Is Capitalism "The Final Stage"?

[The Giant Space Wyrm]

The Final Stage is when we achieve Star Trek Fabricators. Once we have done so we have achieved the Final Stage.

Our only issue will be the Laws of Physics, and standard paranoia surrounding a world where no one needs to struggle breeding complacency or something stupid like that.

[Vivolkha]

"The Final Stage" sounds like another neoliberal screed written by Francis "The End of History" Fukuyama.

My position is there is no Final Stage. Humanity will switch ideologies and systems when they are no longer working and applicable to their current situation, all the way until our extinction, because there is no such thing as a perfect ideology.

This.

[The New California Republic]

@ OP: "viable"? Have you seen how rampant consumerism is turning our planet into a pile of shit?

[Arisyan]

No. Quite frankly socialism is the final stage. Per se eco-socialism, which will end the climate crisis and fix most problems associated with modern capitalism. Capitalism, is quite frankly, only still around through scare tactics through the US and that's all. oh, and neoliberalism played a part too.

[Ifreann]

relevant:

(Image)

Came to post the "Fukuyama announces History 2" picture, this is far superior.

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According to quite a few people online, Karl Marx supported capitalism. So it might be him, who knows?

lol Karl Marx lived off of his rich capitalist friends when he made his communist manifesto. Let that sink in.

Well grifted, Karl.

[Mustardaise]

This thread:
What's it meant to be: a space for providing arguments for or against a thesis that capitalism can change into something else.
What it actually is: white, middle-class communists engaging in virtue signalling and painting large targets on the backs of left-oriented people who want to do something more than just complain about capitalism.

[Pasong Tirad]

This thread:
What's it meant to be: a space for providing arguments for or against a thesis that capitalism can change into something else.
What it actually is: white, middle-class communists complaining about capitalism and painting large targets on the backs of left-oriented people who want to do something more than just complain about capitalism.

Lol what

[Mustardaise]

This thread:
What's it meant to be: a space for providing arguments for or against a thesis that capitalism can change into something else.
What it actually is: white, middle-class communists complaining about capitalism and painting large targets on the backs of left-oriented people who want to do something more than just complain about capitalism.

Lol what

Point to the specific part of my comment which you are having trouble understanding and I'll try my best to elaborate.

[Ifreann]

This thread:
What's it meant to be: a space for providing arguments for or against a thesis that capitalism can change into something else.
What it actually is: white, middle-class communists complaining about capitalism and painting large targets on the backs of left-oriented people who want to do something more than just complain about capitalism.

Lol what

Lefty shitposting is a danger to real leftists because something something middle-class.

[Pasong Tirad]

Lol what

Lefty shitposting is a danger to real leftists because something something middle-class.

I just got called white I feel so dirty.

[Mustardaise]

Lefty shitposting is a danger to real leftists because something something middle-class.

Shitposting is not an issue. The issue is that it is pretty much everything those people are attempting to do in an attempt to fix the world. Meanwhile, the system that works for all the wrong reasons is laughing at us.

[Esheaun Stroakuss]

I am very open to the idea of capitalist reform in the short term. In the long term, capitalism should either be replaced by something else, i.e. socialism/anarchism, or transition into something entirely new. I think the pragmatic approach is to work within the system, change it so it is more ethical and responsible, and more representative of what people want. This can only be done through rhetoric and direct action.

I would like to think the "final stage" is brought in through peaceful means. Though I have to accept the possibility of a violent revolution, I am still not a bloodthirsty psycho who wants people to die, so I am reluctant to advocate for it. If a violent revolution must occur to reach the "final stage" it must be against the aggressors of the state, not citizens.

Capitalism is capable of changing for the better. It is also capable of becoming much worse. Can it be reformed, or is it just putting a new coat of paint over an old, broken thing? Either way I am willing to discuss reform for the short term.

As much as "down with capitalism" is a cool meme, it is also bad optics if you want to get people on your side. Tankies in that regard are not worth your time if you want a straight answer.

[Ifreann]

Lefty shitposting is a danger to real leftists because something something middle-class.

Shitposting is not an issue. The issue is that it is pretty much everything those people are attempting to do in an attempt to fix the world.

Well, good for them to be doing something and not nothing.

Meanwhile, the system that works for all the wrong reasons is laughing at us.

How terrible it must be for you to feel like someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad ideological tendency with which you happen to identify.

[Mustardaise]

How terrible it must be for you to feel like someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad ideological tendency with which you happen to identify.

How terrible it must be for you to feel like when someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad sexual identity with which you happen to identify.

Keep shooting yourself in your foot. Anything after the first shot feels like nothing, anyway.

[Esheaun Stroakuss]

How terrible it must be for you to feel like someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad ideological tendency with which you happen to identify.

How terrible it must be for you to feel like when someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad sexual identity with which you happen to identify.

What...?

[Ifreann]

How terrible it must be for you to feel like someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad ideological tendency with which you happen to identify.

How terrible it must be for you to feel like when someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad sexual identity with which you happen to identify.

Nah, it's usually funny when people laugh at the straights not being okay.

[Atheris]

How terrible it must be for you to feel like someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad ideological tendency with which you happen to identify.

How terrible it must be for you to feel like when someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad sexual identity with which you happen to identify.

Oooookay, now you've lost me.

Ideology is voluntary, sexual orientation isn't.

[Mustardaise]

Ideology is voluntary, sexual orientation isn't.

So you're saying I can just flick my fingers and stop believing that homosexuals should be treated like any other people, and that the poor should have higher standards of living?

[Atheris]

Ideology is voluntary, sexual orientation isn't.

So you're saying I can just flick my fingers and stop believing that homosexuals should be treated like any other people, and that the poor should have higher standards of living?

I can't tell if this is a goalpost or a strawman.

Can it be both? Please tell me it's both.

[Esheaun Stroakuss]

Ideology is voluntary, sexual orientation isn't.

So you're saying I can just flick my fingers and stop believing that homosexuals should be treated like any other people, and that the poor should have higher standards of living?

...no one said you did not believe in those things?

[Ifreann]

Ideology is voluntary, sexual orientation isn't.

So you're saying I can just flick my fingers and stop believing that homosexuals should be treated like any other people, and that the poor should have higher standards of living?

You seem to have flicked your fingers and started to believe that being a lefto is just like being gay, so yes, I imagine that you could.

[Mustardaise]

So you're saying I can just flick my fingers and stop believing that homosexuals should be treated like any other people, and that the poor should have higher standards of living?

...no one said you did not believe in those things?

Wasn't my point, though.

You seem to have flicked your fingers and started to believe that being a lefto is just like being gay, so yes, I imagine that you could.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

[Atheris]

You seem to have flicked your fingers and started to believe that being a lefto is just like being gay, so yes, I imagine that you could.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

The hypocrisy is real with this one.

[Mustardaise]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

The hypocrisy is real with this one.

Not really:

How terrible it must be for you to feel like when someone, somewhere, presumably, is laughing not at you specifically, but at a broad sexual identity with which you happen to identify.

Nah, it's usually funny when people laugh at the straights not being okay.

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Anyway, you guys have each other, so I guess I am happy for you. Just keep your brushes off my back, please.

[Atheris]

The hypocrisy is real with this one.

Not really:

Nah, it's usually funny when people laugh at the straights not being okay.

That's... not what hypocrisy means...