LWDT 7: The Earth and Heavens Tremble.

[Great Minarchistan]

oh wow dude the market likes to price factors and news on its price lets blame capitalists because they dislike my anti business rhetoric, absolutely unsurprising

It's nowhere close to the election and already they scatter like roaches at mere talk. Shameful, really.

yes because unsurprisingly enough financial markets tend to be efficient when pricing factors

[Great Minarchistan]

I actually mind my 1000s parked on a bank account, but I comprehend it if you dont. Feel free to waste away your savings with the homeless while at it

I'd prefer to upturn the system that put them there in the first place

mhmm, and as a proud rentseeker im glad that I can pull my money out to somewhere else in case people like you are brought to power, although yet again im thankful your ideology's partisans arent electable either

[Duvniask]

Also capitalism is indeed the most efficient system when it comes to supply and demand. Until the economic calculation problem is solved, socialism can never work. Even efficient systems aren't perfect, hence waste.

I needn't be the first to tell you, but...

The economic calculation problem has effectively withered away by the onset of advanced computers, which is to say nothing of socialist counters to the criticism back in the day.

[Ostroeuropa]

Economic ideology is important, though. "Working sufficiently good" isn't good enough, especially given the many different metrics that can be used to define that. A system that builds one person's richness at the expense of others can easily be argued to be "working sufficiently good" if that's the purpose of said system, and it alternatively could be argued to be entirely dysfunctional if it does the exact opposite of that given goal.

No. My point is extremes are bad. The one extreme is being totalitarian force things onto people (supposed to help them but not necessarily doing so) or just leave them alone so they can do it all themself (which isn't working out either because we humans need each other). And that is if we are only assuming the best intentions here. Because more often than not 1st comes down to totalitarism and second is just anti-social like i dont care, not my business > modern USA a society that atomizes itself.

But lets get back to the point:

Those extreme viewpoints or derivations thereof aren't going to get any better if they are supplemented with entire tl;dr of books and related ideologies to explain or justify it.

At the end of the day they do remain bad.

This, pretty much.

[Totally Not OEP]

It's definitely the fault of the socialists that these people are snivelling cowards, no doubt.

Of course. Let them run and be cowards, then; Socialism doesn't need the excesses of a Capitalist economy to ensure the wellbeing of the people.

Given in every single instance of being enacted its collapsed living standards even worse than before or made no notable improvements at best, I'm a rate this as a lie chief.

[Crysuko]

Of course. Let them run and be cowards, then; Socialism doesn't need the excesses of a Capitalist economy to ensure the wellbeing of the people.

Given in every single instance of being enacted its collapsed living standards even worse than before or made no notable improvements at best, I'm a rate this as a lie chief.

I'd bet you anything that it happened due to outside fuckery than internal. Capitalist countries have the innate inability to just leave alone, anyone who doesn't march in lockstep must be stamped out

[Totally Not OEP]

Given in every single instance of being enacted its collapsed living standards even worse than before or made no notable improvements at best, I'm a rate this as a lie chief.

I'd bet you anything that it happened due to outside fuckery than internal. Capitalist countries have the innate inability to just leave alone, anyone who doesn't march in lockstep must be stamped out

If your system is the inevitable superior future, it certainly seems odd the outdated system is so efficient in putting it down.

[Crysuko]

I'd bet you anything that it happened due to outside fuckery than internal. Capitalist countries have the innate inability to just leave alone, anyone who doesn't march in lockstep must be stamped out

If your system is the inevitable superior future, it certainly seems odd the outdated system is so efficient in putting it down.

The neoliberal deadlock is already starting to show cracks, don't you worry.

[Totally Not OEP]

If your system is the inevitable superior future, it certainly seems odd the outdated system is so efficient in putting it down.

The neoliberal deadlock is already starting to show cracks, don't you worry.

It is because the Right resurged, not because of the Left; I'm a NatSyd, I hate the Neoliberals as much as the Reds.

[Dumb Ideologies]

Left and right critics of neoliberalism unite!

Where shall we draw the partition line on our shares of Poland?

[Crysuko]

The neoliberal deadlock is already starting to show cracks, don't you worry.

It is because the Right resurged, not because of the Left; I'm a NatSyd, I hate the Neoliberals as much as the Reds.

The difference is that you're more noisy. It's a difference in methodology and PR, not who's made more difference as a whole. As people become more polarised, that's when we can start making judgements. As of now, it could go either way.

[Totally Not OEP]

It is because the Right resurged, not because of the Left; I'm a NatSyd, I hate the Neoliberals as much as the Reds.

The difference is that you're more noisy. It's a difference in methodology and PR, not who's made more difference as a whole. As people become more polarised, that's when we can start making judgements. As of now, it could go either way.

And that noise has utterly shaken the globe. Duterte, Putin, Trump, Brexit, etc all shook the globe and no, this isn't an endorsement of any in particular, but illustrative of the overall fact of what has done the most to shock the establishment; It certainly wasn't #Occupy or the Greek Socialists, for example.

[Crysuko]

The difference is that you're more noisy. It's a difference in methodology and PR, not who's made more difference as a whole. As people become more polarised, that's when we can start making judgements. As of now, it could go either way.

And that noise has utterly shaken the globe. Duterte, Putin, Trump, Brexit, etc all shook the globe and no, this isn't an endorsement of any in particular, but illustrative of the overall fact of what has done the most to shock the establishment; It certainly wasn't #Occupy or the Greek Socialists, for example.

Putin is acting in self interest as opposed to ideology, Trump is a hollow populist and Brexit is a clusterfuck no matter who you ask. Occupy was ostensibly liberal, and Siriza are socdems larping as tankies. Just thought I'd drag your head out of the clouds for a moment.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

Left and right critics of neoliberalism unite!

Where shall we draw the partition line on our shares of Poland?

It always puts me in a difficult position when the far right and the far left both criticize neoliberalism, because I have no love for neoliberalism, and yet, seeing both these forms of collectivists rag on it, makes me want to defend it.

[Crysuko]

Left and right critics of neoliberalism unite!

Where shall we draw the partition line on our shares of Poland?

It always puts me in a difficult position when the far right and the far left both criticize neoliberalism, because I have no love for neoliberalism, and yet, seeing both these forms of collectivists rag on it, makes me want to defend it.

If you defend it then both me and OEP will take jabs

[Totally Not OEP]

Left and right critics of neoliberalism unite!

Where shall we draw the partition line on our shares of Poland?

Poland is a sacred American ally, and my intention is for this to be the future of it:

[Totally Not OEP]

It always puts me in a difficult position when the far right and the far left both criticize neoliberalism, because I have no love for neoliberalism, and yet, seeing both these forms of collectivists rag on it, makes me want to defend it.

If you defend it then both me and OEP will take jabs

Brown-Red Alliance: Because fuck Neoliberalism

[GLDF]

Left and right critics of neoliberalism unite!

Where shall we draw the partition line on our shares of Poland?

I'm not either, and fuck totalitarianism.

But, by the modern definition, neoliberalism is still awful for the Dems.

[Crysuko]

Left and right critics of neoliberalism unite!

Where shall we draw the partition line on our shares of Poland?

Poland is a sacred American ally, and my intention is for this to be the future of it:

Unlikely, to put it mildly.

[Totally Not OEP]

I posted this in RWDT the other day, but ya'll might like it as well:

This question of what happens next is thus central to the economy’s trajectory. Without the productivity gain, nothing happens. Workers able to produce more than before, for whatever reason, is the sine qua non of economic progress. But only if accompanied by rising output are the effects for workers undeniably positive.

Historically, that has been the dynamic. From 1947 to 1972, for instance, economy-wide productivity roughly doubled. But output surged as well and, at the end of the period, the same share of the population was working and men’s wages were up 86%. In the manufacturing sector, productivity rose by 3.4% annually, but real value added rose by 4.2% annually; employment during the period rose by more than three million.

Compare that period to the 21st century, when America has lost nearly five million manufacturing jobs. Was any of this because of extraordinary technological breakthroughs that caused productivity to surge, allowing firms to do much more with many fewer workers? No. In fact, the average rate of productivity growth in manufacturing this century has been 3.1%—lower than 1947–72 and no different than 1972–2000. But output growth has been only 1.3%, less than a third the rate of the earlier period. We’ve gone from the world where firms use a doubling of productivity to double output, to one where they use it to lay off half their workers. Had output growth this century equaled that of 1950–2000, manufacturing employment today would be near an all-time high.

So when policymakers blame automation for job losses, they are looking in the wrong place. Productivity gains have always been with us—in fact, they used to come faster. If anything, the American economy is suffering from insufficient automation—as reflected in declining productivity growth, stagnant wages, and remarkably little use of robots. American manufacturers use only 200 industrial robots per 10,000 workers, the standard measure of adoption. In both Germany and Japan, that level exceeds 300. In South Korea, it exceeds 700. With greater automation and higher productivity, American firms would likely be more competitive in the international economy.

[Dumb Ideologies]

Left and right critics of neoliberalism unite!

Where shall we draw the partition line on our shares of Poland?

Poland is a sacred American ally, and my intention is for this to be the future of it:

Blimey that's a big boy Poland. He's been working out.

[New yugoslavaia]

Poland is a sacred American ally, and my intention is for this to be the future of it:

Blimey that's a big boy Poland. He's been working out.

The Alt-Lite's wet dream.

Don't worry, you can trust me. I used to fly with them.

[Nakena]

And that noise has utterly shaken the globe. Duterte, Putin, Trump, Brexit, etc all shook the globe and no, this isn't an endorsement of any in particular, but illustrative of the overall fact of what has done the most to shock the establishment; It certainly wasn't #Occupy or the Greek Socialists, for example.

Putin is acting in self interest as opposed to ideology, Trump is a hollow populist and Brexit is a clusterfuck no matter who you ask. Occupy was ostensibly liberal, and Siriza are socdems larping as tankies. Just thought I'd drag your head out of the clouds for a moment.

The only point of those things was to throw and shock the world into chaos and wreck the pre-existing post neoliberal order to pave the political landscape for things to come. Most of them have already outlived their usefulness at this point to varying degrees.

[Liriena]

Ah yes, Macri's excuse: it's everybody else's fault. Nevermind that we were, in fact, far better off under the Kirchners. And curse y'all for making me say that aloud.

guys we be better when gubmint make up stats and freeze prices xd

yes

[Cekoviu]

Left and right critics of neoliberalism unite!

Where shall we draw the partition line on our shares of Poland?

It always puts me in a difficult position when the far right and the far left both criticize neoliberalism, because I have no love for neoliberalism, and yet, seeing both these forms of collectivists rag on it, makes me want to defend it.

Neoliberalism is a complex thing with many good aspects and some glaringly bad aspects. There's no right or wrong answer.