Cekovia wrote:Aguaria Major wrote:This may shock you to hear:
But some people actually base their conclusions about the world based on logic, and aren't swayed by the logic of religious people which, when one gets right down to it, amounts to little more than, "because that's what I was taught and God said so."
i genuinely do not understand why you would try to make the large-scale complexities of a beautiful and mysterious universe try to conform to a rigid set of rules, unless you are severely autistic, when you can simply Not. i'd also add that i was not raised a christian and i converted of my own accord because i saw god's truth, not because anyone indoctrinated me.Nothing should be above questioning in the world of logical thinking, and the realities are that:
a) when one examines the utility of religion, there really isn't any argument for keeping it around anymore, and
b) when one examines its fundamental claims about the nature of the universe from a logical perspective, he will always find them to be full of holes.
That being said: if you want to keep practicing it despite the lack of evidence for it being necessay for society and its claims about the universe, by all means, keep doing so. Just don't try to lie to yourself and disguise your conclusion to do so as anything other than blind, illogical tribalism.
Because THAT is what's pointless here.
is your commitment to what you see as logic anything but itself a rigid undying tribalism, a unity to what you yourself have been taught to be the rules of how things operate, a faith in a system which demands you not have faith? is that not itself fundamentally illogical based on your own rules?
And doubling down:
Cekovia wrote:Aguaria Major wrote:1) Umm, because that's how humanity has advanced.
The more knowledge we have about the universe, the more we can advance our tech on the path to a higher plain of existence
tower of babel typa beat, cool. look, there's a difference between trying to use logic to explain the creation of the entire universe and using logic to figure out how certain metals and synthetic chemicals interact in order to produce smartphones or even to figure out how organisms evolved from one starting point.If people thought like you do, then we never would've advanced beyond the stone age, when EVERYTHING was a mystery that instilled awe. It's not autistic to seek greater knowledge of the world around you. It's the human condition.
certainly. what is autistic(-adjacent) is to impose a single system upon the entire universe and insist that everybody who wants to try to add a bit of nuance to that and find a better explanation for some of the stranger unexplained phenomena is a tribalistic illogical idiot, as you're doing.2) No, because logic isn't rooted in a deference to questioning authority or a specifc group of people like your religion is. It's rooted in the individual's capacity for comprehension, and subsequent questioning of, the world around them. That is the antithesis of tribalism, which you evidently do not know the definiton of.
oh wow, you personally investigated every aspect of every scientific phenomenon that you are endorsing? wow that's really impressive and independent of you, no deference to any sort of questioning authority or groups of people like, you know, scientists.If I truly was adhering to tribalism, I'd still be Catholic, like I was taught to be at birth.
you can be tribalistic for a tribe you've joined later than birth.You're grasping for straws and it shows, mate. You've run out of defenses for your own argument, so you're pivoting and falsely attacking me for exhibiting the same behvior as you, which, given the fact you're now using that as ammunition against me, thus taking the stance of that being a negative behavior, you have unwittingly admitted is wrong.
So, in other words, you're so out of arguments that you're destoying the ones you made previously.
jesus christ. no. i am pointing out that we are Both using the same fundamental system of faith for our own belief systems and that's OK and should be embraced but that you are being a hypocrite. i myself perform biological research and i certainly believe the scientific method can be applied to many natural phenomena, as i do! i also understand that fundamentally, my work relies on having faith in the accuracy of other researchers who have provided the basis for my own work and in the scientific method, and that science cannot try to overtake god.
EDIT: By implication calling the poster "abnormal and insane" and explicitly "too far gone":
Cekovia wrote:Horde of One wrote:
Similarly, one might question why you would would want to try to make a universe which is perfectly passible of being explained with logic and science try to conform to the human-made dogma of your religion.
how the hell can u say the universe can be explained entirely by logic and science when there are quite likely literally millions of unanswered scientific questions. why would you say that. why would you think that would be a normal and sane thing to say.And I believe calling all irreligious people severly autistic isn't a very good course of action if you wish to convert them, ad hominems only hurt your cause you know.
i dont care because you people are way too far gone to change your minds anyway. debate on this site is almost entirely for the benefit of the audience.
EDIT2: Minor, but in culmination with these other posts in the same thread:
Cekovia wrote:Kilobugya wrote:
You don't need to understand the detailed specifics of one religion in particular to explain why religious way of thinking in general is flawed. Exactly like you don't need to know the specifics of a particular perpetual motion machine proposal to disregard it due to thermodynamic reasons.
you dont however you do need to understand the basic concepts of religious philosophy in order to not make an utter fool of yourself when trying to argue that it is bad and wrong. which you don't and you just did.
