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Was Jesus a Communist?

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Ceannairceach
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Postby Ceannairceach » Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:29 pm

Yenke-Bin wrote:Not going to read the whole thread,but I will say absolutely 100% that Jesus is not a Communist...Nor a socialist. Jesus would never be those things.


Nor would he be a Republican, Conservative, Libertarian, Democrat, centrist, etc.

Jesus didn't come to play around in the insignificant, human created ideologies. What are they compared to His Kingdom? He came to initiate a new way, and not fit into any form of human social structure. He came to establish a kingdom far more powerful than anything we can create, or even fathom. These earthy kingdoms focus on controlling men and women through power and coercion. He came to rule through the hearts of people. Love is his economic system, and righteous justice is his rule of law.

Yes, because love pays for all the churches in his name, and "righteous justice" puts criminals away.

Good theology though. You should teach.

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Yenke-Bin
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Postby Yenke-Bin » Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:33 pm

Ceannairceach wrote:
Yenke-Bin wrote:Not going to read the whole thread,but I will say absolutely 100% that Jesus is not a Communist...Nor a socialist. Jesus would never be those things.


Nor would he be a Republican, Conservative, Libertarian, Democrat, centrist, etc.

Jesus didn't come to play around in the insignificant, human created ideologies. What are they compared to His Kingdom? He came to initiate a new way, and not fit into any form of human social structure. He came to establish a kingdom far more powerful than anything we can create, or even fathom. These earthy kingdoms focus on controlling men and women through power and coercion. He came to rule through the hearts of people. Love is his economic system, and righteous justice is his rule of law.

Yes, because love pays for all the churches in his name, and "righteous justice" puts criminals away.

Good theology though. You should teach.


Would love allow your neighbor to go under to creditors? Would it allow the poor to have no hope? Would it allow children to go hungry?

And righteous justice would indeed put criminals away...but also rehabilitate them, and help purify society.


And I do teach/disciple some on the side. :)
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The Alma Mater
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Postby The Alma Mater » Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:36 pm

Yenke-Bin wrote:Would love allow your neighbor to go under to creditors? Would it allow the poor to have no hope? Would it allow children to go hungry?


In practice ? Yes. Love is insufficient to feed the billions (US billions, so milliards) of people on this planet.

And righteous justice would indeed put criminals away...but also rehabilitate them, and help purify society.


Aaah, if only humans were this simple :)
Well no. Life would be horribly boring then.
Last edited by The Alma Mater on Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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The Holy Cathedral
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Postby The Holy Cathedral » Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:38 pm

Pandas and Heineken wrote:After watching some religious crap, it seems that Jesus hated the rich and loved the poor. To me, it seems that Jesus constantly stated that the rich had no power over the poor. Jesus even said himself:
"It's very hard for a rich man to get into Heaven. It's easier for a camel to get through the eye of a needle."
This says to me that unless you're poor, you're going to Hell. Thoughts?

NOTE: PLEASE DON'T TURN THIS INTO A RELIGION DISCUSSION!



OK, problem. How do you talk about Jesus and quote Him WITHOUT religious discussion? That's like being at a Corvette show and not allowed to talk about cars.

Jesus gave no political affiliation, and instead separated His church from political discussion ("Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's, render to God the things which are God's." FACT: Jesus was the first Christian scholar to separate Church and State). The fact he says to help the poor and to treat everyone equally shows that he's altruistic. Combine the two. Help others as you can, and keep the government away from my life.

Sounds to me like Jesus was a moral Libertarian.

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The Tofu Islands
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Postby The Tofu Islands » Thu Jul 22, 2010 1:54 am

The Holy Cathedral wrote:OK, problem. How do you talk about Jesus and quote Him WITHOUT religious discussion? That's like being at a Corvette show and not allowed to talk about cars.

Not really. I'm pretty sure that the OP just didn't want this to turn into a discussion about which religion was right/whether Jesus existed/etc.

The Holy Cathedral wrote:The fact he says to help the poor and to treat everyone equally shows that he's altruistic. Combine the two. Help others as you can, and keep the government away from my life.

"Keep the government away from my life" isn't what he said though. He said to obey earthly authority (where it doesn't conflict with his teachings), since his kingdom wasn't earthly.

The Holy Cathedral wrote:Sounds to me like Jesus was a moral Libertarian.

Define "Libertarian".
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Equimanthon
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Postby Equimanthon » Thu Jul 22, 2010 2:00 am

He was Jewish, so of course he was a Communist.
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Geniasis
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Postby Geniasis » Thu Jul 22, 2010 9:48 am

Equimanthon wrote:He was Jewish, so of course he was a Communist.


You know who else was Jewish? Hitler*

*Note: Hitler was most likely not Jewish, and there is no historical evidence to suggest he was.
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Conservative Alliances
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Postby Conservative Alliances » Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:50 am

Geniasis wrote:
Equimanthon wrote:He was Jewish, so of course he was a Communist.


You know who else was Jewish? Hitler*

*Note: Hitler was most likely not Jewish, and there is no historical evidence to suggest he was.

I saw something that said Hitler had fairly close relatives that were Jewish. But I think that that was later revealed to be an error when they were studying his family tree.
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Grave_n_idle
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Postby Grave_n_idle » Thu Jul 22, 2010 12:52 pm

Yenke-Bin wrote:Not going to read the whole thread,but I will say absolutely 100% that Jesus is not a Communist...Nor a socialist. Jesus would never be those things.


Nor would he be a Republican, Conservative, Libertarian, Democrat, centrist, etc.

Jesus didn't come to play around in the insignificant, human created ideologies. What are they compared to His Kingdom? He came to initiate a new way...


Um, yah - but the 'new way' he initiated would be called (ascetic) communism, now.
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Zirconim
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Postby Zirconim » Thu Jul 22, 2010 12:55 pm

Living Freedom Land wrote:
The Holy Bible wrote:It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.


The Bible clearly says, with God, all things are possible. The real problem is not wealth, but that men let wealth get between them and God.

LFL...this is the first thing you've ever posted that actually makes sense... :hug:
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Zirconim
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Postby Zirconim » Thu Jul 22, 2010 12:57 pm

Pandas and Heineken wrote:
Ifreann wrote:I didn't think hating rich people implied communism. Nor do I think Jesus hated anyone.

Well, maybe hated isn't the right word. How 'bout he preferred the poor over the rich?

How bout he preffered the poor to have equal power than the rich dominate? That sounds right to me. ;)
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The Alma Mater
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Postby The Alma Mater » Thu Jul 22, 2010 1:07 pm

Zirconim wrote:
Pandas and Heineken wrote:
Ifreann wrote:I didn't think hating rich people implied communism. Nor do I think Jesus hated anyone.

Well, maybe hated isn't the right word. How 'bout he preferred the poor over the rich?

How bout he preffered the poor to have equal power than the rich dominate? That sounds right to me. ;)


I asked Jesus, and he said:

"That is not what I meant"

Sorry.
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The Holy Cathedral
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Postby The Holy Cathedral » Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:13 pm

The Tofu Islands wrote:
The Holy Cathedral wrote:OK, problem. How do you talk about Jesus and quote Him WITHOUT religious discussion? That's like being at a Corvette show and not allowed to talk about cars.

Not really. I'm pretty sure that the OP just didn't want this to turn into a discussion about which religion was right/whether Jesus existed/etc.

The Holy Cathedral wrote:The fact he says to help the poor and to treat everyone equally shows that he's altruistic. Combine the two. Help others as you can, and keep the government away from my life.

"Keep the government away from my life" isn't what he said though. He said to obey earthly authority (where it doesn't conflict with his teachings), since his kingdom wasn't earthly.

The Holy Cathedral wrote:Sounds to me like Jesus was a moral Libertarian.

Define "Libertarian".


That's more talked about in I Peter ("Submit to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake"). This one is said to where it can be interpreted more openly. Jesus' example shows us to submit to authority, even when it's behaving illegally (His trials were highly illegal for multiple reasons), but after Israel fell to multiple other empires, Jesus is also setting up a religious system that acknowledges a difference in human government and Godly authority.

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Cameroi
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Postby Cameroi » Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:28 pm

religion, not carl marx, invented socialism. neither was christianity, by any means, the first to do so.
rather, mutual support for mutual well being has always been the first and eternal principal of all revealed beliefs.
(also the first to be denied by fanatics, who's motivations, are seldom if ever, actually spiritual anyway.)

as well as, in many ways, the, or at least one of the, prime motivating factor(s) in the very beginnings of so called civilization.
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