Labour Party UK: No welfare for you!

[Ostroeuropa]

The labour welfare nazi (A newly created position that replaced "Party leader" ever since they shat the bed and decided that their core vote isn't the left wing, but right wing hystericals who hate welfare) has decided that there shouldn't be any job seekers allowance for anyone who doesn't have at least an A level or equivalent, and anyone who falls below this threshhold must return to education instead.

Obviously, i'm opposed for various reasons which i'll elaborate now (I sneezed on the enter key, gimme a second.)
It seems to me that this is yet more demonization of people on welfare who, as shocking as this may be to people, don't actually want to remain on welfare for the rest of their lives. Furthermore, many people I know consistently work and work often, but nonetheless are unqualified under their new scheme to receive job seekers allowance (I.E, unemployment benefit) between jobs.
This would apply to people between 18 and 21, so provided they manage to not starve in the meantime it should be fine.

Furthermore, this seems to take an extremely rosey view of our education system. At 18-21 being the target demographic, it'll be impossible for college places to be found for all the people who suddenly need to go enroll and then skip classes in order to obtain their welfare.
I know of 3 people personally who would have been screwed by this shenanigan, who worked when they left school at 16 up until 19 or 20 before being out of work for one or two years, then returned to work.
They have no interest in further education, their careers are based on skill and experience. Nonetheless, the Labour party would have them go waste absolutely everybodies time and a bunch of money in order to make the paranoid loons who go mental every time they think someone is cheating the system feel a little less hysterical.

Couple that with the increase in the number of years you need to pay in to the system from 2 to 5, and Miliband seems absolutely determined to lose the youth vote, considering that earlier this week we had a very nice Tory come on television to explain to the country that it's a little full of shit that peoples criminal records survive beyond their 18th birthday and we probably should rectify that.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... d-miliband
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27911518

What do you think NSG?

[GraySoap]

A more apt analysis has not yet been produced in the history of man.

[Stormaen]

This just goes to show how far Labour have fallen. Even the Tories don't say, "Be smart or no benefits."

Yet another populist measure by a Labour Party that is in freefall. They've lost the economic argument, now they're trying any populist measure to try and look somewhat credible to the middle class. This latest policy is - as Labour is so good at - targets their own voters primarily.

What idiocy. But then, I expect nothing more from the Labour Arty under the leadership of the millionaire son of a Marxist whose entire life has been spent in political jobs (and then claims to, "Understand ordinary people.")

[Zychonia]

The labour welfare nazi (A newly created position that replaced "Party leader" ever since they shat the bed and decided that their core vote isn't the left wing, but right wing hystericals who hate welfare) has decided that there shouldn't be any job seekers allowance for anyone who doesn't have at least an A level or equivalent, and anyone who falls below this threshhold must return to education instead.

Obviously, i'm opposed for various reasons which i'll elaborate now (I sneezed on the enter key, gimme a second.)
It seems to me that this is yet more demonization of people on welfare who, as shocking as this may be to people, don't actually want to remain on welfare for the rest of their lives. Furthermore, many people I know consistently work and work often, but nonetheless are unqualified under their new scheme to receive job seekers allowance (I.E, unemployment benefit) between jobs.
This would apply to people between 18 and 21, so provided they manage to not starve in the meantime it should be fine.

Furthermore, this seems to take an extremely rosey view of our education system. At 18-21 being the target demographic, it'll be impossible for college places to be found for all the people who suddenly need to go enroll and then skip classes in order to obtain their welfare.
I know of 3 people personally who would have been screwed by this shenanigan, who worked when they left school at 16 up until 19 or 20 before being out of work for one or two years, then returned to work.
They have no interest in further education, their careers are based on skill and experience. Nonetheless, the Labour party would have them go waste absolutely everybodies time and a bunch of money in order to make the paranoid loons who go mental every time they think someone is cheating the system feel a little less hysterical.

Couple that with the increase in the number of years you need to pay in to the system from 2 to 5, and Miliband seems absolutely determined to lose the youth vote, considering that earlier this week we had a very nice Tory come on television to explain to the country that it's a little full of shit that peoples criminal records survive beyond their 18th birthday and we probably should rectify that.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... d-miliband
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27911518

What do you think NSG?

Good, Labour Party has some sense, if it ever had any.

[Ostroeuropa]

The labour welfare nazi (A newly created position that replaced "Party leader" ever since they shat the bed and decided that their core vote isn't the left wing, but right wing hystericals who hate welfare) has decided that there shouldn't be any job seekers allowance for anyone who doesn't have at least an A level or equivalent, and anyone who falls below this threshhold must return to education instead.

Obviously, i'm opposed for various reasons which i'll elaborate now (I sneezed on the enter key, gimme a second.)
It seems to me that this is yet more demonization of people on welfare who, as shocking as this may be to people, don't actually want to remain on welfare for the rest of their lives. Furthermore, many people I know consistently work and work often, but nonetheless are unqualified under their new scheme to receive job seekers allowance (I.E, unemployment benefit) between jobs.
This would apply to people between 18 and 21, so provided they manage to not starve in the meantime it should be fine.

Furthermore, this seems to take an extremely rosey view of our education system. At 18-21 being the target demographic, it'll be impossible for college places to be found for all the people who suddenly need to go enroll and then skip classes in order to obtain their welfare.
I know of 3 people personally who would have been screwed by this shenanigan, who worked when they left school at 16 up until 19 or 20 before being out of work for one or two years, then returned to work.
They have no interest in further education, their careers are based on skill and experience. Nonetheless, the Labour party would have them go waste absolutely everybodies time and a bunch of money in order to make the paranoid loons who go mental every time they think someone is cheating the system feel a little less hysterical.

Couple that with the increase in the number of years you need to pay in to the system from 2 to 5, and Miliband seems absolutely determined to lose the youth vote, considering that earlier this week we had a very nice Tory come on television to explain to the country that it's a little full of shit that peoples criminal records survive beyond their 18th birthday and we probably should rectify that.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... d-miliband
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27911518

What do you think NSG?

Good, Labour Party has some sense, if it ever had any.

What sense?
If I left at 16 and worked for 4 years in a technical field as say, a plumber, why shouldn't I get welfare compared to some person who got an A level then bummed around for 3?

[Aushanit]

While I don't think a party holding such views is bad it does show how bad the Labour Party has fallen out of its original ideological beginnings and the generally bad leadership of the party itself.

[Zychonia]

Good, Labour Party has some sense, if it ever had any.

What sense?
If I left at 16 and worked for 4 years in a technical field as say, a plumber, why shouldn't I get welfare compared to some person who got an A level then bummed around for 3?

I meant to say that it is not logical, however, it is more logical than more spending on the NHS, freezing energy prices and nationalising railways.

[Stormaen]

A Tory suggesting we give young'uns a second chance?! Wow. That's quite progressive.

As a side note. The Tories are increasingly - under Cameron, anyway - outmanoeuvring Labour for that social centre. They opposed ID cards, holding DNA profiles indefinitely, etc. Fair enough, still some way to go on not spying on us but then, Labour used 7/7 and "turrrizm" to put that in place.

I sincerely hope that Cameron gets his majority in 2015. Some will dread it, of course, but I'm the opposite: the prospect of a Labour win in 2015 actually scares me. I live in a Labour heartland and yet only 1 person I know plans to vote for them (and she says it's because she's done so all her life, not because she's impressed by Miliband or Balls).

[Ostroeuropa]

A Tory suggesting we give young'uns a second chance?! Wow. That's quite progressive.

As a side note. The Tories are increasingly - under Cameron, anyway - outmanoeuvring Labour for that social centre. They opposed ID cards, holding DNA profiles indefinitely, etc. Fair enough, still some way to go on not spying on us but then, Labour used 7/7 and "turrrizm" to put that in place.

I sincerely hope that Cameron gets his majority in 2015. Some will dread it, of course, but I'm the opposite: the prospect of a Labour win in 2015 actually scares me. I live in a Labour heartland and yet only 1 person I know plans to vote for them (and she says it's because she's done so all her life, not because she's impressed by Miliband or Balls).

Hell no. I'll be voting plaid or green, luckily I have plaid to vote for. It sucks for the English though... Forgive the Lib Dems maybe? I dunno. I can see why the Scots want to get out of dodge frankly. The conservatives are insanely right wing on economics, and Labour is schizophrenic and all over the place, desperately trying to patch together some semblence of a moral compass.

[Stormaen]

Good, Labour Party has some sense, if it ever had any.

What sense?
If I left at 16 and worked for 4 years in a technical field as say, a plumber, why shouldn't I get welfare compared to some person who got an A level then bummed around for 3?

Amen.

[The Serbian Empire]

A Tory suggesting we give young'uns a second chance?! Wow. That's quite progressive.

As a side note. The Tories are increasingly - under Cameron, anyway - outmanoeuvring Labour for that social centre. They opposed ID cards, holding DNA profiles indefinitely, etc. Fair enough, still some way to go on not spying on us but then, Labour used 7/7 and "turrrizm" to put that in place.

I sincerely hope that Cameron gets his majority in 2015. Some will dread it, of course, but I'm the opposite: the prospect of a Labour win in 2015 actually scares me. I live in a Labour heartland and yet only 1 person I know plans to vote for them (and she says it's because she's done so all her life, not because she's impressed by Miliband or Balls).

Hell no. I'll be voting plaid or green, luckily I have plaid to vote for. It sucks for the English though... Forgive the Lib Dems maybe? I dunno. I can see why the Scots want to get out of dodge frankly. The conservatives are insanely right wing on economics, and Labour is schizophrenic and all over the place, desperately trying to patch together some semblence of a moral compass.

And UKIP? They're probably the worst traits of Tories and Labour put together.

[Stormaen]

A Tory suggesting we give young'uns a second chance?! Wow. That's quite progressive.

As a side note. The Tories are increasingly - under Cameron, anyway - outmanoeuvring Labour for that social centre. They opposed ID cards, holding DNA profiles indefinitely, etc. Fair enough, still some way to go on not spying on us but then, Labour used 7/7 and "turrrizm" to put that in place.

I sincerely hope that Cameron gets his majority in 2015. Some will dread it, of course, but I'm the opposite: the prospect of a Labour win in 2015 actually scares me. I live in a Labour heartland and yet only 1 person I know plans to vote for them (and she says it's because she's done so all her life, not because she's impressed by Miliband or Balls).

Hell no. I'll be voting plaid or green, luckily I have plaid to vote for. It sucks for the English though... Forgive the Lib Dems maybe? I dunno. I can see why the Scots want to get out of dodge frankly. The conservatives are insanely right wing on economics, and Labour is schizophrenic and all over the place, desperately trying to patch together some semblence of a moral compass.

Wha'choo talkin' 'bout? The English do have a (soft) nationalist party to vote for! It's called the Conservatives...

Nah, up in these parts: Labour will win. The best I can do is to vote Tory or UKIP. The latter may get a strong showing but I'm not inclined to vote for them. European elections and real elections aren't the same thing...

[Stormaen]

Hell no. I'll be voting plaid or green, luckily I have plaid to vote for. It sucks for the English though... Forgive the Lib Dems maybe? I dunno. I can see why the Scots want to get out of dodge frankly. The conservatives are insanely right wing on economics, and Labour is schizophrenic and all over the place, desperately trying to patch together some semblence of a moral compass.

And UKIP? They're probably the worst traits of Tories and Labour put together.

Good point...

[The Serbian Empire]

And I thought the Democrats were moving right to squeeze out their competition. Labour has taken it to a whole different level come to think of it trying to court the UKIP voters.

[Stormaen]

Forgive the Lib Dems maybe?

They're a bit Euro-federalist for my liking and some of their economic policies are little questionable (IMO). Also, I like the Lib Dems under the Orange Book leadership but I think that'll change come 2015 results and someone like Hughes or Cable from the left of the party will come into the leadership and probably lurch it back to the left of Labour. Where's Paddy Ashdown when you need him?

In all honesty, I'll probably vote Conservative.

[Ostroeuropa]

Forgive the Lib Dems maybe?

They're a bit Euro-federalist for my liking and some of their economic policies are little questionable (IMO). Also, I like the Lib Dems under the Orange Book leadership but I think that'll change come 2015 results and someone like Hughes or Cable from the left of the party will come into the leadership and probably lurch it back to the left of Labour. Where's Paddy Ashdown when you need him?

In all honesty, I'll probably vote Conservative.

To try and cement the drift to the left on social issues?

[Ostroeuropa]

My friend thinks Milibands policy advisors hate his fucking guts because he stole the election and want him gone as leader, hence why they keep handing him these insane policies, so they can generate enough hatred and discontent to shove him before the election and get the person we actually voted for, the other Miliband.

...
It's a possibility.

[Stormaen]

They're a bit Euro-federalist for my liking and some of their economic policies are little questionable (IMO). Also, I like the Lib Dems under the Orange Book leadership but I think that'll change come 2015 results and someone like Hughes or Cable from the left of the party will come into the leadership and probably lurch it back to the left of Labour. Where's Paddy Ashdown when you need him?

In all honesty, I'll probably vote Conservative.

To try and cement the drift to the left on social issues?

More because I like what Cameron is doing. Yes, he's not perfect and there some utter fucking nutters in his Cabinet (looking at you, Gove!) but overall, so far, I think he has been a good PM. The recovery was a little longer than expected but I'm feeling its effect (and I live in the North East!) but obviously, there's some way to go.

Drifting to the left on social issues, I don't really see. The Tories have reformed the benefits system to make it more transparent and simpler (obviously there's a case too many of a crackpot civil servant overstepping the mark in terms of thoroughness) but overall it's been a success.

There are a lot of things that aren't perfect, but for the most part, they seem to have done alright.

Oh and if the drift to the left thing was about Paddy Ashdown and the Lib Dems, he was actually from the left of the party but he was far more realist and pragmatic than the current SDP-wing of the Lib Dems. He was good at outlining a clear message from the Lib Dems, something Clegg seems unable to do on anything but the EU.

[Ardoki]

That is just sad. They should at least change their name if they're going to go back on the original policies of Labour parties everywhere.

[Stormaen]

My friend thinks Milibands policy advisors hate his fucking guts because he stole the election and want him gone as leader, hence why they keep handing him these insane policies, so they can generate enough hatred and discontent to shove him before the election and get the person we actually voted for, the other Miliband.

...
It's a possibility.

That would make sense. The next leader won't the (literally) right Miliband, it'll be Balls or Yvette Cooper. Neither of whom I could ever justify voting for. He's been wrong on eversthing he's said and she seems to forget her party has been out of power for one term, not a generation.

Oh then there's a Chuka Umana. He'll probably make a run for the leadership but his Question Time appearances essentially boil down to, "Don't speak over me [whilst I'm speaking over you]!" Not to mention he (or someone from his office) edited his wikipedia page to call himself the "British Barack Obama".

[Infected Mushroom]

they are way over-complicating this.

Why not just give everyone and anyone who is unemployed welfare?

[Stormaen]

That is just sad. They should at least change their name if they're going to go back on the original policies of Labour parties everywhere.

I suggest a name change to the "They Bore" party. The current leadership has the charisma of a terminally ill hyena.

[Ostroeuropa]

they are way over-complicating this.

Why not just give everyone and anyone who is unemployed welfare?

Because right wingers will start spluttering and coughing, going red faced and pooping themselves before voting for the conservative party like they were planning to anyway.
So basically because the Labour party leadership has absolutely no idea what the people of the country actually believe or act like due to them being utterly detatched from society and living in the westminster bubble, and they have no concept of party loyalty because they are all backstabbing self serving sociopathic little shits, so they think if they just market themselves right the right-wing will elect them.

[GraySoap]

That is just sad. They should at least change their name if they're going to go back on the original policies of Labour parties everywhere.

I suggest a name change to the "They Bore" party. The current leadership has the charisma of a terminally ill hyena.

Hyena are pretty cool. Terminally ill just makes them more sympathetic. I'd vote for one. Although legally I'm not allowed to vote anymore.

[Infected Mushroom]

they are way over-complicating this.

Why not just give everyone and anyone who is unemployed welfare?

Because right wingers will start spluttering and coughing, going red faced and pooping themselves before voting for the conservative party like they were planning to anyway.
So basically because the Labour party leadership has absolutely no idea what the people of the country actually believe or act like due to them being utterly detatched from society and living in the westminster bubble.

so you mean democracy's not working in england (you may have a point)?

i just don't get why they need to make welfare so complicated...