That's how it's always been though.
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by The Empire of Pretantia » Wed May 22, 2019 8:34 pm
by Liriena » Wed May 22, 2019 8:34 pm
Proctopeo wrote:Liriena wrote:comrade dril oppressed a gamer
After doing a thorough review of the situation, this seems to be "fiction is reality and anime boobs is pedophilia" nonsense
I am: A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist An aspiring writer and journalist | Political compass stuff: Economic Left/Right: -8.13 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92 For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism, cynicism ⚧Copy and paste this in your sig if you passed biology and know gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧ |
by Torrocca » Wed May 22, 2019 8:51 pm
Liriena wrote:Proctopeo wrote:After doing a thorough review of the situation, this seems to be "fiction is reality and anime boobs is pedophilia" nonsense
Look, m'dude, just because your loli is technically a thousand-year-old demon doesn't mean we can let her body pillow sign a marriage certificate without parental consent.
by The Xenopolis Confederation » Thu May 23, 2019 5:06 am
by Cekoviu » Thu May 23, 2019 5:14 am
Liriena wrote:comrade dril oppressed a gamer
by Ostroeuropa » Thu May 23, 2019 5:27 am
by Ostroeuropa » Thu May 23, 2019 5:32 am
Rostavykhan wrote:Am I detecting toxic masculinity and enforcement of traditional gender roles? Shocking.
by The Xenopolis Confederation » Thu May 23, 2019 5:34 am
Ostroeuropa wrote:The entire debate is dumb and hinges on some pretty dodgy morality on the part of those criticizing loli.
Firstly you've got the fact that it's fictional and nobody is being harmed.
Secondly you've got the fact that, as has already been noted, often the character is not a child.
And a bunch of other stuff.
The problem with pedophilia is the disparity in the mind. Which is more objectionable, an 8 year old magicked into a 20 year olds body and then getting fucked, or a 20 year old into a 8 year olds body? If you answered the second one, there is something wrong with you, but that appears to be the ethical framework being utilized here. I.E, the objection is based around it being physically unattractive and it's bad if you find it physically attractive.
No. That's not the problem. It's not even A Problem. It's certainly not helpful to the discussion either, and is out of step with our other understanding of sex, sexuality, and consent. Basically all the complaints revolve around having certain prefernces being "Immoral.".
A feeling cannot be immoral.
Okay, so you find it gross. Get a grip? That's literally the same ethical framework people use to shut down gay sex on tv and so on. You should not be attacking people for their sexuality and making them feel bad for it, that's bad behavior.
You may as well be wailing about how people who legit masturbate to two girls one cup are ethically repugnant and them pretending its about public health concerns to cover up what you're actually doing.
Guess what. This is also why being a Furry is okay, and fucking animals isn't. I'd expect you to know that Liriena, but I guess not.
Let's say it's loli. It's even child loli. The anime boobs and all. The most extreme, explicit case you can think of.
It's still not a problem, because there is no actual victim here.
by Crysuko » Thu May 23, 2019 5:35 am
Rostavykhan wrote:Nakena wrote:
Whats amazing that former liberals, once they are getting against the system, are much more filled with rage an anger than those amongst us who had beforehand some kind of distance towards their former beliefs and worldview.
I forget who was behind the quote, that you'll not find a more outspoken critic of a system than those who supported it and recently turned against it.Liriena wrote:comrade dril oppressed a gamer
> Pick up a football.
Am I detecting toxic masculinity and enforcement of traditional gender roles? Shocking.
by Ostroeuropa » Thu May 23, 2019 5:37 am
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Ostroeuropa wrote:The entire debate is dumb and hinges on some pretty dodgy morality on the part of those criticizing loli.
Firstly you've got the fact that it's fictional and nobody is being harmed.
Secondly you've got the fact that, as has already been noted, often the character is not a child.
And a bunch of other stuff.
The problem with pedophilia is the disparity in the mind. Which is more objectionable, an 8 year old magicked into a 20 year olds body and then getting fucked, or a 20 year old into a 8 year olds body? If you answered the second one, there is something wrong with you, but that appears to be the ethical framework being utilized here. I.E, the objection is based around it being physically unattractive and it's bad if you find it physically attractive.
No. That's not the problem. It's not even A Problem. It's certainly not helpful to the discussion either, and is out of step with our other understanding of sex, sexuality, and consent. Basically all the complaints revolve around having certain prefernces being "Immoral.".
A feeling cannot be immoral.
Okay, so you find it gross. Get a grip? That's literally the same ethical framework people use to shut down gay sex on tv and so on. You should not be attacking people for their sexuality and making them feel bad for it, that's bad behavior.
You may as well be wailing about how people who legit masturbate to two girls one cup are ethically repugnant and them pretending its about public health concerns to cover up what you're actually doing.
Guess what. This is also why being a Furry is okay, and fucking animals isn't. I'd expect you to know that Liriena, but I guess not.
Let's say it's loli. It's even child loli. The anime boobs and all. The most extreme, explicit case you can think of.
It's still not a problem, because there is no actual victim here.
Those are good points, but if you are attracted to looking at "lolis" specifically there's no getting around the fact that that is pretty pedophilic.
by The Xenopolis Confederation » Thu May 23, 2019 5:39 am
Ostroeuropa wrote:The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Those are good points, but if you are attracted to looking at "lolis" specifically there's no getting around the fact that that is pretty pedophilic.
*shrug*
Not particularly. If you're attracted on sight then yes, but a significant part of attraction is mannerism and personality based. In this case, especially as you've dumped a non-child personality in there, it's entirely possible to find a character attractive without being a pedophile.
If you dumped a certain personality type into a spider and I spent time with them the thought of trying to figure out how to fuck it would probably cross my mind, but i'm not attracted to spiders.
As a general rule if they're attracted on sight, or attracted to childlike personality traits, that's the red flag.
by Ostroeuropa » Thu May 23, 2019 5:41 am
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Ostroeuropa wrote:
*shrug*
Not particularly. If you're attracted on sight then yes, but a significant part of attraction is mannerism and personality based. In this case, especially as you've dumped a non-child personality in there, it's entirely possible to find a character attractive without being a pedophile.
If you dumped a certain personality type into a spider and I spent time with them the thought of trying to figure out how to fuck it would probably cross my mind, but i'm not attracted to spiders.
As a general rule if they're attracted on sight, or attracted to childlike personality traits, that's the red flag.
I mean, if you're attracted to lolis along with adult anime girls then that's okay, it's just if you specifically prefer lolis that red flags are raised, in my opinion.
by Ostroeuropa » Thu May 23, 2019 5:48 am
by Crysuko » Thu May 23, 2019 6:04 am
Ostroeuropa wrote:Here's an example of some traits of a character and things one loli character did in the show "The Abyss"
1. SCIENCE! HaAhAHahaAHahaHAHahaAhAHAhahaAHHAahAHah. (Mad scientist girl.).
2. Let's go on an adventure into that fucking Cthulhu pit. Why? To see what's in it.
3. Coldly decides to bait and switch a horrible monster into eating her classmates so she can get away with no signs of trauma.
4. Threatens people with a knife.
5. We have to keep going further into the pit, and if you don't want to, that's a problem for all of us. For us. For me. Keep. Walking.
6. Sacrifices some more classmates
7. Oh yeah I was born in the Cthulhu pit but i'm sure it's fine.
8. HMM. SCIENCE.
9. Let's euthanize some people.
10. Oh god, my arm, it is poisoned. It'll need to be cut off. No, no, don't do it at the joint. I know that's easier, but hear me out. If I keep the joint, i'll have more articulation in the arm afterward, so what I need you to do, is break my arm, then saw it off through the break.
11. You've been experimenting on children? Neat! What did you find out? Can I see your data set?
These are not childlike qualities.
Another example, arguably, is Yuno Gasai. Who is basically just Yandere Ur Example, which some men find attractive because the notion of a girl psychotically into you appeals to them.
Often, the loli archetype or underage girl characters are utilized because it's a way for a character to get away with some really fucked up shit and still remain sympathetic. Some people find evil alluring in a "Bad girls" sort of way, similar to "Bad boys".
When deciding if loli is pedophilic, you should probably ask yourself:
does the person in question find the personality type of actual children attractive.
by Ostroeuropa » Thu May 23, 2019 6:17 am
Crysuko wrote:as any pedo who's been put behind bars will tell you, "but she consented" or "but she was more mature" isn't a defence any jury will take seriously.
by The Xenopolis Confederation » Thu May 23, 2019 6:20 am
Ostroeuropa wrote:The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:I mean, if you're attracted to lolis along with adult anime girls then that's okay, it's just if you specifically prefer lolis that red flags are raised, in my opinion.
I'm not denying there's red flags to be had here, i'm objecting to the totalizing narrative being advanced on the issue, as well as the general "anime boobs" thing feminists are pushing out of a hatred for male sexuality being different from female sexuality and refusing to accept that men and women are different, and women are not more ethical and the default men should aspire to with any differences being down to the evil patriarchy.
by Ostroeuropa » Thu May 23, 2019 6:26 am
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Ostroeuropa wrote:
I'm not denying there's red flags to be had here, i'm objecting to the totalizing narrative being advanced on the issue, as well as the general "anime boobs" thing feminists are pushing out of a hatred for male sexuality being different from female sexuality and refusing to accept that men and women are different, and women are not more ethical and the default men should aspire to with any differences being down to the evil patriarchy.
Yeah, prohibiting lolis is a bit of a stretch in my opinion, but saying that it's a result of some sort of misandry seems like a reach.
by Asherahan » Thu May 23, 2019 6:27 am
by North German Realm » Thu May 23, 2019 6:39 am
5 Nov, 2020
Die Morgenpost: "We will reconsider our relationship with Poland" Reichskanzler Lagenmauer says after Polish president protested North German ultimatum that made them restore reproductive freedom. | European Society votes not to persecute Hungary for atrocities committed against Serbs, "Giving a rogue state leave to commit genocide as it sees fit." North German delegate bemoans. | Negotiations still underway in Rome, delegates arguing over the extent of indemnities Turkey might be made to pay, lawful status of Turkish collaborators during occupation of Azerbaijan, Cyprus, Syria.
by Torrocca » Thu May 23, 2019 7:18 am
Ostroeuropa wrote:The entire debate is dumb and hinges on some pretty dodgy morality on the part of those criticizing loli.
by Liriena » Thu May 23, 2019 7:36 am
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Liriena wrote:Turns out that jocks were the real comrades all along and nerds are first in line for the gulags.
This conversation is giving me flashbacks to Johnathan McIntosh's The Adorkable Misogyny of The Big Bang Theory. For this reason, I will be reporting you.
I am: A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist An aspiring writer and journalist | Political compass stuff: Economic Left/Right: -8.13 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92 For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism, cynicism ⚧Copy and paste this in your sig if you passed biology and know gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧ |
by Ostroeuropa » Thu May 23, 2019 7:37 am
Torrocca wrote:Ostroeuropa wrote:The entire debate is dumb and hinges on some pretty dodgy morality on the part of those criticizing loli.
I'm gonna stop you right there, chief.
First and fore-fucking-most, there's literally nothing "dodgy" about criticizing the depiction of kids being sexualized and/or literally fucked, animated or not. Secondly, there's the fact of the matter that both the normalization of pedophilia by accepting loli and the concept of supply and demand exist, which means that A) pedophiles who might not previously go after children because of societal norms might very well be emboldened to actually fucking do it if society allows pedophilic media to be consumed in the form of animated bullshit, and B) demand for more and more extreme forms of child sexualization/fucking very easily could rise to a fuckton more child porn than already exists.
All in all, whatever defense you're making for lolicon is bullshit.
by The Xenopolis Confederation » Thu May 23, 2019 7:42 am
by Liriena » Thu May 23, 2019 7:44 am
Ostroeuropa wrote:The entire debate is dumb and hinges on some pretty dodgy morality on the part of those criticizing loli.
Firstly you've got the fact that it's fictional and nobody is being harmed.
Secondly you've got the fact that, as has already been noted, often the character is not a child.
And a bunch of other stuff.
The problem with pedophilia is the disparity in the mind. Which is more objectionable, an 8 year old magicked into a 20 year olds body and then getting fucked, or a 20 year old into a 8 year olds body? If you answered the second one, there is something wrong with you, but that appears to be the ethical framework being utilized here. I.E, the objection is based around it being physically unattractive and it's bad if you find it physically attractive.
No. That's not the problem. It's not even A Problem. It's certainly not helpful to the discussion either, and is out of step with our other understanding of sex, sexuality, and consent. Basically all the complaints revolve around having certain prefernces being "Immoral.".
A feeling cannot be immoral.
Okay, so you find it gross. Get a grip? That's literally the same ethical framework people use to shut down gay sex on tv and so on. You should not be attacking people for their sexuality and making them feel bad for it, that's bad behavior.
You may as well be wailing about how people who legit masturbate to two girls one cup are ethically repugnant and them pretending its about public health concerns to cover up what you're actually doing.
Guess what. This is also why being a Furry is okay, and fucking animals isn't. I'd expect you to know that Liriena, but I guess not.
Let's say it's loli. It's even child loli. The anime boobs and all. The most extreme, explicit case you can think of.
It's still not a problem, because there is no actual victim here.
I am: A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist An aspiring writer and journalist | Political compass stuff: Economic Left/Right: -8.13 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92 For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism, cynicism ⚧Copy and paste this in your sig if you passed biology and know gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧ |
by Torrocca » Thu May 23, 2019 7:47 am
Ostroeuropa wrote:Torrocca wrote:
I'm gonna stop you right there, chief.
First and fore-fucking-most, there's literally nothing "dodgy" about criticizing the depiction of kids being sexualized and/or literally fucked, animated or not. Secondly, there's the fact of the matter that both the normalization of pedophilia by accepting loli and the concept of supply and demand exist, which means that A) pedophiles who might not previously go after children because of societal norms might very well be emboldened to actually fucking do it if society allows pedophilic media to be consumed in the form of animated bullshit, and B) demand for more and more extreme forms of child sexualization/fucking very easily could rise to a fuckton more child porn than already exists.
All in all, whatever defense you're making for lolicon is bullshit.
Do you have any actual evidence or any of these claims of yours, like scientific evidence, or is it just assertions based in your worldview that the overwhelming majority of people are sick of and think is broken already?
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