Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:15 amNationStates
Because sometimes even national leaders just want to hang out
https://forum.nationstates.net/
[DRAFT] Reduce Abortions Act
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Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:15 amPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:16 amAgainst.
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:17 amDon't try to speak for nations other than your own. At least some of the "non-human" member nations would support a repeal of that resolution.
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:17 amBears Armed wrote:The Brytish Isles wrote:
Non-human member states constitute a notable percentage of WA membership. These same non-human majority member-states remain committed to GA#286
Don't try to speak for nations other than your own. At least some of the "non-human" member nations would support a repeal of that resolution.
Understood. Pardon the transgression.
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:17 amBears Armed wrote:The Brytish Isles wrote:
Non-human member states constitute a notable percentage of WA membership. These same non-human majority member-states remain committed to GA#286
Don't try to speak for nations other than your own. At least some of the "non-human" member nations would support a repeal of that resolution.
Thank you.
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:19 amPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:25 am"FTFY, Ambassador.
The proposing Ambassador may also wish to look to #128, requiring member states to offer and to protect the abortion rights of women facing severe health risks, carrying foetuses to be born with severe incurable conditions and to women who have been raped and to "ensure that abortion facilities are easily available to patients seeking abortion" in such circumstances. Mandating cutting such abortions by 50% -- meaning denying abortions to dying and desperate women -- would not only be undesirable, it would be contradictory, suggesting there are two resolutions that would need overturning.
Which this delegation doesn't see happening. Ever.
Thank goodness.
Against."
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 4:26 amOOC: Against this and any attempt to repeal resolutions 286 and 128. (Except for requiring abortionplexes for all, of course.)
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 5:09 amLegolannd wrote:Bears Armed wrote:OOC
The GA has, however undesirable some people might consider this, decided otherwise.
Proposal Rules: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=159348
Passed Resolutions (searchable thread): viewtopic.php?f=9&t=30
Again, it's not a right.
Ooc: it is, as a matter of law, a right. You can disagree if you would like in a moral sense, but the WA democratically voted to give women the right to receive an abortion on demand. That makes it a right, and any attempt to limit that right will contradict that law and be illegal until you repeal GAR#286.
IC: "We are opposed to all attempts to limit abortion access. Legalizing abortion reduces overall social costs, and is a net boon to society. Historically, the major proponents of a pro-life agenda have proven themselves unworthy of trust, and, frankly, we see little reason to assume good faith in their ideological allies. Opposed."
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:16 amOOC: This forum is for drafting and passing legislation in the General Assembly. Current GA law permits abortion, absolutely. Unless you're going to draft a repeal of such existing law, most of this discussion (philosophical as it is) belongs over in the General forum. Please take it there to continue arguing morals and ethics and biology. Remain here only to discuss GA law.
/Notamod
/Notamod
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 7:31 amSeparatist Peoples wrote:Legolannd wrote:Again, it's not a right.
Ooc: it is, as a matter of law, a right. You can disagree if you would like in a moral sense, but the WA democratically voted to give women the right to receive an abortion on demand. That makes it a right, and any attempt to limit that right will contradict that law and be illegal until you repeal GAR#286.
IC: "We are opposed to all attempts to limit abortion access. Legalizing abortion reduces overall social costs, and is a net boon to society. Historically, the major proponents of a pro-life agenda have proven themselves unworthy of trust, and, frankly, we see little reason to assume good faith in their ideological allies. Opposed."
hahahahahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is the funniest thing. Net boom, are you kdding me? Oh god. Oh, and insult me, that's gonna get your point across.
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 7:41 amLegolannd wrote:Separatist Peoples wrote:Ooc: it is, as a matter of law, a right. You can disagree if you would like in a moral sense, but the WA democratically voted to give women the right to receive an abortion on demand. That makes it a right, and any attempt to limit that right will contradict that law and be illegal until you repeal GAR#286.
IC: "We are opposed to all attempts to limit abortion access. Legalizing abortion reduces overall social costs, and is a net boon to society. Historically, the major proponents of a pro-life agenda have proven themselves unworthy of trust, and, frankly, we see little reason to assume good faith in their ideological allies. Opposed."
hahahahahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is the funniest thing. Net boom, are you kdding me? Oh god. Oh, and insult me, that's gonna get your point across.
'Well, it does a better job of bringing a point across than coming here claiming falsehoods.'
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:34 amLegolannd wrote:Separatist Peoples wrote:Ooc: it is, as a matter of law, a right. You can disagree if you would like in a moral sense, but the WA democratically voted to give women the right to receive an abortion on demand. That makes it a right, and any attempt to limit that right will contradict that law and be illegal until you repeal GAR#286.
IC: "We are opposed to all attempts to limit abortion access. Legalizing abortion reduces overall social costs, and is a net boon to society. Historically, the major proponents of a pro-life agenda have proven themselves unworthy of trust, and, frankly, we see little reason to assume good faith in their ideological allies. Opposed."
hahahahahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is the funniest thing. Net boom, are you kdding me? Oh god. Oh, and insult me, that's gonna get your point across.
You should probably take criticism with a little more grace, as acting like this makes people reluctant to work with you on this draft.
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:52 amBy definition fetuses are incapable of breathing independently. <.>
Also hell has more chance to freeze over than this ever passing.
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:47 amAs it stands, the Federation is opposed. This is not to say that we consider abortion to be a trivial matter, but we recognize that in some cases it is a decision that must be made for medical, and on rare occasion moral, reasons. Attempts to limit access have the potential to harm those who may be in situations that were not of their own volition, and with Resolution 286 in effect individuals who fall under that category have access to the procedure.
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 1:20 pmLegolannd wrote:A Fetus is a human. it's a living, breathing human being.
"I don't know if you've passed a biology course in your life, but if you did, I imagine your teacher ought to be ashamed for letting you pass. Human fetuses famously do no breathe, because they're surrounded by amniotic fluid, not air, while inside the womb. They get their oxygen through the umbilical chord straight into their bloodstream, so they have no need to breathe, either. This can be sometimes done artificially for grown-up humans, too, when they undergo operations in the lungs or nearby areas, where the movement of the lungs would be damaging. In such cases their blood is oxygenated by a machine and they do not breathe, just like what's normal for fetuses."
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 2:41 pmHumans shall have choice to abort or not to. We shall have free choice.
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 7:21 pmLegolannd wrote:hahahahahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is the funniest thing. Net boom, are you kdding me? Oh god. Oh, and insult me, that's gonna get your point across.
Out of Character:
Look, buddy, as a matter of personal opinion, in real life I oppose abortion on moral grounds. It's all well and good in my opinion that you believe abortion to be murder.
But this is the World Assembly. It's a fictional, international government-like structure, and this forum is for roleplaying as ambassadors to that fictional organization.
As such, your posts here do not reflect in any way the behavior that would normally be expected of a diplomat. You're being quite rude to people trying to inform you and offer advice. You aren't seriously proposing a law or defending your proposal.
People here have already said that within the World Assembly, a passed resolution guarantees the right to abortions. You have to repeal this law to move forward with any anti-abortion legislation. If you want to take up that cause, as many other pro life World Assembly members have done in the past, go ahead, but whatever you are doing here, this ain't the way to go about that.
How about let's start over, shall we?
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 7:33 pm(OOC: Couldn't resist.)
Ambassador Holly Dyer entered the room, carrying a copy of the draft proposal in one hand, a lighter in the other. She eyed any others present and rather bluntly exclaimed "Right. I don't particularly feel like doing the niceties today, so here we go. Which one of you wrote this (waving the copy around in the direction of people's faces to be clear) drivel of a proposal. You can all see what I think of it!" and proceeded to grab the lighter, set the copy on fire, scrunch it up and toss it towards the nearest wastebasket, it being of no consequence if it actually landed in it or not. After the dramatic pause-for-effect was over, she resumed speaking "So, it'd be nice to know which one of you needs to be taught about how the personal (often religious) beliefs of one person override the autonomy and control that I have over my own body. Oh, and if you're religious don't waste your time bringing up your holy book of choice. It's neither binding on me nor do I particularly care what it says."
Ambassador Holly Dyer entered the room, carrying a copy of the draft proposal in one hand, a lighter in the other. She eyed any others present and rather bluntly exclaimed "Right. I don't particularly feel like doing the niceties today, so here we go. Which one of you wrote this (waving the copy around in the direction of people's faces to be clear) drivel of a proposal. You can all see what I think of it!" and proceeded to grab the lighter, set the copy on fire, scrunch it up and toss it towards the nearest wastebasket, it being of no consequence if it actually landed in it or not. After the dramatic pause-for-effect was over, she resumed speaking "So, it'd be nice to know which one of you needs to be taught about how the personal (often religious) beliefs of one person override the autonomy and control that I have over my own body. Oh, and if you're religious don't waste your time bringing up your holy book of choice. It's neither binding on me nor do I particularly care what it says."
Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 11:20 pmNew Mushroom Kingdom wrote:"So, it'd be nice to know which one of you needs to be taught about how the personal (often religious) beliefs of one person override the autonomy and control that I have over my own body. Oh, and if you're religious don't waste your time bringing up your holy book of choice. It's neither binding on me nor do I particularly care what it says."
Linda pointed towards the offending author. "There's your target. Just remember that proper violence is usually prevented by the Nullifiers. But tossing him out of a window is just fine."
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:06 amLegolannd wrote:hahahahahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is the funniest thing. Net boom, are you kdding me? Oh god. Oh, and insult me, that's gonna get your point across.
"Boon. Not boom, ambassador. Two very different, if extraordinarily simple, words. And it is true, as allowing, and even subsidizing fully, abortions reduces the overall stress on young women who are pregnant before being able to afford it, which keeps them off social welfare programs and allows them to pursue careers and education with more resource. This drives up their spending and earnings in the long run, giving more taxable income and driving the economy.
"Conversely, a woman forced to care for offspring before financial viability statistically draws more from welfare, earns and spends less, and produces less successful offspring, which has the same effect on them. By permitting free abortion on demand, overall welfare costs are lowered and economic productivity is increased."
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:48 amThe under-ambassador for the nation of Dreadton looks up from his crossword and key’s his microphone, “No.”
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:52 amNew Mushroom Kingdom wrote:(OOC: Couldn't resist.)
Ambassador Holly Dyer entered the room, carrying a copy of the draft proposal in one hand, a lighter in the other. She eyed any others present and rather bluntly exclaimed "Right. I don't particularly feel like doing the niceties today, so here we go. Which one of you wrote this (waving the copy around in the direction of people's faces to be clear) drivel of a proposal. You can all see what I think of it!" and proceeded to grab the lighter, set the copy on fire, scrunch it up and toss it towards the nearest wastebasket, it being of no consequence if it actually landed in it or not. After the dramatic pause-for-effect was over, she resumed speaking "So, it'd be nice to know which one of you needs to be taught about how the personal (often religious) beliefs of one person override the autonomy and control that I have over my own body. Oh, and if you're religious don't waste your time bringing up your holy book of choice. It's neither binding on me nor do I particularly care what it says."
Guards walk into the room and throw her to the ground. President Technic waves a hand. "Eh." The guards remove her.
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:14 amLegolannd wrote:New Mushroom Kingdom wrote:(OOC: Couldn't resist.)
Ambassador Holly Dyer entered the room, carrying a copy of the draft proposal in one hand, a lighter in the other. She eyed any others present and rather bluntly exclaimed "Right. I don't particularly feel like doing the niceties today, so here we go. Which one of you wrote this (waving the copy around in the direction of people's faces to be clear) drivel of a proposal. You can all see what I think of it!" and proceeded to grab the lighter, set the copy on fire, scrunch it up and toss it towards the nearest wastebasket, it being of no consequence if it actually landed in it or not. After the dramatic pause-for-effect was over, she resumed speaking "So, it'd be nice to know which one of you needs to be taught about how the personal (often religious) beliefs of one person override the autonomy and control that I have over my own body. Oh, and if you're religious don't waste your time bringing up your holy book of choice. It's neither binding on me nor do I particularly care what it says."
Guards walk into the room and throw her to the ground. President Technic waves a hand. "Eh." The guards remove her.
Welp. You are now charged with godmodding in flagrante delicto and subject to auto-defenestration of your entire delegation. I suggest utilising the nearest WA approved drycleaner.
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:46 amThis thread has gone about as far as it was ever going to go. Locked before it devolves further into NSG-talk and minor godmodding.