Atheism Discussion Thread

[The New California Republic]

Nope. Never said that or implied it. If you think that I implied it, then you are grossly misinterpreting what I am saying.

You are easy to misunderstand, bröther beär.

I think it is more likely that you mistakenly read something into what I said that clearly wasn't there.

[Pope Joan]

How much "God" is too much, as far as atheism is concerned?

Buddhists do not worship a deity, and their practice is founded upon skepticism. Yet they "look like a duck, quack like a duck, swim like a duck", which is to say that they SEEM a lot like theistic religions in their behavior and ritual.

Paul Tillich talked about a "Ground of Being", which appeals to me intellectually. This is hardly a personal god, not some white bearded figure on a giant throne in the sky; would that be acceptable?

As a nonreligious person I actually quite like Buddhism.

Yes, it is a thoughtful and self-critical discipline

[Annihitor the Incred]

You are easy to misunderstand, bröther beär.

I think it is more likely that you mistakenly read something into what I said that clearly wasn't there.

Yeah, that's what I wrote. You're easy to misunderstand.

[Equality of Nations]

For me it makes sense when i think about the space-time as a god, and therefore by us living in that plane of existence, we contain a tiny piece of that god wherever we go, which in turn makes us tiny pieces of that larger puzzle. This explains why god hasn't showed up to punish sinners at all. It doesn't work that way.

If god was created, that means it's creator had been created as well and this chain of creation would be endless. But if it always existed and will forever exist (space-time) it makes more sense. I imagine it like a giant web of subatomic particles. 6th sense can be explained by this as well. (the urge to want to be somewhere and in fact, finding the person you wanted to speak to there. Happened to me many times as i was a kid.)

[Arkhall]

Omnibenevolent - infinitely good

The Bible suggests God:
. condones rape
. encourages racism
. is blatantly homophobic (even though God would know homosexuality IS NOT a choice)
. calls for killing of innocent people
. has serious anger management issues and commits genocides (if God is evil, that makes a lot of sense given what I do in sandbox video games)

How do we know those things are bad, though?
Checkmate, liberals.

May I point you to Bo Burnham?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxc20saM8DA

[Human Sacred Theocracy]

What is your definition of omnibenevolent, and please pick out a verse.

Omnibenevolent - infinitely good

The Bible suggests God:
. condones rape
. encourages racism
. is blatantly homophobic (even though God would know homosexuality IS NOT a choice)
. calls for killing of innocent people
. has serious anger management issues and commits genocides (if God is evil, that makes a lot of sense given what I do in sandbox video games)

1."But if in the open country a man meets a young woman who is betrothed, and the man seizes her and lies with her, then only the man who lay with her shall die. But you shall do nothing to the young woman; she has committed no offense punishable by death. For this case is like that of a man attacking and murdering his neighbor, because he met her in the open country, and though the betrothed young woman cried for help there was no one to rescue her."

Doesn't sound like "condoning" rape for me.

"If a man meets a virgin who is not betrothed, and seizes her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man who lay with her shall give to the father of the young woman fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he has violated her. He may not divorce her all his days."

This passage should be, as with similar passages of ancient Israelites' law, seen through the lens of a barbaric ancient culture. I believe that God gave them these rather primitive laws to accustom them to order and steer them onto the path of a more humane civilisation.

2. I cannot find any verses stating that humans are not all of equal worth. Quite the contrary.

"When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God."

"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus."

3. Homosexuality is a sin.

"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them."

As for your claim that it is not a choice - I have to disagree. We have all been granted free will, we are not simply machines abiding by programming. Even genes do not control our behavior, merely influence it.

4. I fail to see when does God allegedly "call for killing of innocent people". He has, however, sentenced sinners to death, yes.

5. A spiritual being is above carnal, human urges. Likening God to humans in the Bible is probably an attempt at understanding the infinite Creator. As for the 'genocides'... well, see the above. Civilisations like the Canaanites were worshipping horrible deities, such as Moloch who required child sacrifice. Obviously, such actions are against God's law.

"Have you not known? Have you not heard? The Lord is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth. He does not faint or grow weary; his understanding is unsearchable."

"God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”"

And finally, is God truly "omnibenevolent"? Of that I am not sure. Certainly He is benevolent, and the above arguments suggest He may be omnibenevolent. Obviously the early methods He used with humans are questionable, but let us not forget that God is also just. Perhaps this justice disqualifies the notion of omnibenevolence? Or perhaps it is a part of it? Nevertheless, here is a verse worth contemplating:

"I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the LORD, who does all these things."

Still, it can simply refer to God bringing calamity upon those who disobey Him.

And I'm done. Chances are I shall not post here anymore, for "Bad company ruins good morals."

[Reikoku]

Are animism and atheism compatible?

[Eol Sha]

How do we know those things are bad, though?
Checkmate, liberals.

May I point you to Bo Burnham?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zxc20saM8DA

This was entertaining.

Are animism and atheism compatible?

I don't tend to think so, but I suppose it really doesn't matter.

[Arkhall]

As for your claim that it is not a choice - I have to disagree. We have all been granted free will, we are not simply machines abiding by programming. Even genes do not control our behavior, merely influence it.

If god knows all, then he must know the future. Thus, if he knows the future, then he knows precisely if someone is going to heaven or hell. If someone knows the outcome, and the outcome will never change, then there is no such thing as free will.

[Pilarcraft]

Finally, we have a discussion thread for Atheism... A question. Are Secular Humanists religious people who believe in separation of the Church and State for the sake of humanity, or are they atheist?

[Eol Sha]

Finally, we have a discussion thread for Atheism... A question. Are Secular Humanists religious people who believe in separation of the Church and State for the sake of humanity, or are they atheist?

I don't know if every secular humanist is an atheist, but I don't think secular humanists are religious. For what its worth, secular humanism is filed under "Irreligion" on Wikipedia.

[The Liberated Territories]

I used to be a theist but then I took a depressive existential crisis to the brain

what's up

[The New California Republic]

As for your claim that it (Homosexuality) is not a choice - I have to disagree. We have all been granted free will, we are not simply machines abiding by programming. Even genes do not control our behavior, merely influence it.

So, by that logic, you chose to be straight then? If homosexuality is a choice, then you chose to be straight? When did you choose to be straight? When did you make that choice? Can you remember? No?

Well then...

[New Neruda]

As for your claim that it is not a choice - I have to disagree. We have all been granted free will, we are not simply machines abiding by programming. Even genes do not control our behavior, merely influence it.

If that's true then could genes not "influence" someone to be homosexual?

[New Neruda]

And I'm done. Chances are I shall not post here anymore, for "Bad company ruins good morals."

Then why would you come here in the first place? Only to make two posts and then leave?

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

Finally, we have a discussion thread for Atheism... A question. Are Secular Humanists religious people who believe in separation of the Church and State for the sake of humanity, or are they atheist?

They could be both, but they're atheists more often than not.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

Omnibenevolent - infinitely good

The Bible suggests God:
. condones rape
. encourages racism
. is blatantly homophobic (even though God would know homosexuality IS NOT a choice)
. calls for killing of innocent people
. has serious anger management issues and commits genocides (if God is evil, that makes a lot of sense given what I do in sandbox video games)

1."But if in the open country a man meets a young woman who is betrothed, and the man seizes her and lies with her, then only the man who lay with her shall die. But you shall do nothing to the young woman; she has committed no offense punishable by death. For this case is like that of a man attacking and murdering his neighbor, because he met her in the open country, and though the betrothed young woman cried for help there was no one to rescue her."

Doesn't sound like "condoning" rape for me.

"If a man meets a virgin who is not betrothed, and seizes her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man who lay with her shall give to the father of the young woman fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he has violated her. He may not divorce her all his days."

This passage should be, as with similar passages of ancient Israelites' law, seen through the lens of a barbaric ancient culture. I believe that God gave them these rather primitive laws to accustom them to order and steer them onto the path of a more humane civilisation.

2. I cannot find any verses stating that humans are not all of equal worth. Quite the contrary.

"When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God."

"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus."

3. Homosexuality is a sin.

"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them."

As for your claim that it is not a choice - I have to disagree. We have all been granted free will, we are not simply machines abiding by programming. Even genes do not control our behavior, merely influence it.

4. I fail to see when does God allegedly "call for killing of innocent people". He has, however, sentenced sinners to death, yes.

5. A spiritual being is above carnal, human urges. Likening God to humans in the Bible is probably an attempt at understanding the infinite Creator. As for the 'genocides'... well, see the above. Civilisations like the Canaanites were worshipping horrible deities, such as Moloch who required child sacrifice. Obviously, such actions are against God's law.

"Have you not known? Have you not heard? The Lord is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth. He does not faint or grow weary; his understanding is unsearchable."

"God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”"

And finally, is God truly "omnibenevolent"? Of that I am not sure. Certainly He is benevolent, and the above arguments suggest He may be omnibenevolent. Obviously the early methods He used with humans are questionable, but let us not forget that God is also just. Perhaps this justice disqualifies the notion of omnibenevolence? Or perhaps it is a part of it? Nevertheless, here is a verse worth contemplating:

"I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the LORD, who does all these things."

Still, it can simply refer to God bringing calamity upon those who disobey Him.

And I'm done. Chances are I shall not post here anymore, for "Bad company ruins good morals."

Homosexuality is not a sin, and God kills loads of innocent people in the bible. Just look at Numbers 16.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

I used to be a theist but then I took a depressive existential crisis to the brain

what's up

Not sure what a "depressive existential crisis" is.

[Constitutional Technocracy of Minecraft]

Omnibenevolent - infinitely good

The Bible suggests God:
. condones rape
. encourages racism
. is blatantly homophobic (even though God would know homosexuality IS NOT a choice)
. calls for killing of innocent people
. has serious anger management issues and commits genocides (if God is evil, that makes a lot of sense given what I do in sandbox video games)

1."But if in the open country a man meets a young woman who is betrothed, and the man seizes her and lies with her, then only the man who lay with her shall die. But you shall do nothing to the young woman; she has committed no offense punishable by death. For this case is like that of a man attacking and murdering his neighbor, because he met her in the open country, and though the betrothed young woman cried for help there was no one to rescue her."

Doesn't sound like "condoning" rape for me.

"If a man meets a virgin who is not betrothed, and seizes her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man who lay with her shall give to the father of the young woman fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he has violated her. He may not divorce her all his days."

This passage should be, as with similar passages of ancient Israelites' law, seen through the lens of a barbaric ancient culture. I believe that God gave them these rather primitive laws to accustom them to order and steer them onto the path of a more humane civilisation.

You missed the verse before that, which suggests the VICTIM should be killed as well. The second verse also condones forced marriage.

Secular feminist movements have done far more for women's rights than the Bible.

2. I cannot find any verses stating that humans are not all of equal worth. Quite the contrary.

"When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God."

"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus."

What about the verses where he says that non-Israelites can be slaves, while Israelites can't?

Also, some of the verses in the Bible are complete discrepancies. The above Bible verse contradicts a verse in Corinthians requiring women to be silent in church. Requiring men and women to have different roles, without any basis on biology (there is nothing in a priest's duties which requires having a dick), is plain sexist.

3. Homosexuality is a sin.

"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them."

As for your claim that it is not a choice - I have to disagree. We have all been granted free will, we are not simply machines abiding by programming. Even genes do not control our behavior, merely influence it.

Oh my fucking lord, that's been scientifically debunked. Homosexuality is a complex genetic trait. Also, the relevant verses were composed in ancient Jerusalem and their injunctions against homosexuality were most likely down to the biases of some rabbis. Historians have proven the Bible is not "God-breathed".

And why would a good God care where people put their dicks provided everyone's a consenting adult?

4. I fail to see when does God allegedly "call for killing of innocent people". He has, however, sentenced sinners to death, yes.

Like where God calls Jewish armies to kill civilians?

5. A spiritual being is above carnal, human urges. Likening God to humans in the Bible is probably an attempt at understanding the infinite Creator. As for the 'genocides'... well, see the above. Civilisations like the Canaanites were worshipping horrible deities, such as Moloch who required child sacrifice. Obviously, such actions are against God's law.

"Have you not known? Have you not heard? The Lord is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth. He does not faint or grow weary; his understanding is unsearchable."

"God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”"

And finally, is God truly "omnibenevolent"? Of that I am not sure. Certainly He is benevolent, and the above arguments suggest He may be omnibenevolent. Obviously the early methods He used with humans are questionable, but let us not forget that God is also just. Perhaps this justice disqualifies the notion of omnibenevolence? Or perhaps it is a part of it? Nevertheless, here is a verse worth contemplating:

"I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the LORD, who does all these things."

Still, it can simply refer to God bringing calamity upon those who disobey Him.

And I'm done. Chances are I shall not post here anymore, for "Bad company ruins good morals."

1. God conjures up a shitton of water and floods the whole of Earth, killing trillions of innocent animals, just because some humans pissed him off. And how did the biosphere return to normal like it's Tuesday?
2. God sentences people to infinite time burning in hell for finite crimes. The Ministry of Love in 1984 was less brutal. Couldn't he just make sinners burn until they truly repent?
3. Even if he exists and is impossible to fully understand, for the sake of argument, we could figure out some things about him. Like, at the very least, he isn't Harambe. Similarly, we can figure out that he sets some double standards in the Bible which invalidate his benevolence and justice.

[Albrenia]

And I'm done. Chances are I shall not post here anymore, for "Bad company ruins good morals."

Don't worry, we won't let you harm our morals, you are quite welcome to stay and post.

Anyway, it's clear that 'God' is neither omnibenevolent, omnipresent nor omnipotent. Or if he is, he is uncaring or ineffectual enough that it doesn't actually matter.

[New Emeline]

And I'm done. Chances are I shall not post here anymore, for "Bad company ruins good morals."

Don't worry, we won't let you harm our morals, you are quite welcome to stay and post.

[New Emeline]

I didn't know we even had an atheism thread...

[Albrenia]

1. God conjures up a shitton of water and floods the whole of Earth, killing trillions of innocent animals, just because some humans pissed him off. And how did the biosphere return to normal like it's Tuesday?
2. God sentences people to infinite time burning in hell for finite crimes. The Ministry of Love in 1984 was less brutal. Couldn't he just make sinners burn until they truly repent?
3. Even if he exists and is impossible to fully understand, for the sake of argument, we could figure out some things about him. Like, at the very least, he isn't Harambe. Similarly, we can figure out that he sets some double standards in the Bible which invalidate his benevolence and justice.

Like I said earlier (I think in a different thread) God is Richard Nixon. An act, no matter how vile, is not evil if God does it. Any act, no matter how pure, is 'evil' if God doesn't like it.

The whole concept of 'Hell' is a tool of control. It is unimaginably harsh because that's the scariest thing to threaten the laypeople with if they start getting ideas about why the church has so much power and wealth. No human has ever, or ever could, 'deserve' Hell and no being capable of love would ever subject any human to it.

[Constitutional Technocracy of Minecraft]

1. God conjures up a shitton of water and floods the whole of Earth, killing trillions of innocent animals, just because some humans pissed him off. And how did the biosphere return to normal like it's Tuesday?
2. God sentences people to infinite time burning in hell for finite crimes. The Ministry of Love in 1984 was less brutal. Couldn't he just make sinners burn until they truly repent?
3. Even if he exists and is impossible to fully understand, for the sake of argument, we could figure out some things about him. Like, at the very least, he isn't Harambe. Similarly, we can figure out that he sets some double standards in the Bible which invalidate his benevolence and justice.

Like I said earlier (I think in a different thread) God is Richard Nixon. An act, no matter how vile, is not evil if God does it. Any act, no matter how pure, is 'evil' if God doesn't like it.

The whole concept of 'Hell' is a tool of control. It is unimaginably harsh because that's the scariest thing to threaten the laypeople with if they start getting ideas about why the church has so much power and wealth. No human has ever, or ever could, 'deserve' Hell and no being capable of love would ever subject any human to it.

If you haven't figured out, I'm an atheist

[Albrenia]

Like I said earlier (I think in a different thread) God is Richard Nixon. An act, no matter how vile, is not evil if God does it. Any act, no matter how pure, is 'evil' if God doesn't like it.

The whole concept of 'Hell' is a tool of control. It is unimaginably harsh because that's the scariest thing to threaten the laypeople with if they start getting ideas about why the church has so much power and wealth. No human has ever, or ever could, 'deserve' Hell and no being capable of love would ever subject any human to it.

If you haven't figured out, I'm an atheist

I know, just giving my opinion on your questions.