UK Politics Thread XII: The Lockdown

[Hrythingland]

Why do you not start your own thread(s)?

Imagine trying to be snide by telling me my posts are good enough to be OPs by posting this kind of shit in response?

Why don't you and two other posters *everyone knows who I am talking about*, go have your own thread for this drive by non-contributive shit? Go on, make this observation of yours an OP. I'm rivetted mate, I want to discuss this point you've made more. Pages and pages of it I reckon. We'll all gather round.

Best not to use tech when you've had a few down you. If I said half the things I've said when bevved somewhere they could be kept for posterity I'd be in prison tbh.

[Agarntrop]

Imagine trying to be snide by telling me my posts are good enough to be OPs by posting this kind of shit in response?

Why don't you and two other posters *everyone knows who I am talking about*, go have your own thread for this drive by non-contributive shit? Go on, make this an OP. I'm rivetted mate, I want to discuss this point you've made more. Pages and pages of it. We'll all gather round.

Easy dude....

Nothing more angry than a drunk ostro

[Ostroeuropa]

Easy dude....

Nothing more angry than a drunk ostro

I'm not angry. I just find it comical.

I've been drinking, so ignore the language:

Child abuse incidents have risen a lot over quarantine.

This is a challenge to the Liberal notion that its because of the badmen, with badgenes and badmorals, a personal failure.

Instead, we should probably recognize;
it's mostly linked to psychological stress.
You've got like, absolute psychos who do it because that's just how they are, and then you've got people who snap under pressure and lash out.
Poverty increases pressure. The solution is less poverty and more access to mental health care and so on.
But quarantine also increases pressure.
This is why high pressure jobs have it happen more too, even if they are middle class.
If you're fretting over a meeting tomorrow that determines If you get a major promotion that your identity is based on and your four year old won't shut the fuck up and let you destress, and that's been going on for weeks, you have no time for yourself and no time to let of pressure, so you go mental.
Same for poverty. Fretting over where the next meal is going to come from and trying to be like "I can't think about this, it's making me ill, i'll watch TV and try and chill out" and then your four year old is there preventing you doing that causes a gradual build up as you have no time to chill out. It's stress after stress.
That only applies to psychological "Shut the fuck up you fat and ugly little shit, you're the worst thing that ever happened to me" style and beating style abuse. The sexual abuse stuff is not linked to stress, that's just a different type of fucked in the head like the ones who do it just because they enjoy it.
I also think classes teaching parents how to tell their kids to fuck off in a constructive way would be helpful. Or hell, and I know this is DANGEROUS SOCIALISM, maybe just emergency carers. Just give parents one or two calls a year where they can be like "I need you to babysit, because I'm going mental." and we'll send around a state appointed carer for the day/night.
This is why child abuse is also higher among single parents, both the poverty aspects and the "I have no time to chill out" aspects get worse.



The Tories on the other hand are just like "Oh yeah, child abuse is up by a considerable amount". They haven't quite busted out the "CULTURAL DEGENERATION" reasoning yet, but they're *deafeningly* silent on why that would be the case.

Those are sensible ideas. Though there is the small wrinkle in how social distancing would be maintained with the carers wearing masks and such.

Mmm, I didn't think about social distancing for this proposal. That is a problem, yes. I suppose i'd argue this is more of a long-term thing for curtailing child abuse, while during quarantine the usual ideas for how society should run are all kind of broken.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

British government dumps a billion dollars in a company being out-competed by Starlink... to try to move jobs from Airbus and Florida to UK... who hasn't exactly got a domestic aerospace industry... Dear Boris this doesn't look like it'll work out like you think.

[Alyakia]

The sexual abuse stuff is not linked to stress, that's just a different type of fucked in the head like the ones who do it just because they enjoy it.

many potential sexual abusers are most likely to offend when their self-esteem is low and their stress levels are high. this is why, for example, viewers of child pornography are statistically more likely to be single and unemployed compared to the general population. i mean they're still usually fucked in the head at some level to get to that point in the first place but i have absolutely no doubt that the stress caused by corona is directly fueling the increase in child abuse. but try explaining to tom, dick and harry that you want to make sure potential kiddy fiddlers have a decent job, a nice waifu and a steady supply of chill pills and you'll probably see how fucked we are.

e: and of course this to an extent applies to most other types of crime. same principle. take the person out of the bad environment and put them in the good one.

[Ostroeuropa]

The sexual abuse stuff is not linked to stress, that's just a different type of fucked in the head like the ones who do it just because they enjoy it.

many potential sexual abusers are most likely to offend when their self-esteem is low and their stress levels are high. this is why, for example, viewers of child pornography are statistically more likely to be single and unemployed compared to the general population. i mean they're still usually fucked in the head at some level to get to that point in the first place but i have absolutely no doubt that the stress caused by corona is directly fueling the increase in child abuse. but try explaining to tom, dick and harry that you want to make sure potential kiddy fiddlers have a decent job, a nice waifu and a steady supply of chill pills and you'll probably see how fucked we are.

I didn't know that. That's interesting. Any ideas as to why?

I thought May's big thing to encourage people attracted to children to come forward for help and support was the best thing she did as PM. Also, Beastars I guess. Did you see Jack Saints video on that? It was pretty darn convincing on the topic of queerness (And I get why LGBT folk might get their heckles raised by pedophiles being called "queer", but it's the meaning of the term in as far as Queer theory is about society deemed unacceptable by society, and it covered the issue of predatory sexual relations.). Like, the idea that it's simply not helpful to demonize and demand people suppress it, because the results are either self-harm, or they just snap and do the thing you don't want them to do.

British government dumps a billion dollars in a company being out-competed by Starlink... to try to move jobs from Airbus and Florida to UK... who hasn't exactly got a domestic aerospace industry... Dear Boris this doesn't look like it'll work out like you think.

I mean, it'll let the owners pocket the money, not re-invest it, and shift their portfolios over to competitors like happened with British Steel. so... it's working out. Just not like how he's going to pretend it is.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

many potential sexual abusers are most likely to offend when their self-esteem is low and their stress levels are high. this is why, for example, viewers of child pornography are statistically more likely to be single and unemployed compared to the general population. i mean they're still usually fucked in the head at some level to get to that point in the first place but i have absolutely no doubt that the stress caused by corona is directly fueling the increase in child abuse. but try explaining to tom, dick and harry that you want to make sure potential kiddy fiddlers have a decent job, a nice waifu and a steady supply of chill pills and you'll probably see how fucked we are.

I didn't know that. That's interesting. Any ideas as to why?

I thought May's big thing to encourage people attracted to children to come forward for help and support was the best thing she did as PM. Also, Beastars I guess. Did you see Jack Saints video on that? It was pretty darn convincing on the topic of queerness (And I get why LGBT folk might get their heckles raised by pedophiles being called "queer", but it's the meaning of the term in as far as Queer theory is about society deemed unacceptable by society, and it covered the issue of predatory sexual relations.). Like, the idea that it's simply not helpful to demonize and demand people suppress it, because the results are either self-harm, or they just snap and do the thing you don't want them to do.

British government dumps a billion dollars in a company being out-competed by Starlink... to try to move jobs from Airbus and Florida to UK... who hasn't exactly got a domestic aerospace industry... Dear Boris this doesn't look like it'll work out like you think.

I mean, it'll let the owners pocket the money, not re-invest it, and shift their portfolios over to competitors like happened with British Steel. so... it's working out. Just not like how he's going to pretend it is.

The problem with attempting to help pedophiles rehabilitate will always be those idiots who see people having a sexual attraction to children not as something we should be wanting to cure but as 'I'm gonna smash is fuckin ed in.'

Then the newspapers pick up on it, and suddenly you're soft on pedos. It's the same problem that happens with anything that doesn't fit into the 'tough on crime' mindset.

[Hrythingland]

I didn't know that. That's interesting. Any ideas as to why?

I thought May's big thing to encourage people attracted to children to come forward for help and support was the best thing she did as PM. Also, Beastars I guess. Did you see Jack Saints video on that? It was pretty darn convincing on the topic of queerness (And I get why LGBT folk might get their heckles raised by pedophiles being called "queer", but it's the meaning of the term in as far as Queer theory is about society deemed unacceptable by society, and it covered the issue of predatory sexual relations.). Like, the idea that it's simply not helpful to demonize and demand people suppress it, because the results are either self-harm, or they just snap and do the thing you don't want them to do.



I mean, it'll let the owners pocket the money, not re-invest it, and shift their portfolios over to competitors like happened with British Steel. so... it's working out. Just not like how he's going to pretend it is.

The problem with attempting to help pedophiles rehabilitate will always be those idiots who see people having a sexual attraction to children not as something we should be wanting to cure but as 'I'm gonna smash is fuckin ed in.'

Then the newspapers pick up on it, and suddenly you're soft on pedos. It's the same problem that happens with anything that doesn't fit into the 'tough on crime' mindset.

Well 'I'm gonna smash is fuckin ed in.' Is a reasonable response to paedophilia to be quite frank. It is a parent's worst nightmare, that their child is being preyed on by some seedy old nonce.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

The problem with attempting to help pedophiles rehabilitate will always be those idiots who see people having a sexual attraction to children not as something we should be wanting to cure but as 'I'm gonna smash is fuckin ed in.'

Then the newspapers pick up on it, and suddenly you're soft on pedos. It's the same problem that happens with anything that doesn't fit into the 'tough on crime' mindset.

Well 'I'm gonna smash is fuckin ed in.' Is a reasonable response to paedophilia to be quite frank. It is a parent's worst nightmare, that their child is being preyed on by some seedy old nonce.

Violence isn't a reasonable response to anything, unless you're directly threatened. Nobody is threatened by rehabilitating pedophiles.

[Hrythingland]

Well 'I'm gonna smash is fuckin ed in.' Is a reasonable response to paedophilia to be quite frank. It is a parent's worst nightmare, that their child is being preyed on by some seedy old nonce.

Violence isn't a reasonable response to anything, unless you're directly threatened. Nobody is threatened by rehabilitating pedophiles.

Violence is a perfectly reasonable response to many things, biologically and evolutionarily speaking. If I were a parent and I discovered that my child had come into contact with a released paedo I would be apoplectic.

[Gormwood]

Violence isn't a reasonable response to anything, unless you're directly threatened. Nobody is threatened by rehabilitating pedophiles.

Violence is a perfectly reasonable response to many things, biologically and evolutionarily speaking. If I were a parent and I discovered that my child had come into contact with a released paedo I would be apoplectic.

Smash is ead in for just being around children without actual proof of molestation? And people wonder why pedophiles are so secretive and unwilling to seek help...

[Hrythingland]

Violence is a perfectly reasonable response to many things, biologically and evolutionarily speaking. If I were a parent and I discovered that my child had come into contact with a released paedo I would be apoplectic.

Smash is ead in for just being around children without actual proof of molestation? And people wonder why pedophiles are so secretive and unwilling to seek help...

I don't know what to say really. I can't say I care much for their plight due to all the horrific things I have heard. All I know is that I would be bloody furious if my child or younger siblings were ever exposed to them, probably to the point of contemplating homicide. Perhaps they ought to be sent to kelp farms in the Hebrides.

[Gormwood]

Smash is ead in for just being around children without actual proof of molestation? And people wonder why pedophiles are so secretive and unwilling to seek help...

I don't know what to say really. I can't say I care much for their plight due to all the horrific things I have heard. All I know is that I would be bloody furious if my child or younger siblings were ever exposed to them, probably to the point of contemplating homicide. Perhaps they ought to be sent to kelp farms in the Hebrides.

When you're treated like shit even when you do nothing wrong, you eventually have nothing to lose and decide to be the monster society declares you to be.

[Hrythingland]

I don't know what to say really. I can't say I care much for their plight due to all the horrific things I have heard. All I know is that I would be bloody furious if my child or younger siblings were ever exposed to them, probably to the point of contemplating homicide. Perhaps they ought to be sent to kelp farms in the Hebrides.

When you're treated like shit even when you do nothing wrong, you eventually have nothing to lose and decide to be the monster society declares you to be.

This is true. I think if someone has an attraction to children then there's not a lot that can be done really, unless there are ways of coaching them out of it, but who volunteers to do that I do not know and I do not envy them. At the end of the day the idea of it is wholly stomach churning, and in my opinion physical acts of pedophilia should be met with highly punitive measures, even death.

[Gormwood]

When you're treated like shit even when you do nothing wrong, you eventually have nothing to lose and decide to be the monster society declares you to be.

This is true. I think if someone has an attraction to children then there's not a lot that can be done really, unless there are ways of coaching them out of it, but who volunteers to do that I do not know and I do not envy them. At the end of the day the idea of it is wholly stomach churning, and in my opinion physical acts of pedophilia should be met with highly punitive measures, even death.

Which will do nothing to deter the desperate, just make them more than willing to murder the children to silence the likely only witness.

[Novus America]

This is true. I think if someone has an attraction to children then there's not a lot that can be done really, unless there are ways of coaching them out of it, but who volunteers to do that I do not know and I do not envy them. At the end of the day the idea of it is wholly stomach churning, and in my opinion physical acts of pedophilia should be met with highly punitive measures, even death.

Which will do nothing to deter the desperate, just make them more than willing to murder the children to silence the likely only witness.

If the are already willing to kill the the victim because of a possible death penalty they will probably kill to avoid jail. If the death penalty does not deter people more than jail, then it does not follow that it makes people more likely to commit murder.

It prevents them from doing it again. It is the most effective form of incapacitation based justice. Although it should not be used in all cases, it could be an option on the table.

[Hirota]

It's not even a particularly controversial view amongst the community.

I think it's less the view and more the language he chose to express it. "damn blacks" is always going to create an issue.

Sure. A poor choice of words shouldn't be a reason to lose a job though - see Rebecca Long-Bailey.

Nuance is important, and sometimes people do a shit job of conveying it. But they should be given the opportunity to clarify if challenged.

[Hirota]

Well 'I'm gonna smash is fuckin ed in.' Is a reasonable response to paedophilia to be quite frank. It is a parent's worst nightmare, that their child is being preyed on by some seedy old nonce.

Violence isn't a reasonable response to anything, unless you're directly threatened. Nobody is threatened by rehabilitating pedophiles.

I'm not sure many biological imperatives are particularly reasonable.

By that I mean that most human beings will instinctively tend to prioritise the safety of children (who do not always have to be their own for this instinct to kick in) above others, and go further to ensure that safety.

[Vassenor]

This is a challenge to the Liberal notion that its because of the badmen, with badgenes and badmorals, a personal failure.

People actually think that? News to me.

[Vassenor]

Boris Johnson has just done an extraordinarily shambolic interview on LBC, with a near constant smirk on his face from all of the absolute gibberish he knows he's getting away with.

On Brexit he's made the extraordinary claim that a chaotic "no deal" flounce out of the EU is a "very good option", which is entirely true for the billionaire speculators who are shorting British stocks and assets in anticipation of the post-Brexit crash their Tory chums are going to deliver for them. But it's entirely false in regards to everyone else, especially people and industries that are already struggling desperately from the coronavirus crisis, before the prospects of post-Brexit customs bureaucracy, job losses, and soaring food prices.

On the fact his dad blatantly defied coronavirus travel restrictions Johnson washed his hands of responsibility, just like he did with Cummings previously. Further illustrating the point that Boris Johnson, his family, and his Tory chums are exempt from the public safety rules that his government demand that others abide by.

And on Black Lives Matter Johnson declared that he would never take a knee against systematic racism because he supposedly doesn't believe in gestures.

This is a man who has spent months performatively clapping for the NHS every Thursday, despite the fact his party has spent the entire last decade starving it of funding, repressing NHS workers' wages, closing scores of NHS facilities across the country, and giving away £billions in NHS services and facilities to unaccountable private sector profiteers.

Johnson has provided absolutely shocking takes on three of the main issues in contemporary politics.

On Brexit he smirkingly admits that his pre-election promises of an "over-ready Brexit" were absolute nonsense, and that he actually considers failure to reach an exit agreement to be a "very good option".

On Coronavirus he still believes that establishment elitists like his father and his main adviser are exempt from the public safety rules he demands the rest of us abide by.

And on Black Lives Matter he's not just ridiculing the movement as 'gesture politics' he's also outright lying that he doesn't engage in gesture politics, when his entire political career is studded with examples of vapid and disingenuous political posturing.

It's never going to cease amazing me that millions of Brits actively decided to elect this disgracefully incompetent clown to lead the country, because they didn't want publicly owned railways and water companies; or investment in education, health, housing, and high-skill jobs; or for corporations and the mega-rich to pay just a bit more tax!

Sounds like a pretty good summary of what's been going on.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Which will do nothing to deter the desperate, just make them more than willing to murder the children to silence the likely only witness.

If the are already willing to kill the the victim because of a possible death penalty they will probably kill to avoid jail. If the death penalty does not deter people more than jail, then it does not follow that it makes people more likely to commit murder.

It prevents them from doing it again. It is the most effective form of incapacitation based justice. Although it should not be used in all cases, it could be an option on the table.

No, let's not allow more state-sanctioned killing. We already let the military do it, don't spread that to the justice system

[Vassenor]

Also looks like the government is handing out big contracts to shell companies run by cronies again.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Also looks like the government is handing out big contracts to shell companies run by cronies again.

Well who would you give them to?

[Vassenor]

Also looks like the government is handing out big contracts to shell companies run by cronies again.

Well who would you give them to?

Companies that can actually win a competitive tender process because they actually operate in and have experience with the sector in question. Companies that the government can actually expect to deliver on the investment rather than just take the taxpayers' money and run.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Well who would you give them to?

Companies that can actually win a competitive tender process because they actually operate in and have experience with the sector in question. Companies that the government can actually expect to deliver on the investment rather than just take the taxpayers' money and run.

that doesn't sound british.