NATION

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Right-Wing Discussion Thread XVI: Making Things Right Again

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Do you consider nationalism and patriotism synoymous?

Yes- I am a nationalist and a patriot
86
26%
No- I am a nationalist and a patriot
36
11%
No- I am a nationalist, not a patriot
34
10%
No- I am a patriot, not a nationalist
114
34%
Yes- I am neither a nationalist nor a patriot
15
4%
No- I am neither a nationalist nor a patriot
50
15%
 
Total votes : 335

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Old Tyrannia
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Father Knows Best State

Right-Wing Discussion Thread XVI: Making Things Right Again

Postby Old Tyrannia » Tue May 14, 2019 9:33 am


The Right Wing Discussion Thread
Part XVI
Making Things Right Again



Joseph de Maistre wrote:“There is no philosophy without the art of ignoring objections.”

Sorry, guys, I'm not very good at memes, so have a topical quote instead.

Welcome to the sixteenth incarnation of the Right-Wing Discussion Thread. Following the proud tradition passed down from the long-standing crypto-leftist republican Lord Protector of the Thread, Herskerstad, and the thread's previous regent, the liberal infiltrator noble lady Fahran, I have seized power in a bloody putsch selflessly taken the responsibility of thread OP upon myself.

Here, the stalwarts of the NSG Right gather to bide their time whilst they wait for the final struggle against the forces of anarchy: wreckers of law and order, Communists, Maoists, Trotskyists, neo-Trotskyists, crypto-Trotskyists, union leaders, Communist union leaders, atheists, agnostics, long-haired weirdos, short-haired weirdos, vandals, hooligans, football supporters, namby-pamby probation officers, rapists, papists, papist rapists, foreign surgeons - headshrinkers, who ought to be locked up, Wedgwood Benn, keg bitter, punk rock, glue- sniffers, Play For Today, squatters, Clive Jenkins, Roy Jenkins, Up Jenkins, up everybody's, Chinese restaurants - why do you think Windsor Castle is ringed with Chinese restaurants?

Whatever your political poison, you're welcome to verbally brawl here. Just try to keep to topics related to right-wing politics- whilst the conversation may naturally meander around such areas as religion, philosophy and, of course, left-wing ideology, please remember to limit your discussion of these topics to their relevance to the political right. We leave it up to posters to decide for themselves what constitutes "right-wing" in political jargon. Respect your fellow posters, abide by the site rules and be prepared to have your views challenged, mocked, torn apart, shat on and flushed down the toilet.

Suggestions for improvements, changes, or additions is as always welcome.

Relevant subjects for discussion include:

  • The politics, philosophies, and ideologies of the right.
  • Right-wing perspectives on economics and political economy.
  • News and history relevant to the political Right.
  • Right-wing responses to current events.
  • Right-wing perspectives on social and economic problems.
  • Political, social, cultural, and economic problems and their solutions according to the political Right.
  • The problems facing particular Right-wing movements or the political right in general, and how to resolve them.

Previous Iterations:
Part I | Part II | Part III | Part IV | Part V | Part VI | Part VII | Part VIII | Part IX | Part X | Part XI | Part XII | Part XIII | Part XIV | Part XV

Poll History:

Poll 1: Is Cultural Marxism a Problem? (Jochistan) - 54% Voted Yes
Poll 2: Favourite Right-Wing Politicians? (Kauthar) - 25% voted Donald Trump
Poll 3: Favourite Right-Wing Autocrats (Unnamed Island State) - 45% voted Vladamir Putin
Poll 4: Best Right-Wing Countries (Kauthar) - Putin's Russia 21%
Poll 5: Best Right-Wing Idealogue (Legitimists)

Poll 1: What Right-Wing Ideology do you adhere to? - 55 votes for Libertarian
Poll 2 Favourite Right-Wing Economic System - 31 votes for Neoliberalism
Poll 3: Favourite Right-Wing Dictator - 18 Votes Kai Shek and Pinochet
Poll 4: Favourite Right-Wing Dictator PART 2 - David Cameron 49%
Poll 5: Prominent Right-Wing NSers/Favourite Future Right-Wing Dictator - Old Tyrannia 39 votes/29%
Poll 6: Favourite Fictional Right-Wing Dictators - Emperor Palpatine (Star Wars) 43 Votes/23%

Poll 0.1: Continue the Old Poll Y/N
Poll 1: Favourite Right-Wing Ideologies - Libertarianism/Minarchism

Poll 1: Favorite Centre-Right Parties - Republican Party (US) 39%
Poll 2: What should be the most important core value of a state ideology? Liberty 47%

Poll 1: Which piece of literature has been most significant to the development of right-wing ideology? - Reflections on the Revolution in France 68/237 (29%)
Poll 2: Favourite constitutional/government models? - US 166/528 (31%)

Poll 1: If you could reverse the outcomes of one of these events, which one would it be? - The Russian Revolution 116/343 (34%)
Poll 2: If you could ensure the survival of one empire at their height, which would it be? - The Roman Empire 119/495 (24%)

Do you drink alcohol and what's your opinion of it?
No, and I have a negative opinion of it. It should remain legal. - 57 (36%)
Total Votes: 157 (Recorded 09/01/2017)

Poll 1: Which of the following Trump picks are you most happy with? And are you overall satisfied with them? - James Norman Mattis 92/384 Terrible picks, what have we gotten ourselves into. 97/384
Poll 2: Is Islam compatible with western civilisation? No - 102/330. If reformed yes - 102/330
Poll 3: Which side, for the sake of mankind, should have won WW1? The Allied Powers - 225/385
Poll 4: Was the Reformation a good thing? Yes - 146/287

Poll 1: If you could alter or overturn one of these treaties, which would it be? Treaty of Versailles - 365/564

Poll 1: What stance do you take on immigration? Limited open borders that prioritises only high skilled labour. Melting-pot model. - 204/814

Poll 1: Which Kievan/Novrogrodian/Russian/Soviet leader was the greatest? Peter I The Great. 66/210

Poll 1: Which Japanese Shogunate was the most glorious? - MacArthur Shogunate :'). 289/450

Poll I: How should the government interact with religion? - Secularism 124/212 (58%)
Poll II: What's your favorite Eastern Philosophy? - Confucianism 45/206 (22%), Other/None 56/206 (27%)
Poll III: What's your favorite style of architecture? - Gothic 33/189 (17%)
Poll IV: To what ethical philosophy do you subscribe? - Natural Law Theory 20/112 (18%)

Poll I: Who is your favourite right-wing fiction writer? - JRR Tolkien 101/187 (54%)
Poll II: Do you consider nationalism and patriotism synonymous? - No- I am a patriot, not a nationalist (34%)

Reading Suggestions:
If you’re looking to read something relevant to right-wing politics, consider reading some of the texts below. If you think something’s missing from this list, please post a recommendation. If you think something should be removed, please explain why.

  • ”Leviathan”
    — Thomas Hobbes. (Read Here)
  • ”Two Treatises of Government”
    — John Locke. (Read Here)
  • ”The Protestant Work Ethic and the Spirit of Capitalism.”
    — Max Weber.
  • ”Reflections on the Revolution in France”
    — Edmund Burke. (Read Here)
  • ”The Wealth Of Nations”
    — Adam Smith. (Read Here)
  • ”Essay on the Generative Principle of Political Constitutions and other Human Institutions”
    — Joseph de Maistre. (Read Here)
  • ”Rerum novarum”
    — Pope Leo XIII. (Read Here)
  • ”The Crisis of the Modern World”
    — Rene Guenon. (Read Here)
  • ”The Doctrine Of Fascism”
    — Benito Mussolini. (Read Here)
  • ”The Conservative Mind”
    — Russell Kirk.
  • "On the Constutution of Church and State"
    — Samuel Taylor Coleridge
  • "Political Theology"
    — Carl Schmitt (Read Here)
  • "Revolt Against The Modern World"
    — Julius Evola
  • "How To Be A Conservative"
    — Roger Scruton

If you have a penchant for the colour red and the thought of top hats and canes stirs your bloodlust, you might find yourself fitting in better over at the Left-Wing Discussion Thread.
Last edited by Old Tyrannia on Tue Jul 09, 2019 1:20 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Diopolis
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Postby Diopolis » Tue May 14, 2019 9:57 am

Ah, that new thread smell.
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Proctopeo
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Postby Proctopeo » Tue May 14, 2019 9:58 am

Continuing from the last thread, Wilson was legitimately awful all things considered, he even screwed the peace negotiations to grandstand about his dream, which would become the... League of Nations.
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Thermodolia
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Postby Thermodolia » Tue May 14, 2019 9:59 am

To carry over the conversation from the last thread Wilson was a piece of shit. And unfortunately his philosophy is still the driving force in American foreign policy to this day
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Washington Resistance Army
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue May 14, 2019 9:59 am

I would like to make sure you all know that Maximinus Thrax was the manliest motherfucker to ever live.

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Galloism
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Galloism » Tue May 14, 2019 10:00 am

Conserative Morality wrote:
Galloism wrote:It's really best understood in terms of governmental hierarchy.

You're ordered by the state of California to take a certain action. If the feds are silent to the issue, you must comply. But if there's a United States law that says you can't take that action, then you must comply with federal law - the higher authority.

Similarly, if the Roman government tells you to take a certain action, and God is silent about it, you must comply. If that would violate an order from God, then you must comply with God - the higher authority.

It's really quite simple.

This is not unlike the military command to follow orders generally, unless those orders are in violation of the Uniform Code of Military Justice, passed by Congress, which is a higher authority than your commanding officer.

So again, where does it say "Leech off of the Roman state and obey the precepts handed down on explicitly religious terms except when it's incense"?


Given the NT has a lot of principles and very few laws, it's often up to Christians themselves to ferret out the details. Hence the split, as you mentioned earlier.

This is not unlike the United States last century - where a religious group refused to salute the flag because they saw it as a religious devotion, and filed a couple lawsuits over it. Other religions didn't agree, but that doesn't necessarily make their interpretation invalid, just different.

First one doesn't seem to talk about it being considered a religious devotion at all. Second one gives me an error message. In french.

Tracing it back through the site lands me on a very long article. I'm about halfway down and it hasn't mentioned religious devotion of tax paying at all. Can you tell me where to focus?

[11] Part of what made this system of taxation so complex was that it varied significantly from province to province and over time. In a consideration of the religious responsibilities inherent in Jesus' statement and taxation more generally it is useful to consider the situation in the region of Judea. Thanks to the writings of the New Testament and to the historian Josephus we are relatively well informed about Judea in the first century CE. If the first part of Jesus' statement "Render to Caesar what is Caesar's" was primarily a statement of the political responsibilities of taxation then "Render to God what is God's" can be read as a statement of religious responsibility. There are, of course, many valences to this simple expression, including more abstract responsibilities of religious duty to God in one's actions. However, for the purpose of taxation, I want to focus on the more concrete meanings of this seemingly simple statement. All of Roman taxation was linked in part to religious obligation. In a world in which the favor of the gods was seen as essential to the success of Rome, much of religious life was closely linked to the state. It is no surprise, then, that tax revenues helped to support a range of temples and festivals. Indeed, a fitting expression of this religious connection is offered by the central location in Rome of the Temple of Saturn where the tax revenues were kept.

The second one appears to not have said what I thought it said directly, but supports implications of other implications I should have cited if I was going to use it, I apologize for that.


I'd say the notion that taxes are used to support religious temples and festivals doesn't mean that taxation was a religious obligation, anymore than paying taxes to the United States is engaging in a death worshipping obligation. That seems like a major stretch. No one would reasonably interpret the fact that you paid taxes to the US means you support blowing up other countries, even if that's what a significant portion of your tax revenues are used for.

Once you pay the taxes, the money isn't yours anymore, and it's used in the way the state intends.
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Duhon
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Postby Duhon » Tue May 14, 2019 10:01 am

Diopolis wrote:Ah, that new thread smell.


But can you smell what a byte has cooked?

Also, Nea: Epic Rap Battles of History. Pretty neat rap battles, sometimes.

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Thermodolia
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Tue May 14, 2019 10:01 am

Proctopeo wrote:Continuing from the last thread, Wilson was legitimately awful all things considered, he even screwed the peace negotiations to grandstand about his dream, which would become the... League of Nations.

Which we never joined. Honestly I wish nobody in republicans had challenged Teddy. Because he could have easily won against Wilson and most likely would have gotten involved in WW1 a lot earlier.

Also this is my 50,000th post. God I’ve spent to much time here
Last edited by Thermodolia on Tue May 14, 2019 10:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Nea Byzantia
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Postby Nea Byzantia » Tue May 14, 2019 10:01 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:I would like to make sure you all know that Maximinus Thrax was the manliest motherfucker to ever live.

As a proud Thracian, even I must agree...

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Thermodolia
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Postby Thermodolia » Tue May 14, 2019 10:02 am

Duhon wrote:
Diopolis wrote:Ah, that new thread smell.


But can you smell what a byte has cooked?

Also, Nea: Epic Rap Battles of History. Pretty neat rap battles, sometimes.

I’ve learned a lot of history things from those
Male, centrist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, loves dogs particularly German Shepherds, give me any good Irish or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
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>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
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North German Realm
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Postby North German Realm » Tue May 14, 2019 10:04 am

Proctopeo wrote:Continuing from the last thread, Wilson was legitimately awful all things considered, he even screwed the peace negotiations to grandstand about his dream, which would become the... League of Nations.

While I'm salty about Wilson for obvious reasons, I honestly think that even as a US president, he was nowhere as bad as, say, Andrew Jackson (Especially for his trail of tears) in my personal opinion.
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Washington Resistance Army
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue May 14, 2019 10:04 am

Nea Byzantia wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:I would like to make sure you all know that Maximinus Thrax was the manliest motherfucker to ever live.

As a proud Thracian, even I must agree...


>8 feet tall
>punched a horses teeth out
>ate 60 pounds of meat a day
>had a 16 v 1 fight and won
>the soldiers tasked with killing him were literally too scared to try

Sure a lot of it is probably BS but still, what a boss

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Painisia
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Postby Painisia » Tue May 14, 2019 10:05 am

A thread in the RWDT has the same lifespan as an Italian government.
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Thermodolia
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Postby Thermodolia » Tue May 14, 2019 10:05 am

North German Realm wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:Continuing from the last thread, Wilson was legitimately awful all things considered, he even screwed the peace negotiations to grandstand about his dream, which would become the... League of Nations.

While I'm salty about Wilson for obvious reasons, I honestly think that even as a US president, he was nowhere as bad as, say, Andrew Jackson (Especially for his trail of tears) in my personal opinion.

Jackson was nowhere near as shitty as Wilson
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>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
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Duhon
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Postby Duhon » Tue May 14, 2019 10:05 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Duhon wrote:
But can you smell what a byte has cooked?

Also, Nea: Epic Rap Battles of History. Pretty neat rap battles, sometimes.

I’ve learned a lot of history things from those


The only thing I've learnt from it was the existence of flyting, which should've been the name of rapping from the get-go. Fucking American education system.

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Galloism
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Postby Galloism » Tue May 14, 2019 10:05 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:As a proud Thracian, even I must agree...


>8 feet tall
>punched a horses teeth out
>ate 60 pounds of meat a day
>had a 16 v 1 fight and won
>the soldiers tasked with killing him were literally too scared to try

Sure a lot of it is probably BS but still, what a boss

The stories about him and loosely based on my ancient autobiography.
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Hanafuridake
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Postby Hanafuridake » Tue May 14, 2019 10:07 am

And so the Mandate of Heaven has passed from the perfidious Fahran dynasty to the legitimate House of Tyrannia.

All is well.
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Conserative Morality
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Postby Conserative Morality » Tue May 14, 2019 10:08 am

Thermodolia wrote: Which we never joined. Honestly I wish nobody in republicans had challenged Teddy. Because he could have easily won against Wilson and most likely would have gotten involved in WW1 a lot earlier.

Death to Taft, we must uphold Bull Moose Progressivism and Theodore Roosevelt Thought.
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Duhon
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Duhon » Tue May 14, 2019 10:09 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:As a proud Thracian, even I must agree...


>8 feet tall
>punched a horses teeth out
>ate 60 pounds of meat a day
>had a 16 v 1 fight and won
>the soldiers tasked with killing him were literally too scared to try

Sure a lot of it is probably BS but still, what a boss


It is very likely bullshit, as that comes from that fucking Historia Augusta -- useful only because so much else of Greco-Roman literature has been lost and will never, ever be recovered.

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Washington Resistance Army
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Tue May 14, 2019 10:09 am

Duhon wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
>8 feet tall
>punched a horses teeth out
>ate 60 pounds of meat a day
>had a 16 v 1 fight and won
>the soldiers tasked with killing him were literally too scared to try

Sure a lot of it is probably BS but still, what a boss


It is very likely bullshit, as that comes from that fucking Historia Augusta -- useful only because so much else of Greco-Roman literature has been lost and will never, ever be recovered.


You're just mad you're not 8 feet tall and Emperor

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Thermodolia
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Tue May 14, 2019 10:09 am

Conserative Morality wrote:
Thermodolia wrote: Which we never joined. Honestly I wish nobody in republicans had challenged Teddy. Because he could have easily won against Wilson and most likely would have gotten involved in WW1 a lot earlier.

Death to Taft, we must uphold Bull Moose Progressivism and Theodore Roosevelt Thought.

Here here!!
Male, centrist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, loves dogs particularly German Shepherds, give me any good Irish or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
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Ambassadors to the WA:
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Nea Byzantia
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Nea Byzantia » Tue May 14, 2019 10:11 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Nea Byzantia wrote:As a proud Thracian, even I must agree...


>8 feet tall
>punched a horses teeth out
>ate 60 pounds of meat a day
>had a 16 v 1 fight and won
>the soldiers tasked with killing him were literally too scared to try

Sure a lot of it is probably BS but still, what a boss

I knew he was cool...I didn't know he was that cool, though.

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Novus America
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Novus America » Tue May 14, 2019 10:11 am

North German Realm wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:Continuing from the last thread, Wilson was legitimately awful all things considered, he even screwed the peace negotiations to grandstand about his dream, which would become the... League of Nations.

While I'm salty about Wilson for obvious reasons, I honestly think that even as a US president, he was nowhere as bad as, say, Andrew Jackson (Especially for his trail of tears) in my personal opinion.


While the Trail of Tears was completely fucked up and completely unnecessary, he did not cause the same absurd levels of lasting damage to most people (who were not Cherokee) that Wilson did.
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Duhon
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Founded: Nov 21, 2018
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Duhon » Tue May 14, 2019 10:12 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Duhon wrote:
It is very likely bullshit, as that comes from that fucking Historia Augusta -- useful only because so much else of Greco-Roman literature has been lost and will never, ever be recovered.


You're just mad you're not 8 feet tall and Emperor


I can't be mad about people suffering from fucking gigantism, dude. I only get real pissed off when it's books -- I'm papyrosexual --

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Valrifell
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Left-Leaning College State

Postby Valrifell » Tue May 14, 2019 10:14 am

North German Realm wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:Continuing from the last thread, Wilson was legitimately awful all things considered, he even screwed the peace negotiations to grandstand about his dream, which would become the... League of Nations.

While I'm salty about Wilson for obvious reasons, I honestly think that even as a US president, he was nowhere as bad as, say, Andrew Jackson (Especially for his trail of tears) in my personal opinion.


Andrew Jackson was the man who (symbolically or otherwise) shifted the image of Republicanism away from the coastal elite and towards average Americans.
I like to imagine Sisyphus happy
I did some things

How not to debate: put snarky things implicitly calling out other posters in your sig

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