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[Drafting Still] Maternity and Childcare Support

Where WA members debate how to improve the world, one resolution at a time.

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Godular
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11065
Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Tue Jun 09, 2020 4:33 am

WA Kitty Kops wrote:
Godular wrote:That is exactly the point of it. It is specifically geared towards addressing many of the reasons that a woman might have to get an abortion by simply making them into a non-factor.

OOC: But you could easily do that without underlining the anti-abortion ideology...


OOC: When bringing up a compromise measure, it is somewhat important to outline where the conflict is. Will this stop all the repeal efforts? No, but they’ll have a harder time claiming they are not being listened to.
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Pope Saint Peter the Apostle
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 160
Founded: May 19, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Pope Saint Peter the Apostle » Tue Jun 09, 2020 8:15 am

Godular wrote:
WA Kitty Kops wrote:OOC: But you could easily do that without underlining the anti-abortion ideology...


OOC: When bringing up a compromise measure, it is somewhat important to outline where the conflict is. Will this stop all the repeal efforts? No, but they’ll have a harder time claiming they are not being listened to.

Ambassador, you cannot pretend this is a "compromise"; you say you acknowledge "that many nations have moral qualms regarding abortion access, and often feel disenfranchised by the prevailing atmosphere of perceived lack of compromise and understanding", yet at the same time require us to provide people with free abortions. Opposed per CCC 2270-2275.

--Saint Gerard Majella, C.Ss.R., patron of the unborn children and pregnant women
Senior consuasor ad Sancti Imperium
Keep alert, stand firm in your faith, be courageous, be strong. 1 Cor. 16:13 (NRSVCE)

Pro: Catholicism, Consistent ethic of life, Second Amendment, Welfare.
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Godular
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Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:50 am

Pope Saint Peter the Apostle wrote:
Godular wrote:
OOC: When bringing up a compromise measure, it is somewhat important to outline where the conflict is. Will this stop all the repeal efforts? No, but they’ll have a harder time claiming they are not being listened to.

Ambassador, you cannot pretend this is a "compromise"; you say you acknowledge "that many nations have moral qualms regarding abortion access, and often feel disenfranchised by the prevailing atmosphere of perceived lack of compromise and understanding", yet at the same time require us to provide people with free abortions. Opposed per CCC 2270-2275.

--Saint Gerard Majella, C.Ss.R., patron of the unborn children and pregnant women
Senior consuasor ad Sancti Imperium


"It is a medical procedure per Reproductive Freedoms, and it is relevant to a pregnancy. It is logically necessary to include it among those services that should be offered free. It is a measure that is intended to assist in reducing the frequency of women feeling it necessary to seek out abortion services, without disrupting their right to do so. Whether you like it or not, this IS a compromise. Your objective is furthered while the pro-choice objective remains unhindered.

"I would suggest that it would be more productive to your agenda to support this resolution, as opposition would leave the door open for resolutions such as Access to Abortion to be reintroduced. That resolution might have failed to reach quorum the first time, but it is far more likely to pass than any attempt at a repeal of Reproductive Freedoms. I must ask you then, if you wish to continue your presence within this organization, would you prefer that ALL of the legislation be antagonistic, or that some of these measures at least try to account for your position?"
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Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
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Godular
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Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Sun Jun 14, 2020 9:19 pm

“Are there comments that other folks have regarding this proposal? I’m noting at the moment that I’m getting surprisingly varied impressions from folks in that it is being seen as overly pro-life AND overly pro-choice, which strikes me as a good sign! A good compromise shouldn’t favor one side over the other.

“Is there anything else that folks might recommend as a positive measure for this proposal? Maybe there’s an angle I missed? It still feels too early to fling this into the queue, and I want to incorporate some (OOC) changes, but it would mess up the formatting.”
Last edited by Godular on Sun Jun 14, 2020 9:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
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Godular
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Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:24 pm

OOC: Am I allowed to bump things in this forum for the sake of letting folks know that I'm still accepting suggestions about any changes that might still be needed?
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Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
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Godular
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Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:53 am

Question: Would allowing nations to set a time limit on when an ‘elective’ abortion can be carried out contradict previous legislation? I can’t recall if viability/trimester stuff ever came up.
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Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
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Anurial
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 45
Founded: Feb 17, 2020
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Anurial » Mon Jun 29, 2020 8:03 am

"Alleviating the potential financial burden that an unexpected child can bring is an excellent step in both extending freedom of choice and lowering abortion rates"

OOC: I've never tried writing or contributing to WA resolutions, though is providing financial assistance to certain nations unable to foot the bill a possibility?
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Godular
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Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Mon Jun 29, 2020 8:07 am

Anurial wrote:"Alleviating the potential financial burden that an unexpected child can bring is an excellent step in both extending freedom of choice and lowering abortion rates"

OOC: I've never tried writing or contributing to WA resolutions, though is providing financial assistance to certain nations unable to foot the bill a possibility?


Such is a possibility, and I’d be inclined to incorporate such content into this proposal, but I’d likely need to do some research on setting that section up, and that’s harder to do on a phone.
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Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
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Kenmoria
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Founded: Jul 03, 2017
Corporate Bordello

Postby Kenmoria » Mon Jun 29, 2020 8:55 am

Godular wrote:Question: Would allowing nations to set a time limit on when an ‘elective’ abortion can be carried out contradict previous legislation? I can’t recall if viability/trimester stuff ever came up.

(OOC: That would contradict Reproductive Freedoms, GA #286, which mandates that member nations permit abortion in all circumstances.)
A representative democracy with a parliament of 535 seats
Kenmoria is Laissez-Faire on economy but centre-left on social issues
Located in Europe and border France to the right and Spain below
NS stats and policies are not canon, use the factbooks
Not in the WA despite coincidentally following nearly all resolutions
This is due to a problem with how the WA contradicts democracy
However we do have a WA mission and often participate in drafting
Current ambassador: James Lewitt

For more information, read the factbooks here.

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Godular
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Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Mon Jun 29, 2020 9:24 am

Kenmoria wrote:
Godular wrote:Question: Would allowing nations to set a time limit on when an ‘elective’ abortion can be carried out contradict previous legislation? I can’t recall if viability/trimester stuff ever came up.

(OOC: That would contradict Reproductive Freedoms, GA #286, which mandates that member nations permit abortion in all circumstances.)


Righto. Thanks for that. Doing research on a phone is excessive amounts of bleh.
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Dormant RP: Throne of the Fallen Empire

Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
Post responsibly.

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Pope Saint Peter the Apostle
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 160
Founded: May 19, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Pope Saint Peter the Apostle » Mon Jun 29, 2020 9:41 am

Kenmoria wrote:
Godular wrote:Question: Would allowing nations to set a time limit on when an ‘elective’ abortion can be carried out contradict previous legislation? I can’t recall if viability/trimester stuff ever came up.

(OOC: That would contradict Reproductive Freedoms, GA #286, which mandates that member nations permit abortion in all circumstances.)

OOC: I might be misreading something, but I do not see anything in 286 that mandates that abortions at all stages of life be allowed.
Keep alert, stand firm in your faith, be courageous, be strong. 1 Cor. 16:13 (NRSVCE)

Pro: Catholicism, Consistent ethic of life, Second Amendment, Welfare.
Anti: Fascism, Socialism, Trump, Sedevacantism, Utilitarianism.
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Kenmoria
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Founded: Jul 03, 2017
Corporate Bordello

Postby Kenmoria » Mon Jun 29, 2020 9:48 am

Pope Saint Peter the Apostle wrote:
Kenmoria wrote:(OOC: That would contradict Reproductive Freedoms, GA #286, which mandates that member nations permit abortion in all circumstances.)

OOC: I might be misreading something, but I do not see anything in 286 that mandates that abortions at all stages of life be allowed.

(OOC: I’m looking at ‘DEMANDS that Member Nations prohibit any impediment to the termination of pregnancy that is not applied to medical procedures of similar risk and complexity.’ Any form of restriction on an abortion would fall under this, unless also applied to other medical procedures of similar complexity. I don’t see a time or trimester limit as being reasonably applicable to other medical procedures.)
A representative democracy with a parliament of 535 seats
Kenmoria is Laissez-Faire on economy but centre-left on social issues
Located in Europe and border France to the right and Spain below
NS stats and policies are not canon, use the factbooks
Not in the WA despite coincidentally following nearly all resolutions
This is due to a problem with how the WA contradicts democracy
However we do have a WA mission and often participate in drafting
Current ambassador: James Lewitt

For more information, read the factbooks here.

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Pope Saint Peter the Apostle
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 160
Founded: May 19, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Pope Saint Peter the Apostle » Mon Jun 29, 2020 9:52 am

Kenmoria wrote:
Pope Saint Peter the Apostle wrote:OOC: I might be misreading something, but I do not see anything in 286 that mandates that abortions at all stages of life be allowed.

(OOC: I’m looking at ‘DEMANDS that Member Nations prohibit any impediment to the termination of pregnancy that is not applied to medical procedures of similar risk and complexity.’ Any form of restriction on an abortion would fall under this, unless also applied to other medical procedures of similar complexity. I don’t see a time or trimester limit as being reasonably applicable to other medical procedures.)

OOC: I am not a doctor so I don't know how the complexity and risks of late-stage abortions exactly match up against other procedures, so - as far as I am aware - this clause may or may not prohibit such restrictions. (However, it shouldn't regardless.)
Keep alert, stand firm in your faith, be courageous, be strong. 1 Cor. 16:13 (NRSVCE)

Pro: Catholicism, Consistent ethic of life, Second Amendment, Welfare.
Anti: Fascism, Socialism, Trump, Sedevacantism, Utilitarianism.
WA member. IC comments made by patron saints, representing the Holy See.

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Godular
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Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Mon Jun 29, 2020 10:15 am

Made another change, accounting for Araraukar’s issue with section 2C, replacing it with a funding measure. Let me know if it needs revision.
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Dormant RP: Throne of the Fallen Empire

Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
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Kenmoria
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Corporate Bordello

Postby Kenmoria » Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:09 am

Godular wrote:Made another change, accounting for Araraukar’s issue with section 2C, replacing it with a funding measure. Let me know if it needs revision.

(OOC: I recommend using the preexisting World Assembly General Fund rather than creating a new committee.)
A representative democracy with a parliament of 535 seats
Kenmoria is Laissez-Faire on economy but centre-left on social issues
Located in Europe and border France to the right and Spain below
NS stats and policies are not canon, use the factbooks
Not in the WA despite coincidentally following nearly all resolutions
This is due to a problem with how the WA contradicts democracy
However we do have a WA mission and often participate in drafting
Current ambassador: James Lewitt

For more information, read the factbooks here.

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Godular
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Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:21 am

Kenmoria wrote:
Godular wrote:Made another change, accounting for Araraukar’s issue with section 2C, replacing it with a funding measure. Let me know if it needs revision.

(OOC: I recommend using the preexisting World Assembly General Fund rather than creating a new committee.)


‘tis done
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Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
Post responsibly.

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Araraukar
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Posts: 15273
Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Mon Jun 29, 2020 6:43 pm

Godular wrote:Funding: Resources from the World Assembly General Fund shall be utilized to address the needs of any nations that would be financially overburdened in adhering to the mandates presented in this legislation.

OOC: Make that something like "...any nations that are provenly unable to financially adhere to..." to avoid any anti-abortion nations simply using the WAGF instead of their own moneys (remember that WAGF gets its moneys off of even the poorest of WA nations) to fund anything to do with the surplus children that they don't want people to abort, but don't want to support them either.
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Godular
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Postby Godular » Mon Jun 29, 2020 6:47 pm

Araraukar wrote:
Godular wrote:Funding: Resources from the World Assembly General Fund shall be utilized to address the needs of any nations that would be financially overburdened in adhering to the mandates presented in this legislation.

OOC: Make that something like "...any nations that are provenly unable to financially adhere to..." to avoid any anti-abortion nations simply using the WAGF instead of their own moneys (remember that WAGF gets its moneys off of even the poorest of WA nations) to fund anything to do with the surplus children that they don't want people to abort, but don't want to support them either.


This is also done.
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Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
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Attancia
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Founded: May 01, 2020
Moralistic Democracy

Postby Attancia » Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:09 pm

United Massachusetts wrote:We would clap and applaud enthusiastically at this did it not mandate state funding for "termination of pregnancy."

"As would we. As a nation with the glories of religion deeply engrained in our culture, that simply cannot be."
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Godular
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Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:21 pm

Attancia wrote:
United Massachusetts wrote:We would clap and applaud enthusiastically at this did it not mandate state funding for "termination of pregnancy."

"As would we. As a nation with the glories of religion deeply engrained in our culture, that simply cannot be."


“‘Tis better to be free and rare than to be banned, which itself is a functional impossibility in the World Assembly. You want the WA to aid in reducing abortion numbers? This right here is your best option, if I might be so bold as to say.”
RL position
Active RP: ASCENSION
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Dormant RP: Throne of the Fallen Empire

Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
Post responsibly.

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Pope Saint Peter the Apostle
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 160
Founded: May 19, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Pope Saint Peter the Apostle » Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:53 pm

Godular wrote:
Attancia wrote:"As would we. As a nation with the glories of religion deeply engrained in our culture, that simply cannot be."


“‘Tis better to be free and rare than to be banned, which itself is a functional impossibility in the World Assembly. You want the WA to aid in reducing abortion numbers? This right here is your best option, if I might be so bold as to say.”

Ambassador, instead of this proposal (including state-funded killings of unborn babies), we can work on a proposal that reduces the number of abortions without such a mandate, if the Ambassador insists on including it in his proposal.

--Saint Gerard Majella, C.Ss.R., patron of the unborn children and pregnant women
Senior consuasor ad Sancti Imperium
Last edited by Pope Saint Peter the Apostle on Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
Keep alert, stand firm in your faith, be courageous, be strong. 1 Cor. 16:13 (NRSVCE)

Pro: Catholicism, Consistent ethic of life, Second Amendment, Welfare.
Anti: Fascism, Socialism, Trump, Sedevacantism, Utilitarianism.
WA member. IC comments made by patron saints, representing the Holy See.

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Araraukar
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15273
Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:59 am

OOC: Definitions are a problem. The welfare thing and members are unnecessary, while at-risk STILL catches every fucking one person who has a child. You should also change it to define at-risk HOUSEHOLD instead, as that's what the mandates use.
- Linda Äyrämäki, acting ambassador in the absence of miss Leveret
Araraukar's RP reality is Modern Tech solarpunk. In IC in the WA.
Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
Coronavirus related. This too. And this. These are all jokes. This isn't. This is, again, but it's also the last one.

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Godular
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11065
Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:51 am

Araraukar wrote:OOC: Definitions are a problem. The welfare thing and members are unnecessary, while at-risk STILL catches every fucking one person who has a child. You should also change it to define at-risk HOUSEHOLD instead, as that's what the mandates use.


Ah, thanks. I’m sorry for not acting on your concern earlier, as I wasn’t sure how I should go about remedying it. This answers that concern.

Edited: Change incorporated. Please let me know if I need to revise some other phraseology.
Last edited by Godular on Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
RL position
Active RP: ASCENSION
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Dormant RP: Throne of the Fallen Empire

Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
Post responsibly.

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Godular
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11065
Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:30 pm

OOC: I'd like to get other folks thoughts on whether this is ready to submit yet, or if I still need to make some alterations. I understand that this won't make everyone happy, as such is to be expected with any legislation, but I would like to know if there are any things that could be added or amended. I would be much appreciative.
RL position
Active RP: ASCENSION
Active RP: SHENRYAX
Dormant RP: Throne of the Fallen Empire

Faction 1: The An'Kazar Control Framework of Godular-- An enormously advanced collective of formerly human bioborgs that are vastly experienced in both inter-dimensional travel and asymmetrical warfare.
A 1.08 civilization, according to this Nation Index Thingie
I don't normally use NS stats. But when I do, I prefer Dos Eckis I can STILL kill you.
Post responsibly.

User avatar
Kenmoria
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6373
Founded: Jul 03, 2017
Corporate Bordello

Postby Kenmoria » Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:11 pm

“In clause 1a, ‘Includes childbirth and abortion’ isn’t a proper sentence. I recommend changing it to ‘including childbirth and abortion’ and making it a clause of the previous sentence.”
A representative democracy with a parliament of 535 seats
Kenmoria is Laissez-Faire on economy but centre-left on social issues
Located in Europe and border France to the right and Spain below
NS stats and policies are not canon, use the factbooks
Not in the WA despite coincidentally following nearly all resolutions
This is due to a problem with how the WA contradicts democracy
However we do have a WA mission and often participate in drafting
Current ambassador: James Lewitt

For more information, read the factbooks here.

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