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[DEFEATED] Repeal "Volcanic Activity Convention"

A carefully preserved record of the most notable World Assembly debates.

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Magecastle Embassy Building A5
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Founded: Jul 03, 2022
Corporate Police State

Postby Magecastle Embassy Building A5 » Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:47 pm

Honeydewistania wrote:I have no idea how you construed 'reputational damage' and knowing '100% of the time if someone's corrupt' out of my argument and proceeded to ignore my actual points, but alright. I do question how this is relevant to the proposal in question. Humanitarian Aid Coordination, which you cited, also provides aid to nations but makes no mention of diversion. And neither that nor Volcanic Activity Convention does not stop punishments from being levied, or entities making smart decisions during cooperations to mitigate the risk of corruption. You provide no solution to the problem of aid diversion, and repealing Volcanic Activity Convention will not do anything to that effect, as it will merely make less aid available to nations. If the solution to aid diversion is to cut off all aid, I am eager to see how this plays out on the voting floor.

-Benji

"Relying on member nations to be able to magically tell whether diversion is occuring or will occur is the worst way to deal with the issue of diversion. The correct solution is preventing aid from being diverted by prohibiting nations from doing so. Also, Disaster Precautions and Responses' aid mandate applies to 'Member-nations met with a financial burden as a result of this resolution', implying that such aid would only be provided where necessary to comply with the resolution's mandates -- implicitly meaning that diversion of aid would necessarily result in non-compliance -- rather than throwing it at all evacuations due to volcanic activity. As other resolutions making the target's aid mechanism redundant actually competently ensure that aid is provided and used properly, contrary to your claims, repealing 565 does not 'cut off all aid'."

~Alexander Nicholas Saverchenko-Coletti,
World Assembly Ambassador,
The Empire of The Ice States
Last edited by Magecastle Embassy Building A5 on Tue Oct 04, 2022 7:56 pm, edited 12 times in total.

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West Barack and East Obama
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Postby West Barack and East Obama » Tue Sep 27, 2022 9:25 pm

Dr Justin Obama, Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs: Given the strawman arguments in the FAQ and nonsensical fearmongering in the second argument over supposed unnecessary spending, we will be strongly opposing this.
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Magecastle Embassy Building A5
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Postby Magecastle Embassy Building A5 » Tue Sep 27, 2022 9:28 pm

West Barack and East Obama wrote:Dr Justin Obama, Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs: Given the strawman arguments in the FAQ and nonsensical fearmongering in the second argument over supposed unnecessary spending, we will be strongly opposing this.

"Would you like to explain how the FAQ is strawmanning?"

~Alexander Nicholas Saverchenko-Coletti,
World Assembly Ambassador,
The Empire of The Ice States
Last edited by Magecastle Embassy Building A5 on Tue Oct 04, 2022 7:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Magecastle Embassy Building A5
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Postby Magecastle Embassy Building A5 » Sat Oct 15, 2022 11:29 am

"I have redrafted this to focus on the target's redundancy, in addition to the use of ambiguous language in many sections of the target."

~Alexander Nicholas Saverchenko-Colleti,
World Assembly Ambassador,
The Empire of The Ice States
Last edited by Magecastle Embassy Building A5 on Sat Oct 15, 2022 12:37 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Minskiev
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Postby Minskiev » Mon Oct 17, 2022 1:52 pm

eh, still against actually.
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Magecastle Embassy Building A5
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Postby Magecastle Embassy Building A5 » Mon Oct 17, 2022 2:00 pm

Ooc: Based on a conversation in the WA discord, this has been halloween-ified, and will be submitted with the intent of passing around halloween. To that end, it will be submitted very soon. approvals go here.
Last edited by Magecastle Embassy Building A5 on Mon Oct 17, 2022 4:48 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Wallenburg wrote:If you get a Nobel Prize for the time machine because you wanted to win an argument on the Internet, try to remember the little people who started you on that way.
Ever-Wandering Souls wrote:Our research and user feedback found different use cases of bullets, such as hunting, national defense, and murder. Typically, most bullets fired do not kill people. However, sometimes they do. We found that nearly 100% of users were not impacted by shooting one random user every 30 days, reducing the likelihood of a negative impact on the average user.
Comfed wrote:When I look around me at the state of real life politics, with culture war arguments over abortion and LGBT rights, and then I look at the WA and see the same debates about cannibalism, I have hope for the world.

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Heavens Reach
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Postby Heavens Reach » Mon Oct 17, 2022 4:56 pm

OOC: approved. Again. : P

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Excidium Planetis
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Postby Excidium Planetis » Mon Oct 17, 2022 7:19 pm

Adelia Meritt stamps her copy of the proposal with her seal of approval, which suspiciously looks like the word "BASED".
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Simone Republic
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Postby Simone Republic » Sun Oct 23, 2022 7:16 pm

Please remove that joke about volcanic eruptions killing and zombies. It's offensive to anyone who has suffered through volcanic eruptions, such as Colombia, Montserrat or Japan.
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Magecastle Embassy Building A5
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Postby Magecastle Embassy Building A5 » Sun Oct 23, 2022 9:33 pm

Simone Republic wrote:Please remove that joke about volcanic eruptions killing and zombies. It's offensive to anyone who has suffered through volcanic eruptions, such as Colombia, Montserrat or Japan.

Ooc: To be clear, this is far from my intent with this, and I will withdraw and likely abandon this should there be general agreement with this, as I do not want to make a joke that is perceived generally as disrespectful. Why do you feel this way?
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Wallenburg wrote:If you get a Nobel Prize for the time machine because you wanted to win an argument on the Internet, try to remember the little people who started you on that way.
Ever-Wandering Souls wrote:Our research and user feedback found different use cases of bullets, such as hunting, national defense, and murder. Typically, most bullets fired do not kill people. However, sometimes they do. We found that nearly 100% of users were not impacted by shooting one random user every 30 days, reducing the likelihood of a negative impact on the average user.
Comfed wrote:When I look around me at the state of real life politics, with culture war arguments over abortion and LGBT rights, and then I look at the WA and see the same debates about cannibalism, I have hope for the world.

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United Region Alliance
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URA Recommendation

Postby United Region Alliance » Mon Oct 24, 2022 2:26 pm

The URA recommends Voting FOR Repeal: “Volcanic Activity Convention” by a vote of 56.08% FOR and 23.56% AGAINST. 14 of 24 regions voted.

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Wiskirk
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Founded: Sep 23, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Wiskirk » Tue Oct 25, 2022 8:17 am

Against, simple as that.

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Filonian State
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Postby Filonian State » Tue Oct 25, 2022 8:55 am

Honeydewistania wrote:Against.

Me too
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Philimbesi
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Postby Philimbesi » Wed Oct 26, 2022 3:06 am

I rise to case our vote FOR. While generally, we are not as concerned with the ambiguities present in the original, we fully agree that the original is superfluous, and would like to see it eliminated.

Nigel S Youlkin
USP Ambassador to the WA
The Unified States Of Philimbesi
The Honorable Josiah Bartlett - President

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Filonian State
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[AT VOTE] Repeal "Volcanic Activity Convention"

Postby Filonian State » Wed Oct 26, 2022 3:09 am

Against
I'm back
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Great Tuncae
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Ex-Nation

Postby Great Tuncae » Wed Oct 26, 2022 7:51 am

For
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Viscland
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Postby Viscland » Wed Oct 26, 2022 1:41 pm

For - the Convention is no longer necessary
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Refuge Isle
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Refuge Isle » Thu Oct 27, 2022 12:11 pm

Viscland wrote:For - the Convention is no longer necessary

At last, the volcanoes have been quieted and geological peace has been achieved!

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Aldavieria
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Founded: Oct 27, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Aldavieria » Thu Oct 27, 2022 1:46 pm

Magecastle Embassy Building A5 wrote:Approvals go here!

The World Assembly,

Believing that, with the current risk of those previously thought as dead mysteriously awakening, it is indeed an important goal to prevent more people from dying and potentially returning in a zombified form, something which the resolution has contributed to via efforts to ensure that member nations are protected from the often-deadly dangers of volcanic activity; yet

Finding that the resolution has become superfluous since its passage, as "Disaster Precautions and Responses" already ensures that precautions are taken to ensure that member nations are protected from volcanic activity, as well as other disasters, thus eliminating the need for the "Volcanic Activity Convention",

Observing that even the more specific areas of disaster preparedness that the resolution attempts to address -- including "cooperation between member nations [in] handling disasters like multinational volcanic activity" -- are covered by other existing resolutions;

  • The mandates of "Emergency Broadcasting Standards" adequately cover communication between nations affected by a multinational disaster;

  • "Humanitarian Aid Coordination" also ensures the distribution of humanitarian aid to nations in need of the same, such as those victim of volcanic activity or needing to address an outbreak of the undead;

Haunted too by exceedingly unclear and ambiguous wording in many mandates of the resolution, such as Section 2a.iii, which mandates that member nations at risk of volcanic activity reverse damage from recent volcanic activity "within reason"; and Section 2a.ii, which requires member nations at such risk to distribute resources deemed "relevant" and "necessary"; thus both opening the doors to exploitation of the resolution's mandates, and making bona fide attempts at compliance with the resolution's spirit unclear,

Deducing that the resolution is therefore no longer necessary to mitigate the dangers of volcanic activity, while also being ultimately ineffectual in many of its efforts, meaning that there is no real reason to keep the resolution standing,

Repeals the "Volcanic Activity Convention".


The World Assembly,

Believing that it is indeed important there are strong measures in place to protecting member nations from volcanic activity, which poses a significant danger to many member nations, yet

Objecting to the resolution's self-professed "attempt" at this goal, as it stands in blissful ignorance of the metaphorically limp-wristed, overly restrictive, and burdensome nature of many of its mandates -- making it flawed to the point where repeal is imperative,

Convinced that it is in the interests of all member nations to clear the body of World Assembly law of dross that fails to actually achieve its ostensible goal while wasting member nation finances, especially when such legislation is now superfluous and redundant,

Finds as follows _

  • Vague and subjective language is open to abuse by delinquent member nations. For this reason, the resolution's most inoffensive mandates are easily exploitable and open to evasion, contradicting the resolution's aims. Terminology such as conditioning minimisation of damage to the environment as "reasonable", mandating distribution of "necessary" resources, and only requiring reversal of damage from volcanic activity "within reason", is extremely subjective and abusable; delinquent member nations can thus avoid these "duties" and fail to protect themselves from volcanic activity by, for example, refusing to distribute resources on the basis that they are not "necessary", or failing to reverse any more than minimal damage from volcanic activity on the grounds that it is not "within reason" to do so.

  • Further, Section 2b mandates that member nations at risk of volcanic activity "provid[e] aid to each other in an evacuation"; however, the resolution omits any explicit or implicit mandate whatsoever to prevent member nations from misusing such aid. Diversion very rarely occurs in public so as to give nations an opportunity to instead provide non-material aid in response to the diversion. As a result, this will open up a very likely possibility of a receiving nation misusing such aid -- eg diverting all financial aid to politicians' off-shore bank accounts -- but member nations that happen to be at risk of volcanic activity still being forced to throw money and resources to that nation en masse. Wasteful spending mechanisms reduce the amount of funds available for more important projects funded by member nations, including humanitarian aid for nations that actually require such aid. Member nations should not be allowed to dishonestly flush other member nations' funds down the toilet.

  • Repeal of the resolution eliminates no actual substantial protection in volcanic activity, as all of the resolution ultimately falls under the purview of "Humanitarian Aid Coordination", "Disaster Precautions and Responses" and "Emergency Broadcasting Standards", which more comprehensively and competently legislate on protections in all disasters -- including "cooperation between member nations when it comes to handling disasters" -- rather than narrowly only targetting one specific disaster event. This renders the "Volcanic Activity Convention" obsolete, such that it covers nothing original in World Assembly law, and its significant flaws outweigh any benefit it otherwise may have. Further, any flaws in these resolutions ought to be addressed by replacing them with similar omnibi, rather than only targetting an exceedingly narrow scope of any such flaws.

For these reasons, be the "Volcanic Activity Convention" repealed.

The World Assembly,

Agreeing with the resolution that volcanic activity can cause serious damage to nations, and that strong measures are needed to help protect member nations from volcanic activity,

Dissatisfied with the resolution's self-professed "attempt" at this goal, as it stands in blissful ignorance of the overly restrictive, burdensome, and metaphorically limp-wristed nature of many of its mandates -- making it flawed to the point where repeal is imperative,

Believing that it is in the interests of all member nations to clear the body of World Assembly law of dross that wastes member nation finances while failing to actually achieve its ostensible goal,

Finds as follows _

  • Wasteful spending mechanisms reduce the amount of funds available for more important projects funded by member nations -- including humanitarian aid for evacuating nations that actually require such aid. Section 2b, in mandating that member nations at risk of volcanic activity "provid[e] aid to each other in an evacuation" -- opens up a very likely possibility of a receiving nation misusing such aid, but member nations that happen to be at risk of volcanic activity still being forced to provide "aid" en masse to that nation. Without a mandate preventing member nations from diverting this aid -- which is wholly omitted from the resolution -- this will inevitably result in many member nations being forced to throw money and resources to nations unlikely to actually use them for their intended purpose, eg by diverting all financial aid to politicians' off-shore bank accounts. Therefore, the resolution will oftentimes flush precious member nation funds down the toilet for nothing.

  • In addition, the resolution's most inoffensive mandates are easily exploitable and open to evasion. Terminology such as conditioning minimisation of damage to the environment as "reasonable", mandating distribution of "necessary" resources, and only requiring reversal of damage from volcanic activity "within reason", allows delinquent member nations to avoid these duties and fail to protect their nations from volcanic activity by, for example, refusing to distribute resources on the basis that they are not "necessary", or defining attempts to minimise damage to the environment as not "reasonable".

  • Finally, nearly all of the resolution ultimately falls under the purview of "Disaster Precautions and Responses" and "Emergency Broadcasting Standards", which more comprehensively and competently legislate on all disaster situations, rather than narrowly only targetting one disaster situation. This renders the "Volcanic Activity Convention" obsolete, such that it covers nothing original in World Assembly law. Further, any flaws in these resolutions ought to be addressed by replacing them with similar omnibi, rather than only targetting an exceedingly narrow component of them.

For these reasons, be the "Volcanic Activity Convention" repealed.

Agreeing with the resolution that volcanic activity can cause serious damage to nations and their populaces, and that strong measures are necessary to improve the safety of member nations from volcanic activity,

Not satisfied by the resolution's self-professed "attempt" at this goal, as it stands in blissful ignorance of the overly restrictive, burdensome, and metaphorically limp-wristed nature of many of its mandates -- making it flawed to the point where repeal is imperative,

Thoroughly believing that it is in the interests of all member nations to repeal legislation that wastes member nation finances while failing to actually achieve its ostensible goal,

Informed of the following _

  • Wasteful spending mechanisms reduce the amount of funds available for more important projects funded by member nations -- including humanitarian aid for evacuating nations that actually require such aid. Section 2b, in mandating that member nations at risk of volcanic activity "provid[e] aid to each other in an evacuation" -- opens up a very likely possibility of a receiving nation misusing such aid, but member nations that happen to be at risk of volcanic activity still being forced to provide "aid" en masse to that nation. Without a mandate preventing member nations from diverting this aid -- which is wholly omitted from the resolution -- this will inevitably result in many member nations being forced to throw money and resources to nations unlikely to actually use them for their intended purpose, eg by diverting all financial aid to politicians' off-shore bank accounts. Therefore, the resolution will oftentimes flush precious member nation funds down the toilet for nothing.

  • Additionally, the resolution's most inoffensive mandates are easily exploitable and open to evasion. Terminology such as conditioning minimisation of damage to the environment as "reasonable", mandating distribution of "necessary" resources, and only requiring reversal of damage from volcanic activity "within reason", allows delinquent member nations to avoid these duties and fail to protect their nations from volcanic activity by, for example, refusing to distribute resources on the basis that they are not "necessary", or defining attempts to minimise damage to the environment as not "reasonable".

  • Lastly, nearly all of the resolution ultimately falls under the purview of "Disaster Precautions and Responses" and "Emergency Broadcasting Standards", which more comprehensively and competently legislate on all disaster situations, rather than narrowly only targetting one disaster situation. This renders the "Volcanic Activity Convention" obsolete, such that it covers nothing original in World Assembly law. Further, any flaws in these resolutions ought to be addressed by replacing them with similar omnibi, rather than only targetting an exceedingly narrow component of them.
[/list]

Resultantly concluding that, for these reasons, the resolution remains amateurish, puzzling, and redundant, and as resolutions cannot be amended -- only repealed -- thus ought to be repealed,

Unconvinced that there is anything good to be gained by keeping it in the books, instead that repeal of the resolution would help keep the body of World Assembly law clean from useless dross, the World Assembly

Strikes out and repeals the "Volcanic Activity Convention".

Agreeing with the resolution that volcanic activity can cause serious damage to nations and their populaces, and that strong measures are necessary to improve the safety of member nations from volcanic activity,

Dissatisfied with the resolution's self-professed "attempt" at this goal, as it has several overly restrictive, burdensome and metaphorically limp-wristed mandates that make it flawed to the point where repeal is necessary,

Believing that flawed legislation should not be kept in place because of the goal it ostensibly tries to achieve, and reminding member nations that a repeal of this resolution does not prevent the World Assembly from reestablishing protections to achieve similar aims but in a less burdensome and flawed way,

This World Assembly repeals the "Volcanic Activity Convention" for these reasons _

  • The verbiage of 2b -- which, in an attempt to promote cooperation between nations at risk of volcanic activity, requires member nations at such risk to "provide aid to each other in an evacuation" -- does not include any sort of explicit or implicit condition that the evacuation aid be necessary or even helpful for the evacuation, or that the member nation be able to provide such aid. The resolution thus needlessly drains the funds of member nations that happen to be at risk of volcanic activity, as they are now forced to provide aid in every evacuation due to volcanic activity that occurs in the thousands of nations in the world, regardless of the need for such aid, while establishing no mechanism to support member nations unable to cope with this burden. A developing member nation may very well have to defund essential services such as education, public transport, and law enforcement, in order to assist in an evacuation of a small nation on the opposite side of the world which can proceed perfectly without such aid. Inefficient uses of member nation funds reduce the amount of funds available for more important projects funded by member nations -- including humanitarian aid for evacuating nations that actually require such aid.

  • This mandate further flushes member nation funds down the toilet as the resolution omits any prohibition on member nations misusing such aid, or an allowance for member nations to deny aid to nations that misuse the aid. Thus, this mandate still forces member nations to throw money and resources at evacuating nations even if they are, for example, diverting all financial aid to politicians' off-shore bank accounts.

  • The resolution also makes draconian demands through section 2di, which requires member nations to ensure that "anyone at immediate risk of volcanic activity knows how to evacuate, when to evacuate, and where to evacuate to". This includes persons who are mentally incompetent such that ensuring that they know how to evacuate is difficult or impossible -- such as infants, young children, or mentally incapacitated persons -- thus making compliance unrealistic. Further, such an unreasonable demand is not necessary, as the resolution itself implicitly acknowledges in requiring member nations to "evacuate those unable to evacuate themselves".

  • Finally, while the resolution contains a number of overly restrictive and harmful mandates, its most inoffensive mandates can easily be exploited. Terminology such as conditioning minimisation of damage to the environment as "reasonable" and mandating provision of "necessary" resources allows delinquent member nations to avoid these duties and fail to protect their nations from volcanic activity by, for example, refusing to provide resources on the basis that they are not "necessary", or defining attempts to minimise damage to the environment as not "reasonable".

firmly against

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Viscland
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Founded: Jun 28, 2018
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Viscland » Thu Oct 27, 2022 2:29 pm

Refuge Isle wrote:
Viscland wrote:For - the Convention is no longer necessary

At last, the volcanoes have been quieted and geological peace has been achieved!


As is quite clearly stated in the resolution, the provisions of the Volcanic Activity Convention are already provided for by other resolutions.
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Saomepont Katopir
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Founded: May 12, 2022
Ex-Nation

Postby Saomepont Katopir » Tue Nov 01, 2022 5:02 pm

"Defeated" - good riddance as a lava fan.

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Tinhampton
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Founded: Oct 05, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Tinhampton » Tue Nov 01, 2022 5:30 pm

"Repeal "Volcanic Activity Convention"" was defeated 10,302 votes to 5,859. (36.25% support)
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Potted Plants United
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Founded: Jan 14, 2013
Democratic Socialists

Postby Potted Plants United » Wed Nov 02, 2022 2:28 pm

OOC: Slightly sad I missed the vote, but happy that my opinion won. :P
Last edited by Potted Plants United on Thu Nov 03, 2022 7:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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