The Enadian Herald

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

I guess we can thank you for giving us something we can say in regards to why people should stay away from your region that can be said onsite.

And hell, it started as just skepticism. It was the defensive response rather than actually addressing the issues that’s pushed it over the top.

[Latrovia]

We have nearly two decades of the mods & admins broadly not abusing their powers, sharing confidential player information, being generally open to explain their policies and thought processes when able. Even when we broadly dislike certain policies (notably the offsite evidence bit), that's a different thing than not trusting them.

You, we have that you founded a region and spent a bunch of money on it, and additionally that there is general dislike by the Gameplay community by how you and your admins have handled certain situations.

Thus, you have not proven you or your region worthy of trust.

Facebook was around for like 30 years I think and just recently it was discovered that they were collecting your Data. Google was the next example and so many others followed afterwards. And you're actually telling me that you trust NS? Again, why? This seems like you chose to trust NS, not that you have convincing evidence of what data they store or how they use it. Again I am not saying that NS is not trustworthy. I am just arguing the obvious. The fact that the NSGP has a general dislike in Enadia is yet another unexplained phenomenon.

The NSGP complained that Enadia's DIscord was not pg 13. Yet I see so many regions with creeps all over the place. I see NSGP regions banning members over claims of sexual harassment etc. Everyday I see some big NSGP names stricken out and being labelled as sexual predators. We had two members in Enadia that were attacked constantly by the NSGP claiming that they were sexual predators. We defended both of them and guess what... They were proven innocent. What does the NSGP community have to say now to those literally bullied people? Has anybody from the NSGP apologized for ridiculing and attacking those players? Has any of the NSGP community members not shared all their gathered evidence, chats, screenshots and photos? So please, since we both know that NSGP bullying and data sharing in public is a common thing. Let's focus on that.

Besides I have worked in plenty of regions, I've never had any foreign government officials that came in Enadia peacefully and negotiated with us. Every single foreigner came in and threatened our members, government and regional sovereignty. So apologies, but I don't agree with your methods, at all.

Let me tell you more failed attempts to destroy Enadia.
1) Spam/Malicious Recruitment Telegrams
2) Direct Poaching
3) The failed "Liberate Enadia" bill
4) Constant bullying of regions that wish to establish Embassies with Enadia
5) Constant attacking and out of topic discussions in our NSGP Thread
6) Constant mocking and cursing of Enadia, its regional laws and policies
7) Bulling and attacking EU members
Cheap name calling etc.

So I apologize, but I am unable to work under these circumstances with any of you. This is how you guys lead. And its certainly not an example that I will follow.

[Witchcraft and Sorcery]

Your responses certainly aren't helping you gain the kind of trust that is required for this information either, Latrovia. That this exists on your forum is kind of obtuse to begin with, but the responses that you've given in this thread are shockingly so. Most people wouldn't be dumb enough to put in their IRL name anyway, but for those that don't give it a second thought, and they do exist, it's dangerous. No one, ever, should "put their faith" in a random stranger on an political simulation game, especially one who has acted as you have since this information was brought to your attention.

The mandatory gender selection is just an extra bit on top of the crap heap. Your region is tagged LGBT, for crying out loud. Don't force people to publicly out themselves.

[Latrovia]

Your responses certainly aren't helping you gain the kind of trust that is required for this information either, Latrovia. That this exists on your forum is kind of obtuse to begin with, but the responses that you've given in this thread are shockingly so. Most people wouldn't be dumb enough to put in their IRL name anyway, but for those that don't give it a second thought, and they do exist, it's dangerous. No one, ever, should "put their faith" in a random stranger on an political simulation game, especially one who has acted as you have since this information was brought to your attention.

The mandatory gender selection is just an extra bit on top of the crap heap. Your region is tagged LGBT, for crying out loud. Don't force people to publicly out themselves.

Okay, while I understand what you are saying. Please tell me, how well informed are you about OSSN?

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

Your responses certainly aren't helping you gain the kind of trust that is required for this information either, Latrovia. That this exists on your forum is kind of obtuse to begin with, but the responses that you've given in this thread are shockingly so. Most people wouldn't be dumb enough to put in their IRL name anyway, but for those that don't give it a second thought, and they do exist, it's dangerous. No one, ever, should "put their faith" in a random stranger on an political simulation game, especially one who has acted as you have since this information was brought to your attention.

The mandatory gender selection is just an extra bit on top of the crap heap. Your region is tagged LGBT, for crying out loud. Don't force people to publicly out themselves.

Okay, while I understand what you are saying. Please tell me, how well informed are you about OSSN?

I know nothing about ocular surface squamous neoplasia, other than that it typically arises adjacent to the limbus, over a preexisting pinguecula.

[Queen Yuno]

I'm dying lol

Your registration asks for Real Name


(Image)


I am not accusing anyone of doxxing, but your forum is a HUGE SECURITY RISK, and looks like someone can easily self doxx themselves (if they register to your forum using their real name, then make posts. Anyone can see their real name.) You realize how unsafe the internet is right?

Also, many NS players are dumb enough to do that, so you probably should not give room for risks like these.

For example, people can see that a certain Nation has registered to your forum, click on your forum and see their Real name, and can find their nonNS social medias.

Actually, I agree and disagree at the same time. People nowdays share their information regardless of what platform they are on. People share their actual faces on Discord in dozens of regions. While many people can go by your first or last name or both. Not many happen to have the same face as you. Adding to that, the fact that you consider people dumb and yourself smart, it tells me that you have no knowledge of Internet Security whatsoever. In fact you are more threatened to be discovered by your face or by a quick search on Google, rather than your IP or your name.

Yet you're also encouraging those people, who registered with their real names, to post their real life photos of themselves, because you're doing precisely that as a founder and you're making this very argument.

In the same logical line, NS is a dangerous place, bc the moderators here have access to our IP's, maybe our payment methods etc. Who knows right? It's the internet, a scary place after all.

My personal opinion, as I am dealing with these stuff on a daily basis. Your account, your logins, your payment, your devices and your data are your responsibility. No one has violated anyone's data in Enadia and we encourage people to go by their nations name. eHubs is like Twitter, or Facebook, if you want to choose to post a photo of yours, you may go ahead. If you want to post a meme you're free to go. Nobody is forced in doing anything, I assure you of that.

You can't do shit with an IP address without people's Real Name, so I don't care if forums or NS has my IP. But NationStates doesn't ask for Real Name. Your forum grabs people's IPs but also grabs anyone not smart enough to put a fake name.

And honestly if you want to create a Facebook competitor, you should advertise on a different site. I'm not going to talk with you anymore. I never called myself "Smart" so I'm not interested in talking with you civilly for ad hominem, bye.

Pay more attention to W&S's line of "Most people wouldn't be dumb enough to put in their IRL name anyway, but for those that don't give it a second thought, and they do exist, it's dangerous. No one, ever, should "put their faith" in a random stranger on an political simulation game, especially one who has acted as you have since this information was brought to your attention." rather than deflect with a crappy one-liner about "OSSN"

But I don't think you can be reasoned with at this point.
like i said earlier, in my opinion, if you want to create a Facebook competitor, you should advertise on a different site.

[Latrovia]

No my friend. eHubs is not asking anyones real name.
In eHubs you can roleplay as your nations leader. And if you check the names people have provided none of them have provided any of their real details.

Name - Put anything you Like
Last Name - Put anything you like.
There is no IP collection
No Password collection
No personal Data Collection

Please check Open Source Social Network and you can see more.

I can not edit the gender option and trust me it bothers me a lot as well. I did not the products designer.

[Lord Dominator]

Let me tell you more failed attempts to destroy Enadia.
1) Spam/Malicious Recruitment Telegrams
2) Direct Poaching
3) The failed "Liberate Enadia" bill
4) Constant bullying of regions that wish to establish Embassies with Enadia
5) Constant attacking and out of topic discussions in our NSGP Thread
6) Constant mocking and cursing of Enadia, its regional laws and policies
7) Bulling and attacking EU members
Cheap name calling etc.

1) If you recruit from other UCRs/regions dislike you, best believe you'll get recruited from. Deal with it.
2. See 1.
3. Security Council has a boatload of dumbshit.
4-6. Welcome to Gameplay, your stay will not be enjoyable.
7. Such as?
8. You will likely need to see 4-6, but otherwise where?

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

No my friend. eHubs is not asking anyones real name.
In eHubs you can roleplay as your nations leader. And if you check the names people have provided none of them have provided any of their real details.

Name - Put anything you Like
Last Name - Put anything you like.
There is no IP collection
No Password collection
No personal Data Collection

Please check Open Source Social Network and you can see more.

You’ve been accused of creating a dangerous public environment for which you set the standard, not of harvesting data off this particular site at least. Nice goalpost move though.

For that matter, the answer to “how can people trust you?” Continues to *not* be “ah but how can you trust NS???” This isn’t philosophy class.

[Lord Dominator]

There is no IP collection

You have no idea how websites work and it is showing.

[Eumaeus]

No my friend. eHubs is not asking anyones real name.
In eHubs you can roleplay as your nations leader. And if you check the names people have provided none of them have provided any of their real details.

Name - Put anything you Like
Last Name - Put anything you like.
There is no IP collection
No Password collection
No personal Data Collection

Please check Open Source Social Network and you can see more.

Perhaps you could consider adding text on your application advising users against using their real-life information. As it is there are players, in my experience typically young players, who will use their real name if you do not explicitly tell them not to.

[Latrovia]

1) If you recruit from other UCRs/regions dislike you, best believe you'll get recruited from. Deal with it.
2. See 1.
3. Security Council has a boatload of dumbshit.
4-6. Welcome to Gameplay, your stay will not be enjoyable.
7. Such as?
8. You will likely need to see 4-6, but otherwise where?

1) So your issue is with our recruitment methods.
2) See 1
3) Well to that I can agree
4-6) I have already witnessed that
7) Not going to disclose names on the NSGP thread
See 7

[Latrovia]

No my friend. eHubs is not asking anyones real name.
In eHubs you can roleplay as your nations leader. And if you check the names people have provided none of them have provided any of their real details.

Name - Put anything you Like
Last Name - Put anything you like.
There is no IP collection
No Password collection
No personal Data Collection

Please check Open Source Social Network and you can see more.

Perhaps you could consider adding text on your application advising users against using their real-life information. As it is there are players, in my experience typically young players, who will use their real name if you do not explicitly tell them not to.

That is in fact a very rational idea and our members have already being advised not to do so. But I will find a way to implement it in the forums. Regardless of that, we are requesting people to keep their data safe. People have the chose to their profiles to keep their statuses or comments hidden from other members.

[Latrovia]

There is no IP collection

You have no idea how websites work and it is showing.

I am not sure whether you understood what I meant.

[Witchcraft and Sorcery]

Your responses certainly aren't helping you gain the kind of trust that is required for this information either, Latrovia. That this exists on your forum is kind of obtuse to begin with, but the responses that you've given in this thread are shockingly so. Most people wouldn't be dumb enough to put in their IRL name anyway, but for those that don't give it a second thought, and they do exist, it's dangerous. No one, ever, should "put their faith" in a random stranger on an political simulation game, especially one who has acted as you have since this information was brought to your attention.

The mandatory gender selection is just an extra bit on top of the crap heap. Your region is tagged LGBT, for crying out loud. Don't force people to publicly out themselves.

Okay, while I understand what you are saying. Please tell me, how well informed are you about OSSN?

Sure, I'm not a tech wizard, but I know enough to know that what you're doing is not safe and it doesn't help your region's already piss-poor reputation.

I know nothing about ocular surface squamous neoplasia, other than that it typically arises adjacent to the limbus, over a preexisting pinguecula.

Touché, Souls.

[Latrovia]

Okay, despite our differences in opinions I value everyone's feedback and I assure you that I will see what I can do about the matter and to increase the forums security further more.
Regarding your dislikes over our recruitment process, I am afraid I am not able to do anything about it. We are one of many regions that recruit from the WA and I see no reason why to stop doing that.

Regarding other security features or measures that we have taken. You are more than welcome to visit our platforms with a VPN or whatever other means you like, since you're worried about your safety and have a look around. This is my final comment. Cheers.

[Tim-Opolis]

Okay, despite our differences in opinions I value everyone's feedback and I assure you that I will see what I can do about the matter and to increase the forums security further more.
Regarding your dislikes over our recruitment process, I am afraid I am not able to do anything about it. We are one of many regions that recruit from the WA and I see no reason why to stop doing that.

Regarding other security features or measures that we have taken. You are more than welcome to visit our platforms with a VPN or whatever other means you like, since you're worried about your safety and have a look around. This is my final comment. Cheers.

Translation:

"Alright, so I realize you lot are real pissed but I can't fathom why so I'm going to do literally nothing because I know better than all of you and Enadia is the modern-day reincarnation of a digitized Rome. Regarding you lot being rightfully upset about how we're dickheads with our recruitment, I'm going to do literally nothing about it but pretend that it's because my hands are tied despite myself being the all-powerful founder of the region. We're one of many people who are dickheads with our recruitment, so we're going to hope that there's strength and numbers.

Regarding other security features or measures we have taken, I'm going to forego giving any genuine answer and tell you to use a VPN despite the fact that many of our issues that were brought up cannot be solved with a VPN. Totally come look around though, I need those site clicks. This isn't going to be my final comment, but I'm going to pretend it is. Fuck y'all."

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Okey dokey:

1. The forum doesn't collect real names, if it does then it's going to stop that today.
2. This enadia social network concept is both not needed and a threat to user privacy.
3. Do not ask people to give someone they have no reason to trust real names, and definitely not pictures. You might be willing to share your real name, but not everybody is.

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

Okey dokey:

1. The forum doesn't collect real names, if it does then it's going to stop that today.
2. This enadia social network concept is both not needed and a threat to user privacy.
3. Do not ask people to give someone they have no reason to trust real names, and definitely not pictures. You might be willing to share your real name, but not everybody is.

1) “it’s their fault if they use a real name!”
2) “ah but where else will people call me attractive” (based on actual posts)
3) “it’s their problem if they choose to post that, after I set that example as the person running it.”

[Armaros]

It’s hard to put into words how I feel about this, and I would probably get warned of I did. So I’ll keep it to these things:

1) this is a political game. If you want a social media platform, go to facebook or instagram.
2) some, especially the younger players, might be confused by what they have to fill in as “name” and might fill out their real name.
3) your registration forces people to fill out gender. Aside from the question about why it is there, or why it’s mandatory to fill out, why can’t people choose anything else but “male” or “female”?
4) you people refuse to take responsibility at all.
TL;DR: this is a bad idea on more levels then the human mind can comprehend.

[Lord Dominator]

You have no idea how websites work and it is showing.

I am not sure whether you understood what I meant.

Websites and forums collect IPs by nature.

Either you are unaware of this, or you have managed to ditch one of the better methods of keeping bad people off it.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I am not sure whether you understood what I meant.

Websites and forums collect IPs by nature.

Either you are unaware of this, or you have managed to ditch one of the better methods of keeping bad people off it.

This is someone who thinks a google doc is a good way to do citizenship applications.

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

It’s been pointed out to me that Facebook was founded February 4, 2004, and is thus 15 years old. NationStates is older than Facebook. Facebook has not been around 30 years.

Just another factual inaccuracy in the rampant whataboutism

[Valerievna]

The fact that the NSGP has a general dislike in Enadia is yet another unexplained phenomenon.

Have you not been reading your own thread???

[Greater vakolicci haven]

We have nearly two decades of the mods & admins broadly not abusing their powers, sharing confidential player information, being generally open to explain their policies and thought processes when able. Even when we broadly dislike certain policies (notably the offsite evidence bit), that's a different thing than not trusting them.

You, we have that you founded a region and spent a bunch of money on it, and additionally that there is general dislike by the Gameplay community by how you and your admins have handled certain situations.

Thus, you have not proven you or your region worthy of trust.

Facebook was around for like 30 years I think and just recently it was discovered that they were collecting your Data. Google was the next example and so many others followed afterwards. And you're actually telling me that you trust NS? Again, why? This seems like you chose to trust NS, not that you have convincing evidence of what data they store or how they use it. Again I am not saying that NS is not trustworthy. I am just arguing the obvious. The fact that the NSGP has a general dislike in Enadia is yet another unexplained phenomenon.

The NSGP complained that Enadia's DIscord was not pg 13. Yet I see so many regions with creeps all over the place. I see NSGP regions banning members over claims of sexual harassment etc. Everyday I see some big NSGP names stricken out and being labelled as sexual predators. We had two members in Enadia that were attacked constantly by the NSGP claiming that they were sexual predators. We defended both of them and guess what... They were proven innocent. What does the NSGP community have to say now to those literally bullied people? Has anybody from the NSGP apologized for ridiculing and attacking those players? Has any of the NSGP community members not shared all their gathered evidence, chats, screenshots and photos? So please, since we both know that NSGP bullying and data sharing in public is a common thing. Let's focus on that.

Besides I have worked in plenty of regions, I've never had any foreign government officials that came in Enadia peacefully and negotiated with us. Every single foreigner came in and threatened our members, government and regional sovereignty. So apologies, but I don't agree with your methods, at all.

Let me tell you more failed attempts to destroy Enadia.
1) Spam/Malicious Recruitment Telegrams
2) Direct Poaching
3) The failed "Liberate Enadia" bill
4) Constant bullying of regions that wish to establish Embassies with Enadia
5) Constant attacking and out of topic discussions in our NSGP Thread
6) Constant mocking and cursing of Enadia, its regional laws and policies
7) Bulling and attacking EU members
Cheap name calling etc.

So I apologize, but I am unable to work under these circumstances with any of you. This is how you guys lead. And its certainly not an example that I will follow.

You do know that the liberate Enadia proposal failed because the person submitting it did so in the hope that it would convince you to improve Enadia? That same person even joined Enadia for a time. Obviously both failed.