UK Politics Thread XI: Boris' Big Bombastic Brexit Bash

[The New California Republic]

To the best of my knowledge she hasn't, but I honestly don't believe that she would go into a coalition with them, as it'd be political suicide for her to do so.

I thought she has said to vote tactically to prevent the Tories from getting a majority.

And the current selling point of the Lib Dems is stopping Brexit, which is totally at odds with the Tory message of "get Brexit done", so it's hard to see how they could come together in a coalition.

[Shrillland]

Possibilities I can see are:

1. Large Tory majority, sufficient to prevent the ERG from having everybody over the barrel. Boris' transition arrangement passes, then fuck all productive is done until right near the deadline, and we go back into the same shitty "negotiate the night before a deadline" mess again, only in a worse position.
2. Narrow Tory majority, placing the ERG in a controlling position. ERG begins pushing hard for a no-deal Brexit, quite possibly successfully.
3. Hung parliament, nobody able to form any sort of governing arrangement: we have another election in early 2020, fuck all of significance happens until then.
4. Hung parliament, some arrangement of Labour/LD/NI parties/SNP/Green/Tory moderates manages to force through some kind of second referendum motion, and we have months of pissing around over the details of that.

Broadly, no really good options, but I'd rate them as 3,4,1,2 in order of quality, and 2,3,1,4 in order of likelihood.

I think its safe to say Brexit is never happening at this point. why is it so damm complicated? The Eu should just say we arent giving you any more extensions and let them leave with no deal as horrible as that would be.

There is going to be a Brexit on January 31, the Tories will win and they'll claim that will be the mandate they need.

[Auristania]

All I know is that a bunch of defenceless dogs are getting dragged out into the freezing rain so people can Twatter about it.

Won't anyone think of the dogs?

If doggos had a vote then it wouldn't be as bad, even if it was just a symbolic vote to give them something to do. I think it'd be a pretty close race between the Bum Sniffing Party and the More Squeaky Toys Party.

True, but which is which? New Labour offers many squeaky toys if and only if our EU Lords and Masters permit us to have toys likewise New Labour is into Intersectional identity politics, so they are the Bum party.

[Ifreann]

my official prediction for this election is "fuck knows jfc"

note: that's "jesus fucking christ" not "jeremy fucking corbyn" but "jeremy fucking corbyn" would be acceptale

Jesus Corbyn?

Jeremy Christ?

[Salandriagado]

You can give special trade benefits to friendly countries: it's called "signing a bilateral agreement with them".

But you might want to do so without signing such an agreement.

That's silly: you can just sign a bilateral agreement that literally only does that.

And what about punishing hostile ones? Why would you want to treat all countries you do not have an agreement with the exact same?

Even if they are completely different?

To prevent some very obvious abuses of the system that would happen without that.

[Pasong Tirad]

my official prediction for this election is "fuck knows jfc"

note: that's "jesus fucking christ" not "jeremy fucking corbyn" but "jeremy fucking corbyn" would be acceptale

Jesus Corbyn?

Jeremy Christ?

Jeremy F Christ
Jesus F Corbyn

[Novus America]

But you might want to do so without signing such an agreement.

That's silly: you can just sign a bilateral agreement that literally only does that.

And what about punishing hostile ones? Why would you want to treat all countries you do not have an agreement with the exact same?

Even if they are completely different?

To prevent some very obvious abuses of the system that would happen without that.

You do know it is not that easy to negotiate a comprehensive agreement?
That it is complicated and time consuming?

Also the system itself is what is allowing abuse.
If one country treats its workers or the environment particularly badly, punishing them for that should be a valid option.

You cannot logically be pro labor, pro environment and pro the WTO, as the WTO has no environmental nor labor protections.

I mean sure a lot of people in the UK probably do not care but still, for those that do it is a bad thing.

And how is the inability to specifically target EU goods going to help the UK negotiate with the EU?

[Farnhamia]

You aren't. You're obligated to pay the government in return for existing in their country. The government is then morally obligated to provide for the welfare of its citizens, which includes healthcare.

Parasites will inevitably try to undermine the social contract the moment they have the means to do it, by buying the state that is meant to enforce that contract. This is what the wealthy have done in this country, and it is clear that our system no longer works as a result.

If the state cannot be reclaimed and the social contract enforced, throwing out those who won't abide by it, then the rich parasites must no longer be allowed to exist and their means of control (i.e. wealth) must be taken from them, in order to secure the integrity of both democracy and the social contract as a whole.

*** Warned for trolling ***

[Adamantaean Magocrate]

Parasites will inevitably try to undermine the social contract the moment they have the means to do it, by buying the state that is meant to enforce that contract. This is what the wealthy have done in this country, and it is clear that our system no longer works as a result.

If the state cannot be reclaimed and the social contract enforced, throwing out those who won't abide by it, then the rich parasites must no longer be allowed to exist and their means of control (i.e. wealth) must be taken from them, in order to secure the integrity of both democracy and the social contract as a whole.

*** Warned for trolling ***

I beg your pardon, he means they must take a long vacation.

[Celritannia]

If doggos had a vote then it wouldn't be as bad, even if it was just a symbolic vote to give them something to do. I think it'd be a pretty close race between the Bum Sniffing Party and the More Squeaky Toys Party.

True, but which is which? New Labour offers many squeaky toys if and only if our EU Lords and Masters permit us to have toys likewise New Labour is into Intersectional identity politics, so they are the Bum party.

There are no EU lords and Masters.
And the EU does not deal with a nation's politics at all considering the EU is a partnership of all members involved.

[Puertollano]

Westminster voting intention:

CON: 45% (-)
LAB: 34% (+3)
LDEM: 9% (-2)

via
@Survation
, 10 - 11 Dec
Chgs. w/ 07 Dec

[Outer Sparta]

Westminster voting intention:

CON: 45% (-)
LAB: 34% (+3)
LDEM: 9% (-2)

via
@Survation
, 10 - 11 Dec
Chgs. w/ 07 Dec

Wow Lib Dem only at 9? There must be a significant amount for other parties in this poll.

[Puertollano]

Westminster voting intention:

CON: 45% (-)
LAB: 34% (+3)
LDEM: 9% (-2)

via
@Survation
, 10 - 11 Dec
Chgs. w/ 07 Dec

Wow Lib Dem only at 9? There must be a significant amount for other parties in this poll.

They've been hemorrhaging votes to Labour since the campaign started.

[Outer Sparta]

Wow Lib Dem only at 9? There must be a significant amount for other parties in this poll.

They've been hemorrhaging votes to Labour since the campaign started.

That poll's showing a higher Tory margin than the aggregate of polls.

[Greed and Death]

Wow Lib Dem only at 9? There must be a significant amount for other parties in this poll.

They've been hemorrhaging votes to Labour since the campaign started.

The problem with Labour is they are not taking a position on Brexit. Saying I have not thought about the biggest current issue of the day is a bold move for a political party.

[Minoa]

I am ready to be in the front of the polling station queue again.

Polling stations are open from 07:00 to 22:00, but early is better!

-- Minoa

[Shrillland]

I am ready to be in the front of the polling station queue again.

Polling stations are open from 07:00 to 22:00, but early is better!

-- Minoa

Good luck with that, let us know how it goes!

And for the rest of you, go vote! This is quite possibly the most consequential election since at least 1979 and possibly since 1945, Britain stands at the crossroads of salvation and annihilation, and you have to make the choice of which you want! No pressure though.

[Pasong Tirad]

I am ready to be in the front of the polling station queue again.

Polling stations are open from 07:00 to 22:00, but early is better!

-- Minoa

Good luck with that, let us know how it goes!

And for the rest of you, go vote! This is quite possibly the most consequential election since at least 1979 and possibly since 1945, Britain stands at the crossroads of salvation and annihilation, and you have to make the choice of which you want! No pressure though.

Stability and strong government with Boris or chaos with Jeremy Corbyn?

[Purgatio]

*** Warned for trolling ***

I beg your pardon, he means they must take a long vacation.

It was pretty obvious what he meant, this is post hoc sugar-coating

[Crysuko]

Good luck with that, let us know how it goes!

And for the rest of you, go vote! This is quite possibly the most consequential election since at least 1979 and possibly since 1945, Britain stands at the crossroads of salvation and annihilation, and you have to make the choice of which you want! No pressure though.

Stability and strong government with Boris or chaos with Jeremy Corbyn?

This but ironically

[Purgatio]

True, but which is which? New Labour offers many squeaky toys if and only if our EU Lords and Masters permit us to have toys likewise New Labour is into Intersectional identity politics, so they are the Bum party.

There are no EU lords and Masters.
And the EU does not deal with a nation's politics at all considering the EU is a partnership of all members involved.

Not to mention legislative proposals can be voted down by the Parliament (which EU voters vote for) and the Council of Ministers (drawn from Member State governments), I never heard of a Lord and Master who can only do things with the approval of democratic bodies accountable to his serfs

[Purgatio]

Stability and strong government with Boris or chaos with Jeremy Corbyn?

This but ironically

I'm not Johnson fan, seriously, but Prime Minister Corbyn leaves a bad taste in my mouth, I mean with all the chaos with the PLP and how badly he's handled all the disruption and divisions within his own party, especially on Brexit, you think a Corbyn Premiership will be stable? Jesus back in 2017 during the campaign he had like twenty different positions on Brexit

[The Archregimancy]

Political Betting summarises (almost) all of the final polls:



http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index. ... ls-almost/

Summarising ranges quickly for the four parties running candidates across Great Britain (the Scottish Greens and English & Welsh Greens are wholly separate parties), and without commenting on quality of individual polls...

CON: 41-45% (median 43%)

LAB: 30-36% (median 33%)

LibDem: 10-14% (median 12%)

Brexit: 2-4% (median 3%)

The outer ranges of those polls are all within a +/- 3% margin of error from the median. I have not attempted to calculate means across the polls.

[The Archregimancy]

Stability and strong government with Boris or chaos with Jeremy Corbyn?

All joking aside, neither of the main parties will be able to provide stability; what we are voting on is our preferred medium of ongoing chaos.

British politics is going through one of its occasional but recurring periods of instability, like it did in the aftermath of the First World War and the aftermath of the repeal of the Corn Laws. That doesn't necessarily make me feel much better about the causes and potential outcomes of the current period of instability, but from the broader historical perspective this simply happens every 70 to 90 years or so.

So buckle up; chaos ahoy.

[Shrillland]

Polls are now open. Good luck to you all.