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DRAFT: Reducing the Need for Abortions

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Araraukar
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DRAFT: Reducing the Need for Abortions

Postby Araraukar » Sat Feb 15, 2020 1:06 pm

OOC: For discussion about the need for a resolution on profylactics and preventing pregnancies in the first place, go here: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=481116

Reducing the Need for Abortions

Category: Social Justice
Strength: to be decided later

The World Assembly,

Aware of abortion being a hotly contested issue,

Acknowledging the dislike of many nations towards the previously passed freedoms on the subject of abortion,

Suggesting that rather than attempting to repeal the previous resolutions or reducing individuals' right to choose, the need for abortions might be targeted instead,

Recognizing that many nations simply might not know how to reduce the need for abortions,

Hoping to provide some guidance on the matter,

Hereby,

1. Defines, for the purposes of this resolution,
  1. an "abortion" as the artificial termination of a pregnancy,
  2. a "potential mother" as any pregnant individual who is an inhabitant or a citizen of a World Assembly member nation,
  3. a "home nation" as a member nation where the potential mother has permanent residency, or if they live in a non-member nation, a member nation where they are a citizen,

2. Clarifies that this resolution does not affect one way or another the legality of abortion, but does apply to all home nations where abortion is legal,

3. Mandates that all potential mothers be treated as equals, regardless of their national, cultural, ethnic, sexual, gender, religious or political backgrounds and orientations,

4. Requires that all potential mothers be given unbiased and thorough information about all of their options, when they seek help for their condition, including but not limited to,
  1. different methods of abortion, incluing the potential complications and danger to the potential mother, and the required aftercare,
  2. the processes of pregnancy and birth, including the potential complications and danger to them and their offspring,
  3. different methods of delivering their offspring alive, and the required aftercare,
  4. adoption options, both national and international,
  5. parenthood, both the positive and negative effects on their life, and
  6. reliable methods of preventing pregnancies,

5. Requires that member nations establish, if such does not already exist, a specific branch of maternity healthcare, either as separate clinics or incorporated into existing healthcare system, to provide potential mothers easy access to supportive healthcare during pregnancy, birth and early years of childcare,

6. Mandates that member nations ensure potential mothers adequate access to maternity healthcare, and that anything to do with maternity healthcare, including transport, treatments and specialist services be made free or easily affordable for them,

7. Further requires that member nations establish, if such does not already exist, postnatal maternity support system to ensure, including but not limited to,
  1. hands-on teaching on how to handle a newborn,
  2. hands-on teaching on childcare more generally,
  3. providing materials needed for childcare of a newborn,
  4. ensuring adequate nutrition to young children and the caretakers of young children,
  5. a chance to speak with a mental health specialist when necessary,
  6. a chance to meet other new parents for peer-to-peer support, and
  7. access to reliable prevention methods to reduce the risk of non-planned pregnancies,

8. Encourages nations to ensure that new parents have the opportunity to bond with their newborn without considerable loss of income.

IC: "For a long while we Araraukarians have been watching the abortion debate raging on and have been amazed at how it has become so fanatical over the choice to do or not do an abortion, when there have always been ways to significantly reduce the need for abortions to exist in the first place. Some nations that we won't mention here, keep on raging against the rock that is one of the previous resolutions, but repeatedly fail to provide real answers to why they keep having such a problem with abortions in the first place? If you have access to preventative methods, know that sex can result in pregnancies and know that you won't be left to cope alone if you choose not to abort - and even that you can let your baby to be adopted, if you'd prefer not to have it yourself - really do do wonders to the lowering of abortion rates. So we thought to give everyone something new to chew on, instead, and maybe help reduce the pressure over the whole issue of abortion."

OOC: Not sure of the strength, because for somewhere like RL Finland, this would be Mild, because most of the things are already in effect (and may be partially copied from there, I admit), but something like, say, USA, it would probably be Significant at least, and some third world poor hellhole of a country, it might even be Strong. What are we assuming for the general level of WA nations?

Also, it's not in Healthcare, because the focus is meant to be on the assistance and welfare support available, not healthcare methods themselves, but if others feel it's too healthcare-oriented, then switching it there isn't that big a problem.
Last edited by Araraukar on Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Araraukar
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Postby Araraukar » Sat Feb 15, 2020 1:06 pm

OOC: Reserved.
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Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
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Terttia
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Postby Terttia » Sat Feb 15, 2020 1:41 pm

You can also focus on ways to prevent unintended pregnancies (a leading cause to abort an offspring) through methods such as contraception.
Last edited by Terttia on Sat Feb 15, 2020 1:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Araraukar
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Postby Araraukar » Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:24 pm

Terttia wrote:You can also focus on ways to prevent unintended pregnancies (a leading cause to abort an offspring) through methods such as contraception.

IC: "The proposal requires potential mothers to be given information about reliant contraception methods, and new parents access to the actual contraception methods, so it is included. However, contraception without education does not do much, as many of them don't work unless used properly. There's nothing in the proposal that would block another one focusing on availability and information of contraceptives, though."

OOC: Reason I didn't make them the main focus is that if you think abortion is a contested thing... people go nuts over contraceptives and access to them and such. That's why in my proposal there's a requirement on info to people who already are pregnant, and actually getting access to them for people who've recently become parents, which should lessen the knee-jerk reaction of "but info of and access to contraceptives makes you have too much sex/have sex at too young an age" or whatever. Clearly someone who's pregnant, is already sexually active, so that doesn't apply. And I've been told that anyone who thinks the parents of a newborn/very young baby have any sex at all, have never lived through that period. :P

Also I couldn't remember if the sex ed resolution still existed and didn't want too much duplication.
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Postby Excidium Planetis » Sat Feb 15, 2020 5:49 pm

"At last, an abortion resolution everyone can agree on!" Cornelia Schultz declares, while putting on a combat helmet and taking cover behind the nearest desk sturdy enough to survive a typical abortion debate.
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Araraukar
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Postby Araraukar » Sat Feb 15, 2020 11:28 pm

Excidium Planetis wrote:"At last, an abortion resolution everyone can agree on!" Cornelia Schultz declares, while putting on a combat helmet and taking cover behind the nearest desk sturdy enough to survive a typical abortion debate.

OOC: I get that you're playing, but this is specifically not an abortion proposal and as such abortion debate (that is, debate about whether abortion is good or bad) would be offtopic here. Other than that, I'll see if Linda couldn't find some of Janis's notes on your nation and ambassador, to have some idea of who the heck the crazy lady is. :lol:
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Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
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Liberimery
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Postby Liberimery » Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:25 am

I would also add a “No Questions Asked” safe abandonment program where mothers of new new borns can leave a child at hospitals and other qualified institutions (police and fire stations, religious facilities, etc.) with our fear of child abandonment charges. This will prevent the “dumpster baby” issue where parents will leave unwanted children in unsafe or unknown locations and cause the child’s death.

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Kenmoria
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Postby Kenmoria » Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:26 am

“I think that ‘services ’ ought to have a comma after it in clause 6.”
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Araraukar
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Postby Araraukar » Sun Feb 16, 2020 12:04 pm

Liberimery wrote:I would also add a “No Questions Asked” safe abandonment program where mothers of new new borns can leave a child at hospitals and other qualified institutions (police and fire stations, religious facilities, etc.) with our fear of child abandonment charges. This will prevent the “dumpster baby” issue where parents will leave unwanted children in unsafe or unknown locations and cause the child’s death.

IC: "Wouldn't all reasonable nations already have such a program available, though? If someone simply cannot cope with parenthood, it's best for everyone that they be allowed to relinquish their child to better carers and adoption."

OOC: I'll have to check the existing adoption resolution(s), but a vague memory tries to claim this was already tried by someone, and the general agreement was that child services that already need to exist for other resolutions, would likely be enough to deal with that.

Also, Kenmoria, thanks. I'll wait for more comments before making any edits, but noted. :)
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Morover
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Postby Morover » Sun Feb 16, 2020 12:42 pm

"Clause four should probably be rephrased to '...unbiased and thorough information about all of their options on their pregnancy...', to help better clarify."

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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Sun Feb 16, 2020 12:47 pm

Support, having given this a quick skim read.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

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Postby The Sheika » Sun Feb 16, 2020 1:41 pm

I must admit that at first glance with the title I was leery about the contents of the proposal. Instead, I can happily say that the Federation is in support of the proposal as it provides a reasonable means of prevention without completely barring the procedure.
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Greifenburg
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Postby Greifenburg » Sun Feb 16, 2020 3:48 pm

Seeing that this matches quite nicely the policies in Greifenburg and seems quite sound, we are supporting this proposal.
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Bananaistan
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Postby Bananaistan » Sun Feb 16, 2020 4:18 pm

"Contraception and sex education reduce the need for abortions. Wishy-washy bs about postnatal care and forcing GPs to tell expectant mothers where the nearest abortion clinic is do not."
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Araraukar
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Postby Araraukar » Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:37 pm

Bananaistan wrote:"Contraception and sex education reduce the need for abortions. Wishy-washy bs about postnatal care and forcing GPs to tell expectant mothers where the nearest abortion clinic is do not."

"And yet with resolution 369 in place, abortion seems to be a hotly debated issue. Obviously sex ed alone is not enough. Contraceptive education is already mandated by this proposal."

OOC EDIT: Opinions on the strength (or even category)?
Last edited by Araraukar on Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Maraculand
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Postby Maraculand » Mon Feb 17, 2020 6:48 am

6. Mandates that member nations ensure potential mothers adequate access to maternity healthcare, and that anything to do with maternity healthcare, including transport, treatments and specialist services be made free or easily affordable for them,


Maraculand does not believe in forcing tax payers to fund it's health care system. Will vote against this proposal.
If this proposal is rewritten in a way that free care is not a part of it, I believe it would be a fine document.
Last edited by Maraculand on Mon Feb 17, 2020 6:49 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby Wallenburg » Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:10 am

"The seventh clause, concerning a 'postnatal maternity support system', ought to be extended to those other than biological mothers. In particular, fathers and adoptive parents."
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Marxist Germany
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Postby Marxist Germany » Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:20 am

"Support, although forcing doctors to show ultrasound images or perhaps an endoscopy during an abortion also reduces the number of abortions."
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:26 am

Marxist Germany wrote:"Support, although forcing doctors to show ultrasound images or perhaps an endoscopy during an abortion also reduces the number of abortions."

Yeah, no. :roll:
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

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Marxist Germany
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Postby Marxist Germany » Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:51 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Marxist Germany wrote:"Support, although forcing doctors to show ultrasound images or perhaps an endoscopy during an abortion also reduces the number of abortions."

Yeah, no. :roll:

"Why should murderers not be able to see their victim going through the gruesome death caused by the abortion?"
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:58 am

Marxist Germany wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:Yeah, no. :roll:

"Why should murderers not be able to see their victim going through the gruesome death caused by the abortion?"

Because the WA doesn't classify it as murder for a start, and it'd break section 4 of GAR #128:

4. FURTHER MANDATES that physicians who carry out abortions must be trained to the same accepted medical standards that all surgeons are held to, and that abortions are carried out in a way that is as painless as possible while preserving the mother's physical health;

What you are proposing would cause severe emotional pain, and so would not be carrying out the abortion "in a way that is as painless as possible".
Last edited by The New California Republic on Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
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Quinovia
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Postby Quinovia » Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:06 am

Marxist Germany wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:Yeah, no. :roll:

"Why should murderers not be able to see their victim going through the gruesome death caused by the abortion?"


This resolution has nothing to do with classifying abortions as murders, and is not the place for that debate, as has been previously stated. We aren't here to decide if abortions are good or bad.

Furthermore, my nation's primary issue with resolution is the requirement that "all potential mothers be given unbiased and thorough information about all topics." Simply put, nations are unable to provide "unbiased" information, as illustrated by Marxist Germany's post. Mothers should be given access to information, but frankly, it should not be thrust upon them. If a mother comes seeking an abortion, and has no interest in listening to the different options, a doctor should not be mandated to give them "all other options." Just give the abortion. We will not support the resolution unless it is amended to get rid of this unnecessary requirement. Doctors should not be forced, as Marxist Germany has so bluntly put it, to show anything if it is against the wishes of the mother.

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Marxist Germany
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Postby Marxist Germany » Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:06 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Marxist Germany wrote:"Why should murderers not be able to see their victim going through the gruesome death caused by the abortion?"

Because the WA doesn't classify it as murder for a start, and it'd break section 4 of GAR #128:

4. FURTHER MANDATES that physicians who carry out abortions must be trained to the same accepted medical standards that all surgeons are held to, and that abortions are carried out in a way that is as painless as possible while preserving the mother's physical health;

What you are proposing would cause severe emotional pain, and so would not be carrying out the abortion "in a way that is as painless as possible".

"Perhaps if seeing your unborn child being murdered causes severe emotional pain to you then you should not be doing so?"
Country represents RL views mostly. Not Marxist anymore.
Author of GA#461, GA#470, GA#477, GA#481, GA#486 (co-author), and SC#295

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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:09 am

Marxist Germany wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:Because the WA doesn't classify it as murder for a start, and it'd break section 4 of GAR #128:


What you are proposing would cause severe emotional pain, and so would not be carrying out the abortion "in a way that is as painless as possible".

"Perhaps if seeing your unborn child being murdered causes severe emotional pain to you then you should not be doing so?"

Try repealing #128 if you aren't happy about it. ;)
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:24 am

Marxist Germany wrote:"Support, although forcing doctors to show ultrasound images or perhaps an endoscopy during an abortion also reduces the number of abortions."

What physical and psychological benefit does shoving a tube down an informed and non-consenting woman provide in every case you care to mention? And if it provides none but inflict psychological and physical abuse, is it against GAR#9? And thus would including this bit in the draft contradict GAR#9?
Last edited by Austria-Bohemia-Hungary on Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am, edited 2 times in total.

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