PDOX Games VIII: Communism Will Win

[Alvecia]

So can I just clarify? We're angry that within about a week of release, they're patching several issues and releasing it for free, because it's hypothetically possible that in an alternate reality it might not have been free.

That seems entirely reasonable.

Also, why are pigs being stabbed?

The increase stability button in I:R is now “Sacrifice to the Gods” and is a picture of a pig being stabbed.

[Alvecia]

As I’m sure we’re all well aware, there is a point at which you can no longer develop the game and must prepare it for release.

And if that means the game is unfinished, feature bare or just not fun people will complain and not buy it. That's just the way it goes.

That’s perfectly fine, it’s just got nothing much to do with whether or not PDX already had this stuff finished either:
A) before development close, or
B) with intent to include it as a paid feature.
As was your initial accusation.

[Platypus Bureaucracy]

So can I just clarify? We're angry that within about a week of release, they're patching several issues and releasing it for free, because it's hypothetically possible that in an alternate reality it might not have been free.

That seems entirely reasonable.

Also, why are pigs being stabbed?

The increase stability button in I:R is now “Sacrifice to the Gods” and is a picture of a pig being stabbed.

Aw, that's mean.

[Hammer Britannia]

So can I just clarify? We're angry that within about a week of release, they're patching several issues and releasing it for free, because it's hypothetically possible that in an alternate reality it might not have been free.

That seems entirely reasonable.

Also, why are pigs being stabbed?

The increase stability button in I:R is now “Sacrifice to the Gods” and is a picture of a pig being stabbed.

I:R is the best game now

[Ism]

Fuck it ill try anway

nope

Sorry to hear that, my saves seem to been working fine, though it does keep saying the checksum is off. You gotta go back a version for CK2 to be compatible with 1.9 of the mod, did you make sure to do that?

[Holy Tedalonia]

So can I just clarify? We're angry that within about a week of release, they're patching several issues and releasing it for free, because it's hypothetically possible that in an alternate reality it might not have been free.

That seems entirely reasonable.

Also, why are pigs being stabbed?

The increase stability button in I:R is now “Sacrifice to the Gods” and is a picture of a pig being stabbed.

I’m am peaking on +3 stability for the past several years in game. Caledonia: A place of perfect stability and safety. Minus the fact, my chiefs keep forming retinues thus entrenching them with the fickle ideals of greed.

I mean, you can’t use religion for anything else save for that religion boon and sacrifice up in Druidic Scotland. That being said, if anyone knows any other use, please let me know I’m like sitting on a 1k religious power, and sometimes even 2k.

[Holy Tedalonia]

As I’m sure we’re all well aware, there is a point at which you can no longer develop the game and must prepare it for release.

And if that means the game is unfinished, feature bare or just not fun people will complain and not buy it. That's just the way it goes.

Given how its a new standard, I’d say I:R less bare bones then Destiny, Fallout 76, or Anthem. I only bought one of the three for that very reason. It’s a direction the game industry just keeps wanting to go, I don’t think itll get better anytime soon.

[Ostroeuropa]

Trying a Saguntum game. (Aiming for Iberia Universalis.).

Had a solid start, now a matter of consolidation, recovery, and expansion. Saguntum is a cool one to go for, it's the city that allied with Rome and was besieged and destroyed by Hannibal so he could bait the Romans into the second punic war.

It's about midway up the med coast of Spain, opposite Rome.

I've learned from previous games to just... let shit go. Don't convert all provinces at once, just one or two at a time, or you'll risk civil wars. (Siiiigh.).

I don't know if Saguntum or Iberians in general are matriarchal, but Saguntum has thee woman chieftains at start.

[Alvecia]

The increase stability button in I:R is now “Sacrifice to the Gods” and is a picture of a pig being stabbed.

I’m am peaking on +3 stability for the past several years in game. Caledonia: A place of perfect stability and safety. Minus the fact, my chiefs keep forming retinues thus entrenching them with the fickle ideals of greed.

I mean, you can’t use religion for anything else save for that religion boon and sacrifice up in Druidic Scotland. That being said, if anyone knows any other use, please let me know I’m like sitting on a 1k religious power, and sometimes even 2k.

The three uses I’m aware of are boons, stabbing pigs, and converting religion. You won’t encounter the third at all in the British Isles, it’s all Druidic.
Also the odd event.
Oratory and Civic power are the two big ones I’ve found.

[Evil Dictators Happyland]

I’m am peaking on +3 stability for the past several years in game. Caledonia: A place of perfect stability and safety. Minus the fact, my chiefs keep forming retinues thus entrenching them with the fickle ideals of greed.

I mean, you can’t use religion for anything else save for that religion boon and sacrifice up in Druidic Scotland. That being said, if anyone knows any other use, please let me know I’m like sitting on a 1k religious power, and sometimes even 2k.

The three uses I’m aware of are boons, stabbing pigs, and converting religion. You won’t encounter the third at all in the British Isles, it’s all Druidic.
Also the odd event.
Oratory and Civic power are the two big ones I’ve found.

Oh god, I read this as "Oral and Civic power" for a second and now I can't see anything else

[Purpelia]

And if that means the game is unfinished, feature bare or just not fun people will complain and not buy it. That's just the way it goes.

That’s perfectly fine, it’s just got nothing much to do with whether or not PDX already had this stuff finished either:
A) before development close, or
B) with intent to include it as a paid feature.
As was your initial accusation.

Withholding content that is ready for release from the release is bad. End of story. It produces a bad product that I will not buy.

And if that means the game is unfinished, feature bare or just not fun people will complain and not buy it. That's just the way it goes.

Given how its a new standard, I’d say I:R less bare bones then Destiny, Fallout 76, or Anthem. I only bought one of the three for that very reason. It’s a direction the game industry just keeps wanting to go, I don’t think itll get better anytime soon.

You just named 3 games I didn't buy for that reason. As for getting better that depends entirely on how many people are willing to not buy vs the number of apologists that will buy anything made by their favorite studio no matter what.

Capitalism is ruled by supply and demand. Producers of any good or service will always try to make their products as cheap and crap as they can get away with before people stop buying. But it is us not them who draw that line.

[Holy Tedalonia]

I’m am peaking on +3 stability for the past several years in game. Caledonia: A place of perfect stability and safety. Minus the fact, my chiefs keep forming retinues thus entrenching them with the fickle ideals of greed.

I mean, you can’t use religion for anything else save for that religion boon and sacrifice up in Druidic Scotland. That being said, if anyone knows any other use, please let me know I’m like sitting on a 1k religious power, and sometimes even 2k.

The three uses I’m aware of are boons, stabbing pigs, and converting religion. You won’t encounter the third at all in the British Isles, it’s all Druidic.
Also the odd event.
Oratory and Civic power are the two big ones I’ve found.

Yeah, oratory is another one I’m 1k in, simply because if you use it to change laws, you’ll lose loyalty, and given that the chieftains love to create their own retinues (Loyalty debuff: loyal cohorts), I’m likely to get into civil war thanks to law changes.

[Evil Dictators Happyland]

That’s perfectly fine, it’s just got nothing much to do with whether or not PDX already had this stuff finished either:
A) before development close, or
B) with intent to include it as a paid feature.
As was your initial accusation.

Withholding content that is ready for release from the release is bad. End of story. It produces a bad product that I will not buy.

Given how its a new standard, I’d say I:R less bare bones then Destiny, Fallout 76, or Anthem. I only bought one of the three for that very reason. It’s a direction the game industry just keeps wanting to go, I don’t think itll get better anytime soon.

You just named 3 games I didn't buy for that reason. As for getting better that depends entirely on how many people are willing to not buy vs the number of apologists that will buy anything made by their favorite studio no matter what.

Capitalism is ruled by supply and demand. Producers of any good or service will always try to make their products as cheap and crap as they can get away with before people stop buying. But it is us not them who draw that line.

I still don't get why you're bitching because they didn't make you pay for the patch

[Holy Tedalonia]

Given how its a new standard, I’d say I:R less bare bones then Destiny, Fallout 76, or Anthem. I only bought one of the three for that very reason. It’s a direction the game industry just keeps wanting to go, I don’t think itll get better anytime soon.

You just named 3 games I didn't buy for that reason. As for getting better that depends entirely on how many people are willing to not buy vs the number of apologists that will buy anything made by their favorite studio no matter what.

Capitalism is ruled by supply and demand. Producers of any good or service will always try to make their products as cheap and crap as they can get away with before people stop buying. But it is us not them who draw that line.

Fair point, I mean Destiny is probably held up by casuals and loyal fans at this point. I don’t disagree with your assessment at all really, just building off of it really. I think the greed and interest of pulling cash from the casual audience is almost always going to win developers over. Which is why its not going to go anytime soon. Casuals don’t seek for much challenge or anything really. Which is why they naturally have a higher tolerance to this sort of dickery. Its one of the reasons why I have been avoiding triple A games for the past few years, because that part of the industry is so desperately searching ways to appease the casuals.

Anyway, I’m enjoying I:R so far. I’m probably going to get burned out, but its not going to be until I finished a couple games. I feel like its a full fledged game, but definitely has room for improvement. My main issue is the lack luster of events so far, but given that I’m playing Caledonia I’m not surprised.

[Lunas Legion]

I'm just waiting for mods for I:R before I decide if it's worth my money or not. I just want an Alexander mod or a mod for right after his death because the wars of the Diadochi are more interesting the earlier they are.

[Purpelia]

I still don't get why you're bitching because they didn't make you pay for the patch

I already answered that. One should be praised for doing, after being forced that which he should have done to begin with on his own free will and volition.

Anyway, I’m enjoying I:R so far. I’m probably going to get burned out, but its not going to be until I finished a couple games. I feel like its a full fledged game, but definitely has room for improvement. My main issue is the lack luster of events so far, but given that I’m playing Caledonia I’m not surprised.

My main issue is really that I don't see a reason to buy it as opposed to sticking with CK2 or EU4. Does it do anything better or more fun than either of those games? So far my impression from all sources I've seen is no.

[Valrifell]

I still don't get why you're bitching because they didn't make you pay for the patch

I already answered that. One should be praised for doing, after being forced that which he should have done to begin with on his own free will and volition.

With the absense of alternate universes, you're just playing with baseless counterfactuals. We don't and can't know if they would've acted like this regardless. Besides, free will is a spook.

I'd reccomend not peddling in statements which are unprovable and unfalsifiable, terribly unhealthy.

[Holy Tedalonia]

Anyway, I’m enjoying I:R so far. I’m probably going to get burned out, but its not going to be until I finished a couple games. I feel like its a full fledged game, but definitely has room for improvement. My main issue is the lack luster of events so far, but given that I’m playing Caledonia I’m not surprised.

My main issue is really that I don't see a reason to buy it as opposed to sticking with CK2 or EU4. Does it do anything better or more fun than either of those games? So far my impression from all sources I've seen is no.

Well, just because something previously is “better” doesn’t mean the next game from the developers is not worth buying. I like I:R mainly for the time period, I’m a Roman Empire fanboy, and I’m obviously going to be into the time period.

It may not be as developed as EU4 or CK2, but I don’t necessarily need it to be to achieve the things I want out of the game. In fact, its considerably a low blow, to use two games that arguably had about the same amount of content at launch, and not has been improved via patches and dlcs. So while I see your point, Ill have to respectfully disagree, as I find reasons myself to get the game, and I am currently enjoying my experiences in the game.

[Purpelia]

With the absense of alternate universes, you're just playing with baseless counterfactuals. We don't and can't know if they would've acted like this regardless. Besides, free will is a spook.

I'd reccomend not peddling in statements which are unprovable and unfalsifiable, terribly unhealthy.

We know how they acted. They withed content. There is nothing unprovable about that unless you believe that amount of changes can be magicked up out of thin air. It just is not possible. And I am willing to stake my carrier as a game developer on that statement.

Well, just because something previously is “better” doesn’t mean the next game from the developers is not worth buying. I like I:R mainly for the time period, I’m a Roman Empire fanboy, and I’m obviously going to be into the time period.

That is literally what it means. If I can get more fun out of playing another game than by definition that game is not worth buying over those others.

It may not be as developed as EU4 or CK2, but I don’t necessarily need it to be to achieve the things I want out of the game. In fact, its considerably a low blow, to use two games that arguably had about the same amount of content at launch, and not has been improved via patches and dlcs. So while I see your point, Ill have to respectfully disagree, as I find reasons myself to get the game, and I am currently enjoying my experiences in the game.

Not really. Compare it to a game that's relatively recent so we can remember it easily. HOI4. HOI4 at launch was a 100% improvement over 3. Neither were as good at launch as 2 but it was still a very good game.

Although HOI4 is a bit of an extreme in that I would take HOI4 at launch over HOI3 with full DLC any day.

[Holy Tedalonia]

Well, just because something previously is “better” doesn’t mean the next game from the developers is not worth buying. I like I:R mainly for the time period, I’m a Roman Empire fanboy, and I’m obviously going to be into the time period.

That is literally what it means. If I can get more fun out of playing another game than by definition that game is not worth buying over those others.

That is a fallacious argument. Take the total war franchise for instance, your basically saying, Total War Warhammer II is objectively the best game in the franchise, and thus all other of their games are irrelevant, due to being inferior. (This is just a example)

These games differentiate based upon scenarios, some people have different tastes in scenarios. For instance, I like Roman era stuff. Sure EU4 or CK2 may be better as of right now, but my interest in Roman era gameplay wins out, as I:R fulfills that demand of a Roman era strategy game. Needless to say, your point of the best games are the only games worth playing is a moot point.

It may not be as developed as EU4 or CK2, but I don’t necessarily need it to be to achieve the things I want out of the game. In fact, its considerably a low blow, to use two games that arguably had about the same amount of content at launch, and not has been improved via patches and dlcs. So while I see your point, Ill have to respectfully disagree, as I find reasons myself to get the game, and I am currently enjoying my experiences in the game.

Not really. Compare it to a game that's relatively recent so we can remember it easily. HOI4. HOI4 at launch was a 100% improvement over 3. Neither were as good at launch as 2 but it was still a very good game.

Although HOI4 is a bit of an extreme in that I would take HOI4 at launch over HOI3 with full DLC any day.

I don’t disagree, but I don’t see how HoI4’s launch relates to the launches of CK2, EU4, or I:R, except adds another example that could relate on the list. Unless you mean Europa Universalis: Rome is better.

[Alvecia]

In other game related news, I’ve decided to go for the Boiis are back in town achievement.

Game plan was to expand fast, and take out Rome while they were still small and low on manpower from conquests.

Unfortunately it seems I overdid it and am now in three separate wars, one with Rome by myself, and with an ongoing rebellion.

Fortunately Rome was actually quite low, and occupied with some wars to the south when they declared, so I’ve managed to take a lot of territory and am moving on Roma. Hopefully I can knock them out quick and turn my attention onwards and northwards.

[Alvecia]

Also to add to the ongoing discussion, HOI4 was actually delayed a long time to get to launch state, and people still got pissy.
So I guess damned if you do, damned if you don’t.

[Valrifell]

Was playing another Charlemagne start which quickly turned into an "play Imperial politcs" run, which is fine and I'm eventually elected Emperor.

Except the Reichskrone is missing and also I don't have the option to he coronated by the Pope. I think something went wrong somewhere.

[Impaled Nazarene]

Was playing another Charlemagne start which quickly turned into an "play Imperial politcs" run, which is fine and I'm eventually elected Emperor.

Except the Reichskrone is missing and also I don't have the option to he coronated by the Pope. I think something went wrong somewhere.

Pope is probably shacked up because of a plague

[The Huskar Social Union]

Fuck it ill try anway

nope

Sorry to hear that, my saves seem to been working fine, though it does keep saying the checksum is off. You gotta go back a version for CK2 to be compatible with 1.9 of the mod, did you make sure to do that?

I did, i couldnt load my saves at all when i reverted to the previous game version.