How to save socialism in the US (and other western countries

[Disgraces]

It is, isn't it?
Come now, do you think you are the only one to ever suffer? That poverty is something only you may have?

No, and I am not proud of being poor, it infuriates me, because the government does live the good life in the "imperialist" countries.

Idk, having access to Internet doesn't sound like being poor to me.

[Atheris]

No, and I am not proud of being poor, it infuriates me, because the government does live the good life in the "imperialist" countries.

Idk, having access to Internet doesn't sound like being poor to me.

You'd be surprised.

[Mirjt]

Come to the Philippines, have our KFC leftovers scavenged out of the garbage, picked off the bone, and then recooked for a few pesos a serving.

Ha, in Venezuela people literally eat dead rats and everything there is, socialism is a failure, and more with corruption.

1. Venezuela was not socialist, they just had a socialist party (which was actually advocating social democracy and not socialism, and still did not implement even a quarter of their social democratic platform) in power, and the only really socialist thing they did was nationalize the oil industry.

2. Venezuela was sabatogged by the U.S. intelligence agencies because they would not allow our private oil companies to buy and sell their abundant oil at the time.

3. The leaders in Venezuela decided to base their entire economy on oil and then did not spend the money they gained from their oil boom wisely, resulting in an economic collapse. That is not a problem with socialism, that is a problem with incompetent leadership and giving leadership too much power (it may be a criticism against relying too much on centralized planning, even if you are still using a mostly capitalist economy, however socialism can exist as market socialism, centralized planning, decentralized local planning, indicative planning, a mix of various planned and market economic models, other planned economic models, gift economies, etc...).

4. The situation in Venezuela as awful as it was, was also misrepresented by the media to seem even worse than it already was in order to discredit the socialist party and by extension socialism.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

Come to the Philippines, have our KFC leftovers scavenged out of the garbage, picked off the bone, and then recooked for a few pesos a serving.

Ha, in Venezuela people literally eat dead rats and everything there is, socialism is a failure, and more with corruption.

Venezuela has never been a socialist country. It's just against the US and close to Russia.Maybe it make people think of Guba.

[Bear Stearns]

Stop doing woke shit and embrace white working class populism.

[Eurasies]

No, and I am not proud of being poor, it infuriates me, because the government does live the good life in the "imperialist" countries.

Idk, having access to Internet doesn't sound like being poor to me.

Every day the electricity is cut at least 3 times a day, my parents and I live on the dollars that one of our brothers who lives in the US sends us, we are very rich.

[Eurasies]

Incredible that there are people who criticize the United States from their iPhone and know more about Venezuela than a Venezuelan, unusual.

[Eurasies]

Ha, in Venezuela people literally eat dead rats and everything there is, socialism is a failure, and more with corruption.

Venezuela has never been a socialist country. It's just against the US and close to Russia.Maybe it make people think of Guba.

Because the ruling Party is the United Socialist Party of Venezuela ?, Because the traitorous soldiers march saying "We are socialists, chavistas and anti-imperialists" ?, Because Cuba, Russia and Iran bring mercenaries to Venezuela ?, FROM INSURANCE TO PERPETUATE "PEACE "

[Lavan Tiri]

I like how the topic was supposed to be "hey, what's the future of leftist ideology in the west?" and within less than 3 pages everything was completely bogged down by a petty argument over semantics.

[Kowani]

Incredible that there are people who criticize the United States from their iPhone and know more about Venezuela than a Venezuelan, unusual.

There are things you can’t see from the ground.

[Crockerland]

Joe Biden, a moderate,

Not by any stretch of the definition.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

Venezuela has never been a socialist country. It's just against the US and close to Russia.Maybe it make people think of Guba.

Because the ruling Party is the United Socialist Party of Venezuela ?, Because the traitorous soldiers march saying "We are socialists, chavistas and anti-imperialists" ?, Because Cuba, Russia and Iran bring mercenaries to Venezuela ?, FROM INSURANCE TO PERPETUATE "PEACE "

Claiming to be socialist doesn't mean it's true.Socialism is committed to industrialization, social welfare and poverty eradication.They will also do their best to develop education, health care and provide jobs.Just like Cuba and North Korea, although the income is not high, it has perfect and good medical services and a very high educated population.If the government can't do it, or if it doesn't try to do it, it's clearly not socialism.
Venezuela's economic problems are due to a lack of industrialization and over dependence on oil. When oil prices fall, Venezuela's economy is ruined.This has nothing to do with socialism.I can understand your complaints about a bad life.But this is really not the fault of socialism.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Because the ruling Party is the United Socialist Party of Venezuela ?, Because the traitorous soldiers march saying "We are socialists, chavistas and anti-imperialists" ?, Because Cuba, Russia and Iran bring mercenaries to Venezuela ?, FROM INSURANCE TO PERPETUATE "PEACE "

Claiming to be socialist doesn't mean it's true.Socialism is committed to industrialization, social welfare and poverty eradication.They will also do their best to develop education, health care and provide jobs.Just like Cuba and North Korea, although the income is not high, it has perfect and good medical services and a very high educated population.If the government can't do it, or if it doesn't try to do it, it's clearly not socialism.
Venezuela's economic problems are due to a lack of industrialization and over dependence on oil. When oil prices fall, Venezuela's economy is ruined.This has nothing to do with socialism.I can understand your complaints about a bad life.But this is really not the fault of socialism.

Venezuela's oil production is on a long downward trend. That's probably the fault of the government, not reinvesting enough. Insofar as the government is socialist, it IS the fault of socialism.

[Plzen]

They will also do their best to develop education, health care and provide jobs.Just like Cuba and North Korea, although the income is not high, it has perfect and good medical services and a very high educated population

I’m sorry, North Korea has what now?

[citations needed]

While I agree with the people who say that North Korea is not a socialist country anymore, North Korea’s complete failure as an economy and as a society was clearly evident well before they stopped being a socialist country. It, like the rest of the Soviet bloc, is a clear example of where socialism didn’t work.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

Claiming to be socialist doesn't mean it's true.Socialism is committed to industrialization, social welfare and poverty eradication.They will also do their best to develop education, health care and provide jobs.Just like Cuba and North Korea, although the income is not high, it has perfect and good medical services and a very high educated population.If the government can't do it, or if it doesn't try to do it, it's clearly not socialism.
Venezuela's economic problems are due to a lack of industrialization and over dependence on oil. When oil prices fall, Venezuela's economy is ruined.This has nothing to do with socialism.I can understand your complaints about a bad life.But this is really not the fault of socialism.

Venezuela's oil production is on a long downward trend. That's probably the fault of the government, not reinvesting enough. Insofar as the government is socialist, it IS the fault of socialism.

Looking back on the news in 2015, Obama launched the first round of sanctions against Venezuela.International oil prices fell and have been at a low level since.
Venezuela's crude oil quality is poor, and the cost of refining and extracting is too high.Under the current oil price, the more you sell, the more money you lose.What's more, sometimes it can't be sold.It will never get better unless they develop alternative industries.
https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/brent-crude-oil

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Venezuela's oil production is on a long downward trend. That's probably the fault of the government, not reinvesting enough. Insofar as the government is socialist, it IS the fault of socialism.

Looking back on the news in 2015, Obama launched the first round of sanctions against Venezuela.International oil prices fell and have been at a low level since.
Venezuela's crude oil quality is poor, and the cost of refining and extracting is too high.Under the current oil price, the more you sell, the more money you lose.What's more, sometimes it can't be sold.It will never get better unless they develop alternative industries.
https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/brent-crude-oil

My graph showed a downward trend in production since 2000, ie about when Chavez took power.
It's not really about the current price, or even the last two years. Your source isn't that relevant.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

They will also do their best to develop education, health care and provide jobs.Just like Cuba and North Korea, although the income is not high, it has perfect and good medical services and a very high educated population

I’m sorry, North Korea has what now?

[citations needed]

Stable electricity, transportation, communications. Medical and educational coverage for all, good social security.No homelessness and low unemployment.
Because of sanctions, there is no oil, fertilizer and industrial raw materials.Food and consumer goods are in short supply, and cars and agricultural machinery cannot run.People are malnourished.
Of course, North Korea has already deviated from the socialist road, citing a bad example.I'm sorry.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

Looking back on the news in 2015, Obama launched the first round of sanctions against Venezuela.International oil prices fell and have been at a low level since.
Venezuela's crude oil quality is poor, and the cost of refining and extracting is too high.Under the current oil price, the more you sell, the more money you lose.What's more, sometimes it can't be sold.It will never get better unless they develop alternative industries.
https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/brent-crude-oil

My graph showed a downward trend in production since 2000, ie about when Chavez took power.
It's not really about the current price, or even the last two years. Your source isn't that relevant.

Emmm..You're right.This is strange.They destroyed their only profitable business.What happened?No matter how stupid people are, they will not refuse to make money.

[Plzen]

Stable electricity, transportation, communications. Medical and educational coverage for all, good social security.No homelessness and low unemployment.

In North Korea? Really? I say this again:

[citations needed]

[Nobel Hobos 2]

My graph showed a downward trend in production since 2000, ie about when Chavez took power.
It's not really about the current price, or even the last two years. Your source isn't that relevant.

Emmm..You're right.This is strange.They destroyed their only profitable business.What happened?No matter how stupid people are, they will not refuse to make money.

There was a strike, and Chavez sacked a bunch of oil workers. Then a more recent dip. But what's notably lacking is any big drop after US companies were nationalized. At the time a lot of Americans here thought that would be disastrous for Venezuela ... well politically I guess it was.

The EIA graph is no way up to date, it must be said.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

Stable electricity, transportation, communications. Medical and educational coverage for all, good social security.No homelessness and low unemployment.

In North Korea? Really? I say this again:

[citations needed]

From UN.Look at education, health, employment and other indicators.
http://hdr.undp.org/en/countries/profiles/PRK

[The Lone Alliance]

Unfortunately in the US Socialism is has to not only compete with Capitalism on the right it also has to compete with "Woke Capitalism" which uses Leftist Social Issues to make Capitalism look acceptable.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

No, and I am not proud of being poor, it infuriates me, because the government does live the good life in the "imperialist" countries.

Idk, having access to Internet doesn't sound like being poor to me.

That's a terrible thing to say. Suppose the poster is using a library computer, or a friend's phone. The only defence they have against your accusation of "not poor" is to disclose personal details which nobody should be required to disclose.

You're poor-shaming. It's disgraceful.

[Nobel Hobos 2]

Unfortunately in the US Socialism is has to not only compete with Capitalism on the right

Wait, you're missing that capitalism is a wider and more pervasive thing than politics. Capitalists are not all on the right, or even on the left. It's possible to be a Capitalist and have no political alignment at all.

it also has to compete with "Woke Capitalism" which uses Leftist Social Issues to make Capitalism look acceptable.

"Making capitalism look acceptable" is something a Capitalist would do, right?

Capitalism has a place in all of our hearts. To be honest, capitalism has earned our respect. That doesn't mean we have to surrender to it.

[Nogodia]

I’m sorry, North Korea has what now?

[citations needed]

Stable electricity, transportation, communications. Medical and educational coverage for all, good social security.No homelessness and low unemployment.
Because of sanctions, there is no oil, fertilizer and industrial raw materials.Food and consumer goods are in short supply, and cars and agricultural machinery cannot run.People are malnourished.
Of course, North Korea has already deviated from the socialist road, citing a bad example.I'm sorry.

"Stable electricity" in most of the developed regions, albeit without high-usage for most people (because their infrastructure is shit).
"Transportation" on somewhat outdated or deteriorated infrastructure, alongside an utterly gutted rapid transit network even in the capital.
"Communications" heavily restricted by government policy.
"Medical and educational coverage" for all while lacking several crucial parts to make a medical system work and having a relatively decent education system.
"Good social security" my ass.
"No homelessness and low unemployment" because you would be cast to the bottom of the very worst pillar of society if you weren't working if you could. When all the jobs that seem worthwhile are taken, you'll get thrown into one of the many meager or brutally difficult occupations the state can provide for unskilled workers (mostly joining the obscenely bloated military).

"Because of sanctions, there is no oil, fertilizer and industrial raw materials. Food and consumer goods are in short supply, and cars and agricultural machinery cannot run. People are malnourished."

Ah yes, sanctions applied with significant force to them after they developed nuclear weapons following literal fucking decades of wasting economic potential, opportunities for development, and failing to build up a economy that could survive and normalize trade after the Soviet Union collapsed. Let's not pretend like America refusing to trade with them after the war left them incapable of entering the global economy when they were happily sending foreign military advisors and buying arms from their Eastern Bloc pals.