessary, just disrupts the tone of the beginning of the clause.

This bit sounds weird: “to place the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants as Delegate”. I’m pretty sure “to place (nation) as delegate” is wrong maybe “to get (nation) into the delegacy”? Something similar would certainly work too :)

Also just as a side note, this is a wild way to subvert a region and I think that’s super cool.

Giovanniland wrote: Horrified that WEP again seized the delegacy of the West Pacific in January 2009, destabilizing the region by declaring the former Constitution void, disbanding the entire government including the notable West Pacific Liberation Force, and then building a committee-style government that again featured nations condemned by this Council, such as Pierconium and Minineenee, actions that enabled WEP's delegacy to last for over 100 days until it was ousted in a counter-coup by Rolheath with the aid of Lone Wolves United in April 2009;

Pierconium and Minineenee should have nation tags, right?

Giovanniland wrote: Appalled that, in all three mentioned delegacies, WEP actively undermined the previous existing democratic institutions present in the region for most of its early history, replacing it with governments based on the authoritarian principle of delegate supremacy that goes against the democratic ideals of the Security Council, eventually serving as a basis for later West Pacifican governments to strengthen this principle and allow it to last to the present day;

First comma is unnecessary, as is “previous”

Giovanniland wrote: Concluding that WEP’s role in overthrowing various iterations of a government, holding power for over a year across these three reigns, and undermining democratic ideals, even if concentrated in only one region, certainly changed the course of history, and sadly served as an inspiration or even as a training ground for nations such as Durkadurkiranistan II, also condemned by this Council, to plan more coups in other major regions, and

The highlighted “as” should be removed.


Wow, sorry to make your day harder, I feel bad about that one clause ;-; Hope this was helpful nonetheless.

Have a magnificent day!

-A
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Giovanniland
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Corporate Bordello

Postby Giovanniland » Tue Sep 21, 2021 4:24 pm

Thousand Branches wrote:Hi! I just have some short somewhat long wording suggestions. Wonderful draft btw!

Giovanniland wrote:the banjection of over 70 long-term residents from the region, many of which had no political aspirations at all, as well as prominent members that would later become delegates, for example Bhang Bhang Duc, Westwind, and Biteland;

Okay two small things on this one. First of all, and this is 100% personal opinion, but I would change “banjection” to something less NSish like “exile” or “banishment”. I always think stuff like that helps a lot with making something feel more IC. Secondly, and more importantly, I would change “for example” to “including”. I think that just flows quite a bit better.

Thanks, both suggestions have been added.

Thousand Branches wrote:
Giovanniland wrote: the enlistment of nations from other regions to hold important roles and cement the Triumvirate's control of the region, such as Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council) and Unistrut, that aided in administering regional communication platforms, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes;

“the enlistment of nations from other regions to hold important roles” This bit sounds really weird but for the life of me I cannot figure out why. That’s totally unhelpful I know. Maybe “to hold” should be “in holding”? I think that might be it. Keep in mind you’d also have to change “cement” to “cementing”.

Also I’m pretty sure a “such as” transition doesn’t work there mechanically, because in continuing that sentence you would then be referring to the Triumvirate’s control of the region, not the nations earlier mentioned. Admittedly I spent like 10 minutes trying to figure out how you could reorder that in the sentence and I came up with that you’d pretty much have to just separate them into a second sentence and/or completely rework the clause. Here’s my suggestion (hopefully this is somewhat helpful):

“the enlistment of nations from other regions in cementing the Triumvirate's control of the region by aiding in administering regional communication platforms and in doing so, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes. These nations included Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council) and Unistrut (something notably bad about Unistrut I know nothing about NS history so this one is on you);”

I’m sorry that I made this so dang complicated, please forgive me.

No need to be sorry, your feedback is very helpful! First part of the suggestion was added. That said, for the second one, I'm not really a fan of placing full stops into proposal texts since they're supposed to be read as a single, long-running sentence at least in my opinion. So how's this, I tried to reword the clause while maintaining the same content:
the enlistment of nations from other regions, such as Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council) and Unistrut, that held important roles like administering regional communication platforms in order to cement the Triumvirate's control of the region, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes;


Thousand Branches wrote:
Giovanniland wrote:Aghast that the West Pacific Triumvirate was not WEP's only subversion to the delegacy of the West Pacific, however, as the nation first worked closely with Gatesville Inc, a region also condemned by this Council, to place the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants as Delegate in March 2008 and then purposefully make that nation go into inactivity to destabilize the region; the leader of WEP was later given control to Lots of Ants towards the end of the delegacy and used this fact for their own benefit by posting a "farewell" address and resigning from the World Assembly as Lots of Ants only to assume the seat as WEP in April 2008, staying for around a month in the position;

I don’t think the “however” at the beginning is necessary, just disrupts the tone of the beginning of the clause.

This bit sounds weird: “to place the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants as Delegate”. I’m pretty sure “to place (nation) as delegate” is wrong maybe “to get (nation) into the delegacy”? Something similar would certainly work too :)

Also just as a side note, this is a wild way to subvert a region and I think that’s super cool.

Also accepted these suggestions.

Thousand Branches wrote:
Giovanniland wrote: Horrified that WEP again seized the delegacy of the West Pacific in January 2009, destabilizing the region by declaring the former Constitution void, disbanding the entire government including the notable West Pacific Liberation Force, and then building a committee-style government that again featured nations condemned by this Council, such as Pierconium and Minineenee, actions that enabled WEP's delegacy to last for over 100 days until it was ousted in a counter-coup by Rolheath with the aid of Lone Wolves United in April 2009;

Pierconium and Minineenee should have nation tags, right?

Actually, since they were both mentioned earlier with nation tags in the proposal, I didn't really see a need to put nation tags again.

Thousand Branches wrote:
Giovanniland wrote: Appalled that, in all three mentioned delegacies, WEP actively undermined the previous existing democratic institutions present in the region for most of its early history, replacing it with governments based on the authoritarian principle of delegate supremacy that goes against the democratic ideals of the Security Council, eventually serving as a basis for later West Pacifican governments to strengthen this principle and allow it to last to the present day;

First comma is unnecessary, as is “previous”

Giovanniland wrote: Concluding that WEP’s role in overthrowing various iterations of a government, holding power for over a year across these three reigns, and undermining democratic ideals, even if concentrated in only one region, certainly changed the course of history, and sadly served as an inspiration or even as a training ground for nations such as Durkadurkiranistan II, also condemned by this Council, to plan more coups in other major regions, and

The highlighted “as” should be removed.

Wow, sorry to make your day harder, I feel bad about that one clause ;-; Hope this was helpful nonetheless.

Have a magnificent day!

-A

And for those two last suggestions, also applied them. As I said before, no need to be sorry, given that your feedback is very helpful. Thank you! :)
Last edited by Giovanniland on Tue Sep 21, 2021 4:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Thousand Branches
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Thousand Branches » Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:28 pm

Giovanniland wrote:No need to be sorry, your feedback is very helpful! First part of the suggestion was added. That said, for the second one, I'm not really a fan of placing full stops into proposal texts since they're supposed to be read as a single, long-running sentence at least in my opinion. So how's this, I tried to reword the clause while maintaining the same content:
the enlistment of nations from other regions, such as Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council) and Unistrut, that held important roles like administering regional communication platforms in order to cement the Triumvirate's control of the region, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes;

Now that I’m reading it, this looks like a totally okay solution actually. Somehow in my process of working through this clause I’d got it through my head that by putting the nation names there, it would sound like you were referring to the regions and not the nations, but now that I’m reading it, it reads totally normal. Honestly can’t think why I got that into my head :p

Anyway, it looks awesome!
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Goobergunchia
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Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Goobergunchia » Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:01 pm

Minor possible tweaks:

the enlistment of nations from other regions, such as Unistrut and Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council) and Unistrut, that held important roles like administering regional communication platforms in order to cement the Triumvirate's control of the region, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes;


Reading it aloud, I think the parenthetical reads slightly better if it ends the clause rather than in the middle.

Aghast that the West Pacific Triumvirate was not WEP's only subversion to the delegacy of the West Pacific, as the nation first worked closely with Gatesville Inc, a region also condemned by this Council, to get the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants into the delegacy in March 2008 and then purposefully make that nation go into inactivity to destabilize the region; the leader of WEP was later given control to of Lots of Ants towards the end of the delegacy and used this fact for their own benefit by posting a "farewell" address and resigning from the World Assembly as Lots of Ants, only to assume the seat as WEP in April 2008, staying for around a month in the position;

Horrified that WEP again seized the delegacy of the West Pacific in January 2009, destabilizing the region by declaring the former Constitution void, disbanding the entire government including the notable West Pacific Liberation Force, and then building a committee-style government that again featured nations condemned by this Council, such as Pierconium and Minineenee, actions that enabled WEP's delegacy to last for over 100 days until it was ousted in a counter-coup by Rolheath ROLHEATH with the aid of Lone Wolves United in April 2009;


This is mostly grammatical nitpicking and a note that ROLHEATH's' nation name was in all caps. "... featured nations, such as Pierconium and Minineenee, condemned by this Council ..." would also work.
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Wickedly evil people
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Corporate Police State

Postby Wickedly evil people » Wed Sep 22, 2021 6:49 am

Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:
Giovanniland wrote:Thanks for the info BBD, I've updated the proposal with the number of over 70. Interestingly enough, via a search in the TWP regional forum archives, I was able to find a post by you mentioning "Remember the 28", so probably the first batch was 28 indeed.

Oh good, senility has not yet crept in. :)



I was traveling for business in RL and it was time to meet the crew for our evening repast. So I stopped at 28. If you were active on the old forum and said anything bad about poor innocent Eli, out you went. :)

Got the rest later...
Last edited by Wickedly evil people on Wed Sep 22, 2021 6:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Giovanniland
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Founded: Aug 10, 2019
Corporate Bordello

Postby Giovanniland » Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:37 am

Thousand Branches wrote:
Giovanniland wrote:No need to be sorry, your feedback is very helpful! First part of the suggestion was added. That said, for the second one, I'm not really a fan of placing full stops into proposal texts since they're supposed to be read as a single, long-running sentence at least in my opinion. So how's this, I tried to reword the clause while maintaining the same content:
the enlistment of nations from other regions, such as Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council) and Unistrut, that held important roles like administering regional communication platforms in order to cement the Triumvirate's control of the region, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes;

Now that I’m reading it, this looks like a totally okay solution actually. Somehow in my process of working through this clause I’d got it through my head that by putting the nation names there, it would sound like you were referring to the regions and not the nations, but now that I’m reading it, it reads totally normal. Honestly can’t think why I got that into my head :p

Anyway, it looks awesome!

Thanks :)
Goobergunchia wrote:Minor possible tweaks:

the enlistment of nations from other regions, such as Unistrut and Pierconium (a nation condemned by this very Council) and Unistrut, that held important roles like administering regional communication platforms in order to cement the Triumvirate's control of the region, demonstrating a foreign influence in the government imposed against residents' wishes;


Reading it aloud, I think the parenthetical reads slightly better if it ends the clause rather than in the middle.

Aghast that the West Pacific Triumvirate was not WEP's only subversion to the delegacy of the West Pacific, as the nation first worked closely with Gatesville Inc, a region also condemned by this Council, to get the Gatesville agent Lots of Ants into the delegacy in March 2008 and then purposefully make that nation go into inactivity to destabilize the region; the leader of WEP was later given control to of Lots of Ants towards the end of the delegacy and used this fact for their own benefit by posting a "farewell" address and resigning from the World Assembly as Lots of Ants, only to assume the seat as WEP in April 2008, staying for around a month in the position;

Horrified that WEP again seized the delegacy of the West Pacific in January 2009, destabilizing the region by declaring the former Constitution void, disbanding the entire government including the notable West Pacific Liberation Force, and then building a committee-style government that again featured nations condemned by this Council, such as Pierconium and Minineenee, actions that enabled WEP's delegacy to last for over 100 days until it was ousted in a counter-coup by Rolheath ROLHEATH with the aid of Lone Wolves United in April 2009;


This is mostly grammatical nitpicking and a note that ROLHEATH's' nation name was in all caps. "... featured nations, such as Pierconium and Minineenee, condemned by this Council ..." would also work.

Those all look good and I've accepted them, except for the last wording suggestion: even though both get the message across, I think that "again featured nations condemned by this Council" is stronger and sounds more evil.
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Giovanniland
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Corporate Bordello

Postby Giovanniland » Tue Sep 28, 2021 9:27 am

Given that it's been a while since the last comment and that the thread is almost falling off the first page, I think I can bump it to hopefully attract some more comments.
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Hulldom
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Postby Hulldom » Tue Sep 28, 2021 9:54 am

Looks fine to me, Gio. Good luck when you submit!
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Giovanniland
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Corporate Bordello

Postby Giovanniland » Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:50 pm

Hulldom wrote:Looks fine to me, Gio. Good luck when you submit!

Thank you :D
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Giovanniland
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Corporate Bordello

Postby Giovanniland » Sun Oct 03, 2021 5:53 am

Bumping this again as to hopefully have some more feedback. I am planning to submit in around one week if no major changes are made to the proposal.
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Giovanniland
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Corporate Bordello

Postby Giovanniland » Tue Oct 12, 2021 12:12 pm

This has been submitted.
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Greater Cesnica
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Postby Greater Cesnica » Sat Oct 16, 2021 8:41 pm

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