The Miniluv Messenger: TEP Liberated!

[Marilyn Manson Freaks]

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Welcome back, lmao.

[Lord Dominator]

Beauty indeed.

[Pierconium]

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The best post I have seen in a while.

This should just be a lesson to anyone intimidated by the supposed ‘power’ of the so-called families. Lots of bark, not much bite.

It’s all a bit messy, honestly. Why is there no finesse in NS villainy any longer?

[Stellar Colonies]

TEP update is relatively soon.

[Feu de Glace]

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I needed this, thank you.

[Cormactopia Prime]

Well, this sure has been interesting. In closing, I would just like to make a few final points:

1. Congratulations to the natives of The East Pacific on a well earned victory over veteran "elites" who didn't last longer than a day. The dedication TEP's natives showed to the region, the speed in which they responded to unendorsement campaigns, etc., is testament to the underlying strength of TEP, and I hope in the coming days and weeks you'll channel that strength into making the reforms necessary to ensure nothing like this ever happens again.

2. I think this coup was the most incompetent display I've ever seen from gameplayers who purportedly know what they're doing, the so-called "elites" who in some cases have been playing this game longer than some players have been alive. I hope this will be a lesson to newer players that often the "elites," myself included, are not all we're cracked up to be, and you can in fact challenge us and make an impact on this game. So do it.

3. I really can't emphasize this enough: I told you all so, I told you repeatedly, and boy was I right about everything. That is reward enough for me.

[The Pharcyde]

2. I think this was the most incompetent display I've ever seen from gameplayers who purportedly know what they're doing, the so-called "elites" who in some cases have been playing this game longer than some players have been alive. I hope this will be a lesson to newer players that often the "elites," myself included, are not all we're cracked up to be, and you can in fact challenge us and make an impact on this game. So do it.

Challenge accepted.

[Guy]

Can you literally just stop talking, stop undermining TSP's treaty ally while it's being couped, and stop undermining your own government's response?

Why TSP continues to tolerate you in any role beyond resident is beyond me. You are nothing but a liability and headache for them. If you're ever again elected Minister of Foreign Affairs, or anything else for that matter, after this deplorable reaction to a coup in an allied region, that will be appalling.

Occasionally, it is okay to avail yourself of the opportunity to shut the hell up and leave it to the people actually elected to respond.

There's a bit more to it than this. The alliance, as Glen has said, is a multilateral one. TSP was thrown off guard when TRR showed no interest in reviewing the treaty - the TRR FA Minister flipflopped when they realized their delegate, rather than being opposed, was on board with Scardino's radical policies. Kyorgia's TRR embraced the LWU crowd with open arms, rejected attempts to express condemnation at any and all of the obvious canaries in the coal mine, and established an ill-timed Arts Festival. It was at that point that I chastised certain TRR officials in public for not doing what TRR traditionally was expected to do (defend democratic values), and Guy/Kyorgia et. al. claimed I knew "nothing" of the region's foreign policy and its governing philosophy.

None of this is true whatsoever, and every single claim outright false, aside from the fact that the arts festival was mistimed.

One is always placed in a difficult situation when confidential discussions are misrepresented, because you cannot refute them. Without going into TSP's position, TRR's position was always that native ejections were a negative step for TEP, and we had been at high alert for the possibility of a coup since June. Since RO powers were removed from Viziers 10 days ago, TRR has been in constant contact with them, taking joint proactive steps.

I'm sorry if you don't like the way that TRR's administration went about addressing Fedele's delegacy. We got results done. Our early representations resulted in native ejections almost completely stopping. And, importantly, we have worked hard to ensure that any coup is defeated. I'll take this over your libelous gossip.

[The Miniluv Messenger]

Following liberation of The East Pacific, over the next few days (and probably weeks), the Miniluv Messenger will be engaging in a "post-mortem" analysis, which will consider what went wrong with the coup and what went right with the resistance, as well as disclosing and dissecting never before seen logs from the coup planning chat courtesy of one of its participants, as well as reporting on the aftermath effects in TEP and elsewhere.

Stay tuned!

[El Fiji Grande]

Well said, Cormac!

[Greater Saint-Paul]

Report from a NPA Private on the frontline:
This was a damn well exiting activity. For 4 hours +, I’ve been endorsing, supporting, cheering, trying to boost the morale and keep the war effort going, as my NPA comrades silently endorsed the victors. For my first mission, I’d say its been a really fun experience and I couldn’t have asked for better comrades in the fray, fighting shoulder to shoulder with me. In the end, I’d say Cormac summed up our feat pretty well. Remember this: whenever democracy is violated in our ally regions, deliverance will come, and it will come hitting hard

[Stellar Colonies]

https://www.nationstates.net/region=the ... #p36670156

As you can see, emotions were running hot during the final moments and beyond.

[Queen Yuno]

Ahahaha that meme is hilarious

@AMOM
Anyway, I'm so glad people realized the ban is stupid ^_^

That makes me happy

Again, I hold 0 grudges, the admin who banned me has apologized to me for his mistake, it's whatever

[Verdrassil]

A free TEP is cool and epic. I can't wait for us to gain subscribers.

[Frattastan IV]

There's a bit more to it than this. The alliance, as Glen has said, is a multilateral one. TSP was thrown off guard when TRR showed no interest in reviewing the treaty - the TRR FA Minister flipflopped when they realized their delegate, rather than being opposed, was on board with Scardino's radical policies. Kyorgia's TRR embraced the LWU crowd with open arms, rejected attempts to express condemnation at any and all of the obvious canaries in the coal mine, and established an ill-timed Arts Festival. It was at that point that I chastised certain TRR officials in public for not doing what TRR traditionally was expected to do (defend democratic values), and Guy/Kyorgia et. al. claimed I knew "nothing" of the region's foreign policy and its governing philosophy.

None of this is true whatsoever, and every single claim outright false, aside from the fact that the arts festival was mistimed.

One is always placed in a difficult situation when confidential discussions are misrepresented, because you cannot refute them. Without going into TSP's position, TRR's position was always that native ejections were a negative step for TEP, and we had been at high alert for the possibility of a coup since June. Since RO powers were removed from Viziers 10 days ago, TRR has been in constant contact with them, taking joint proactive steps.

I'm sorry if you don't like the way that TRR's administration went about addressing Fedele's delegacy. We got results done. Our early representations resulted in native ejections almost completely stopping. And, importantly, we have worked hard to ensure that any coup is defeated. I'll take this over your libelous gossip.

What Guy said. You are completely misinformed: there was no disagreement between the delegate and the FA officer. Kyorgia was concerned about Fedele and didn't see him as anything other than a threat to democracy in TEP for as long as the matter was discussed.

TSP would have likely have taken a stiffer response earlier if TRR had been willing to back it up in tandem.

So you would've rather seen the dissolution of the alliance with TEP and us taking the stance that there was little to 'salvage' - a terrible attitude which wouldn't have helped TEP at all.

[Great Algerstonia]

Hail Marrabuk! We won!

[Aleister]

Tim was isolated from the actual group chat since like July maybe earlier, so unless the logs aren't from him...

But if you want to know why it failed, hit me up! I'm just as baffled in a lot of ways at the performance.

[Buranda]

Ahahaha that meme is hilarious

@AMOM
Anyway, I'm so glad people realized the ban is stupid ^_^

That makes me happy

Again, I hold 0 grudges, the admin who banned me has apologized to me for his mistake, it's whatever

It's one hell of a mistake...

[Unibot III]

None of this is true whatsoever, and every single claim outright false, aside from the fact that the arts festival was mistimed.

One is always placed in a difficult situation when confidential discussions are misrepresented, because you cannot refute them. Without going into TSP's position, TRR's position was always that native ejections were a negative step for TEP, and we had been at high alert for the possibility of a coup since June. Since RO powers were removed from Viziers 10 days ago, TRR has been in constant contact with them, taking joint proactive steps.

I'm sorry if you don't like the way that TRR's administration went about addressing Fedele's delegacy. We got results done. Our early representations resulted in native ejections almost completely stopping. And, importantly, we have worked hard to ensure that any coup is defeated. I'll take this over your libelous gossip.

What Guy said. You are completely misinformed: there was no disagreement between the delegate and the FA officer. Kyorgia was concerned about Fedele and didn't see him as anything other than a threat to democracy in TEP for as long as the matter was discussed.

TSP would have likely have taken a stiffer response earlier if TRR had been willing to back it up in tandem.

So you would've rather seen the dissolution of the alliance with TEP and us taking the stance that there was little to 'salvage' - a terrible attitude which wouldn't have helped TEP at all.

These are lies - boldfaced lies. It was made clear to TSP that TRR's Delegate didn't favour intervention with TEP case - they threw their hands up in the air in frustration with TRR. Kyorgia then launched in a public tirade about how his government differed from past TRR governments and would not intervene in TEP to make "flashy" scene. Now TSP is being called upon to explain why it didn't take a strong stance when their ally, TRR, was privately and publicly refusing to intervene, but now claims retroactively to have been intervening regardless and holding a dim view of a government it was enthusiastically embracing and entertaining.

[The Notorious Mad Jack]

What Guy said. You are completely misinformed: there was no disagreement between the delegate and the FA officer. Kyorgia was concerned about Fedele and didn't see him as anything other than a threat to democracy in TEP for as long as the matter was discussed.



So you would've rather seen the dissolution of the alliance with TEP and us taking the stance that there was little to 'salvage' - a terrible attitude which wouldn't have helped TEP at all.

These are lies - boldfaced lies. It was made clear to TSP that TRR's Delegate didn't favour intervention with TEP case - they threw their hands up in the air in frustration with TRR. Kyorgia then launched in a public tirade about how his government differed from past TRR governments and would not intervene in TEP to make "flashy" scene. Now TSP is being called upon to explain why it didn't take a strong stance when their ally, TRR, was privately and publicly refusing to intervene, but now claims retroactively to have been intervening regardless and holding a dim view of a government it was enthusiastically embracing and entertaining.

I'm sure we'd all be interested to know how someone banned from both TSP and TRR knows so much about what I assume are private discussions between two governments. Care to enlighten the class as to how you came about this information?

[Frattastan IV]

These are lies - boldfaced lies. It was made clear to TSP that TRR's Delegate didn't favour intervention with TEP case - they threw their hands up in the air in frustration with TRR. Kyorgia then launched in a public tirade about how his government differed from past TRR governments and would not intervene in TEP to make "flashy" scene. Now TSP is being called upon to explain why it didn't take a strong stance when their ally, TRR, was privately and publicly refusing to intervene, but now claims retroactively to have been intervening regardless and holding a dim view of a government it was enthusiastically embracing and entertaining.

You think that Kyo embraced LWU because you rely on people who aren't well informed and you have a tendency to exaggerate any tiny rumour.

There was a lot of attention to the situation in TEP and a lot of thought was put into it. GR argues that the treaty should have been ended because TEP had turned into a Rahl outpost that couldn't be saved. Which: (1) wasn't true, as hopefully Fedele's demise and TEP's future can prove; (2) is a terrible response to take when dealing with a vulnerable ally (you are "abandoning" them, voiding any coup-deterrence effect the treaty might have, creating bad feelings with TEP natives in general, ...). Yep, TRR was so awful that it gave TEP one more treatied ally (TSP) to call on when the time came. Big deal.

The public condemnation had no positive effect on the situation. The main consequence was to make many TEP citizens - including security officials and old guard - close ranks with their government and stick their heads in the sand (East Malaysia's "all is well in TEP"). It happened with a TSP-only statement and would have been the same with a TSP-TRR one. "Stiffer action" like ending the treaty could've been even worse: it would have meant accepting that the region was an LWU stomping ground and done nothing to solve the situation. There was no intervention (an interesting euphemism for reneging on defence commitments) that was going to throw Fedele out other than internal opposition from the people of The East Pacific itself.

TRR did signal its concern for the purges and the border control appointments to the parties that mattered. It did signal that it would stick by the security provisions of the treaty (which yes, are designed against coups too). We had an unassailable conduct towards TEP that couldn't be exploited later on to argue that we were their 'enemies'. The coup happened, and it has been defeated. We opposed it and won some goodwill, and hopefully TEP can be a free region again now.

The government stuck to its strategy and it paid off despite your attempts at shaming them into compliance with your will, and it deserves credit for that. Foresight and fortitude. I couldn't hope for more.

[Jazksrkeal]

I'm sure we'd all be interested to know how someone banned from both TSP and TRR knows so much about what I assume are private discussions between two governments. Care to enlighten the class as to how you came about this information?

Not entirely unprecedent that someone in either government told him, so no need to say more.

While I can't claim to have been privy to any talks I think I can claim to have some insight into TRR, and I would find it hard to believe the portrayal of Kyorgia as a raider boogeyman and LWU/Couper enabler considering what I've read about the TEP debacle.

[Frattastan IV]

Now TSP is being called upon to explain why it didn't take a strong stance

Also, about this, no-one here is wondering why "TSP didn't take a strong stance". Maybe it's different in TSP's political debate, but I don't see anyone in this thread or in TEP's leadership wishing that TSP had shut down their alliance. If anything, the negative comments are about GR's remarks.

But if somewhere there is someone attacking TSP for being 'soft on Fedele' (a suggestion which is almost as stupid as when people said that TRR was soft on the NPO) then, sure, feel free to dump that blame on TRR or Kyorgia the Raider.

[Numero Capitan]

TSP and TRR played this perfectly*, as well as most other regions involved in this. If they had been more aggressive early on it would have given the Fedele regime an easy propaganda win that would have kept more natives onside for longer. When Fedele overstepped in a big way the only enemy of TEP was clearly the now unlawful regime, when foreign militaries intervened they were acting against an unlawful delegate, not just a bad one with terrible policies and a questionable inner circle. They delivered an effective and unified response that deterred support for Fedele from anyone outside their inner circle. Any criticism of that is laughable and appears mostly personal.

* the official approach of each government.

[The Pharcyde]

Now TSP is being called upon to explain why it didn't take a strong stance

Besides you, who are the players making these calls?