by Marcuslandia » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:38 am
by Marcuslandia » Mon Jun 22, 2009 1:03 pm
by Tanaara » Mon Jun 22, 2009 1:14 pm
by Unibot » Mon Jun 22, 2009 2:55 pm
I had an idea. Let each nation have a secret registry. They have to choose one of the options - but their choice is viewable ONLY by themselves and the Game Mods.
Invader
Defender
Neither
That way if nation X choses invader and moves into a region and is later part of an invasion force and takes over the delegateship and starts booting people - well, it's flat out easy for the Game Mods to determine if it griefing, or legitimate intra-regional workings.( versus inter- regional )
That way puppet #9 can sit in Region X being mister-long-time-sleeper agent/ spy/mole - but there is no question if he is a native / what his 'intent' was - he had to announce it to the referees...
Also if some one labeled as Neither, then participated in an invasion, then their work is recogniseable as griefing...
Vocenae wrote:Unibot, you have won NS.
by Marcuslandia » Mon Jun 22, 2009 3:53 pm
Unibot wrote:I had an idea. Let each nation have a secret registry. They have to choose one of the options - but their choice is viewable ONLY by themselves and the Game Mods.
Invader
Defender
Neither
That way if nation X choses invader and moves into a region and is later part of an invasion force and takes over the delegateship and starts booting people - well, it's flat out easy for the Game Mods to determine if it griefing, or legitimate intra-regional workings.( versus inter- regional )
That way puppet #9 can sit in Region X being mister-long-time-sleeper agent/ spy/mole - but there is no question if he is a native / what his 'intent' was - he had to announce it to the referees...
Also if some one labeled as Neither, then participated in an invasion, then their work is recogniseable as griefing...
I like it, in fact I came up with something similar for regions.
But couldn't the people, just err... lie?
by Marcuslandia » Mon Jun 22, 2009 4:16 pm
by Marcuslandia » Mon Jun 22, 2009 4:22 pm
by Martyrdoom » Mon Jun 22, 2009 4:26 pm
by Whamabama » Mon Jun 22, 2009 4:29 pm
by Marcuslandia » Mon Jun 22, 2009 4:37 pm
by Marcuslandia » Mon Jun 22, 2009 4:44 pm
Martyrdoom wrote:Due to 'nativity' and influence there are no 'invasions', so there's no definition. No offense to anyone but maybe we should just skip this pretense, and ask whether 'griefing' as it is now expressed and understood ("Harassing a nation or region because of what they did or said") is absolutely and unequivocally compatible and complimentary with the previous 'invasion-griefing' rule?
by Whamabama » Mon Jun 22, 2009 5:27 pm
Martyrdoom wrote:Due to 'nativity' and influence there are no 'invasions', so there's no definition. No offense to anyone but maybe we should just skip this pretense, and ask whether 'griefing' as it is now expressed and understood ("Harassing a nation or region because of what they did or said") is absolutely and unequivocally compatible and complimentary with the previous 'invasion-griefing' rule?
by [violet] » Mon Jun 22, 2009 7:48 pm
Marcuslandia wrote:then what if a resident goes to the SC and starts ranting, "We're under attack!" Gives the SC something to do. They investigate the action, compare notes, discuss the matter. "Is this an actual invasion, or is it just an internal dispute with the loser trying to paint his opponents as "invaders"? The SC discusses the matter to its satisfaction. If the conclusion is, "Yes, we believe this an actual invasion,"
by Naivetry » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:37 pm
by [violet] » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:50 pm
Naivetry wrote:link is to [violet]'s rebuttal
by Marcuslandia » Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:33 am
by Tanaara » Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:40 am
Also if some one labeled as Neither, then participated in an invasion, then their work is recogniseable as griefing...
by Erastide » Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:48 am
by Marcuslandia » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:14 pm
Erastide wrote:So a nation is a long time resident of the region but begins to feel that the region is going in the wrong direction or that the region needs a change of leadership to make it better. He calls in a few friends from outside the region to come support him since he's probably already got internal support and boom, he's delegate. Now, he kicks the people that he thinks were bad for the region and they cry foul.
I would call that an acceptable situation and not something that should be interfered with.
But the situation could also be run where its an invader plant who had been in the region for a long time but only joined the WA a few days/week before the friends come in so he can get a few legit endos from natives to boost him up even more. He kicks a few "natives" and they cry foul. But he doesn't gloat on the RMB, he just declares there's a new forum and a new system of government since the old one wasn't working.
How could you tell the difference between these two scenarios? How would you judge it?
by Bears Armed » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:28 pm
Erastide wrote:So a nation is a long time resident of the region but begins to feel that the region is going in the wrong direction or that the region needs a change of leadership to make it better. He calls in a few friends from outside the region to come support him since he's probably already got internal support and boom, he's delegate. Now, he kicks the people that he thinks were bad for the region and they cry foul.
I would call that an acceptable situation and not something that should be interfered with.
But the situation could also be run where its an invader plant who had been in the region for a long time but only joined the WA a few days/week before the friends come in so he can get a few legit endos from natives to boost him up even more. He kicks a few "natives" and they cry foul. But he doesn't gloat on the RMB, he just declares there's a new forum and a new system of government since the old one wasn't working.
How could you tell the difference between these two scenarios? How would you judge it?
by Erastide » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:30 pm
Marcuslandia wrote:The tactic of using a puppet this way changes drastically if change just one aspect: the Influence it accumulates just sitting there. So what about this idea: Since the only use of Influence seems to relate to the I/D game, and you can only really use that Influence _actively_ (i.e., spend), how about making it that a nation doesn't accumulate Influence unless it is also a WA?
All of sudden the complexion changes when invaders have to infiltrate a region with a live soldier instead of a zombie awaiting a brain transplant. If raiders want to infiltrate a region, they'll have to commit a player's one and only WA to do so. That would deprive them of the practice of planting puppets in 10-12 regions and just letting them sit there, taking up space until the Magic Moment. That should offset the Defender disadvantage because _they_ haven't similarly planted puppets in those same regions.
by Marcuslandia » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:57 pm
Erastide wrote:And what about innocent people that haven't joined the WA and are just sitting there and then their region gets invaded? That makes it insanely easy to kick them out.
by Erastide » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:17 pm
by Whamabama » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:21 pm
by Marcuslandia » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:26 pm
Erastide wrote:People play more than one nation and keep them in more than one region and play both of them equally and with as much effort. But they can only have 1 WA. So one region's nation will be slightly less protected as it stands. Giving them no protection seems way too harsh. Also, RPers and other people don't join the WA because they disagree with its policies. You'd be penalizing them in the event of an invasion.
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