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[PASSED] Access to Abortion

A carefully preserved record of the most notable World Assembly debates.

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Wallenburg
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 20769
Founded: Jan 30, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Wallenburg » Fri Jul 10, 2020 1:25 pm

United Massachusetts wrote:The World Assembly continues to grasp at a sovereignty it never enjoyed to begin with. Unsurprising.

I expected a better grasp of the most basic mechanics of the World Assembly from such a well-established regular.
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ImperialRussia
Envoy
 
Posts: 295
Founded: May 16, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby ImperialRussia » Fri Jul 10, 2020 1:33 pm

These our children in my nation and we should respect them for our future generations and not murder them these our people they’ll shall mercy from birth no matter if there adopted. Will still oppose abortion because it’s murder no matter if the victim is rapped the rapist will Be sentenced to death and the government ensure maternity leave for child so it the governments burden to take care of the child and so it’s the mothers choose to adopt child or take care on her own. Our government are not dogs that who killed there kin if it wasn’t there blood will give mercy to those who not given a choice to live because there father was a coward who decided to rape someone for there perverted it our choice to take care of the child and not to abort but adopt it to our military and train that to do better in society and tell what his father mistake shall never will repeat again.
Last edited by ImperialRussia on Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:04 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Godular
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10696
Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Fri Jul 10, 2020 1:36 pm

ImperialRussia wrote:These our children in my nation and we should respect them for our future generations and not murder them these our people they’ll shall mercy from birth no matter if there adopted.


“I’m sorry, what?”
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MC United
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Posts: 204
Founded: Jan 05, 2011
New York Times Democracy

Postby MC United » Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:04 pm

The New California Republic wrote:
MC United wrote:The rabid anti-life faction of the WA may think they can force supply, but they bloody well cannot force demand.

But Ambassador, the demand must surely be there if this is an issue in the first place?

"The distinguished Ambassador from The New California Republic perhaps assumes that the demand is uniformly spread throughout the members of the WA. MC United can assure him that is not the case. There is very little demand for the execution of unborn citizens in MC United.

Uniter values recognize the necessity for the procedure in cases where the physical life of the mother is threatened, in which case it becomes a matter of self-defense. Many Uniters are also willing to look away in instances of rape or incest. Abortion on the basis of "mental distress" or the like is strongly discouraged, as the exception that swallows the rule; counseling is readily available in such cases. Abortion for mere convenience, or refusal to accept responsibility, is even more strongly discouraged in Uniter society.

The government of MC United intends to do everything possible to maintain Uniter values in the face of the determination of the rabid anti-life faction of the WA to spread its values, in particular its demand for unrestricted execution of unborn citizens, at taxpayer expense, into its society."

Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote: You could... idfkn quit the WA instead of contorting yourself in this medieval manner.


“The suggestion of the Ambassador from Austria-Bohemia-Hungary, and his characterization of the policy of MC United, has been conveyed to our government and shall be given all the consideration it is due.”
Last edited by MC United on Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:11 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Omigodtheykilledkenny
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5697
Founded: Mar 14, 2005
Capitalizt

Postby Omigodtheykilledkenny » Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:11 pm

"Ladies and gentlemen, the Kennyite delegation would like to announce...that the Strangers' Bar needs to do a better job protecting its liquor--HEY, GET OFF, GET OFF ME!!"

Jimmy, for the moment, had staved off his Secret Service detail's attempt to take back his apparently pilfered Wild Turkey 101 bottle; he took a hearty swig before wiping off his mouth.

"I apologize that the actual ambassador could not be here," the secretary slurred drunkenly. "Assuredly she had other important matters to sort." ...On the cable-news circuit, he finished silently to himself; either trying to shout down Leo Terrell or flirt it up with Touré...Oh God, please don't let her be flirting with Touré; the last time she had to fight off a harassment complaint..."NO, GET OFF, ASSHOLES, GET OFF!!" Valiantly the Secret Service had again tried, albeit failed, to recover Neville's bottle before the barlord tried to add a hefty surcharge to the Kennyites' tab. It was bad enough Jimmy had already been hitting the hard stuff a lot more heavily since Sammy passed, but now having to sit through another distressing abortion debate...?

"We are pleased that this assembly has found yet another excuse to return to its favorite subject of debate," Jimmy soldiered on, mushmouthed, as though there had been no interruption, "and so dearly heartened that this latest round of nonsense makes all of you feel so special. But I tell you one thing: Sammy never would have stood for this; he would have...no, actually, at this point he probably would be at the bar making out with his girlfriend, or he would have simply disappeared for weeks on end...you know, he actually wasn't a very good ambassador...but the point stands--GET OFF ME, LOSERS!!"

Presently, Jimmy had tried to demonstrate his resolve by lightly stomping the floor where he stood, but now was swaying uncomfortably. As though to remedy his momentary dizziness, he stole another swig. "My point being that the irritating persistence of both factions on this issue, bringing it up again and again and again for vote, has driven many innocent bystanders to the bottle!" Jimmy's bottle, incidentally, was in jeopardy once again, as a brave agent tried to make a dive for it; somehow the inebriated secretary dodged the assault (leaving the agent to crash to the floor, defeated) and held his prize aloft in a triumphant manner, adding, with dramatic flair, an appropriately Heston-esque salute:

"FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!!!--NO, GET OFF!!"




"...by the way, we voted against."
Last edited by Omigodtheykilledkenny on Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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ImperialRussia
Envoy
 
Posts: 295
Founded: May 16, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby ImperialRussia » Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:19 pm

Children are always to suffer in abortions give them mercy to ban abortion so they can succeed in there Living as a decent person or citizen.

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Draganisia
Envoy
 
Posts: 221
Founded: Nov 17, 2010
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Draganisia » Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:19 pm

Eventually the Draganisia Ambassador would return to the WA after talking things over with the Emperor.

"While we are still against this we have decided that we will let the WA enforce it's legality if it passes along with all other WA laws. I'd like to tell you exactly why we changed our minds from our earlier position but... Let's just say that conversation wouldn't be appropriate for here."
Last edited by Draganisia on Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Wallenburg
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Posts: 20769
Founded: Jan 30, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Wallenburg » Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:33 pm

ImperialRussia wrote:These our children in my nation and we should respect them for our future generations and not murder them these our people they’ll shall mercy from birth no matter if there adopted. Will still oppose abortion because it’s murder no matter if the victim is rapped the rapist will Be sentenced to death and the government ensure maternity leave for child so it the governments burden to take care of the child and so it’s the mothers choose to adopt child or take care on her own. Our government are not dogs that who killed there kin if it wasn’t there blood will give mercy to those who not given a choice to live because there father was a coward who decided to rape someone for there perverted it our choice to take care of the child and not to abort but adopt it to our military and train that to do better in society and tell what his father mistake shall never will repeat again.

Ah yes, execution and conscription into war, true marks of a pro-life policy platform.
THERE IS NO WAR IN BA SING SE
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Jutsa
Senator
 
Posts: 4963
Founded: Dec 06, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Jutsa » Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:39 pm

"To point out to many seemingly drunk ambassadors complaining about sovereignty over choice vs. life, we do already have legislation that mandates that abortion be made legal and available. It's the principle of yet a third piece of similar, albeit better written, legislation being passed forcing all nations and taxpayers to pay for it, at times potentially at the expense of national security. Not to mention that existing legislation comes off at least somewhat considerate, while this appears arrogant and inconsiderate to those who are pro-life."
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Attempted Socialism
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Founded: Feb 21, 2011
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Attempted Socialism » Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:49 pm

Jutsa wrote:"To point out to many seemingly drunk ambassadors complaining about sovereignty over choice vs. life, we do already have legislation that mandates that abortion be made legal and available. It's the principle of yet a third piece of similar, albeit better written, legislation being passed forcing all nations and taxpayers to pay for it, at times potentially at the expense of national security. Not to mention that existing legislation comes off at least somewhat considerate, while this appears arrogant and inconsiderate to those who are pro-life."

"Not quite. As anyone with more than a passing familiarity of the anti-choice advocates in the World Assembly knows, the anti-choice delegations have long flaunted their complete disregard for the laws and the decent compromises they represented. That is why On Abortion had to be assisted by Reproductive Freedom, and now those two resolutions can be further supported by passing Access to Abortion. If anti-choice nations had simply accepted the laws when they passed, and the verdict of the many failed repeals, rather than the continued and flagrant disregard for established World Assembly law, this whole thing would have stopped around On Abortion. The increased hostility that you think you detect is a very measured, very respectful and very considerate response to years and decades of aggressive and deliberate lawlessness perpetrated by a few rogue states."


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Flying Eagles
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 169
Founded: Nov 04, 2017
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Flying Eagles » Fri Jul 10, 2020 3:47 pm

We now realize that GAR#286 already legalized abortion on demand. Since our position is that GAR#128 is sufficient, we must all block this resolution and repeal GAR#286.
Last edited by Flying Eagles on Fri Jul 10, 2020 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Velosia
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Founded: Nov 29, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Velosia » Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:13 pm

Kingdom of Velosia
AGAINST

Firstly, we want to make it clear that the majority of Velosians support the intended outcome of this resolution, as does this delegation as it is assembled here today. However we must respectfully oppose the passage of this resolution due to the significant financial and societal problems that have the potential to arise within developing member nations and member nations with large populations of citizens who are either wary of or openly opposed to membership within the World Assembly.

The relatively few outliers aside, the majority of member nations that are set to be most affected by this resolution are already host to substantial numbers of citizens who, as a result of financial or political problems currently facing their societies, are unable to access the most basic healthcare, even without the added obligations called for in this resolution. Even if not a majority, a not-insignificant number of member nations would not have the financial means or the infrastructure necessary to effectively implement the various programmes and institutions this resolution aims to establish.

It's also important to note that the poorest and most politically unstable nations are also often the most religiously and socially conservative. Not only will this resolution negatively impact the economies of the nations it will almost certainly apply the most to, it also risks harming the ongoing efforts of this assembly to bring a swift, but considerate, end to national anti-abortion legislation. Whilst this delegation is aware of the numerous extent resolutions that openly support the right to abortion, they generally approach the issue in a more respectful and less economically damaging way. This particular resolution on the subject, while laudable in what it ultimately hopes to achieve, is borderline hostile in its opening and needlessly punitive in its intent.

Our interpretation of this resolution is that, given the mandatory financial obligations and seeming lack of exceptions or provisions for nations that are unable to meet said obligations, it will only serve to negatively affect member nations that are already in difficult financial and societal situations. The majority of the developed world, with healthcare systems and economies that are able to take on the additional costs and obligations this resolution calls for, already have comprehensive national abortion legislation that meets the internationally-acceptable standards set by the World Assembly. As such, we cannot offer our support to this resolution.
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Jutsa
Senator
 
Posts: 4963
Founded: Dec 06, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Jutsa » Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:17 pm

"Not quite. As anyone with more than a passing familiarity of the anti-choice advocates in the World Assembly knows, the anti-choice delegations have long flaunted their complete disregard for the laws and the decent compromises they represented. That is why On Abortion had to be assisted by Reproductive Freedom, and now those two resolutions can be further supported by passing Access to Abortion. If anti-choice nations had simply accepted the laws when they passed, and the verdict of the many failed repeals, rather than the continued and flagrant disregard for established World Assembly law, this whole thing would have stopped around On Abortion. The increased hostility that you think you detect is a very measured, very respectful and very considerate response to years and decades of aggressive and deliberate lawlessness perpetrated by a few rogue states."


"This is somewhat my point, ambassador. Pro-choice already has two bodies of increasingly progressive legislation, and pro-life has none. While we're in favor of pro-choice,
I think you're missing our point — Reproductive Freedom is not a "decent compromise", it is a strictly pro-choice stance.
And yet those bodies of legislation stand not repealed. Yet, anyway.

Furthermore,"
DEMANDS that Member Nations prohibit any impediment to the termination of pregnancy that is not applied to medical procedures of similar risk and complexity,

"I think if there are nations circumnavigating this existing clause, then you have a much larger issue than passing another resolution saying the same thing,
yet also making the nationstate pay for everything and mandating patients be flown to neighboring countries,
almost regardless of context, if access is deemed 'not quick enough'.

I think it's safe to say things could have stopped at On Abortion. Anything more, as this states,
is anything but a 'very measured, very respectable and very considerate response', as you put it."
Last edited by Jutsa on Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Omigodtheykilledkenny
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Capitalizt

Postby Omigodtheykilledkenny » Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:18 pm

Attempted Socialism wrote:"anti-choice...anti-choice...anti-choice...blah blah blah"

Still waving around his Wild Turkey™ bottle, Jimmy turned toward the Palentine delegation, where Sen. Sulla appeared to be drinking moonshine straight from the jar. "Horatio, my good man," he cheerfully slurred: "This calls for a drinking game; one shot everytime some idiot says 'anti-choice'. I bet I drink you right under the table, you flipping lightweight!"

He burped loudly and nearly fell on his ass while trying to back into his seat...then, naturally, took another swig.



EDIT: I must have been drunk myself when I was trying to type this.
Last edited by Omigodtheykilledkenny on Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:32 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Godular
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10696
Founded: Sep 09, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:19 pm

Velosia wrote:
Kingdom of Velosia
AGAINST

Firstly, we want to make it clear that the majority of Velosians support the intended outcome of this resolution, as does this delegation as it is assembled here today. However we must respectfully oppose the passage of this resolution due to the significant financial and societal problems that have the potential to arise within developing member nations and member nations with large populations of citizens who are either wary of or openly opposed to membership within the World Assembly.

The relatively few outliers aside, the majority of member nations that are set to be most affected by this resolution are already host to substantial numbers of citizens who, as a result of financial or political problems currently facing their societies, are unable to access the most basic healthcare, even without the added obligations called for in this resolution. Even if not a majority, a not-insignificant number of member nations would not have the financial means or the infrastructure necessary to effectively implement the various programmes and institutions this resolution aims to establish.

It's also important to note that the poorest and most politically unstable nations are also often the most religiously and socially conservative. Not only will this resolution negatively impact the economies of the nations it will almost certainly apply the most to, it also risks harming the ongoing efforts of this assembly to bring a swift, but considerate, end to national anti-abortion legislation. Whilst this delegation is aware of the numerous extent resolutions that openly support the right to abortion, they generally approach the issue in a more respectful and less economically damaging way. This particular resolution on the subject, while laudable in what it ultimately hopes to achieve, is borderline hostile in its opening and needlessly punitive in its intent.

Our interpretation of this resolution is that, given the mandatory financial obligations and seeming lack of exceptions or provisions for nations that are unable to meet said obligations, it will only serve to negatively affect member nations that are already in difficult financial and societal situations. The majority of the developed world, with healthcare systems and economies that are able to take on the additional costs and obligations this resolution calls for, already have comprehensive national abortion legislation that meets the internationally-acceptable standards set by the World Assembly. As such, we cannot offer our support to this resolution.


“Concerns about financial impact have already been addressed. Any nation with demonstrable financial difficulties in the implementation of this resolution can receive assistance from the WA General Fund in order to do so.”
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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Founded: Jun 28, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:24 pm

I'm just surprised at the number of nations coming forth to argue that they have a financial inability to provide common and important oral hormone supplements. Do y'all also have this problem when it comes to insulin?
Last edited by Austria-Bohemia-Hungary on Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Picairn
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Founded: Feb 21, 2020
New York Times Democracy

Postby Picairn » Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:47 pm

Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:I'm just surprised at the number of nations coming forth to argue that they have a financial inability to provide common and important oral hormone supplements. Do y'all also have this problem when it comes to insulin?

Read the proposal carefully. It also mandates that nations must subsidise travels for abortion abroad and cover the costs for the building, operation and maintenance of abortion clinics, ready to speedily provide free contraceptives and other abortion services upon request. Not to mention that all abortion clinics will be tax-exempt from now on when the proposal pass.

This is eye-poppingly expensive. In the real world, not even European countries or Canada subsidises travel and other services for abortions. This proposal would be mocked and demolished for incurring enormous costs.
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Tinfect
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Tinfect » Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:55 pm

Picairn wrote:Not to mention that all abortion clinics will be tax-exempt from now on when the proposal passes.


OOC:
This only applies to clinics built under Section 4. If you would like to preempt this measure, ensure that your citizens have access to clinics.
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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Posts: 13369
Founded: Jun 28, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:57 pm

Picairn wrote:
Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:I'm just surprised at the number of nations coming forth to argue that they have a financial inability to provide common and important oral hormone supplements. Do y'all also have this problem when it comes to insulin?

Read the proposal carefully. It also mandates that nations must subsidise travels for abortion abroad and cover the costs for the building, operation and maintenance of abortion clinics, ready to speedily provide free contraceptives and other abortion services upon request. Not to mention that all abortion clinics will be tax-exempt from now on when the proposal pass.

This is eye-poppingly expensive. In the real world, not even European countries or Canada subsidises travel and other services for abortions. This proposal would be mocked and demolished for incurring enormous costs.

OOC: Did you notice that all this that you are bringing up is in case of rampant inaccessibility compounded by a government ideologically unwilling to address this issue? I don't see why European countries or Canada needs to subside travel when abortifacients, education and contraceptives are readily available. Maybe if you are Romania where abortion is illegal and you have to smuggle IUD's in from West Germany.
Last edited by Austria-Bohemia-Hungary on Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:59 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Jutsa
Senator
 
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Founded: Dec 06, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Jutsa » Fri Jul 10, 2020 5:02 pm

"Correct, but rampant inaccessibility is supposed to be the whole point of this legislation's acting toward reducing, and, in fact, a non-insignificant part of existing legislation.
Furthermore, I still fail to see how having the state pay for and provide travel to conflicting nations, regardless of other circumstances,
such as disease, the potential for armed conflict, non-WA status thus having potentially lower safety standards, etc, would be a good idea in practice."
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United Massachusetts
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby United Massachusetts » Fri Jul 10, 2020 5:03 pm

IC: "Ah yes, and then we get the rhetoric about how poor nations can just "take money from the General Fund" to implement whatever resolution they want. When the General Fund is a bottomless pit, it is tremendously easy to write legislation. There is no scarcity, no creativity, nothing of the sort. I may be forced to write a resolution to give everyone $100,000 each month, because the logic is eerily similar."

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The Palentine
Diplomat
 
Posts: 694
Founded: May 18, 2005
Mother Knows Best State

Postby The Palentine » Fri Jul 10, 2020 5:04 pm

Omigodtheykilledkenny wrote:
Attempted Socialism wrote:"anti-choice...anti-choice...anti-choice...blah blah blah"

Still waving around his Wild Turkey™ bottle, Jimmy turned toward the Palentine delegation, where Sen. Sulla appeared to be drinking moonshine straight from the jar. "Horatio, my good man," he cheerfully slurred: "This calls for a drinking game; one shot everytime some idiot says 'anti-choice'. I bet I drink you right under the table, you flipping lightweight!"

He burped loudly and nearly fell on his ass while trying to back into his seat...then, naturally, took another swig.



EDIT: I must have been drunk myself when I was trying to type this.


The good but unwholsome old reprobate gives Jimmy a smile most unpleasent and says,

"Why the hell not? Its not like theres going to be a shock about this vote's outcome. The damned Festering Snakepit is softer than a sock full of Grits. Might as well further hobnail my liver. Try to keep up this time, ya mary!"

The good but unwholesome Senator turns to an intern and says,
"Baskim, my Boy! Go fetch some more hooch from my office. Time to show this Kennyite how a real man drinks...and bring the 190 proof good stuff!"

As the intern hurries off, Sen Sulla gives Jimmy a salute and downs a fresh swig of Old Fashioned Appalachian Snakebite Remedy.
Last edited by The Palentine on Fri Jul 10, 2020 5:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Imperium Anglorum
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9593
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Fri Jul 10, 2020 5:40 pm

United Massachusetts wrote:It looks as though TNP propped this up to vote by installing delegates. It is unfortunate, needless to say.

This is really fucking rich coming from UM, who led the use of raiders to stop this proposal from reaching quorum. And after opprobrium from GA regulars, vowed never to do it again ("I don't regret this specific action, but I won't do it again" WA Discord, 2020-04-26), and then immediately led another series of raids in a systematic and organised attempt to stop this proposal.

UM admitted to this on Discord and trumpeted it on Right to Life's RMB. He admitted to attempting to rig the Annual Review poll this week. He admitted to cooperating in a conspiracy to overthrow the North Pacific. UM makes the nukes but then after everyone makes bigger nukes he wants to put them away. If TNP and I have sawdust in our eyes, he should pay attention that the trees and thornbushes growing out of his do not affect his sight.

I mean seriously, this whole thing is like Comical Ali:
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Last edited by Imperium Anglorum on Fri Jul 10, 2020 6:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Godular
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Godular » Fri Jul 10, 2020 5:42 pm

Imperium Anglorum wrote:
United Massachusetts wrote:It looks as though TNP propped this up to vote by installing delegates. It is unfortunate, needless to say.

This is really fucking rich coming from UM, who led the use of raiders to stop this proposal from reaching quorum. And after opprobrium from GA regulars, vowed never to do it again ("I don't regret this specific action, but I won't do it again" WA Discord, 2020-04-26), and then immediately led another series of raids in a systematic and organised attempt to stop this proposal.

UM admitted to this on Discord and trumpeted it on your region's RMB. He admitted to attempting to rig the Annual Review poll this week. He admitted to cooperating in a conspiracy to overthrow the North Pacific. UM makes the nukes but then after everyone makes bigger nukes he wants to put them away. If TNP and I have sawdust in our eyes, he should pay attention that the trees and thornbushes growing out of his do not affect his sight.


"Sowing discord on Discord? Hee!"
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Flying Eagles
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Posts: 169
Founded: Nov 04, 2017
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Flying Eagles » Fri Jul 10, 2020 6:20 pm

This resolution needs the following line “REALIZING that modern medical research notes that a fetus does not develop consciousness until after it is viable outside of the uterus”
Unfortunately, despite the above, there are rare examples of fetuses being aborted after this point. Therefore, the GA is legalizing murder with this resolution.

OOC for viability point: https://www.zerotothree.org/resources/1375-when-does-the-fetus-s-brain-begin-to-work
https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/opinion/the-moment-a-baby-s-brain-starts-to-function-and-other-scientific-answers-on-abortion-1.3506968%3fmode=amp
https://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/19/books/chapters/the-ethical-brain.html

OOC for late-term abortion. See third example. I don’t think she intended harm by aborting and and I don’t want to judge IRL people, but I think adoption could’ve been a better solution: https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/25/health/abortion-late-in-pregnancy-eprise/index.html

Never mind the above 2 attempts at an intelligent statement. The real solution is not banning abortion, but providing support (eg. financial) so that it becomes unnecessary.
Last edited by Flying Eagles on Mon Jul 13, 2020 4:06 pm, edited 4 times in total.
I do dumb things sometimes. Sorry.

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