[1234 ISSUE] They Have the Whole Score

[Eisegesis]

[TITLE]

They Have the Whole Score

[DESCRIPTION]

A group of local cheerleaders from @@CAPITALCITY@@ recently went to the authoritarian nation, @@RANDOMNATION@@, to support our team as they internationally compete. Unfortunately, the cheerleaders were thrown in jail for life after using their popular cheer “1234 You Suck and Suck and Suck Some More.” Parts of the cabinet have gathered in your office to determine what to do.

[OPTION 1] “We must immediately reach out to @@RANDOMNATION@@, see what they want, and work for those cheerleaders’ safe return,” pressures your foreign minister, @@RANDOM NAME@@, recognizing his possible moment in the sun. “We may have to give up a thing or two to those dirty tyrants…but 1234 that’s how we avoid war,” he says pulling a pom-pom from his jacket.

[EFFECT] citizens are kidnapped by foreign powers all the time.

[OPTION 2] “Alright!? None of this is ‘alright!’ Our honor is at stake, our pride!” proclaims General @@RANDOMNAME@@ as he awkwardly tries to thumb wrestle someone. “1234 lets bomb some s@*t and declare war! They won’t have a choice but to let them go.

[EFFECT] a thumb war is being waged for some cheerleaders.

[OPTION 3] “There may be another way, a more…secret way,” whispers a spy that may be the minister of shadows, @@RANDOMNAME@@. “I could send in a team…yeah, a team of 10, 1 engineer, 2 soldiers, 3 scouts, and maybe 4 pyros if we really want to cheese through this.”

[EFFECT] the pyro is a spy.

[OPTION 4] “Y’know, we could do nothing,” bluntly puts the minister of solutions, @@RANDOMNAME@@, dropping jaws in the room. “I mean…1234 simply better to ignore, am I right, guys, or am I right?”

[EFFECT] the government isn’t doing much of anything these days.

First Draft

[TITLE]

1234 I Declare Thumb War

[DESCRIPTION]

As you welcome foreign leaders to an international summit being held by @@NATION@@, gliding through the standard, boring handshakes and photographs, the young and rambunctious leader of @@RANDOMNATIONNAME@@ grabs your hand and declares a thumb war. Not wanting to back down in front of the media, you find yourself counting up to combat.

[OPTION 1] “I must be cautious, take a slow approach, wait for the enemy to strike first and review the options,” you think to yourself, wanting to wipe that smirk look off the young leaders face. “I’ll hang back, tire them out with a war of attrition.”

[EFFECT] Wars with @@NATION@@ can last forever.

[OPTION 2] “Wait, no, no, no! That won’t work,” the voice shouts nervously in your head as the war approaches. “I have to strike first and fast, put them in their place for all to see. No one messes with me, and my nation!”

[EFFECT] @@NATION@@ bombs first and asks questions later.

[OPTION 3] “Or…maybe I should lay a trap, yeah, yeah, lay a trap. I’ll play possum,” you think fast as the adrenaline floods your body. “I’ll play dead and grab him at the last moment! You can’t put this possum in a cage!”

[EFFECT] @@NATION@@ kills every enemy twice.

[OPTION 4] “What have I gotten myself into," the adrenaline screams deep from your bones. “I need to get out of this I-I…need to back down."

[EFFECT] @@NATION@@’s leader can be found hiding under tables during meet and greets.

[Baggieland]

Due to player autonomy reasons, an issue can never state what LEADER thinks. It's always best to have someone else suggest each action to LEADER.

Also, I don't see where the 1234 bit comes into this issue. I know there are four options, but it has to be more than that.

[USS Monitor]

Did you ask Verdant Haven if it was OK to borrow his title? I know the draft is different, and thumb wars are a thing, but I still think this is bad form if you didn't ask first.

[Eisegesis]

Due to player autonomy reasons, an issue can never state what LEADER thinks. It's always best to have someone else suggest each action to LEADER.

Also, I don't see where the 1234 bit comes into this issue. I know there are four options, but it has to be more than that.

The thumb war reflects, based on the leaders actions, the nations actions in terms of war. So thumb war would equal real war in the results of this issue, or at least that is the intent. 1234 is basic to thumb war. Separating that from thumb war would be something. I don't see how its not related. Also, dont you make the rules? I dont see why an issue couldn't be a discussion within the leader's head. You are looking for something special.

[Eisegesis]

Did you ask Verdant Haven if it was OK to borrow his title? I know the draft is different, and thumb wars are a thing, but I still think this is bad form if you didn't ask first.

I've never done this before, so no. Also, his title says "a" thumb war and is also missing 1234. I dont see it being an issue, nor do I see these titles as the same. Its a common phrase relating to the same theme. As you said, the issue is different but both are submitted for the contest. It's a theme. I'm following the theme. Themes will be the same. You pick the best upon submission. This flatly isnt his title, but I have no issue sharing. I would kindly ask the same of him for this common theme contest. You will get better submissions that way. Limiting your copyright of a similar theme to a "it's kinda like his" may ruin, or at least discourage people, in your 1234 contest.

[Candensia]

Also, I don't see where the 1234 bit comes into this issue. I know there are four options, but it has to be more than that.

I’ll elucidate you. The connection stems from a rhyme usually said before engaging in thumb wrestling, also known as thumb wars.

What’s the rhyme, y’say?

”One, two, three, four, I declare thumb war.”

[Eisegesis]

Also, I don't see where the 1234 bit comes into this issue. I know there are four options, but it has to be more than that.

I’ll elucidate you. The connection stems from a rhyme usually said before engaging in thumb wrestling, also known as thumb wars.

What’s the rhyme, y’say?

”One, two, three, four, I declare thumb war.”

Thank you.

[Eisegesis]

I would like comments that help make the draft better. Like I said, this is new to me.

[USS Monitor]

Did you ask Verdant Haven if it was OK to borrow his title? I know the draft is different, and thumb wars are a thing, but I still think this is bad form if you didn't ask first.

I've never done this before, so no. Also, his title says "a" thumb war and is also missing 1234. I dont see it being an issue, nor do I see these titles as the same. Its a common phrase relating to the same theme. As you said, the issue is different but both are submitted for the contest. It's a theme. I'm following the theme. Themes will be the same. You pick the best upon submission. This flatly isnt his title, but I have no issue sharing. I would kindly ask the same of him for this common theme contest. You will get better submissions that way.

When it comes to sharing, he doesn't owe you anything. Thumb wars are not a broad enough topic to warrant multiple issues, and he definitely had the idea before you posted.

[The Free Joy State]

Thoughts:

@@LEADER@@ never thinks anything. It's a major player autonomy sin to attribute any thoughts, feelings, musings or opinions to another player's character.

I'm not sure building a whole issue around (literally) how to approach a thumb war is an issue. Verdant Haven's idea is more encompassing, and pre-exists yours. I suggest you find another topic.

It is bad form to use pretty much the same title as another player's ongoing draft without asking permission -- even with one word's difference.

[Eisegesis]

I've never done this before, so no. Also, his title says "a" thumb war and is also missing 1234. I dont see it being an issue, nor do I see these titles as the same. Its a common phrase relating to the same theme. As you said, the issue is different but both are submitted for the contest. It's a theme. I'm following the theme. Themes will be the same. You pick the best upon submission. This flatly isnt his title, but I have no issue sharing. I would kindly ask the same of him for this common theme contest. You will get better submissions that way.

When it comes to sharing, he doesn't owe you anything. Thumb wars are not a broad enough topic to warrant multiple issues, and he definitely had the idea before you posted.

Reading over his issue, his idea is nothing like mine. That is just nonsense. Yes, the titles are similar but they are all going to the same place, in the same bucket, waiting on one winner so. I dont see the problem.

[Eisegesis]

Thoughts:

@@LEADER@@ never thinks anything. It's a major player autonomy sin to attribute any thoughts, feelings, musings or opinions to another player's character.

I'm not sure building a whole issue around (literally) how to approach a thumb war is an issue. Verdant Haven's idea is more encompassing, and pre-exists yours. I suggest you find another topic.

It is bad form to use pretty much the same title as another player's ongoing draft without asking permission -- even with one word's difference.

His idea is nothing like mine outside the similar title. I would like further discussion on this half claimed similarity here that does not go further than the title. This is a contest about a theme. You will not get the best issue out of limiting people on this small ground. This issue allows the player to pick which options best represents their character. There is no difference between that and an any other issue. I'm sure expanding your limitation for a special issue may make the reading more exciting. Please consider it. Otherwise, how should I change it?

[The Free Joy State]

Thoughts:

@@LEADER@@ never thinks anything. It's a major player autonomy sin to attribute any thoughts, feelings, musings or opinions to another player's character.

I'm not sure building a whole issue around (literally) how to approach a thumb war is an issue. Verdant Haven's idea is more encompassing, and pre-exists yours. I suggest you find another topic.

It is bad form to use pretty much the same title as another player's ongoing draft without asking permission -- even with one word's difference.

His idea is nothing like mine outside the similar title. I would like further discussion on this half claimed similarity here that does not go further than the title. This is a contest about a theme. You will not get the best issue out of this limiting people on nothing like you are right now.

Yes, there is a theme, and within that theme there is much room for creativity -- as other would-be participants have shown.

Even if an issue is not the winner, it may be added to the game. However, there is this thing called "overlap" -- if, by virtue of content -- one issue overlaps too much with the other on subject, it is not possible to add both.

You may "like further discussion". Further discussion will not improve the manners of taking someone else's title without asking, and then writing an issue that also uses thumb wars as a subject. That's not how things work in GI!

And you will never, ever be able to attribute thoughts, feelings, wishes, hopes, desires, wants, or dreams to @@LEADER@@. That's not how things work in issues.

And kindly do not tell people they're talking:

just nonsense

In addition to being a Mod, Monitor is an Issues editor and experienced author. And that is also not how we talk to each other in GI!

I again suggest you re-examine your idea, because there is a wealth of creativity within the numbers 1, 2, 3, 4.

[Eisegesis]

His idea is nothing like mine outside the similar title. I would like further discussion on this half claimed similarity here that does not go further than the title. This is a contest about a theme. You will not get the best issue out of this limiting people on nothing like you are right now.

Yes, there is a theme, and within that theme there is much room for creativity -- as other would-be participants have shown.

Even if an issue is not the winner, it may be added to the game. However, there is this thing called "overlap" -- if, by virtue of content -- one issue overlaps with the other, it will not be possible to add both.

You may "like further discussion". Further discussion will not improve the manners of taking someone else's title without asking. That's not how things work in GI!

And you will never, ever be able to attribute thoughts, feelings, wishes, hopes, desires, wants, or dreams to @@LEADER@@. That's not how things work in issues.

And kindly do not tell people they're talking:

just nonsense

In addition to being a Mod, Monitor is an Issues editor and experienced author. And that is also not how we talk to each other in GI!

I again suggest you re-examine your idea, because there is a wealth of creativity within the numbers 1, 2, 3, 4.

Re examine my idea or my title? The only issue here you have expressed is my title and it is hardly similar to the other authors outside a common phrase. I can reword to attribute items to someone else other than leader but all decisions come from them so I dont see how advise from an advisor and the decision the leader makes are somehow different in the end. I encourage you to have a creative discussion with your team and expand your horizons for this special circumstance. Otherwise, please suggest edits to the draft.

[The Free Joy State]

Yes, there is a theme, and within that theme there is much room for creativity -- as other would-be participants have shown.

Even if an issue is not the winner, it may be added to the game. However, there is this thing called "overlap" -- if, by virtue of content -- one issue overlaps with the other, it will not be possible to add both.

You may "like further discussion". Further discussion will not improve the manners of taking someone else's title without asking. That's not how things work in GI!

And you will never, ever be able to attribute thoughts, feelings, wishes, hopes, desires, wants, or dreams to @@LEADER@@. That's not how things work in issues.

And kindly do not tell people they're talking:

In addition to being a Mod, Monitor is an Issues editor and experienced author. And that is also not how we talk to each other in GI!

I again suggest you re-examine your idea, because there is a wealth of creativity within the numbers 1, 2, 3, 4.

Re examine my idea or my title? The only issue here you have expressed is my title and it is hardly similar to the other authors outside a common phrase.

Both! I told you further up that:

I'm not sure building a whole issue around (literally) how to approach a thumb war is an issue. Verdant Haven's idea is more encompassing, and pre-exists yours. I suggest you find another topic.

Yes, using the major part of someone else's title without prior permission is a problem.

So is using the same topic as foundation -- unless they're good with it (which most players are; but you should check).

However, in this draft's case, the topic doesn't really go anywhere. Literally how to behave in a thumb war is not an issue.

I suggest you explore one of the many other potential ideas in 1234. And a new title.

EDIT: And we will never, ever let you violate player autonomy by putting thoughts and wishes into their character's head. Never. We're actually getting stricter on that.

[Eisegesis]

Re examine my idea or my title? The only issue here you have expressed is my title and it is hardly similar to the other authors outside a common phrase.

Both! I told you further up that:

I'm not sure building a whole issue around (literally) how to approach a thumb war is an issue. Verdant Haven's idea is more encompassing, and pre-exists yours. I suggest you find another topic.

Yes, using the major part of someone else's title without prior permission is a problem.

So is using the same topic as foundation -- unless they're good with it (which most players are; but you should check).

However, in this draft's case, the topic doesn't really go anywhere. Literally how to behave in a thumb war is not an issue.

I suggest you explore one of the many other potential ideas in 1234. And a new title.

How is any issue that gives you advise on how to behave or act any different from this one? Besides, the circumstances of the leader and the funny actions that may result from that is a lot of the basic foundations of issues.

[The Free Joy State]

Both! I told you further up that:

Yes, using the major part of someone else's title without prior permission is a problem.

So is using the same topic as foundation -- unless they're good with it (which most players are; but you should check).

However, in this draft's case, the topic doesn't really go anywhere. Literally how to behave in a thumb war is not an issue.

I suggest you explore one of the many other potential ideas in 1234. And a new title.

How is any issue that gives you advise on how to behave or act any different from this one?

Other, external characters -- filled with their own biases -- giving LEADER advice is much different than trying to tell other players how their character is thinking.

And, as you may have missed it:

EDIT: And we will never, ever let you violate player autonomy by putting thoughts and wishes into their character's head. Never. We're actually getting stricter on that.

If your premise relies on the ability to violate player autonomy, you need a new premise.

No ifs, no buts. We're not creating exemptions.

[Candensia]

Thoughts:

@@LEADER@@ never thinks anything. It's a major player autonomy sin to attribute any thoughts, feelings, musings or opinions to another player's character.

I'm not sure building a whole issue around (literally) how to approach a thumb war is an issue. Verdant Haven's idea is more encompassing, and pre-exists yours. I suggest you find another topic.

It is bad form to use pretty much the same title as another player's ongoing draft without asking permission -- even with one word's difference.

His idea is nothing like mine outside the similar title. I would like further discussion on this half claimed similarity here that does not go further than the title. This is a contest about a theme. You will not get the best issue out of this limiting people on these half baked grounds. This issue allows the player to pick which options best represents their character. There is no difference between that and an any other issue. I'm sure expanding your limitation for a special issue may make the reading more exciting. Please consider it.

I do not mean to take this off topic, but I believe you are approaching this in entirely the wrong manner. In this forum, players draft issues, and recieve feedback from others. In this forum, it is important to respect other writers, so that one might be respected in return, and benefit from continued feedback and collective knowledge.

It is bad form to utilize the same (or a very similar) title as another, older, active drafting thread, as it (or at least appears to) partially usurp the creativity presented in their draft. It’s not absolutely forbidden, just frowned upon and seen as somewhat tactless. Please be aware of that as you continue your draft.

Okay, with regards to your premise.

I just don’t buy it. If the leader of Candensia was challenged to a thumb war at an international summit, they would simply decline, unclasp hands, and there’d be no issue. I feel the setting is not appropriate. What’s the word? Verisimilitude. Needs more verisimilitude.

[Eisegesis]

How is any issue that gives you advise on how to behave or act any different from this one?

Other, external characters -- filled with their own biases -- giving LEADER advice is much different than trying to tell other players how their character is thinking.

And, as you may have missed it:

EDIT: And we will never, ever let you violate player autonomy by putting thoughts and wishes into their character's head. Never. We're actually getting stricter on that.

If your premise relies on the ability to violate player autonomy, you need a new premise.

No ifs, no buts. We're not creating exemptions.

Could you help me understand where player autonomy ends then so I may improve this draft? Does it end upon the words being uttered from an advisor? Can nothing be uttered from the leader? And if so, could you give me a working example of it?

[Eisegesis]

His idea is nothing like mine outside the similar title. I would like further discussion on this half claimed similarity here that does not go further than the title. This is a contest about a theme. You will not get the best issue out of this limiting people on these half baked grounds. This issue allows the player to pick which options best represents their character. There is no difference between that and an any other issue. I'm sure expanding your limitation for a special issue may make the reading more exciting. Please consider it.

I do not mean to take this off topic, but I believe you are approaching this in entirely the wrong manner. In this forum, players draft issues, and recieve feedback from others. In this forum, it is important to respect other writers, so that one might be respected in return, and benefit from continued feedback and collective knowledge.

It is bad form to utilize the same (or a very similar) title as another, older, active drafting thread, as it (or at least appears to) partially usurp the creativity presented in their draft. It’s not absolutely forbidden, just frowned upon and seen as somewhat tactless. Please be aware of that as you continue your draft.

Okay, with regards to your premise.

I just don’t buy it. If the leader of Candensia was challenged to a thumb war at an international summit, they would simply decline, unclasp hands, and there’d be no issue. I feel the setting is not appropriate. What’s the word? Verisimilitude. Needs more verisimilitude.

I do not mean to sound disrespectful. I mean to challenge some of the claims being put forward when the aim is creativity. I trust the people in charge are creative. I want to push where they are and see where they are at the same time. As for the title, given the context of the contest, I still hold firm in my point. You will all see better result if you relax on this half baked claim of copyright you are making. Thumb war is so common that if you actually took it to the copyright office, I would be dumbfounded you left with a patient. Let people write what they want, and the creative, hopefully open judges can pick the best. If there is an issue of overlap, talk to the authors then. Finding out their issue is likely to be submitted can spur all the creative juices. We are all on the same side here. Also, on this "declining the international submit bit," just dismiss the issue.

[The Free Joy State]

Other, external characters -- filled with their own biases -- giving LEADER advice is much different than trying to tell other players how their character is thinking.

And, as you may have missed it:

If your premise relies on the ability to violate player autonomy, you need a new premise.

No ifs, no buts. We're not creating exemptions.

Could you help me understand where player autonomy ends then so I may improve this draft? Does it end upon the words being uttered from an advisor? Can nothing be uttered from the leader? And if so, could you give me a working example of it?

Handily, my fellow senior, Candlewhisper Archive has a guide to player autonomy so I don't have to: What is Player Autonomy.

This draft still lacks verisimilitude and notability, however, and your time would be better spent on a completely new draft.

[Eisegesis]

We are all making edits to the posts as we go. I'd prefer we just post again at this point. I'm having to go back and edit posts in response to authority's edits in their posts lol

[Eisegesis]

Could you help me understand where player autonomy ends then so I may improve this draft? Does it end upon the words being uttered from an advisor? Can nothing be uttered from the leader? And if so, could you give me a working example of it?

Handily, my fellow senior, Candlewhisper Archive has a guide to player autonomy so I don't have to: What is Player Autonomy.

This draft still lacks verisimilitude, however, and your time would be better spent on a completely new draft.

Oh, this is perfect. Thank you.

EDIT: can I keep using this thread for the new draft? Furthermore, can you further define verisimilitude. Does it need to be a bigger issue than just a thumb war between leaders? What is to small, is their a good standard to keep it mind? Are their things that are to big? Is this idea reworkable at all? Given from an advisors mouth, I don't see why this would not be real. In the age we live in, anything can be real and matter in politics so I am having a hard time understand what is "impactful" to you. Also, you are losing opportunity for humor. Further edit: does the location of the leader, such as an event or circumstance, fall under the player autonomy?

[The Free Joy State]

Handily, my fellow senior, Candlewhisper Archive has a guide to player autonomy so I don't have to: What is Player Autonomy.

This draft still lacks verisimilitude, however, and your time would be better spent on a completely new draft.

Oh, this is perfect. Thank you.

EDIT: can I keep using this thread for the new draft? Furthermore, can you further define verisimilitude. Does it need to be a bigger issue than just a thumb war between leaders? What is to small, is their a good standard to keep it mind? Are their things that are to big? Is this idea reworkable at all?

I also edited in that it lacks "notability".

To answer your questions:

Can you keep your 1234 drafts on the same thread: Yes. In fact, we prefer it if all drafts for each individual issue remain in one place.

Define verisimilitude:Realistic. Or, rather, realistic, within the internal reality of the game (because NS has a logic of its own).

Is the issue too small: I think so. How to behave in a thumb war is, in itself, not really an issue that would confront a national leader, and there are probably few national leaders that would engage in thumb wars at international summits, rather than just roll their eyes and walk away (and while we do have a Dismiss button, we don't want it used all or the majority of the time).

What is too small: Anything that a real national leader probably wouldn't give attention to.

Is anything too big: Most topics are on the table (we have issues on war, poverty, abortion, euthanasia, etc.). Issues relating to the supernatural are usually not (at least, not in a way that confirms them to exist), and some topics are too unrealistic for NS (issues about a perfect pill that solves world hunger, for example).

Is the idea reworkable: I really, really suggest that you consider another idea. 1234 does give scope to work with.

Here's more about Getting an Idea for Writing an Issue.

[Eisegesis]

Oh, this is perfect. Thank you.

EDIT: can I keep using this thread for the new draft? Furthermore, can you further define verisimilitude. Does it need to be a bigger issue than just a thumb war between leaders? What is to small, is their a good standard to keep it mind? Are their things that are to big? Is this idea reworkable at all?

I also edited in that it lacks "notability".

To answer your questions:

Can you keep your 1234 drafts on the same thread: Yes. In fact, we prefer it if all drafts for each individual issue remain in one place.

Define verisimilitude:Realistic. Or, rather, realistic, within the internal reality of the game (because NS has a logic of its own).

Is the issue too small: I think so. How to behave in a thumb war is, in itself, not really an issue that would confront a national leader, and there are probably few national leaders that would engage in thumb wars at international summits, rather than just roll their eyes and walk away (and while we do have a Dismiss button, we don't want it used all or the majority of the time).

What is too small: Anything that a real national leader probably wouldn't give attention to.

Is anything too big: Most topics are on the table (we have issues on war, poverty, abortion, euthanasia, etc.). Issues relating to the supernatural are usually not (at least, not in a way that confirms them to exist), and some topics are too unrealistic for NS (issues about a perfect pill that solves world hunger, for example).

Is the idea reworkable: I really, really suggest that you consider another idea. 1234 does give scope to work with.

Here's more about Getting an Idea for Writing an Issue.

Thank you for the help.