[SUBMITTED] Yes, We Have No Vanilla

by **Bears Armed** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:28 am

I’ve decided to produce a draft based on another recent problem from RL.
A very large proportion of the natural Vanilla used nowadays comes from Madagascar (although production is increasing in Indonesia as well), where a combination of factors (tropical storms affecting the harvest, political instability, and possibly changes in land-use to growing more food for local consumption instead) have pushed the price up significantly in some recent years, which has led to criminal gangs stealing the product, which has further discouraged farmers from growing this [labour-intensive, and rather fiddly] crop as well… Considerably more of the synthetic version (produced from Lignin) than of the natural one is actually used already, but gourmets (and fashions, e.g. for ‘vanilla sugar’, due to at least one celebrity chef) and widespread prejudice against “artificial” foodstuffs mean that there is still a high demand for the real thing…
And the suggested title is, as some of you might recognise, modified from the title of an old song.
I’m using Macronesia in this issue, not only because it is already conceptually in a suitable climatic zone for this crop but also because its name so conveniently blends elements of ‘Madagascar’ and ‘Indonesia’.
So far I only have one option (i.e. the first) with unrestricted validity, but every nation should also qualify for (in the second draft [onwards]) either the second and third or the fourth and fifth as well even if not also for the sixth or seventh.

Submitted Version

Yes, We Have No Vanilla

[issue]A dramatic rise in the price of vanilla has led to a warning by @@NATION@@'s main ice-cream makers that they might discontinue their vanilla-flavoured products altogether. This has caused a public outcry, and the problem has now been brought to you for solution.
[validity]unrestricted (or say that ‘Average Income of Poor’ must be high enough for mass-market demand for these goods to exist, and for labour costs to leave domestic production of vanilla uneconomical, but not so high that the price rise isn’t really a problem?)

[option]"We don't like the idea of losing those lines either," explains ice-cream industry spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@, "but we couldn't produce vanilla on a worthwhile scale in this country, so all of the vanilla we use is imported from Macronesia instead. However, problems there — tropical storms damaging the harvest, political unrest, and criminal gangs raiding the farms — have combined with rising demand to push the price up twelvefold in just a couple of years. That makes it simply too expensive for us to use, if we are going to keep selling the ice-cream at a price many people would be willing to pay. If the government wants us to keep on producing reasonably inexpensive vanilla ice-cream, to keep people happy, then the government will have to subsidize it."
[validity]unrestricted
[effect]the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ government is @@REGION@@’s largest purchaser of vanilla

[option]"Subsidies!" exclaims Cherry Berry, director of gourmet gelatiers Jen And Berry’s. "You should let the market decide, instead. The mass-market producers might see sales fall a bit, but we already know that shoppers will willingly pay well for quality from companies such as ours, so if people really want vanilla ice-cream then they will still buy it even with these rising prices." She opens a tub of her company’s Happy Hazelnut Latte ice-cream, and starts eating.
[validity]Invalid for nations that ban private enterprise
[effect]grandparents tell their grandchildren tales of a mythical white ice-cream

[option]"Meh," comments @@RANDOMNAME@@, one of your Press Officers. "Vanilla is so boring, anyway. Seems to me that this shortage is actually a blessing in disguise because it might prompt people to try other flavours, more interesting ones, instead."
[validity]capitalist
[effect]mocha-chili is the nation's new favourite flavour of ice-cream

[option]"H’mm," muses @@RANDOMNAME@@, Second Under-Minister for Food Production. "We could switch to producing the vanilla that we want for ourselves. That might not be the most efficient allocation of workers, but it would be worth it as another step towards economic self-sufficiency and better than continuing to exploit peasants in poorer countries."
[validity]Invalid for nations that allow private enterprise
[effect]the nation is forecast to become self-sufficient in vanilla by the end of the next ten — or maybe twenty, or thirty — years

[option]"Bah!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAME@@, Minister for Ideological Certainty. "That would be wasteful of workers who could be employed more worthily on projects of greater importance, such as improving infrastructure. Ice-cream is decadent luxury that should have no place in true Communist society. Let us ban it altogether, to prevent capitalist indulgence from corrupting our nation."
[validity]communist
[effect]the police raid black market ice-cream parlours

[option]"A perfectly good 'vanilla' flavouring can be synthesised easily and cheaply from one of the wood-pulp industry's by-products, actually," your Science adviser @@RANDOMNAME@@ comments. "Sell that as 'DEMONYMADJECTIVE Vanilla' at a good price and who’s going to care about any slight difference?"
[validityInvalid for nations below the top 75% for Scientific Advancement
[effect]foodies argue the relative merits of domestic and imported vanilla essence

[option]Violetist Grand Poobah @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@ has a different idea about this matter, however: "Vanilla is sacred to Violet," she insists, “and so only we, as Her faithful, should be allowed to use it for anything… and that should be the true, natural material, not some synthetic substitute.”
[validityInvalid for nations in which Violetism is banned
[effect]desperate vanilla-addicts are converting to Violetism

Yes, We have no Vanilla

[issue]A recent warning by the country's ice-cream manufacturers that they might discontinue their vanilla-flavoured products has caused a public outcry.
[validity]unrestricted

[option]"We don't like the idea of having to drop those lines either," explains industry spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@, "but all of our vanilla has to be imported from Macronesia and problems there — tropical storms damaging the harvest, political unrest, and criminal gangs raiding the farms — have combined with rising demand to push the price up eightfold since just a couple of years ago. That makes it simply too expensive for us to use if we're going to sell the ice-cream at a price people would be willing to pay. If the government wants us to keep on producing vanilla ice-cream, to keep people happy, then the government will have to subsidize it."
[validity]unrestricted
[effect]the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ government is the region’s largest purchaser of vanilla

[option]"Subsidies!" exclaims Cherry Berry, director of gourmet gelatiers Jen And Berry’s. "You should let the market decide, instead. We already know that people will willingly pay well for quality products."
[validity]capitalist
[effect]vanilla ice-cream has become a luxury

[option]"Bah!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAME@@, Second Under-Minister for Food Production. "Ice-cream is decadent luxury that should have no place in true Communist society. Let us ban it altogether."
[validity]communist
[effect]the police raid black market ice-cream parlours

[option]"A perfectly good 'vanilla' flavouring can be synthesised easily and cheaply from one of the wood-pulp industry’s by-products, actually," your Science adviser @@RANDOMNAME” comments. "Sell that as @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE Vanilla’ at a good price and who’s going to care about any slight difference?"
[validity]reasonable (“top 75%”) Scientific Advancement
[effect]foodies argue the relative merits of domestic and imported vanilla essence

[option]Violetist grand poobah @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@ has a different idea about this matter, however: "Vanilla is sacred to Violet," she insists, “and so only we, as Her faithful, should be allowed to use it for anything… and that should be the natural material, not some synthetic substitute.”
[validity]Violetism is legal
[effect]the only legal use of vanilla is in Violetist rites

I considered adding another option, with the validity of a low pacifism plus a strong military, which would involve seizing control of some islands with a suitable climate so that vanilla can be produced under your own people’s supervision, but [so far] have decided against doing so.

[alignright](SimreeveIssues)[/align]

by **Trotterdam** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:36 am

Why can't you grow natural vanilla in your own nation? Climate? What about greenhouses?

Bears Armed wrote:[issue]A recent warning by the country's ice-cream manufacturers that they might discontinue their vanilla-flavoured products has caused a public outcry.

Bears Armed wrote:[option]"Subsidies!" exclaims Cherry Berry, director of gourmet gelatiers Jen And Berry’s. "You should let the market decide, instead. We already know that people will willingly pay well for quality products."

According to the opening, the market has decided, and it has decided it might discontinue the products. "Might" is vague, admittedly, but the implication is that they will unless you do something about it.

If the market can reasonable be expected not to discontinue the products, then that should be addressed in the opening.

by **Annihilators of Chan Island** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:36 pm

So if vanilla products are becoming too expensive to import due to myriad foreign horrors, why is there is enough outcry to catch the attention of the leader of the nation? Either there are not enough people to make it viable- in which case there wouldn't be outcry- or the citizenry would be prepared to fork out more for their favourite ice cream... in which case, why would the ice cream industry want to pull out this flavour?

Also, @@NAME@@ is completely capable of growing vanilla. It has areas with the climate for it. So why not grow the stuff domestically if there are so many dangers? Bonus points if it is a step on the way to full autarky.

Capitalist option 2 is just too much of a no brainer. Communist option 2 is too similar to option 4.

by **Australian rePublic** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:01 pm

I think that the Violtism option is taking things too far

by **Sacara** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:18 pm

Is there a reference I'm missing in the title, or is this what you decided upon?

by **USS Monitor** » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:03 pm

Sacara wrote:Is there a reference I'm missing in the title, or is this what you decided upon?

Bears Armed wrote:And the suggested title is, as some of you might recognise, modified from the title of an old song.

The original is bananas instead of vanilla.

by **Candlewhisper Archive** » Fri Jun 15, 2018 2:43 am

Same reference is made in the effect line of 649.3, incidentally.

Not that it stops you using this title, just pointing out that it's not an unknown reference.

by **Nicana** » Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:39 am

"Vanilla" is often used to mean bland, plain, unexciting. Maybe you could work in an option making use of that, such as a double-chocolate chip cookie fan saying "good! now maybe people will try some of the more exciting flavours?". Relatedly, "vanilla ice-cream has become a luxury" is a boring outcome text: how about something like "vanilla ice-cream is an exotic flavour available only to the wealthiest libertines".

Personally I think too much of the issue description has been put into the first option text, and it would be better to have some exposition in the description text -- but that's a stylistic thing as it wouldn't really affect the mechanics.

by **Bears Armed** » Fri Jun 15, 2018 9:41 am

Your comments have been read. My replies, and a new draft, should be ready for posting at some point within the next few days.

by **Bears Armed** » Sat Jun 16, 2018 8:29 am

Second draft posted.

Trotterdam wrote:Why can't you grow natural vanilla in your own nation? Climate? What about greenhouses?

Vanilla is a labour-intensive crop whose production is too fiddly for mechanisation to be practical (see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla and https://www.economist.com/the-economist ... of-vanilla). Any nation with wide enough demand for ice-cream (etc.) for a shortage of affordable vanilla to be a problem probably has an economy strong enough that it has to pay its workers too highly for ‘domestic’ production to be cost-effective against imports despite the latter’s recent increase in price. I’ve now mentioned the possibility of taking this into effect for the issue’s overall validity.

Trotterdam wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[issue]A recent warning by the country's ice-cream manufacturers that they might discontinue their vanilla-flavoured products has caused a public outcry.
[option]"Subsidies!" exclaims Cherry Berry, director of gourmet gelatiers Jen And Berry’s. "You should let the market decide, instead. We already know that people will willingly pay well for quality products."

According to the opening, the market has decided, and it has decided it might discontinue the products. "Might" is vague, admittedly, but the implication is that they will unless you do something about it.
If the market can reasonably be expected not to discontinue the products, then that should be addressed in the opening.

I’ve re-written the opening to explain the situation more clearly, and also re-written Cherry’s option to emphasise that what she sees continuing to be bought is ‘gourmet’ ice-cream rather than mass-market brands.

Annihilators of Chan Island wrote:So if vanilla products are becoming too expensive to import due to myriad foreign horrors, why is there is enough outcry to catch the attention of the leader of the nation? Either there are not enough people to make it viable- in which case there wouldn't be outcry- or the citizenry would be prepared to fork out more for their favourite ice cream... in which case, why would the ice cream industry want to pull out this flavour?

The manufacturers mostly think that too few people would continue buying the stuff at the prices they would now have to charge... and of course decreasing sales mean increasing costs for overheads per unit sold which would push prices up still further… (This price rise for vanilla is a RL problem, and the production & sale of vanilla ice-cream has declined: I’ve only exaggerated the situation — as befits this game — verry slightly…)

Annihilators of Chan Island wrote:Also, @@NAME@@ is completely capable of growing vanilla. It has areas with the climate for it. So why not grow the stuff domestically if there are so many dangers? Bonus points if it is a step on the way to full autarky.

Obviously there’s no way to set the issue’s validity for whether or not the nation has areas with the suitable climate… but even areas with the suitable climate probably don’t also have the species needed to pollinate the vanilla flowers “naturally” (as those have not been transplanted successfully in RL from the plant’s original Mexican home to any of the other places where the crop is grown), so you’d have to rely on pollination by hand instead: Admittedly producers in a communist state probably wouldn’t be as concerned about labour costs or profit margins as producers in a capitalist economy, but there’s still the question of whether they’d regard vanilla as essential enough for the allocation of enough labour to do the job. I’ve given the second draft a pro-Autarky option for nations that do think so.
Any players who think that their nations can produce enough vanilla domestically without problems would just have to dismiss this issue: Probably we all have one or more issues that we dismiss as inappropriate already, anyway, right?

Annihilators of Chan Island wrote:Capitalist option 2 is just too much of a no brainer. Communist option 2 is too similar to option 4.

Capitalist option #2 has been re-written to emphasise the potential downsides more clearly. I do see what you mean about the resemblance, but think that there might be enough difference in Stat effects to make including both of them worthwhile,

Australian rePublic wrote:I think that the Violetism option is taking things too far.

Maybe. I might remove it before submission, or the editors might do so if they accept the issue. It was just the fact that ‘vanilla’ begins with a ‘v’. like Violet, that led me to include this.

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:Same reference is made in the effect line of 649.3, incidentally.

Not that it stops you using this title, just pointing out that it's not an unknown reference.

I didn’t remember that effect line. Maybe I’ve never made that choice? *<goes to look at option>* Nope, pretty sure that I always choose option 2 on that issue.

Nicana wrote:"Vanilla" is often used to mean bland, plain, unexciting. Maybe you could work in an option making use of that, such as a double-chocolate chip cookie fan saying "good! now maybe people will try some of the more exciting flavours?". Relatedly, "vanilla ice-cream has become a luxury" is a boring outcome text: how about something like "vanilla ice-cream is an exotic flavour available only to the wealthiest libertines".

That’s a good idea: New option added.

Nicana wrote:Personally I think too much of the issue description has been put into the first option text, and it would be better to have some exposition in the description text -- but that's a stylistic thing as it wouldn't really affect the mechanics.

On a previous occasion I was told that I’d put too much in the description and not left enough for the first option: Just can’t win…

Having looked at the draft again, though, I agree with you and have expanded the description slightly.

by **Nicana** » Sat Jun 16, 2018 9:11 am

I like the new option.

by **Trotterdam** » Sat Jun 16, 2018 9:59 am

Bears Armed wrote:
Trotterdam wrote:Why can't you grow natural vanilla in your own nation? Climate? What about greenhouses?
Vanilla is a labour-intensive crop whose production is too fiddly for mechanisation to be practical (see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla and https://www.economist.com/the-economist ... of-vanilla). Any nation with wide enough demand for ice-cream (etc.) for a shortage of affordable vanilla to be a problem probably has an economy strong enough that it has to pay its workers too highly for ‘domestic’ production to be cost-effective against imports despite the latter’s recent increase in price. I’ve now mentioned the possibility of taking this into effect for the issue’s overall validity.

Interesing. First-world nations benefiting from the existence of poorer nations to import cheap stuff from is a rather underappreciated issue today. Even people who are aware of the unfortunate implications tend to sweep them under the rug because they like having cheap stuff.

However, this angle isn't really in focus in the draft (only one of the communist-only options in the latest revision even mentions it), which makes it unconvincing as a justification for the scenario, and raises the question of whether you're actually addressing the most important problem on the subject...

by **Bears Armed** » Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:18 am

Trotterdam wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:Vanilla is a labour-intensive crop whose production is too fiddly for mechanisation to be practical (see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla and https://www.economist.com/the-economist ... of-vanilla). Any nation with wide enough demand for ice-cream (etc.) for a shortage of affordable vanilla to be a problem probably has an economy strong enough that it has to pay its workers too highly for ‘domestic’ production to be cost-effective against imports despite the latter’s recent increase in price. I’ve now mentioned the possibility of taking this into effect for the issue’s overall validity.
Interesing. First-world nations benefiting from the existence of poorer nations to import cheap stuff from is a rather underappreciated issue today. Even people who are aware of the unfortunate implications tend to sweep them under the rug because they like having cheap stuff.

However, this angle isn't really in focus in the draft (only one of the communist-only options in the latest revision even mentions it), which makes it unconvincing as a justification for the scenario, and raises the question of whether you're actually addressing the most important problem on the subject...

The communist mentions this because it seems ideologically appropriate for them to do so. I think that the manufacturers quoted here (options 1 & [capitalist] 2) — and the enthusiast for more interesting flavours ([capitalist] option 3) probably just overlooked this aspect of the matter. It’s definitely a question worth asking, but… maybe in a separate issue of its own?

by **Sacara** » Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:00 pm

Bears Armed wrote:[issue]A drastic rise in the price of vanilla has led to a warning by the country's main ice-cream makers and some other food manufacturers that they might discontinue their vanilla-flavoured products altogether. This has caused a public outcry, and the problem has now been brought to you for solution.

I'd personaly just cut out the bolded parts. The first one makes the sentence read awkwardly, and the second one adds nothing to the issue.

Bears Armed wrote:[option]"We don't like the idea of having to drop those lines either," explains ice-cream industry spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@, "but we couldn't produce vanilla on a worthwhile scale in this country so all of the vanilla we use is imported from Macronesia instead and problems there — tropical storms damaging the harvest, political unrest, and criminal gangs raiding the farms — have combined with rising demand to push the price up twelvefold since just a couple of years ago. That makes it simply too expensive for us to use if we are going to keep selling the ice-cream at a price many people would be willing to pay. If the government wants us to keep on producing reasonably inexpensive vanilla ice-cream, to keep people happy, then the government will have to subsidize it."

country. All... It splits it up so it's not one long sentence. Since just also reads awkwardly.

Bears Armed wrote:[effect]the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ government is the region’s largest purchaser of vanilla

This just tells me what the option did. I would expect something along lines of "half of the government's budget goes to purchasing vanilla" or something of the sorts.

Bears Armed wrote:[option]"Subsidies!" exclaims Cherry Berry, director of gourmet gelatiers Jen And Berry’s. "You should let the market decide, instead. The mass-market producers might see sales fall a bit, but we already know that shoppers will willingly pay well for quality from firms such as ours so if people really want vanilla ice-cream then they will still buy it even at higher prices."

ours, so...then, they. I feel like this option is a bit bland. Maybe add character to the speaker, other than his funny name.

Bears Armed wrote:[effect]for most people vanilla ice-cream has become a rare treat

"grandparents tell their kids stories of a mythical white ice cream" or something funny.

Bears Armed wrote:[option]"Meh," comments @@RANDOMNAME@@, one of your Press Officers. "Vanilla is so boring, anyway. This shortage is actually a blessing in disguise because it might prompt people to try other flavours, more interesting ones, instead."

other more interesting flavors, instead. Why is it one of your Press Officers? I don't see the connection.

Bears Armed wrote:[option]"H’mm," muses @@RANDOMNAME@@, Second Under-Minister for Food Production. "We could switch to producing the vanilla that we want for ourselves. That might not be the most efficient allocation of workers, but it would be worth it as a step towards Autarky and better than continuing to exploit peasants in poorer countries."

Can you be communist and an autarky? If so, should that be a requirement? I don't like the explicit name drop of Autarky, anyways. If you're going to have it, though, it doesn't need to be capitalized.

Bears Armed wrote:[effect]the country is forecast to become self-sufficient in vanilla by the end of the next ten — or maybe twenty, or thirty — years

Not a bad effect line. "the Party requires farms to reach monthly quotas of vanilla", or something of the sorts, is my suggestion.

Bears Armed wrote:[option]"A perfectly good 'vanilla' flavouring can be synthesised easily and cheaply from one of the wood-pulp industry’s by-products, actually," your Science adviser @@RANDOMNAME” comments. "Sell that as @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE Vanilla’ at a good price and who’s going to care about any slight difference?"

@@RANDOMNAME@@. Why is there an apostrophe after Vanilla, unless you missed the beginning one. and,...

Bears Armed wrote:[option]Violetist grand poobah @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@ has a different idea about this matter, however: "Vanilla is sacred to Violet," she insists, “and so only we, as Her faithful, should be allowed to use it for anything… and that should be the natural material, not some synthetic substitute.”

I'd just scrap this whole option, to be honest.

Bears Armed wrote:[effect]the only legal use of vanilla is in Violetist rites

But if you're going to keep it, think of an effect that doesn't tell us what we just read. I can't think of one off the top of my head, however.

Take what you wish.

by **Bears Armed** » Sat Jun 23, 2018 8:24 am

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[issue]A drastic rise in the price of vanilla has led to a warning by the country's main ice-cream makers and some other food manufacturers that they might discontinue their vanilla-flavoured products altogether. This has caused a public outcry, and the problem has now been brought to you for solution.
I'd personaly just cut out the bolded parts. The first one makes the sentence read awkwardly, and the second one adds nothing to the issue.

Agreed on the first part, thinking about the second one.

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[option]"We don't like the idea of having to drop those lines either," explains ice-cream industry spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@, "but we couldn't produce vanilla on a worthwhile scale in this country so all of the vanilla we use is imported from Macronesia instead and problems there — tropical storms damaging the harvest, political unrest, and criminal gangs raiding the farms — have combined with rising demand to push the price up twelvefold since just a couple of years ago. That makes it simply too expensive for us to use if we are going to keep selling the ice-cream at a price many people would be willing to pay. If the government wants us to keep on producing reasonably inexpensive vanilla ice-cream, to keep people happy, then the government will have to subsidize it."
country. All... It splits it up so it's not one long sentence. Since just also reads awkwardly.

Some people do use long sentences in their speech — me, for example — so I don’t think that that one is too unreasonable, but I will think further about this point.
“since just a couple of years ago” has been changed to “in just a couple of years”: Better?

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[effect]the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ government is the region’s largest purchaser of vanilla
This just tells me what the option did. I would expect something along lines of "half of the government's budget goes to purchasing vanilla" or something of the sorts.

Although players looking at the nation’s stats would be able to see that it doesn’t? I’ll consider other possibilities.

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[option]"Subsidies!" exclaims Cherry Berry, director of gourmet gelatiers Jen And Berry’s. "You should let the market decide, instead. The mass-market producers might see sales fall a bit, but we already know that shoppers will willingly pay well for quality from firms such as ours so if people really want vanilla ice-cream then they will still buy it even at higher prices."
ours, so...then, they. I feel like this option is a bit bland. Maybe add character to the speaker, other than his funny name.

I’ve added a comma after “ours”, for now, although I think that that is a matter of taste rather than a grammatical necessity. There should not be one between “then” and “they”. Slightly less bland now?

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[effect]for most people vanilla ice-cream has become a rare treat
"grandparents tell their kids stories of a mythical white ice cream" or something funny.

Thinking about this.

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[option]"Meh," comments @@RANDOMNAME@@, one of your Press Officers. "Vanilla is so boring, anyway. This shortage is actually a blessing in disguise because it might prompt people to try other flavours, more interesting ones, instead."
other more interesting flavors, instead. Why is it one of your Press Officers? I don't see the connection.

Please remember that people’s speech patterns vary, so they don’t all use the most concise wording possible: I think that the current wording expresses the speaker’s thoughts well enough. If this offering is accepted by the editors then they can change this detail, of course, if they want to.
The speaker is a Press Officer because there has to be some reason for their presence and changing the emphasis like that from fixing the current problem to novelty felt like a rather press-officerish (or PR-expertish) sort of approach to me.

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[option]"H’mm," muses @@RANDOMNAME@@, Second Under-Minister for Food Production. "We could switch to producing the vanilla that we want for ourselves. That might not be the most efficient allocation of workers, but it would be worth it as a step towards Autarky and better than continuing to exploit peasants in poorer countries."
Can you be communist and an autarky? If so, should that be a requirement? I don't like the explicit name drop of Autarky, anyways. If you're going to have it, though, it doesn't need to be capitalized.

Why not? No, it shouldn’t be a requirement, because they haven’t necessarily reached that condition yet. I’ve changed the wording to “economic self-sufficiency”, now, anyway.

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[effect]the country is forecast to become self-sufficient in vanilla by the end of the next ten — or maybe twenty, or thirty — years

Not a bad effect line. "the Party requires farms to reach monthly quotas of vanilla", or something of the sorts, is my suggestion.

Your suggestion goes further than mine, it seems to me, in implying that the policy would actually work: I’d rather leave it as it is.

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[option]"A perfectly good 'vanilla' flavouring can be synthesised easily and cheaply from one of the wood-pulp industry’s by-products, actually," your Science adviser @@RANDOMNAME” comments. "Sell that as @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE Vanilla’ at a good price and who’s going to care about any slight difference?"
@@RANDOMNAME@@. Why is there an apostrophe after Vanilla, unless you missed the beginning one.

Oops! Both details fixed.

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[option]Violetist grand poobah @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@ has a different idea about this matter, however: "Vanilla is sacred to Violet," she insists, “and so only we, as Her faithful, should be allowed to use it for anything… and that should be the natural material, not some synthetic substitute.”
I'd just scrap this whole option, to be honest.
Bears Armed wrote:[effect]the only legal use of vanilla is in Violetist rites
But if you're going to keep it, think of an effect that doesn't tell us what we just read. I can't think of one off the top of my head, however.

I’m not 100% committed to that option’s inclusion, but I’ll leave it for now and see what the editors think. What’s your opinion of the new effect line?

by **Shwe Tu Colony** » Sun Jun 24, 2018 2:22 pm

Orange words are suggestions, orange ellipsis are removed phrases, underlined words are comments.

Code: Select all: [color=#FF6A00][/color]

Bears Armed wrote:Yes, We have no Vanilla

[issue]A dramatic rise in the price of vanilla has led to a warning by the country's main ice-cream makers that they might discontinue their vanilla-flavoured products altogether. This has caused a public outcry, and the problem has now been brought to you for a solution.
[validity]unrestricted (or say that ‘Average Income of Poor’ must be high enough for mass-market demand for these goods to exist, and for labour costs to leave domestic production of vanilla uneconomical, but not so high that the price rise isn’t really a problem?)

[option]"We don't want to drop those lines either," explains ice-cream industry spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@, "but we couldn't produce vanilla on a worthwhile scale in this country, so all of the vanilla we use is imported from Macronesia. However, problems there — tropical storms damaging the harvest, political unrest, and criminal gangs raiding the farms — in tandem with rising demand have pushed the price up twelvefold in just a couple of years. That makes it simply too expensive for us ... if we are going to keep selling the ice-cream at a reasonable price ... . If we are to continue producing ... vanilla ice-cream for the common people, then the government will have to subsidize it."
[validity]unrestricted
[effect]the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ government is the region’s largest purchaser of vanilla

[option]"Subsidies!" exclaims Cherry Berry, director of gourmet gelatiers Jen And Berry’s. "You should let the market decide, instead. The mass-market producers might see sales fall a bit, but we already know that shoppers will willingly pay well for quality from companies such as ours, so if people really want vanilla ice-cream then they will still buy it, even with these rising prices." She opens a tub of her company’s Happy Hazelnut Latte ice-cream ... and starts eating.
[validity]capitalist
[effect]... vanilla ice-cream has become a rare treat for most people

[option]"Meh," comments @@RANDOMNAME@@, one of your Press Officers. "Vanilla is so boring, anyway. Seems to me that this shortage is actually a blessing in disguise because it might prompt these lovers of boring [color=#FF6A00]vanilla taste[/color] to try other, more interesting flavours, ... instead."
[validity]capitalist
[effect]mocha-chili is the nation's new favourite flavour of ice-cream

[option]"H’mm," muses @@RANDOMNAME@@, Second Under-Minister for Food Production. "We could switch to producing some homegrown vanilla ... for ourselves. It might not be the most efficient allocation of workers, but it would be worth it as another step towards economic self-sufficiency. Plus, it's better than continuing to exploit peasants in those pitiful capitalist nations."
[validity]communist
[effect]the country is forecast to become self-sufficient in vanilla by the end of the next ten — or maybe twenty, or thirty — years

[option]"Bah!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAME@@, Minister for Ideological Certainty. "That would be a waste of workers who could be employed ... on projects of greater importance, such as improving infrastructure. Ice-cream is decadent luxury that should have no place in true Communist society. Let us ban it altogether, to prevent capitalist indulgence from corrupting our nation."
[validity]communist
[effect]the police raid black market ice-cream parlours

[option]"A perfectly good 'vanilla' flavouring can be synthesised easily and cheaply from one of the by-products of the wood-pulp industry, actually," your Science adviser @@RANDOMNAME@@ comments. "Sell that as 'DEMONYMADJECTIVE Vanilla' at a good price and who’s going to care about any slight difference?"
[validity]reasonable (“top 75%”) Scientific Advancement
[effect]foodies argue the relative merits of domestic and imported vanilla essence

[option]Violetist grand poobah (does it need to be capitalized?) @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@ has a different idea about this matter, however: "Vanilla is sacred to Violet," she insists, “and so only we, as Her faithful, should be allowed to use it for anything… and it has be only the best of the natural sort, not some inferior synthetic substitute. Such a sacrifice would only infuriate Her.”
[validity]Violetism is legal
[effect]desperate vanilla-addicts are converting to Violetism

by **Bears Armed** » Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:52 am

Sacara wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:[effect]for most people vanilla ice-cream has become a rare treat
"grandparents tell their kids stories of a mythical white ice cream" or something funny.

I might adopt your suggestion here: Definitely considering it.

Shwe Tu Colony wrote:Orange words are suggestions, orange ellipsis are removed phrases, underlined words are comments.
Code: Select all
[color=#FF6A00][/color]

Bears Armed wrote:Yes, We have no Vanilla

[issue]A dramatic rise in the price of vanilla has led to a warning by the country's main ice-cream makers that they might discontinue their vanilla-flavoured products altogether. This has caused a public outcry, and the problem has now been brought to you for a solution.
[validity]unrestricted (or say that ‘Average Income of Poor’ must be high enough for mass-market demand for these goods to exist, and for labour costs to leave domestic production of vanilla uneconomical, but not so high that the price rise isn’t really a problem?)

[option]"We don't want to drop those lines either," explains ice-cream industry spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@, "but we couldn't produce vanilla on a worthwhile scale in this country, so all of the vanilla we use is imported from Macronesia. However, problems there — tropical storms damaging the harvest, political unrest, and criminal gangs raiding the farms — in tandem with rising demand have pushed the price up twelvefold in just a couple of years. That makes it simply too expensive for us ... if we are going to keep selling the ice-cream at a reasonable price ... . If we are to continue producing ... vanilla ice-cream for the common people, then the government will have to subsidize it."
[validity]unrestricted
[effect]the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ government is the region’s largest purchaser of vanilla

[option]"Subsidies!" exclaims Cherry Berry, director of gourmet gelatiers Jen And Berry’s. "You should let the market decide, instead. The mass-market producers might see sales fall a bit, but we already know that shoppers will willingly pay well for quality from companies such as ours, so if people really want vanilla ice-cream then they will still buy it, even with these rising prices." She opens a tub of her company’s Happy Hazelnut Latte ice-cream ... and starts eating.
[validity]capitalist
[effect]... vanilla ice-cream has become a rare treat for most people

[option]"Meh," comments @@RANDOMNAME@@, one of your Press Officers. "Vanilla is so boring, anyway. Seems to me that this shortage is actually a blessing in disguise because it might prompt these lovers of boring [color=#FF6A00]vanilla taste[/color] to try other, more interesting flavours, ... instead."
[validity]capitalist
[effect]mocha-chili is the nation's new favourite flavour of ice-cream

[option]"H’mm," muses @@RANDOMNAME@@, Second Under-Minister for Food Production. "We could switch to producing some homegrown vanilla ... for ourselves. It might not be the most efficient allocation of workers, but it would be worth it as another step towards economic self-sufficiency. Plus, it's better than continuing to exploit peasants in those pitiful capitalist nations."
[validity]communist
[effect]the country is forecast to become self-sufficient in vanilla by the end of the next ten — or maybe twenty, or thirty — years

[option]"Bah!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAME@@, Minister for Ideological Certainty. "That would be a waste of workers who could be employed ... on projects of greater importance, such as improving infrastructure. Ice-cream is decadent luxury that should have no place in true Communist society. Let us ban it altogether, to prevent capitalist indulgence from corrupting our nation."
[validity]communist
[effect]the police raid black market ice-cream parlours

[option]"A perfectly good 'vanilla' flavouring can be synthesised easily and cheaply from one of the by-products of the wood-pulp industry, actually," your Science adviser @@RANDOMNAME@@ comments. "Sell that as 'DEMONYMADJECTIVE Vanilla' at a good price and who’s going to care about any slight difference?"
[validity]reasonable (“top 75%”) Scientific Advancement
[effect]foodies argue the relative merits of domestic and imported vanilla essence

[option]Violetist grand poobah (does it need to be capitalized?) @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@ has a different idea about this matter, however: "Vanilla is sacred to Violet," she insists, “and so only we, as Her faithful, should be allowed to use it for anything… and it has be only the best of the natural sort, not some inferior synthetic substitute. Such a sacrifice would only infuriate Her.”
[validity]Violetism is legal
[effect]desperate vanilla-addicts are converting to Violetism

Agreed about "dramatic" rather than "drastic" in the introduction, that's a much better choice (and I knew that I'd got something wrong in that section: Maybeso "dramatic" was what I originally intended to say...).
Thinking about some of your other suggestions.

by **Marilyn Manson Freaks** » Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:17 am

I really like this issue.

by **Bears Armed** » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:28 am

Shwe Tu Colony wrote:Orange words are suggestions, orange ellipsis are removed phrases, underlined words are comments.
Code: Select all
[color=#FF6A00][/color]

My responses are in blue.

Yes, We have no Vanilla

[issue]A dramatic (Yes) rise in the price of vanilla has led to a warning by the country's main ice-cream makers that they might discontinue their vanilla-flavoured products altogether. This has caused a public outcry, and the problem has now been brought to you for a (No) solution.
[validity]unrestricted (or say that ‘Average Income of Poor’ must be high enough for mass-market demand for these goods to exist, and for labour costs to leave domestic production of vanilla uneconomical, but not so high that the price rise isn’t really a problem?)

[option]"We don't want to drop those lines either," (Different change made, instead) explains ice-cream industry spokesperson @@RANDOMNAME@@, "but we couldn't produce vanilla on a worthwhile scale in this country, so all of the vanilla we use is imported from Macronesia. However, (Yes, to shorten sentence) problems there — tropical storms damaging the harvest, political unrest, and criminal gangs raiding the farms — in tandem (No: multiple problems => not "tandem") with rising demand have pushed (No) the price up twelvefold in just a couple of years. That makes it simply too expensive for us ... (No) if we are going to keep selling the ice-cream at a reasonable (No) price ... (No). If we are to continue (No) producing ... (No) vanilla ice-cream for the common people (No), then the government will have to subsidize it."
[validity]unrestricted
[effect]the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ government is the region’s largest purchaser of vanilla

[option]"Subsidies!" exclaims Cherry Berry, director of gourmet gelatiers Jen And Berry’s. "You should let the market decide, instead. The mass-market producers might see sales fall a bit, but we already know that shoppers will willingly pay well for quality from companies (Okay) such as ours, so if people really want vanilla ice-cream then they will still buy it, even with these rising prices (Yes)." She opens a tub of her company’s Happy Hazelnut Latte ice-cream ... (No) and starts eating.
[validity]capitalist
[effect]... vanilla ice-cream has become a rare treat for most people (Different line adopted instead)

[option]"Meh," comments @@RANDOMNAME@@, one of your Press Officers. "Vanilla is so boring, anyway. Seems to me that (Yes) this shortage is actually a blessing in disguise because it might prompt these lovers of boring [color=#FF6A00]vanilla taste[/color] (No, too repetitive) to try other, more interesting flavours, ... (No) instead."
[validity]capitalist
[effect]mocha-chili is the nation's new favourite flavour of ice-cream

[option]"H’mm," muses @@RANDOMNAME@@, Second Under-Minister for Food Production. "We could switch to producing some homegrown vanilla ... (No: He/she is too confident for such a limited suggestion… otherwise they probably wouldn’t suggest trying to grow the vanilla yourselves anyway….) for ourselves. It (No, to avoid repetition of "it" in this sentence) might not be the most efficient allocation of workers, but it would be worth it as another step towards economic self-sufficiency. Plus, it's better than continuing to exploit peasants in those pitiful capitalist nations (No. Nations with peasant farmers so lowly-paid that producing vanilla there for export is potentially worthwhile probably wouldn’t count as having reached the ‘capitalist’ stage yet under Marxist definitions.)."
[validity]communist
[effect]the country is forecast to become self-sufficient in vanilla by the end of the next ten — or maybe twenty, or thirty — years

[option]"Bah!" exclaims @@RANDOMNAME@@, Minister for Ideological Certainty. "That would be a waste of workers (Maybe: I was giving this minister a stereotyped ‘Russian’ speaking style, because of the lengthy Russia/Communism connection in RL, and IIRC Russian doesn’t use the “a” in such situations… so this line would become just “That would be waste of workers [etc]” and I think that “wasteful of” works better than “waste of”…) who could be employed ... (Probably not on projects of greater importance, such as improving infrastructure. Ice-cream is decadent luxury that should have no place in true Communist society. Let us ban it altogether, to prevent capitalist indulgence from corrupting our nation (Yes)."
[validity]communist
[effect]the police raid black market ice-cream parlours

[option]"A perfectly good 'vanilla' flavouring can be synthesised easily and cheaply from one of the by-products of the wood-pulp industry (Slightly different wording adopted instead), actually," your Science adviser @@RANDOMNAME@@ comments. "Sell that as 'DEMONYMADJECTIVE Vanilla' at a good price and who’s going to care about any slight difference?"
[validity]reasonable (“top 75%”) Scientific Advancement
[effect]foodies argue the relative merits of domestic and imported vanilla essence

[option]Violetist grand poobah (does it need to be capitalized?) (According to previous issues that use that title, yes, it does) @@RANDOMFEMALENAME@@ has a different idea about this matter, however: "Vanilla is sacred to Violet," she insists, “and so only we, as Her faithful, should be allowed to use it for anything… and it has be only the best of the natural sort, not some inferior synthetic substitute. Such a sacrifice would only infuriate Her. (Maybe, but I’m not even sure about leaving this option in the draft anyway… And if only the Violetists are allowed to use vanilla for anything anyway then — unless it’s actually being issued to them by the government, I suppose — surely they can make this decision about sourcing it for themselves without needing a government ruling on that point?)”
[validity]Violetism is legal
[effect]desperate vanilla-addicts are converting to Violetism

The fourth draft has now been posted.

by **Candlewhisper Archive** » Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:04 am

Interesting issue, I like it.

Maybe try and revisit those effect lines that don't attempt jokes, and attempt some funny with them.

by **Bears Armed** » Sat Jul 21, 2018 7:43 am

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:Interesting issue, I like it.

Thank you.

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:Maybe try and revisit those effect lines that don't attempt jokes, and attempt some funny with them.

Most of them [apart from the first] already attempt jokes... Okay, I'll see what I can do.

by **Bears Armed** » Mon Aug 06, 2018 5:27 am

Bears Armed wrote:
Candlewhisper Archive wrote:Maybe try and revisit those effect lines that don't attempt jokes, and attempt some funny with them.
Most of them [apart from the first] already attempt jokes... Okay, I'll see what I can do.

Okay, so the lines currently given are:

"the @@DEMONYMADJECTIVE@@ government is the region’s largest purchaser of vanilla" _ which I agree definitely has room for improvement.

"grandparents tell their grandchildren tales of a mythical white ice-cream" _ Okay?

"mocha-chili is the nation's new favourite flavour of ice-cream" _ Okay?

"the country is forecast to become self-sufficient in vanilla by the end of the next ten — or maybe twenty, or thirty — years" _ Okay? Or too cynical [or not obvious enough] about the national planned economy's ability to meet that target?

"the police raid black market ice-cream parlours" _ Okay? maybe there's room for improvement, but it seems no worse than some effect lines for options in existing issues...

"foodies argue the relative merits of domestic and imported vanilla essence" _ Okay? I Like it, anyway...

"desperate vanilla-addicts are converting to Violetism" _ Room for improvement?

by **Candlewhisper Archive** » Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:08 am

Don't sweat it too much if you can't come up with anything. It's a good issue for sure, and we can always teamthink some lines backstage if it comes to it.

by **Bears Armed** » Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:37 am

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:Don't sweat it too much if you can't come up with anything. It's a good issue for sure, and we can always teamthink some lines backstage if it comes to it.

Okay, thank you. I'll just give this another week, or thereabouts, before submitting it.

by **Bears Armed** » Wed Aug 08, 2018 8:10 am

Okay, inviting suggestions for better effect lines...

EDIT: In the effect line for the first option, I have just changed "the region's" to "@@REGION@@’s"... Not funnier, but probably better.

[SUBMITTED] Yes, We Have No Vanilla

[SUBMITTED] Yes, We Have No Vanilla

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