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by UniversalCommons » Fri May 17, 2019 2:13 am
by Reatra » Fri May 17, 2019 2:50 am
UniversalCommons wrote:Industrial society in some ways is overrated. I like William Morris's ideas of the Arts and Crafts Movement. Having a society of craftsmen or craftspeople with very high quality goods backed by a scientific revolution appeals to me. Keeping things clean, craft oriented, high quality, building on a human scale, and scientific is appealing. Also using water, wind, and wave power has an appeal to me with a dose of human powered machinery and some biofuels. There is a lot of impracticality in reading people like Lewis Mumford, R. Buckminster Fuller, and John Todd, but it provides for an idea of building a clean society without the baggage of mass consumerism.
by G-Tech Corporation » Fri May 17, 2019 4:26 am
by Plzen » Fri May 17, 2019 4:53 am
G-Tech Corporation wrote:So Plzen, looking at your post, I’m not really sure what to do with it. An outsider gawking at Mara isn’t ICly going to provoke much more of a reaction than last time your character’s beau swung by. And he essentially just got told where the nearest market was.
by G-Tech Corporation » Fri May 17, 2019 6:58 am
Plzen wrote:G-Tech Corporation wrote:So Plzen, looking at your post, I’m not really sure what to do with it. An outsider gawking at Mara isn’t ICly going to provoke much more of a reaction than last time your character’s beau swung by. And he essentially just got told where the nearest market was.
An outsider with an entourage would provoke some level of curiosity, no? It’s not like tourism is a big thing in this era. You can coincidentally stumble upon the scene or something.
I’m not sure what to do to draw more attention, to be honest. It’s not like some random person asking to meet the village leadership is going to go down remotely well.
by Joohan » Fri May 17, 2019 10:57 am
Reatra wrote:Bortslovakia wrote:
Honestly being hyper focused on one thing just seems like a recipe for failure to me. A diversified diet with acceptable production at each level of the food chain staves off starvation, and should ensure at least decent levels of nutritional intake. Just having a lot of food isn't going to immediately translate to having a complex society capable of political organization, material production, or technological advancement.
who's hyperfocused? I highly doubt even Old Kingdom Egypt, with a million people packed into a few miles around the Nile, could support an industrial civilization even with the technology to do so. There simply wouldnt be enough minds and enough muscle around.
And actually, having a lot of food is kinda instrumental to the development of political organizations. Whether that be high intensity hunting and gathering like in prehistoric Pacific Northwest and Florida, or agriculture, or aquaculture, etcetera, it all requires a rather massive surplus of food compared to most of human history. You're right that it doesn't immediately translate, but it's kinda a necessary first step.
There are many crops from the Americas who's calories per area and per hour of labor far outclass most Old World domesticates. That's important. Less people/less time involved in producing more food means more people/more time for doing other things.
You can make all the steel, steam engines, gunpowder, whatever, you want, but if 80% of the population is still dedicating the vast majority of their lives to supporting the basic needs of the rest of society, there are so many thousands, hundreds of thousands, even millions of people who will likely live and die without contributing their creativity and minds to a different section of society.
by UniversalCommons » Fri May 17, 2019 12:11 pm
by UniversalCommons » Fri May 17, 2019 12:28 pm
by Cainesland » Fri May 17, 2019 12:46 pm
UniversalCommons wrote:Basically two ships would have gone into the black sea looking for trade after paying for passage from Troy. They would have followed the coast line looking for places to trade. Eventually they would have made it to Novorossiysk. They would have initially stopped at the trading post at Varna and would probably go back there for supplies. Basically, it would have been a high risk venture like the attempt to go to Ur where all of them could die. Two of the crew would be picked hands of Oak, basically the best soldiers or merchants they could find to report back. They would be looking for trade items, new technology, men with unusual skills, etc. They would have probably had to hire a translator or two. Tea, cabbage, any plant good that was unique which they could grow themselves would be desired.
by Reatra » Fri May 17, 2019 12:56 pm
Joohan wrote:You should be careful about going to America. Like, even when mankind was fairly advanced and Europeans attempted to colonize the new world, most of those settlements went under - and quite a few just got straight up destroyed.
You are operating off of not even that base and far less technology. Odds of you dying are like... * furiously calculates on abacus *...not good fam.
by Joohan » Fri May 17, 2019 2:03 pm
Reatra wrote:Joohan wrote:You should be careful about going to America. Like, even when mankind was fairly advanced and Europeans attempted to colonize the new world, most of those settlements went under - and quite a few just got straight up destroyed.
You are operating off of not even that base and far less technology. Odds of you dying are like... * furiously calculates on abacus *...not good fam.
Wait I’m confused..? are you saying like, the odds of anyone dying are higher in the Americas than the Old World?
What’s the evidence for that? That seems...... really ahistorical...
If you’re saying because early European settler colonies failed, all that means is that the native people had enough means to resist it during the early years.
by Reatra » Fri May 17, 2019 2:11 pm
Joohan wrote:Reatra wrote:
Wait I’m confused..? are you saying like, the odds of anyone dying are higher in the Americas than the Old World?
What’s the evidence for that? That seems...... really ahistorical...
If you’re saying because early European settler colonies failed, all that means is that the native people had enough means to resist it during the early years.
You're not traveling to the new world all on your own, are you? I would assume you were going to bring over some kind of party to help colonize with you.
And most settlements went down because the colonials were unfamiliar with the terrain, flaura, fauna and unable to adapt.
by Joohan » Fri May 17, 2019 2:57 pm
Reatra wrote:Joohan wrote:
You're not traveling to the new world all on your own, are you? I would assume you were going to bring over some kind of party to help colonize with you.
And most settlements went down because the colonials were unfamiliar with the terrain, flaura, fauna and unable to adapt.
It's not to colonize, it's following the already existent trade routes down south to better climates. It's basically the same thing as if I went down south to China via the existent trade routes.
And if there's one place I'm familiar with, it's Western North America
by Reatra » Fri May 17, 2019 3:26 pm
Joohan wrote:Reatra wrote:
It's not to colonize, it's following the already existent trade routes down south to better climates. It's basically the same thing as if I went down south to China via the existent trade routes.
And if there's one place I'm familiar with, it's Western North America
I mean, 2019 California that is...
You'll have to book it to. I don't see how you might survive a winter in either Siberia, Alaska, or northern Canada.
by Ralnis » Fri May 17, 2019 6:48 pm
by Ralnis » Fri May 17, 2019 8:05 pm
by Reatra » Fri May 17, 2019 8:59 pm
by Hanafuridake » Sat May 18, 2019 12:46 pm
Suriyanakhon's alt, finally found my old account's password李贽 wrote:There is nothing difficult about becoming a sage, and nothing false about transcending the world of appearances.
by Joohan » Sat May 18, 2019 4:13 pm
by Joohan » Sat May 18, 2019 4:17 pm
by Hanafuridake » Sat May 18, 2019 4:29 pm
Suriyanakhon's alt, finally found my old account's password李贽 wrote:There is nothing difficult about becoming a sage, and nothing false about transcending the world of appearances.
by G-Tech Corporation » Sat May 18, 2019 4:33 pm
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