Your Nation's Air Force Mark III: Best Korea Edition

[The Akasha Colony]

It's that time again folks! Post your Nation's Air Force here. Planes, helicopters, gyrodynes and autogyros are all welcome. Be they strategic bomber or tiny trainer post it here. Naval aviation is fine too. So are missiles. Anything and everything that flies through the air and isn't a mech. Mechs go in the Mech thread.

In addition to the ban on mecha, posts like "Our whole Air Force is Classified" are not acceptable answers. Ignoring all of the various reasons why that's pretty much impossible in the modern world, this thread is to show off what you have, and possibly even seek insight on how to make what you have better.

Please note that by posting in here you open yourself up to any and all constructive criticism people here have to offer. (Really we're only trying to help) That said you should avoid going out of your way to criticize posts that aren't even trying making an attempt at realism, and don't want help to have a realistic air force is also frowned upon.

Mark I is found here.
Mark II is found here.

Other Useful threads:
Realism Consultation Thread
Infantry Discussion Thread
Ground Vehicle Discussion Thread
Your Nation's Warships


Some helpful reads:

For those of you who want to maybe dip your foot into designing a fighter or other aircraft, The NS Draftroom's Guide to building a Fighter is a great place to start.

Fighter aircraft combat range calculator is now available.

https://www.mediafire.com/?yakbbbnb018gb2b

It has two modules which do exactly same thing, 1st module however do calculation for only ONE aircraft. The 2nd Module does multiple planes which you can see by yourself.

What Aircraft Should I use? Or why F-22s, B-52s, and A-10s alone are not a legitimate Air Force.
To be added


The failures of FSW: Why the Forward Swept Wing isn't as Cool as you think.

The Forward Swept Wing (FSW) is a common element that comes up often in NS fighter design. It offers a major increase in maneuverability, and it can look pretty bad ass. But its advantages end there. Both the United States, and Russia built tech demonstrators using FSWs. (The Grumman X-29 and Sukhoi Su-47 respectively.) Both are neat looking aircraft, but if you look at both companies, and fast forwards to today, both projects ended in dead ends without any major follow ups. The reasons for this are simple, the engineers at both companies realized that the pros don't outweigh the cons. What exactly are the cons? For starters the FSW has severe stability issues at high speeds. While such instability can be somewhat compensated for with modern flight Fly-by-wire technology, there is no way of overcoming the other flaws. Namely increased stress on the wings which leads to increased wear on the airframe, and thus a short life for the aircraft. This leads to the next major drawback, the need for a stronger wing, a stronger wing means more mass, and more mass in the wing means less payload you can carry.

to be continued

Also don't even think about Forward Swept Swing Wings. They're literally impossible due to the way the cross section of the wing changes between the different swing modes and the heavy and complex equipment you'd need to move the wings.

Why the A-10 is not the answer to modern Air Support:
Insert guide here
Until that guide is in place, a handy debate on the subject that points out its flaws may be foundhere In the previous thread.

Now from somethings that aren't as good as you think, to something that isn't as bad as you think.
Why the F-35 isn't as Shit as you think it is:
inset guide here



NOTE: Borrowing Corp's OP for now since it's quite good. Will make a proper new OP and banner in a few days when I get back from traveling. Updated links to point to current incarnation of the other military threads.

[New Antonalia]

Well in all fairness, the A-10 Warthog is still a spectacular weapons system, and A-10 pilots love flying it. All that needs to happen is to modernize it. AND NO THE F-35 IS NOT THE ANSWER! THAT PLANE IS A POS!

[Free Asian Ports]

Well in all fairness, the A-10 Warthog is still a spectacular weapons system, and A-10 pilots love flying it. All that needs to happen is to modernize it. AND NO THE F-35 IS NOT THE ANSWER! THAT PLANE IS A POS!

That doesn't sound like a good starting argument.

[Mynockia]

Well in all fairness, the A-10 Warthog is still a spectacular weapons system, and A-10 pilots love flying it. All that needs to happen is to modernize it. AND NO THE F-35 IS NOT THE ANSWER! THAT PLANE IS A POS!

That doesn't sound like a good starting argument.

I have my Orville Redenbacher's on standby if you guys want some.

[Crookfur]

Well in all fairness, the A-10 Warthog is still a spectacular weapons system, and A-10 pilots love flying it. All that needs to happen is to modernize it. AND NO THE F-35 IS NOT THE ANSWER! THAT PLANE IS A POS!

Yes the a-10 has been great for the conflicts the US has been involved in for the past quarter of a century. Saddly it won't be great in a more serious conflict with a more capable adversary in the future.

[New Antonalia]

That doesn't sound like a good starting argument.

I have my Orville Redenbacher's on standby if you guys want some.

Sure, artificial butter flavor?

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Well in all fairness, the A-10 Warthog is still a spectacular weapons system, and A-10 pilots love flying it. All that needs to happen is to modernize it. AND NO THE F-35 IS NOT THE ANSWER! THAT PLANE IS A POS!

Just like any heavy shore battery was superior to ships mounting the very same guns in the nineteenth century, the SPAAG with the ability to direct 30 mm fire under radar control in addition to its short-range surface-to-air missiles is almost inherently superior and will destroy handily any A-10's attempting to attack with its gun. Unless ofc you stay above its envelope, in which case why are you slogging a 2 ton dead weight the size of two Volkswagens?
(I swear if somebody makes a land-based Goalkeeper...)

[Crookfur]

Well in all fairness, the A-10 Warthog is still a spectacular weapons system, and A-10 pilots love flying it. All that needs to happen is to modernize it. AND NO THE F-35 IS NOT THE ANSWER! THAT PLANE IS A POS!

Just like any heavy shore battery was superior to ships mounting the very same guns in the nineteenth century, the SPAAG with the ability to direct 30 mm fire under radar control in addition to its short-range surface-to-air missiles is almost inherently superior and will destroy handily any A-10's attempting to attack with its gun. Unless ofc you stay above its envelope, in which case why are you slogging a 2 ton dead weight the size of two Volkswagens?
(I swear if somebody makes a land-based Goalkeeper...)

IIRC the Chinese did.

[Mynockia]

I have my Orville Redenbacher's on standby if you guys want some.

Sure, artificial butter flavor?

Nah, horrific orange "cheese" flavor.

[Spirit of Hope]

Hey look my airforce.

[Free Asian Ports]

F-16X Falcon 2000 Y/N? Or something like an F-16 with the same facelift the Super Hornet got.

[Free Asian Ports]

Hey look my airforce.

>2,100 Rafales

Wut

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

F-16X Falcon 2000 Y/N? Or something like an F-16 with the same facelift the Super Hornet got.

So you can't get any of the new toys that are just about 1,000 times superior than a plane that almost didn't get a radar, almost cancelled and exported to Iran with the F-5's engines? :P

[The Akasha Colony]

Hey look my airforce.

Why u no heavy fighter?

F-16X Falcon 2000 Y/N? Or something like an F-16 with the same facelift the Super Hornet got.

If a totally new fighter like F-35 is off the table, sure. If it isn't, that's probably better.

[Free Asian Ports]

F-16X Falcon 2000 Y/N? Or something like an F-16 with the same facelift the Super Hornet got.

So you can't get any of the new toys that are just about 1,000 times superior than a plane that almost didn't get a radar, almost cancelled and exported to Iran with the F-5's engines?

More like I'd rather not spend money on the F-35 and would prefer something that makes my fleet of F-16s actually useful in the coming decades while Lockheed buries its head deeper into its own arse. At this point, I see few alternatives to the F-35 besides upgrading old aircraft (like the F-16) or NS-wanking some magical upgrades to foreign "equivalents".

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

So you can't get any of the new toys that are just about 1,000 times superior than a plane that almost didn't get a radar, almost cancelled and exported to Iran with the F-5's engines? :P

More like I'd rather not spend money on the F-35 and would prefer something that makes my fleet of F-16s actually useful in the coming decades while Lockheed buries its head deeper into its own arse. At this point, I see few alternatives to the F-35 besides upgrading old aircraft (like the F-16) or NS-wanking some magical upgrades to foreign "equivalents".

Rest in pieces FAP. You can't hide from contractor corruption and the glories of MUH CAPITALISM.
So who are you gonna sponsor? GE or P&W?

[The Akasha Colony]

So you can't get any of the new toys that are just about 1,000 times superior than a plane that almost didn't get a radar, almost cancelled and exported to Iran with the F-5's engines?

More like I'd rather not spend money on the F-35 and would prefer something that makes my fleet of F-16s actually useful in the coming decades while Lockheed buries its head deeper into its own arse. At this point, I see few alternatives to the F-35 besides upgrading old aircraft (like the F-16) or NS-wanking some magical upgrades to foreign "equivalents".

The problem is that the things that would make a fighter useful for the next few decades, at least against other modern fighters, is basically F-35. If you're only going to fight other nations incapable or unwilling to buy newer 4+ or 5th generation fighters, you can get on without them. But a modern F-16 won't close the gap against F-35 or any other fifth gen.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Just buy 3000 ex-RAF/RN Harriers on discount. You're not Bahrain/Le Saudis so ur not getting the latest F-16's anyway. Probs stuck like the Dutch on F-16A's that's hankering by somehow.

[Husseinarti]

Hey look my airforce.

Hey thats a cool air force, needs moar hoovy fiters

So you can't get any of the new toys that are just about 1,000 times superior than a plane that almost didn't get a radar, almost cancelled and exported to Iran with the F-5's engines?

More like I'd rather not spend money on the F-35 and would prefer something that makes my fleet of F-16s actually useful in the coming decades while Lockheed buries its head deeper into its own arse. At this point, I see few alternatives to the F-35 besides upgrading old aircraft (like the F-16) or NS-wanking some magical upgrades to foreign "equivalents".

Just buy MiG-21 upgraded with like AESA and 3d thurst vectoring.

You could get like 100 of them for the price of like 20 F-16s.

Hey look my airforce.

Why u no heavy fighter?

here is fiter u wunt cume buy

[Free Asian Ports]

More like I'd rather not spend money on the F-35 and would prefer something that makes my fleet of F-16s actually useful in the coming decades while Lockheed buries its head deeper into its own arse. At this point, I see few alternatives to the F-35 besides upgrading old aircraft (like the F-16) or NS-wanking some magical upgrades to foreign "equivalents".

The problem is that the things that would make a fighter useful for the next few decades, at least against other modern fighters, is basically F-35. If you're only going to fight other nations incapable or unwilling to buy newer 4+ or 5th generation fighters, you can get on without them. But a modern F-16 won't close the gap against F-35 or any other fifth gen.

I guess it's time to pull out Wikipedia and the J-31...

Just buy 3000 ex-RAF/RN Harriers on discount. You're not Bahrain/Le Saudis so ur not getting the latest F-16's anyway. Probs stuck like the Dutch on F-16A's that's hankering by somehow.

Locally-produced F-16A/B equivalents (dubbed F-16J and F-16M, respectively) upgraded in the late 90s and again in 2009. The latter upgrade gave it an AESA radar.

I also already have several dozen Sea Harriers I use/used for light attack and... "carrier" use. If you could call two Sea Control Ships "carriers".

[Free Asian Ports]

More like I'd rather not spend money on the F-35 and would prefer something that makes my fleet of F-16s actually useful in the coming decades while Lockheed buries its head deeper into its own arse. At this point, I see few alternatives to the F-35 besides upgrading old aircraft (like the F-16) or NS-wanking some magical upgrades to foreign "equivalents".

Just buy MiG-21 upgraded with like AESA and 3d thurst vectoring.

You could get like 100 of them for the price of like 20 F-16s.

We retired our MiG-21s in the 80s. Good riddance, too.

[Paragania]

Yay new thread!





(Click for fullsize!)

(Click for fullsize)

[Free Asian Ports]

That's hawt. I want some.

[The Corparation]

Damn those are good looking.

[Spirit of Hope]

Hey look my airforce.

Why u no heavy fighter?

Rafale B is twin seater weighing in at 10,000 kg. It isn't exactly light.

But yeah I don't have any real heavy fighters, because I try and stick to RL weapons systems, and there aren't a lot of good options going forward in the future.

Hey look my airforce.

Hey thats a cool air force, needs moar hoovy fiters

Haven't put up my IIwiki page for it yet, wanted to detail out my wings and shit more. Which reminds me, anyone have any good links on air force unit layouts?

here is fiter u wunt cume buy

I use IRL when possible. Makes getting certain things hard.