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by Cosmopolitan borovan » Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:58 pm
by Imperium Anglorum » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:09 am
by Wallenburg » Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:59 pm
by Imperium Anglorum » Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:12 pm
Wallenburg wrote:IC: "Wallenburg's economy is more than diverse enough to stave off runaway delinquency on loan payments,
Wallenburg wrote:Also, it's called a liquidity crisis, not an illiquidity crisis.
by Wallenburg » Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:17 pm
by Jutsa » Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:39 pm
by Sciongrad » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:38 am
Wallenburg wrote:OOC: If you fail to strike the preambulatory claim to the contrary before submission of your proposal, my office will reluctantly put forward a legality challenge against it."
Wallenburg wrote:Imperium Anglorum wrote:This is just godmodding. Next, I'll say that in my nation, nobody dies.
OOC: Not even remotely. It's absurd to claim that a national economy, no matter how large and how diversified, will inevitably crumble under the weight of unpaid loans, while (presumably) asserting that international economies are inherently immune from such issues, regardless of how small or homogeneous they are.
by Imperium Anglorum » Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:28 am
by Desmosthenes and Burke » Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:11 am
Jutsa wrote:OOC: I genuinely was about to jump in on the "this is unintelligible jargon" myself until I realized that a lot of this is somehow terminology I understand.
Except tranche. According to google, tranche is a noun and not a verb, meaning "a portion of something", so I'm very confuzzled. >_>
by Wallenburg » Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:09 pm
Wallenburg wrote:OOC: Not even remotely. It's absurd to claim that a national economy, no matter how large and how diversified, will inevitably crumble under the weight of unpaid loans, while (presumably) asserting that international economies are inherently immune from such issues, regardless of how small or homogeneous they are.
OOC: It's not absurd. This literally happened in the United States during the 2007-2008 financial crisis. High delinquency rates on mortgages led to a rapid devaluation of mortgage-backed securities. Because almost all banks were so reliant on mortgage-backed securities, when their value disintegrated, they experienced a liquidity crisis. No economy is too big to avoid a liquidity crisis. That's just not realistic.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Banana noted something important, I thought. I didn't in fact authorise the facility to audit filers. It requires that authority and will be given it when I get around to editing the draft.
On the matter of Wally and his wilful ignorance of finance, I don't have much of a response other than stop being wilfully ignorant. This isn't that hard, and can really be explained to a reasonable degree in any basic macroeconomics or finance class. Whole books for mass media have been written on the topic. Read one. You might even learn something of import to public policy.
by Sciongrad » Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:25 pm
Wallenburg wrote:OOC: And everyone who knows anything about the subprime mortgage crisis knows that relaxed lending standards allowed mortgage lenders to start selling to unqualified buyers en masse, even through 2006 as delinquency on those subprime mortgages spiked. Those subprime loans moved up the securitization chain, and so did the delinquency on their loans. Any serious person, economist or not, recognizes that higher lending standards from the start, or even a regulatory response in 2006, would have minimized the subsequent crisis or eliminated it altogether. So yes, it is absolutely absurd to insist that national economies and the states that regulate them simply cannot avoid a liquidity crisis.
by Wallenburg » Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:36 pm
Sciongrad wrote:Wallenburg wrote:OOC: And everyone who knows anything about the subprime mortgage crisis knows that relaxed lending standards allowed mortgage lenders to start selling to unqualified buyers en masse, even through 2006 as delinquency on those subprime mortgages spiked. Those subprime loans moved up the securitization chain, and so did the delinquency on their loans. Any serious person, economist or not, recognizes that higher lending standards from the start, or even a regulatory response in 2006, would have minimized the subsequent crisis or eliminated it altogether. So yes, it is absolutely absurd to insist that national economies and the states that regulate them simply cannot avoid a liquidity crisis.
OOC: The question is not whether or not it is possible to avoid liquidity crises. It obviously is, and this proposal takes as its fundamental assumption that there are ways of preventing liquidity crises.
The question is whether it is realistic for large, diverse economies to experience liquidity crises — it is. Your argument also makes the faulty assumption that any liquidity crisis can be prevented by a government that has adopted the proper policies. But one needs only to look to Europe to see how a liquidity crisis in one country can create a liquidity crunch in others. In other words, liquidity crises can have exogenous causes that a large, economically diverse country cannot prevent. The sovereign debt crises in Spain and Italy — the fourth and third largest economies in continental Europe — were sparked by the sovereign debt crisis in Greece. Many countries with very responsible banking and fiscal policies suffered liquidity crises because of exogenous factors. You can't godmod your way out of economic crises.
by Sciongrad » Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:09 pm
Wallenburg wrote:OOC: If that isn't the question you want to argue about, don't argue about it. If you agree with me that national economies are capable of avoiding liquidity crises, then you have absolutely no reason to be arguing with me.
OOC: I never argued that there exist no nations that experience liquidity crises despite the size and diversity of the economy, so this whole chunk of your post is rather irrelevant. I should also note that illiquidity of certain assets is not the only reason why national economies may experience crises. RPing as a nation that can responsibly manage its economy to a degree that a liquidity crisis is very unlikely is in no way RPing as a nation whose economy experiences no difficulties whatsoever. Stop pretending otherwise.
by Yohannes » Wed Nov 28, 2018 1:24 am
by Kowani » Thu Nov 29, 2018 1:07 am
by Jutsa » Thu Nov 29, 2018 8:32 am
by Kenmoria » Thu Nov 29, 2018 10:24 am
Kowani wrote:Ambassador Nego drops his copy of the proposal in a nearby trash can. "Well, ambassador. I'd vote, If I could fucking read what I was voting on." "But, since I can't, no vote for you."
by Separatist Peoples » Thu Nov 29, 2018 1:27 pm
Kowani wrote:Ambassador Nego drops his copy of the proposal in a nearby trash can. "Well, ambassador. I'd vote, If I could fucking read what I was voting on." "But, since I can't, no vote for you."
by Wallenburg » Thu Nov 29, 2018 2:07 pm
by Separatist Peoples » Thu Nov 29, 2018 3:30 pm
by Wallenburg » Thu Nov 29, 2018 3:36 pm
by Sierra Lyricalia » Thu Nov 29, 2018 3:45 pm
by Doing it Rightland » Thu Nov 29, 2018 3:46 pm
Wallenburg wrote:OOC: Seeing as people are not born with an innate knowledge of economic jargon and theory, I find that incredibly hard to believe.
by Separatist Peoples » Thu Nov 29, 2018 3:52 pm
Wallenburg wrote:Separatist Peoples wrote:Ooc: I've never taken an econ course at any level. I understand it fine. Either I'm uncommonly intelligent, or it isn't that hard
OOC: Seeing as people are not born with an innate knowledge of economic jargon and theory, I find that incredibly hard to believe.
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