1870 : Alternative Divergence [AH][OOC][REBOOT]

[Sanabel]

That's bogus diplomacy, so I hope you're not serious, though I doubt India or Yemen are big trading partners with Ruthenia anyway.

Do you have any presence in the Indian Ocean, even a minor one? We have trading fleets that work outside of the Indian Ocean, but it isn't as major as our operations there.

I want trade with all the peoples

We have a presence in the Mediterranean, but that's about as far south as things go.

[Seinlo]

Do you have any presence in the Indian Ocean, even a minor one? We have trading fleets that work outside of the Indian Ocean, but it isn't as major as our operations there.

I want trade with all the peoples

We have a presence in the Mediterranean, but that's about as far south as things go.

Oh. So, goods that are traded through us probably reach you. Doesn't mean I have any influence over them, or that they are in large amounts, though.

[Intermountain States]

Berserkers weren't really a thing as some elite crazed fighters. They're more like medieval champions or gladiators in Scandinavia used by lords to settle legal issues with duels.

[Sanabel]

We have a presence in the Mediterranean, but that's about as far south as things go.

Oh. So, goods that are traded through us probably reach you. Doesn't mean I have any influence over them, or that they are in large amounts, though.

I cant think of any Omani goods that would be consumed in large amounts anyway. More likely you'd buy our heavy industrial goods like steel and locomotive parts.

[Seinlo]

Oh. So, goods that are traded through us probably reach you. Doesn't mean I have any influence over them, or that they are in large amounts, though.

I cant think of any Omani goods that would be consumed in large amounts anyway. More likely you'd buy our heavy industrial goods like steel and locomotive parts.

Yemen* Oman is controlled by Yemen. We have lots of goods... oh, large amounts. Yeah. We do need a major supplier of locomotive parts because of our railways. Is it conceivable that we contracted you to build our railways, and that you may have a construction firm operating in my nation? I think that we have steel, though.

[Danceria]

Oh.

Well...there goes my glorious vision of the 17th century being nothing but Beserkers vs Azteks to the soundtrack of epic pirate music, turning the Caribbean Sea and the Gulf of Mexico red with each others blood.

Needless to say, you're still pagan, and worse still, a powerful pagan who no doubt still sacrifices good Christians to their vile gods in secret.

Who needs the canal when you have the Suez, Argentina, and influence in the Cape of Good Hope?

These Azteks are much more subtle than that, your Berserkers would be dead before they even knew they were under attack while I was already onto the next objective, as for foreign policy I have a clear set of allies and objectives, and very much confident in my own abilities and the excellent defense the distance equation of the Atlantic offers...

Suez? you mean the canal operated by one of my good and close allies? I do wonder indeed

*Grinds teeth in Scandinavian frustration*

In all seriousness, I thought my folks puttered around the New World being explorers an' sheeit, then you came along with your mass produced human sacrifices.

Then we spent the age of piracy *Orthodox Equivalent of "For the Glory of Odin"/Deus Vult!*-ing and *Aztek version of Deus Vult*-ing at each other, turning the sea a slight shade of red, until now we just glare at each other, do occasional espionage, and mutter and wring our hands at each other.

[Sanabel]

I cant think of any Omani goods that would be consumed in large amounts anyway. More likely you'd buy our heavy industrial goods like steel and locomotive parts.

Yemen* Oman is controlled by Yemen. We have lots of goods... oh, large amounts. Yeah. We do need a major supplier of locomotive parts because of our railways. Is it conceivable that we contracted you to build our railways, and that you may have a construction firm operating in my nation? I think that we have steel, though.

What kind of goods?

Yeah, you could've contracted us to build your railways. It's unlikely you are a steel producer, you don't have the proper climate, resources, or topography to produce steel in 1870.

[Seinlo]

I have lots of mineral wealth. Just... not lots of coal. Okay, so, yeah, we'll be purchasing steal from you.

I'm glad with all of these minerals, though, especially gold. I need to figure out what I want my currency to be like, though. Perhaps a multi-currency system where gold and silver are minted, silver less valuable, with a backed fiat currency that is less valuable, to avoid that one thing that makes a more valuable currency marked with the same number as a less valuable currency inevitably disappear (forgot the name).

[Elerian]

That's bogus diplomacy, so I hope you're not serious, though I doubt India or Yemen are big trading partners with Ruthenia anyway.

We Kebabs do love our parties after all

[Sanabel]

I have lots of mineral wealth. Just... not lots of coal. Okay, so, yeah, we'll be purchasing steal from you.

I'm glad with all of these minerals, though, especially gold. I need to figure out what I want my currency to be like, though. Perhaps a multi-currency system where gold and silver are minted, silver less valuable, with a backed fiat currency that is less valuable, to avoid that one thing that makes a more valuable currency marked with the same number as a less valuable currency inevitably disappear (forgot the name).

History has shown that using multiple currencies just creates problems in the long term.

I myself plan on having political strife over the use of gold vs bimetallism vs paper.

That's bogus diplomacy, so I hope you're not serious, though I doubt India or Yemen are big trading partners with Ruthenia anyway.

We Kebabs do love our parties after all

But this one is for Latin peoples, sorry.

[Novacom]

These Azteks are much more subtle than that, your Berserkers would be dead before they even knew they were under attack while I was already onto the next objective, as for foreign policy I have a clear set of allies and objectives, and very much confident in my own abilities and the excellent defense the distance equation of the Atlantic offers...

Suez? you mean the canal operated by one of my good and close allies? I do wonder indeed

*Grinds teeth in Scandinavian frustration*

In all seriousness, I thought my folks puttered around the New World being explorers an' sheeit, then you came along with your mass produced human sacrifices.

Then we spent the age of piracy *Orthodox Equivalent of "For the Glory of Odin"/Deus Vult!*-ing and *Aztek version of Deus Vult*-ing at each other, turning the sea a slight shade of red, until now we just glare at each other, do occasional espionage, and mutter and wring our hands at each other.

Now I could have allowed you to persist with that delusion but I thought I'm a nice guy and all, but no, the Aztek's are a leading power in the Americas (with good relations with several other great powers) with a very healthy economy actively working on the Panama Canal with a fairly healthy military with a reformed "religion" which is gradually fading away as was always intended especially with the whole Socialist/Syndicalist school of thought that holds sway.

[Seinlo]

Yemen* Oman is controlled by Yemen. We have lots of goods... oh, large amounts. Yeah. We do need a major supplier of locomotive parts because of our railways. Is it conceivable that we contracted you to build our railways, and that you may have a construction firm operating in my nation? I think that we have steel, though.

What kind of goods?

Yeah, you could've contracted us to build your railways. It's unlikely you are a steel producer, you don't have the proper climate, resources, or topography to produce steel in 1870.

We manufacture high-quality military equipment (including small weapons, field artillery (which includes mortars), rocket artillery, shell guns, and lots of other things), produce a food surplus that allows export for our agricultural products, textile products that we are proud of, mineral products (gold, salt, clay, marble, iron, tin, aluminum, et cetera), and some other stuff.

When we discover oil, we will have very large amounts, though it will take time to discover oil everywhere in the Empire.

[Elerian]

*Grinds teeth in Scandinavian frustration*

In all seriousness, I thought my folks puttered around the New World being explorers an' sheeit, then you came along with your mass produced human sacrifices.

Then we spent the age of piracy *Orthodox Equivalent of "For the Glory of Odin"/Deus Vult!*-ing and *Aztek version of Deus Vult*-ing at each other, turning the sea a slight shade of red, until now we just glare at each other, do occasional espionage, and mutter and wring our hands at each other.

Now I could have allowed you to persist with that delusion but I thought I'm a nice guy and all, but no, the Aztek's are a leading power in the Americas (with good relations with several other great powers) with a very healthy economy actively working on the Panama Canal with a fairly healthy military with a reformed "religion" which is gradually fading away as was always intended especially with the whole Socialist/Syndicalist school of thought that holds sway.

It seems like everyone is starting to have their nations heading towards socialism or communism now.

[Seinlo]

I have lots of mineral wealth. Just... not lots of coal. Okay, so, yeah, we'll be purchasing steal from you.

I'm glad with all of these minerals, though, especially gold. I need to figure out what I want my currency to be like, though. Perhaps a multi-currency system where gold and silver are minted, silver less valuable, with a backed fiat currency that is less valuable, to avoid that one thing that makes a more valuable currency marked with the same number as a less valuable currency inevitably disappear (forgot the name).

History has shown that using multiple currencies just creates problems in the long term.

I myself plan on having political strife over the use of gold vs bimetallism vs paper.

We Kebabs do love our parties after all

But this one is for Latin peoples, sorry.

Oh. What do you suggest for a highly developed economy, then? Perhaps gold is accepted as currency, but has more of a place as a trade currency or an investment, while backed fiat currency is the currency used by the nation?

[Seinlo]

Now I could have allowed you to persist with that delusion but I thought I'm a nice guy and all, but no, the Aztek's are a leading power in the Americas (with good relations with several other great powers) with a very healthy economy actively working on the Panama Canal with a fairly healthy military with a reformed "religion" which is gradually fading away as was always intended especially with the whole Socialist/Syndicalist school of thought that holds sway.

It seems like everyone is starting to have their nations heading towards socialism or communism now.

Islam supports capitalism in Cold War confirmed; is major driving force.

[Novacom]

Now I could have allowed you to persist with that delusion but I thought I'm a nice guy and all, but no, the Aztek's are a leading power in the Americas (with good relations with several other great powers) with a very healthy economy actively working on the Panama Canal with a fairly healthy military with a reformed "religion" which is gradually fading away as was always intended especially with the whole Socialist/Syndicalist school of thought that holds sway.

It seems like everyone is starting to have their nations heading towards socialism or communism now.

Do remember I was Syndicalist in the old thread too...

[Sanabel]

Now I could have allowed you to persist with that delusion but I thought I'm a nice guy and all, but no, the Aztek's are a leading power in the Americas (with good relations with several other great powers) with a very healthy economy actively working on the Panama Canal with a fairly healthy military with a reformed "religion" which is gradually fading away as was always intended especially with the whole Socialist/Syndicalist school of thought that holds sway.

It seems like everyone is starting to have their nations heading towards socialism or communism now.

Ruthenia will never go red!

History has shown that using multiple currencies just creates problems in the long term.

I myself plan on having political strife over the use of gold vs bimetallism vs paper.

But this one is for Latin peoples, sorry.

Oh. What do you suggest for a highly developed economy, then? Perhaps gold is accepted as currency, but has more of a place as a trade currency or an investment, while backed fiat currency is the currency used by the nation?

That's sort of what Cuba does today. It's a mess.

Really, the kind of currency you use has tradeoffs. Gold benefits the rich, and stops inflation, bimetallism and paper allow for more money to be in circulation but at a lower value.

[Intermountain States]

Now I could have allowed you to persist with that delusion but I thought I'm a nice guy and all, but no, the Aztek's are a leading power in the Americas (with good relations with several other great powers) with a very healthy economy actively working on the Panama Canal with a fairly healthy military with a reformed "religion" which is gradually fading away as was always intended especially with the whole Socialist/Syndicalist school of thought that holds sway.

It seems like everyone is starting to have their nations heading towards socialism or communism now.

Columbia is better dead than red.

[Seinlo]

It seems like everyone is starting to have their nations heading towards socialism or communism now.

Ruthenia will never go red!

Oh. What do you suggest for a highly developed economy, then? Perhaps gold is accepted as currency, but has more of a place as a trade currency or an investment, while backed fiat currency is the currency used by the nation?

That's sort of what Cuba does today. It's a mess.

Really, the kind of currency you use has tradeoffs. Gold benefits the rich, and stops inflation, bimetallism and paper allow for more money to be in circulation but at a lower value.

Oh, okay. I think I might go with gold, then, but I wanted something that allowed for a reasonable and decent trade and normal currency. *Sighs.* Is this a good choice? I dunno :/

[Seinlo]

I just realized that Madagascar has coal. I'm not sure if it's enough for my uses, though, so I'll still be importing steal. Even if it was, I would still import steel, because more trade is good.

[Sanabel]

Ruthenia will never go red!

That's sort of what Cuba does today. It's a mess.

Really, the kind of currency you use has tradeoffs. Gold benefits the rich, and stops inflation, bimetallism and paper allow for more money to be in circulation but at a lower value.

Oh, okay. I think I might go with gold, then, but I wanted something that allowed for a reasonable and decent trade and normal currency. *Sighs.* Is this a good choice? I dunno :/

In the 1870s, gold would be a fine choice.

I just realized that Madagascar has coal. I'm not sure if it's enough for my uses, though, so I'll still be importing steal. Even if it was, I would still import steel, because more trade is good.

Coal wasn't mined there till the mid 20th century for a reason.

[Seinlo]

Oh, okay. I think I might go with gold, then, but I wanted something that allowed for a reasonable and decent trade and normal currency. *Sighs.* Is this a good choice? I dunno :/

In the 1870s, gold would be a fine choice.

I just realized that Madagascar has coal. I'm not sure if it's enough for my uses, though, so I'll still be importing steal. Even if it was, I would still import steel, because more trade is good.

Coal wasn't mined there till the mid 20th century for a reason.

Yeah, and I don't think I have enough of Tanzania to get ample coal from there.

Thanks for the help. I wonder if I'll ever move away from gold as a currency.

I need a European or Oriental power to help me industrialize, which means making contracts for regularly scheduled shipments of various industrial materials and minerals. Who to pick. Hmm.

[Sanabel]

In the 1870s, gold would be a fine choice.

Coal wasn't mined there till the mid 20th century for a reason.

Yeah, and I don't think I have enough of Tanzania to get ample coal from there.

Thanks for the help. I wonder if I'll ever move away from gold as a currency.

I need a European or Oriental power to help me industrialize, which means making contracts for regularly scheduled shipments of various industrial materials and minerals. Who to pick. Hmm.

Your climate and topography is really really bad for industrialization. Textiles, crafts, resource processing, etc would probably be your best bet, but becoming a manufacturer of heavy industrial goods is unlikely.

[Seinlo]

Yeah, and I don't think I have enough of Tanzania to get ample coal from there.

Thanks for the help. I wonder if I'll ever move away from gold as a currency.

I need a European or Oriental power to help me industrialize, which means making contracts for regularly scheduled shipments of various industrial materials and minerals. Who to pick. Hmm.

Your climate and topography is really really bad for industrialization. Textiles, crafts, resource processing, etc would probably be your best bet, but becoming a manufacturer of heavy industrial goods is unlikely.

You're probably, right, but I wanted industrial machinery for things like textiles, crafts, and resource processing. I mean, I suppose I have those already, since I could just purchase them. *Shrugs.* I also have nice cities, already, and don't need to ruin them with smoke-puffing factories. I suppose it's best to stay my on my current route for those things, instead of trying to industrialize.

[Rygondria]

What would a good population be for this Netherlands,Northern Belgium, Mozambique, Singapore, and the Malay Penninusla