by Lareine Alpine » Mon May 15, 2023 5:06 pm

by Desmosthenes and Burke » Mon May 15, 2023 5:30 pm

by The Ice States » Mon May 15, 2023 5:36 pm
Desmosthenes and Burke wrote:The ambassador may wish to peruse the past resolutions. The WA librarian has the tomes permanently available on the circulation desk. (OOC: The Passed Resolutions Sticky).
We might particularly draw the ambassador's attention to
Good: GA#80, GA#474, GA#475
Bad: GA#4, GA#493, GA#103, GA#369
Ugly: GA#514, GA#603
There are probably others that we have forgotten, but the WA has already mandated the main thrust of your proposal, already meddles far to much with education, and what little is not covered should not be used to further undermine the sovereignty and societal norms, mores, and customs of member states.

by Desmosthenes and Burke » Mon May 15, 2023 5:45 pm
by Lareine Alpine » Tue May 16, 2023 1:17 am
Desmosthenes and Burke wrote:The ambassador may wish to peruse the past resolutions. The WA librarian has the tomes permanently available on the circulation desk. (OOC: The Passed Resolutions Sticky).
We might particularly draw the ambassador's attention to
Good: GA#80, GA#474, GA#475
Bad: GA#4, GA#493, GA#103, GA#369
Ugly: GA#514, GA#603
There are probably others that we have forgotten, but the WA has already mandated the main thrust of your proposal, already meddles far to much with education, and what little is not covered should not be used to further undermine the sovereignty and societal norms, mores, and customs of member states.
by Lareine Alpine » Tue May 16, 2023 1:26 am
The Ice States wrote:Desmosthenes and Burke wrote:The ambassador may wish to peruse the past resolutions. The WA librarian has the tomes permanently available on the circulation desk. (OOC: The Passed Resolutions Sticky).
We might particularly draw the ambassador's attention to
Good: GA#80, GA#474, GA#475
Bad: GA#4, GA#493, GA#103, GA#369
Ugly: GA#514, GA#603
There are probably others that we have forgotten, but the WA has already mandated the main thrust of your proposal, already meddles far to much with education, and what little is not covered should not be used to further undermine the sovereignty and societal norms, mores, and customs of member states.
"GA #603 was repealed several months ago via GA #639. However, we would otherwise agree that much of this draft is redundant, although we oppose your Natsov arguments, such as that nations should have the sovereign power to segregate schools or allow child labour."
~Alexander Nicholas Saverchenko-Colleti,
World Assembly Ambassador,
The Communal Union of the Ice States.

by Juansonia » Tue May 16, 2023 7:35 am
"GA#23, one of the most notable resolutions which this Assembly has passed, has imposed a wholesale ban on slavery and forced labor subject to exceptions which do not encompass most forms of child labor. The term 'child' contains those who are close to adulthood; they should have a right to voluntarily work for fair compensation." - Maria-Fernanda Novo, AmbassadorLareine Alpine wrote:--snip--
GA#4 is a resolution to put "Restrictions on Child Labor" noting that child labour is tolerated and therefore require urgent attention of the member states to amend/repeal this resolution.
In view of the above resolutions, we re-assert that a resolution recognising primary education as a fundamental universal right requires urgent attention and that forced child labour be permanently outlawed.
We thus cordially invite your expertise to improve the draft resolution and recognise primary education as a fundamental right.
Space Squid wrote:Each sin should get it's own month.
Right now, Pride gets June, and Greed, Envy, and Gluttony have to share Thanksgiving/Black Friday through Christmas, Sloth gets one day in September, and Lust gets one day in February.
It's not equitable at all
Gandoor wrote:Cliché: A mod making a reply that's full of swearing after someone asks if you're allowed to swear on this site.
It makes me chuckle every time it happens.
by Lareine Alpine » Tue May 16, 2023 8:30 am
Juansonia wrote:"General Assembly resolution no.299 bans WA resolutions from imposing a specific number as an age restriction, and leaves that matter to member states in all cases. Specifying a specific age in units would be absurd, as a year could easily be shorter than this sentence or longer than I have lived so far. Not all WA members use the same calendar, and many, due to biological reasons, age at very different rates."
- Maria-Fernanda Novo, WA Ambassador for the Armed Republic of Juansonia"GA#23, one of the most notable resolutions which this Assembly has passed, has imposed a wholesale ban on slavery and forced labor subject to exceptions which do not encompass most forms of child labor. The term 'child' contains those who are close to adulthood; they should have a right to voluntarily work for fair compensation." - Maria-Fernanda Novo, AmbassadorLareine Alpine wrote:--snip--
GA#4 is a resolution to put "Restrictions on Child Labor" noting that child labour is tolerated and therefore require urgent attention of the member states to amend/repeal this resolution.
In view of the above resolutions, we re-assert that a resolution recognising primary education as a fundamental universal right requires urgent attention and that forced child labour be permanently outlawed.
We thus cordially invite your expertise to improve the draft resolution and recognise primary education as a fundamental right.

by Juansonia » Tue May 16, 2023 4:43 pm
"I believe that you are mistaken. GA#299 doesn't legalise child labor based on arbitrary definitions of age. Rather, it reserves to member states the right to define the boundary between childhood and adulthood. Having age limits set by the World Assembly would be a fool's errand, as any number chosen arbitrarily by proposal-writers would be wrong in at least 13% of member states. After all, one of the delegates to this assembly is a sapient potted plant." - Maria-Fernanda Novo, WA Ambassador for the Armed Republic of JuansoniaLareine Alpine wrote:Juansonia wrote:"General Assembly resolution no.299 bans WA resolutions from imposing a specific number as an age restriction, and leaves that matter to member states in all cases. Specifying a specific age in units would be absurd, as a year could easily be shorter than this sentence or longer than I have lived so far. Not all WA members use the same calendar, and many, due to biological reasons, age at very different rates."
- Maria-Fernanda Novo, WA Ambassador for the Armed Republic of Juansonia
"GA#23, one of the most notable resolutions which this Assembly has passed, has imposed a wholesale ban on slavery and forced labor subject to exceptions which do not encompass most forms of child labor. The term 'child' contains those who are close to adulthood; they should have a right to voluntarily work for fair compensation." - Maria-Fernanda Novo, Ambassador
We thank the ambassador of the Armed Republic of Juansonia for their valuable input and bringing into light the resolutions GA#299 and GA#23.
With respect to the interpretation of GA#299, under this resolution, specific age limits is under the purview of each member states.
However this non-universal definition of age opens up a plethora of cases of misuse. The implication of this for children is that it jeopardises recognition of their fundamental primary education rights since, in the present form GA#299 legalises child labour in member states based on arbitrary definition of age.
OOC: Stop right fucking there. GA resolutions cannot be amended - that isn't how the game's code works. Resolutions must be repealed in their entirety or left as-is.Thus, we recognise the need for an immediate amendment to this resolution to protect child rights universally.
Space Squid wrote:Each sin should get it's own month.
Right now, Pride gets June, and Greed, Envy, and Gluttony have to share Thanksgiving/Black Friday through Christmas, Sloth gets one day in September, and Lust gets one day in February.
It's not equitable at all
Gandoor wrote:Cliché: A mod making a reply that's full of swearing after someone asks if you're allowed to swear on this site.
It makes me chuckle every time it happens.
by Lareine Alpine » Thu May 18, 2023 2:07 pm
Lareine Alpine wrote:Category: Education/Strong
Per the feedback received for vagueness in the terms used, the proposal was therefore withdrawn. Looking forward to strengthing this proposal with positive feedback.Elementary Education as a Fundamental Right
The World Assembly,
Recognising that,
education is one of the pillars of societal development and civilizational progress as well as vital to social and economic mobility,
Acknowledging that,
socio-economic disparity is a persistent issue of minorities in every nation,
Noting that,
income disparities and marginalization of minority groups leads to inequality in education,
Noting that,
equal and equitable access to education therefore remains a significant challenge for children from disadvantaged minority groups,
Hereby, within any limits set by earlier resolutions,
Defines minors as children classified as per the legal definitions established by member states within their respective constitutions.
Defines disability or disabilities as a physical or mental impairment impeding an individual to function with the same capacities or capabilities as a person without impairments
Defines impairments as medically certified chronic conditions that limits functioning of an individual from any gainful activities,
Declares that,
i. Elementary education is a universal fundamental right.
Mandates that,
i. Elementary or Primary education be made compulsory for all minors
ii. Primary public and private schools implements only those disciplines established under national educational framework
ii.a Public and private schools reserve the right to implement optional disciplines subject to
approval from relevant authority
iii. Minors with disabilities be provided free special education services and assistive technologies.[/list]
Recommends that,
a. Complimentary balanced diet meals be provided at all primary public and private schools
b. Curriculum constitutes Science, Arts and Sports
c. Yearly free of cost excursions be incorporated to promote
c.i Experiential learning
c.ii Cultural understanding and respect for diversity
d. Inclusive learning environment be created to promote respect, support of individual differences and collaboration between specially abled and non-specially abled children for an inclusive society

by Cappedore » Fri May 19, 2023 11:36 am
President Austin Merrill | Vice President Cleveland Durand | Chancellor Maya Murray
by Lareine Alpine » Fri May 19, 2023 1:42 pm
Cappedore wrote:Agreed in principle, but this wouldn't make it through quorum let alone be voted in. Individual member states would rather legislate how their education system works themselves.
by Wallenburg » Fri May 19, 2023 2:23 pm
Lareine Alpine wrote:GA#80 is a resolution for "Promotion of Basic Education" which do not mandate member state to recognise basic education as a fundamental universal right
1. Declares that all citizens have the right to be educated, and thus be provided with the following capabilities through some sort of variation of edification:
• Comprehensive literacy skills and fluency in the official or popular language(s) of their nation;
• An understanding of basic arithmetical operations, geometrics and fundamental mathematics;
• Cognizance of financial mathematics and concepts, currency and economics that is appropriate to the economy of their nation;
• A familiarity with their nation’s governmental policies, processes, civics, rights and freedoms;
• A fair and impartial recollection of historical national and international events, politics and society;
• An accurate understanding of ecological life, nature and the environment;
• A fair and impartial familiarity to common cultural customs, beliefs and ideologies in their nation of residence and abroad;
• Knowledge of the geographical and/or astrographical characteristics of their surrounding environment, including natural, political and demographical characteristics;
2. Further requires that member nations attempt to provide citizens of a nation the aforementioned education in the fullest possible form for any citizen that is mentally incapable, neurologically undeveloped, or otherwise incapable of learning or retaining within reason the fundamental aspects to a basic education;
by Lareine Alpine » Fri May 19, 2023 2:43 pm
Wallenburg wrote:Lareine Alpine wrote:GA#80 is a resolution for "Promotion of Basic Education" which do not mandate member state to recognise basic education as a fundamental universal right
Really? Because1. Declares that all citizens have the right to be educated, and thus be provided with the following capabilities through some sort of variation of edification:
• Comprehensive literacy skills and fluency in the official or popular language(s) of their nation;
• An understanding of basic arithmetical operations, geometrics and fundamental mathematics;
• Cognizance of financial mathematics and concepts, currency and economics that is appropriate to the economy of their nation;
• A familiarity with their nation’s governmental policies, processes, civics, rights and freedoms;
• A fair and impartial recollection of historical national and international events, politics and society;
• An accurate understanding of ecological life, nature and the environment;
• A fair and impartial familiarity to common cultural customs, beliefs and ideologies in their nation of residence and abroad;
• Knowledge of the geographical and/or astrographical characteristics of their surrounding environment, including natural, political and demographical characteristics;
2. Further requires that member nations attempt to provide citizens of a nation the aforementioned education in the fullest possible form for any citizen that is mentally incapable, neurologically undeveloped, or otherwise incapable of learning or retaining within reason the fundamental aspects to a basic education;
certainly looks like mandating member states recognize basic education as a fundamental universal right.

by Juansonia » Fri May 19, 2023 3:16 pm
"If the right is provided and protected, what difference does it make whether the law calls a spade a spade?" - Maria-Fernanda Novo, Ambassador.Lareine Alpine wrote:Wallenburg wrote:Really? Because1. Declares that all citizens have the right to be educated, and thus be provided with the following capabilities through some sort of variation of edification:
• Comprehensive literacy skills and fluency in the official or popular language(s) of their nation;
• An understanding of basic arithmetical operations, geometrics and fundamental mathematics;
• Cognizance of financial mathematics and concepts, currency and economics that is appropriate to the economy of their nation;
• A familiarity with their nation’s governmental policies, processes, civics, rights and freedoms;
• A fair and impartial recollection of historical national and international events, politics and society;
• An accurate understanding of ecological life, nature and the environment;
• A fair and impartial familiarity to common cultural customs, beliefs and ideologies in their nation of residence and abroad;
• Knowledge of the geographical and/or astrographical characteristics of their surrounding environment, including natural, political and demographical characteristics;
2. Further requires that member nations attempt to provide citizens of a nation the aforementioned education in the fullest possible form for any citizen that is mentally incapable, neurologically undeveloped, or otherwise incapable of learning or retaining within reason the fundamental aspects to a basic education;
certainly looks like mandating member states recognize basic education as a fundamental universal right.
Not denying that it looks like recognizing basic education as a right.
However, have the right to be educated is not the same as declaring basic education as a fundamental right . The former phrase refers ]entitlement of individuals to receive education, while the later is about giving legal recognition and protection of education as a fundamental right for all minors.
Space Squid wrote:Each sin should get it's own month.
Right now, Pride gets June, and Greed, Envy, and Gluttony have to share Thanksgiving/Black Friday through Christmas, Sloth gets one day in September, and Lust gets one day in February.
It's not equitable at all
Gandoor wrote:Cliché: A mod making a reply that's full of swearing after someone asks if you're allowed to swear on this site.
It makes me chuckle every time it happens.
by Lareine Alpine » Fri May 19, 2023 3:37 pm
Juansonia wrote:"If the right is provided and protected, what difference does it make whether the law calls a spade a spade?" - Maria-Fernanda Novo, Ambassador.Lareine Alpine wrote:
Not denying that it looks like recognizing basic education as a right.
However, have the right to be educated is not the same as declaring basic education as a fundamental right . The former phrase refers ]entitlement of individuals to receive education, while the later is about giving legal recognition and protection of education as a fundamental right for all minors.

by Juansonia » Fri May 19, 2023 7:25 pm
"Not really. In fact, one could argue that it's less effective than directly obliging member states to act as they are intended to, since the terms 'fundamental right' leave a lot of room for interpretation, especially in terms of positive and negative rights."Lareine Alpine wrote:Simply because explicitly defining something as a fundamental right attaches a higher significance and legal recognition hence an an obligation to uphold and to ensure the right is being respected.Juansonia wrote:"If the right is provided and protected, what difference does it make whether the law calls a spade a spade?" - Maria-Fernanda Novo, Ambassador.
"With the exception of noncitizen rights, the phrase 'It's six of one and half a dozen of the other' is an applicable analogy to this situation." - Maria-Fernanda Novo, AmbassadorFurthermore, in the cited resolution, it does not explicitly state that the right is provided or protected.
It only 'declares that citizens have the right to be educated'.. it doesn't say 'education is a right'
Space Squid wrote:Each sin should get it's own month.
Right now, Pride gets June, and Greed, Envy, and Gluttony have to share Thanksgiving/Black Friday through Christmas, Sloth gets one day in September, and Lust gets one day in February.
It's not equitable at all
Gandoor wrote:Cliché: A mod making a reply that's full of swearing after someone asks if you're allowed to swear on this site.
It makes me chuckle every time it happens.

by Imperium Anglorum » Fri May 19, 2023 7:26 pm
Desmosthenes and Burke wrote:
We apologize for the oversight. The gnomes maintaining the RexisQuexis Categories data have updated of late. We do note, we do not see that repeal as an excuse to pursue further meddling by this body.
by Wallenburg » Fri May 19, 2023 8:08 pm
Lareine Alpine wrote:Wallenburg wrote:Really? Because1. Declares that all citizens have the right to be educated, and thus be provided with the following capabilities through some sort of variation of edification:
• Comprehensive literacy skills and fluency in the official or popular language(s) of their nation;
• An understanding of basic arithmetical operations, geometrics and fundamental mathematics;
• Cognizance of financial mathematics and concepts, currency and economics that is appropriate to the economy of their nation;
• A familiarity with their nation’s governmental policies, processes, civics, rights and freedoms;
• A fair and impartial recollection of historical national and international events, politics and society;
• An accurate understanding of ecological life, nature and the environment;
• A fair and impartial familiarity to common cultural customs, beliefs and ideologies in their nation of residence and abroad;
• Knowledge of the geographical and/or astrographical characteristics of their surrounding environment, including natural, political and demographical characteristics;
2. Further requires that member nations attempt to provide citizens of a nation the aforementioned education in the fullest possible form for any citizen that is mentally incapable, neurologically undeveloped, or otherwise incapable of learning or retaining within reason the fundamental aspects to a basic education;
certainly looks like mandating member states recognize basic education as a fundamental universal right.
Not denying that it looks like recognizing basic education as a right.
However, have the right to be educated is not the same as declaring basic education as a fundamental right . The former phrase refers ]entitlement of individuals to receive education, while the later is about giving legal recognition and protection of education as a fundamental right for all minors.
by Lareine Alpine » Sat May 20, 2023 1:09 am
Juansonia wrote:"Not really. In fact, one could argue that it's less effective than directly obliging member states to act as they are intended to, since the terms 'fundamental right' leave a lot of room for interpretation, especially in terms of positive and negative rights."Lareine Alpine wrote:Simply because explicitly defining something as a fundamental right attaches a higher significance and legal recognition hence an an obligation to uphold and to ensure the right is being respected.
- Maria-Fernanda Novo, WA Ambassador for the Armed Republic of Juansonia"With the exception of noncitizen rights, the phrase 'It's six of one and half a dozen of the other' is an applicable analogy to this situation." - Maria-Fernanda Novo, AmbassadorFurthermore, in the cited resolution, it does not explicitly state that the right is provided or protected.
It only 'declares that citizens have the right to be educated'.. it doesn't say 'education is a right'
by Lareine Alpine » Sat May 20, 2023 1:25 am
Wallenburg wrote:Lareine Alpine wrote:
Not denying that it looks like recognizing basic education as a right.
However, have the right to be educated is not the same as declaring basic education as a fundamental right . The former phrase refers ]entitlement of individuals to receive education, while the later is about giving legal recognition and protection of education as a fundamental right for all minors.
GAR #80 recognizes the legal right to education and protects that right through mandates. You have decent room for argument on the matter of non-citizen education, but there is no question whether the right to education is already recognized for citizens.

by Juansonia » Sat May 20, 2023 9:16 am
"Do you even understand how rights work? Calling something a right does not say anything about who is entitled to it or what standard of protection is sufficent. Furthermore, the difference between positive and negative rights is so massive that, unless clarified, simply declaring something a 'fundamental right' would be absurd."Lareine Alpine wrote:I would like to respectfully disagree on this, fundamental right does not leave room for interpretation simply because it is recognised as a right and therefore it has to be respected.Juansonia wrote:"Not really. In fact, one could argue that it's less effective than directly obliging member states to act as they are intended to, since the terms 'fundamental right' leave a lot of room for interpretation, especially in terms of positive and negative rights."
- Maria-Fernanda Novo, WA Ambassador for the Armed Republic of Juansonia
"With the exception of noncitizen rights, the phrase 'It's six of one and half a dozen of the other' is an applicable analogy to this situation." - Maria-Fernanda Novo, Ambassador
"That isn't how it works. At least within the World Assembly, the right to free speech is protected by GA#436, and the right to privacy is protected by GA#213 and GA#383. GA#383 only mentions the concept of rights in the preamble - all protections are through the form of mandating that member states refrain from certain courses of action. GA#436 does not declare that a right to free expression exists, but only that member states cannot hinder said right beyond exceptions in World Assembly law. While GA#213 declares that every person has a right to privacy, it only works because the next clause expressly prohibits member states from infringing upon said right. Across the entirety of WA precedent, there hasn't been a single instance where simply declaring something a right carries with it the full force of legislative protection."For example, right to freedom of speech, right to privacy etc is not mandated rather by recognizing it as a fundamental right, they enjoy the highest protection and legal recognition.
"That is not how the law of the General Assembly works. If GA law prohibits or requires something, no leeway can be implied."Member states can further add clauses to make sure it is not 'absolute' and has limits to avoid infringement upon rights of others.
"That's the problem. You don't care about whether those children have an education or the opportunity, as long as the words 'education' and 'fundamental universal right' are next to each other in World Assembly legislation. I, however, am concerned with the practical effects of World Assembly law. Specifically, what, if anything, would that right's codification oblige or prohibit member states to do?"In the case of basic education for minors, by proposing it is a fundamental right, it does not infringe upon rights of others and hence I fail to see how it leaves rooms for interpretation other than to simply consider elementary education as a right.
Space Squid wrote:Each sin should get it's own month.
Right now, Pride gets June, and Greed, Envy, and Gluttony have to share Thanksgiving/Black Friday through Christmas, Sloth gets one day in September, and Lust gets one day in February.
It's not equitable at all
Gandoor wrote:Cliché: A mod making a reply that's full of swearing after someone asks if you're allowed to swear on this site.
It makes me chuckle every time it happens.
by Lareine Alpine » Sat May 20, 2023 9:49 am
Juansonia wrote:OOC: these quotes are from Maria-Fernanda Novo, WA Ambassador for the Armed Republic of Juansonia.
IC:"Do you even understand how rights work? Calling something a right does not say anything about who is entitled to it or what standard of protection is sufficent. Furthermore, the difference between positive and negative rights is so massive that, unless clarified, simply declaring something a 'fundamental right' would be absurd."Lareine Alpine wrote:I would like to respectfully disagree on this, fundamental right does not leave room for interpretation simply because it is recognised as a right and therefore it has to be respected.
That's the problem. You don't care about whether those children have an education or the opportunity, as long as the words 'education' and 'fundamental universal right' are next to each other in World Assembly legislation. I, however, am concerned with the practical effects of World Assembly law. Specifically, what, if anything, would that right's codification oblige or prohibit member states to do?"

by Juansonia » Sat May 20, 2023 10:04 am
"It does no such thing. It simply declares it a universal fundamental right, and it then proceeds to make it compulsory for all minors. "Lareine Alpine wrote:Respectfully, the draft makes it clear who is entitled to this right.Juansonia wrote:OOC: these quotes are from Maria-Fernanda Novo, WA Ambassador for the Armed Republic of Juansonia.
IC:"Do you even understand how rights work? Calling something a right does not say anything about who is entitled to it or what standard of protection is sufficent. Furthermore, the difference between positive and negative rights is so massive that, unless clarified, simply declaring something a 'fundamental right' would be absurd."
"That isn't how it works. Even if it was clear that all children have said right, that would say nothing about whether (and to what extent) member states would be obligated to provide education or to safeguard access to it."The standard of protection is implicitly considered when calling something a fundamental right.
OOC: You have a lot of reading up to do. By the way, RL norms often don't mean a thing.In WA it might be different to which case I cannot debate about it since I am novice.
"No, it isn't."Respectfully, again, the obligation or prohibition from considering this as a fundamental right is mentioned in the proposal.That's the problem. You don't care about whether those children have an education or the opportunity, as long as the words 'education' and 'fundamental universal right' are next to each other in World Assembly legislation. I, however, am concerned with the practical effects of World Assembly law. Specifically, what, if anything, would that right's codification oblige or prohibit member states to do?"
"Maybe if you addressed the points that I mentioned, I would know which parts need clarification. However, here are two points that I am confident that you can understand. First, that a right to something must be waivable, which is contradicted by primary education being compulsory. Second, the fact that 'minor' includes everything from infants to those mere seconds from adulthood, and that a large amount of that range is either too young to be educated or too old to benefit from repetition of primary-level education."
I invite the ambassador to clarify the concerns, the draft can only be improved with a constructive feedback.
Space Squid wrote:Each sin should get it's own month.
Right now, Pride gets June, and Greed, Envy, and Gluttony have to share Thanksgiving/Black Friday through Christmas, Sloth gets one day in September, and Lust gets one day in February.
It's not equitable at all
Gandoor wrote:Cliché: A mod making a reply that's full of swearing after someone asks if you're allowed to swear on this site.
It makes me chuckle every time it happens.
by Lareine Alpine » Mon May 22, 2023 1:13 pm
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