NATION

PASSWORD

Freedom of conscience

Where WA members debate how to improve the world, one resolution at a time.

Advertisement

Remove ads

User avatar
Araraukar
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13737
Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:48 pm

Kenmoria wrote:(OOC: The technology is already in development, and there is always the question of FT or PMT member states operating with different tech levels.)

OOC: I am well aware of that research, because human mind and memory are among the subjects of great interest to me. FMRI has already been known to be pretty much fool-proof lie detector for a while as well, but it's still not being used as a lie detector in trials. Why? Because it's unwieldy as it requires the person to be hooked up to the MRI machine. Same here. Even if the system was perfected so that it can actually read thoughts, it would still require you to be in a FMRI machine. Those are big and unwieldy. Even in the best case scenario it would only strengthen the argument against this thing, as it would make the "conspiracy to commit X" crimes all that much harder to act on.

As for roleplaying... I have an actual telepathic species and they additionally utilize brain implants capable of "reading" thoughts in my RP, and yet I am arguing against this on the basis that most nations in NS will not. FT nations are even at best guess, about 10% of all nations. Magical nations that can achieve thought reading via magical means, likely overlapping slightly with FT, but let's call that another 10%. That still leaves 80% of nations where it is not something that can feasibly be achieved. So the strength cannot be significant, as it does not significantly impact a significant amount of member nations.

I also find it highly hypocritical of IA to use "but RP!" as the basis on a proposal after years of calling all imaginative RP "wanking", and strawmanning my RP in particular, simply because I've opposed his bully tactics. But his morals or the lack of them are not the point here.
- Linda Äyrämäki, acting ambassador in the absence of miss Leveret
Araraukar's RP reality is Modern Tech solarpunk.

Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
Araraukar wrote:
Blueflarst wrote:a cosmopolitan hammer
United Massachusetts wrote:Can we all call ourselves "cosmopolitan hammers"?
Us cosmopolitan hammers
Can teach some manners
Often sorely lacking
Hence us attacking
Silly GA spammers

User avatar
Imperium Anglorum
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8885
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Thu Aug 29, 2019 4:14 pm

Araraukar wrote:OOC: I am well aware of that research, because human mind and memory are among the subjects of great interest to me. FMRI has already been known to be pretty much fool-proof lie detector for a while as well, but it's still not being used as a lie detector in trials. Why? Because it's unwieldy as it requires the person to be hooked up to the MRI machine. Same here. Even if the system was perfected so that it can actually read thoughts, it would still require you to be in a FMRI machine. Those are big and unwieldy. Even in the best case scenario it would only strengthen the argument against this thing, as it would make the "conspiracy to commit X" crimes all that much harder to act on.

As for roleplaying... I have an actual telepathic species and they additionally utilize brain implants capable of "reading" thoughts in my RP, and yet I am arguing against this on the basis that most nations in NS will not. FT nations are even at best guess, about 10% of all nations. Magical nations that can achieve thought reading via magical means, likely overlapping slightly with FT, but let's call that another 10%. That still leaves 80% of nations where it is not something that can feasibly be achieved. So the strength cannot be significant, as it does not significantly impact a significant amount of member nations.

Ara, repeating the assertion "de minimis non curat lex" doesn't make it true here. I don't recall these overwrought protestations of pointlessness to AI legislation when Sierra Lyricalia was writing AI Coexistence Protocol, pulling out magical statistics of how 80 pc of nations don't have synthetic life. But that aside, your conception of conspiracy does appear to be at least somewhat deficient. See supra (edited, wrong post link). And otherwise, if you want to make flowering proclamations on the GA rules all day long in that static unproductive fashion, feel free to do so.

Araraukar wrote:I also find it highly hypocritical of IA to use "but RP!" as the basis on a proposal after years of calling all imaginative RP "wanking", and strawmanning my RP in particular, simply because I've opposed his bully tactics. But his morals or the lack of them are not the point here.

I'm unclear how I have now been cast as Titus Annius Milo, but if that is the narrative, I'll quote T Swift, I would very much like to be excluded from this narrative. Also see id., which clarifies my nuanced and generally pro-activity position on the topic. But about those latter points, I would never make insinuations that someone who disagrees with me must do so due to mental illness or reject as unimportant, proposals with clear analogues in real life. I would outright refuse to make slanderous claims of my political opponents' inherent immorality and blackened souls if they contributed to multiple communities without pay, without remuneration, and without expectation of honours.
Last edited by Imperium Anglorum on Thu Aug 29, 2019 6:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Author: 1 SC and 28 GA resolutions
Maintainer: GA Passed Resolutions
Developer: Communiqué and InfoEurope
Delegate for Europe
Out-of-character unless marked otherwise
Ideological Bulwark 285, WALL delegate
Dastardly villain providing free services to the community sans remuneration

User avatar
Araraukar
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13737
Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Thu Aug 29, 2019 5:27 pm

Imperium Anglorum wrote:I'm unclear how

Imperium Anglorum wrote:Stop wanking.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:RP wank isn't creative compliance.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:If we're just going to FT wank all our problems away
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Yea, and I have space-wank up the wazoo that can make all of your chaps look like primitives.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:This time, it was species-wank on top of species-wank on top of species-wank.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Ye Olde Planete in the Past Wank System doesn't have global warming.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:So, you're stuck between the national sovereigntists (I am one) who think this shouldn't be regulated and the majority of the WA who doesn't care for FT tech wank.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:we generally try to avoid the higher echelons of RP wank.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:The World Assembly is a mishmash of RP-wank all the time

OOC: If you want more, you'll have to wait until I have time to comb through your posts in more detail.
- Linda Äyrämäki, acting ambassador in the absence of miss Leveret
Araraukar's RP reality is Modern Tech solarpunk.

Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
Araraukar wrote:
Blueflarst wrote:a cosmopolitan hammer
United Massachusetts wrote:Can we all call ourselves "cosmopolitan hammers"?
Us cosmopolitan hammers
Can teach some manners
Often sorely lacking
Hence us attacking
Silly GA spammers

User avatar
Imperium Anglorum
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8885
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Thu Aug 29, 2019 6:37 pm

Araraukar wrote:
Imperium Anglorum wrote:I'm unclear how

Imperium Anglorum wrote:Stop wanking.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:RP wank isn't creative compliance.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:If we're just going to FT wank all our problems away
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Yea, and I have space-wank up the wazoo that can make all of your chaps look like primitives.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:This time, it was species-wank on top of species-wank on top of species-wank.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Ye Olde Planete in the Past Wank System doesn't have global warming.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:So, you're stuck between the national sovereigntists (I am one) who think this shouldn't be regulated and the majority of the WA who doesn't care for FT tech wank.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:we generally try to avoid the higher echelons of RP wank.
Imperium Anglorum wrote:The World Assembly is a mishmash of RP-wank all the time

OOC: If you want more, you'll have to wait until I have time to comb through your posts in more detail.

So you have evidence that I think people shouldn't be RP wanking... you're seriously complaining that I think RNT ought be applied when people start saying global warming doesn't exist because they live in 4000 BC so that's why the proposal shouldn't be passed, the "fact" that people breathe carbon dioxide means we cannot restrict carbon dioxide missions means we cannot pass limits on how much CO2 is in the atmosphere, the "fact" that food is non-renewable so food welfare proposals which assume agriculture exists ought fail, etc.?

If so, I'm not Milo; I'm Cincinnatus! These are great positions to be holding! And it turns out that RNT doesn't apply to technologies that we can reasonably predict will exist or to problems that we can reasonably foresee happening, like the topics of AI Coexistence Protocol (voted in favour of that) and To Prevent Dangerous Debris (got that to quorum for Defwa). Tides come in, tides go out, never a miscommunication!

What I dislike isn't your straw man of "all RP", but rather, RP that is contrived as a means to shut down serious discussion of a proposal. That sort of RP is bad RP. That sort of RP is the sort that Gruen et al have satirised with "Omicron Convenience IV in the Space Wank system". And yea, yea, there's probably some sort of case where I've made arguments of that sort playing devil's advocate or in many years past. If I cut Trump's speeches out of context, he loves Mexicans.

Author: 1 SC and 28 GA resolutions
Maintainer: GA Passed Resolutions
Developer: Communiqué and InfoEurope
Delegate for Europe
Out-of-character unless marked otherwise
Ideological Bulwark 285, WALL delegate
Dastardly villain providing free services to the community sans remuneration

User avatar
Youssath
Attaché
 
Posts: 97
Founded: Jul 12, 2019
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Youssath » Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:04 am

"Against. All thoughts and expressions should only be mandated by the state."

"Freedom is slavery. Glory to the Republic!"

User avatar
Araraukar
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13737
Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:48 am

Imperium Anglorum wrote:So you have evidence that I think people shouldn't be RP wanking... you're seriously complaining that I think RNT ought be applied *snip*

What I dislike isn't your straw man of "all RP", but rather, RP that is contrived as a means to shut down serious discussion of a proposal. That sort of RP is bad RP.

OOC: You call all RP not suited to your way of thinking "wanking". People are allowed to RP however they want, and give opinions based on their RP on the proposal threads. That does not equal to "shutting down discussion", if they simply use their RP reasoning to explain how the proposal doesn't affect them, or would affect them more negatively than intended. It's neither good or bad roleplaying, it's simply roleplaying. You don't need to agree, but neither do you need to call it "wank".

And RNT applies in systems much more varied than what RL has. Again, you can roleplay your way and make your system a carbon copy of RL if you want, but others don't have to agree. Many of us have used weeks (adding the hours together) on research for worldbuilding, when the RP reality differs significantly from RL, but all non-carbon-copies need a certain amount of suspension of disbelief.

If you no longer feel that way and instead welcome varied RP, then great! But in the past you have been very dismissive of especially FT RP. Since you seem to be basing this proposal on something that's pure FT for any kind of practical application, it's akin to Putin coming out of the closet as gay and making Russia into an LGBT rights paradise overnight.

But you've taken some steps toward the sensible direction already, such as renaming it Freedom of Conscience, because that's a much more sensible concept than "thought crime".

It's still not significant strength, though.
- Linda Äyrämäki, acting ambassador in the absence of miss Leveret
Araraukar's RP reality is Modern Tech solarpunk.

Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
Araraukar wrote:
Blueflarst wrote:a cosmopolitan hammer
United Massachusetts wrote:Can we all call ourselves "cosmopolitan hammers"?
Us cosmopolitan hammers
Can teach some manners
Often sorely lacking
Hence us attacking
Silly GA spammers

User avatar
Sierra Lyricalia
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 3368
Founded: Nov 29, 2008
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Sierra Lyricalia » Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:34 am

Araraukar wrote:...Since you seem to be basing this proposal on something that's pure FT for any kind of practical application, it's akin to Putin coming out of the closet as gay and making Russia into an LGBT rights paradise overnight.

OOC: Pure FT? When we can already, as you yourself pointed out, use brain scans to detect lying, all you have to do is ask yes or no questions that wouldn't make the House Un-American Activities Committee or the KGB even blink, and there's your easy-peasy detection of illegal thoughts. I don't see this as more than a couple-few decades out of common totalitarian use, and that's IRL, let alone in the vast NS RP multiverse.


It's still not significant strength, though.

That's an eminently arguable position, given the complexity of actually carrying it out.
Principal-Agent, Anarchy; Squadron Admiral, The Red Fleet
Stephanie Athena Zakalwe
Author: 354 GA / Issues 436, 451, 724
S.L. Ambassador to the World Assembly
Tech Level: Complicated (or not: 7/0/6 i.e. 12) / RP Details
Leonid Berkman Pavonis,
Ideological Deviant, MT Army stooge, & "red [who] do[es]n't read" (various)
Ambassador-At-Large
Illustrious Bum #279



User avatar
Araraukar
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13737
Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:57 am

Sierra Lyricalia wrote:OOC: Pure FT?

OOC: Everyone keeps missing the "for any kind of practical application". If you still need to stuff someone into a MRI device to "read" their inner workings, that's hardly practical. (Also, PMT is a type of FT, so even if it was only a few dozen years away from being practical in RL, that's still "future tech". It's like how profitable fusion reactors have been "15-30 years from now" for at least the last 30 years, and are still considered a FT thing.)

Out of interest, is it a practical thing in your RP reality?

As for the "but totalitarianism" excuse, why would they even bother to read someone's thoughts if they were an undesirable individual? KGB and similar rarely let facts (even regular lie detector tests) get in the way. And for the record, though Araraukar is a totalitarian nation to some extent at least, this would sound like a nonsense proposal to them in IC simply because they'd think locking people up (or worse) simply because of beliefs would go so far beyong reasonable nation theory as to be laughable. And yes I know RL examples existed, but Araraukar doesn't exist on the RL Earth, so they might not exist for them (I haven't figured out the global cultural history yet).

It's still not significant strength, though.

That's an eminently arguable position, given the complexity of actually carrying it out.

Carrying what out? Not being snippy, legitimate confusion.
- Linda Äyrämäki, acting ambassador in the absence of miss Leveret
Araraukar's RP reality is Modern Tech solarpunk.

Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
Araraukar wrote:
Blueflarst wrote:a cosmopolitan hammer
United Massachusetts wrote:Can we all call ourselves "cosmopolitan hammers"?
Us cosmopolitan hammers
Can teach some manners
Often sorely lacking
Hence us attacking
Silly GA spammers

User avatar
Sierra Lyricalia
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 3368
Founded: Nov 29, 2008
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Sierra Lyricalia » Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:05 pm

Araraukar wrote:
Sierra Lyricalia wrote:OOC: Pure FT?

OOC: Everyone keeps missing the "for any kind of practical application". If you still need to stuff someone into a MRI device to "read" their inner workings, that's hardly practical. (Also, PMT is a type of FT, so even if it was only a few dozen years away from being practical in RL, that's still "future tech". It's like how profitable fusion reactors have been "15-30 years from now" for at least the last 30 years, and are still considered a FT thing.)

Out of interest, is it a practical thing in your RP reality?

OOC: I hadn't considered it, honestly. Certainly there are regimes in my RP past which I wouldn't put it. Lemme get back to ya on that one.


As for the "but totalitarianism" excuse, why would they even bother to read someone's thoughts if they were an undesirable individual? KGB and similar rarely let facts (even regular lie detector tests) get in the way.

There was a reason I mentioned HUAC first: picture an authoritarian democracy, which claims to uphold people's rights to the extent that they can't just be tossed in prison on a lark, but certain political or religious beliefs can disqualify them from important or visible professional employment. It's extremely easy to imagine an "enlightened" society refusing to convict someone without proof of ideological malfeasance, but throwing away the key once such proof is provided. Now, historically, such governments have either quickly descended into more repressive modes or soon stepped back from the brink, but could such a regime be stable? Theoretically I don't see why not.


And for the record, though Araraukar is a totalitarian nation to some extent at least, this would sound like a nonsense proposal to them in IC simply because they'd think locking people up (or worse) simply because of beliefs would go so far beyong reasonable nation theory as to be laughable. And yes I know RL examples existed, but Araraukar doesn't exist on the RL Earth, so they might not exist for them (I haven't figured out the global cultural history yet).

Is this a "forced RP" objection? I don't see why you'd have to consider it as happening in your own country(ies) or planet(s).

That's an eminently arguable position, given the complexity of actually carrying it out.

Carrying what out? Not being snippy, legitimate confusion.
Sorry, carrying out the process of interrogation under fMRI. One can imagine a hospital having a machine with a video camera inside that can and will regularly be used for such a process, where the video (incorporating a real-time instrumentation readout in a sub-window) is then presented in court alongside expert testimony.

Excessively elaborate right this second? Yes. Possible not long from now? Also yes.

TL;dr I object to your characterization of this as totally unnecessary or unrealistic, but I agree that you probably have a point as to the strength, for more or less the reasons you argue. Like my own single resolution, this is a topic that we IRL as a civilization should start considering soon, instead of waiting until it's already being carried out (i.e. until it's already too late to do anything but react). Therefore it's reasonable WA fodder, but probably not more than Mild (especially considering the current existence of GAR #436 [and no, it's not duplicative IMO]).

Edit: fix quote tags
Last edited by Sierra Lyricalia on Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Principal-Agent, Anarchy; Squadron Admiral, The Red Fleet
Stephanie Athena Zakalwe
Author: 354 GA / Issues 436, 451, 724
S.L. Ambassador to the World Assembly
Tech Level: Complicated (or not: 7/0/6 i.e. 12) / RP Details
Leonid Berkman Pavonis,
Ideological Deviant, MT Army stooge, & "red [who] do[es]n't read" (various)
Ambassador-At-Large
Illustrious Bum #279



User avatar
Imperium Anglorum
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8885
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:49 pm

Sierra Lyricalia wrote:point as to the strength

Imperium Anglorum wrote:What is your philosophy on the application of the strength rule? Is there a framework in which the breadth of what is being regulated maps to statistical impact?

Though I ought probably amend it to: In what framework does a subject topic in your mind map to a particular strength?

Author: 1 SC and 28 GA resolutions
Maintainer: GA Passed Resolutions
Developer: Communiqué and InfoEurope
Delegate for Europe
Out-of-character unless marked otherwise
Ideological Bulwark 285, WALL delegate
Dastardly villain providing free services to the community sans remuneration

User avatar
Wayneactia
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 378
Founded: Aug 01, 2014
Corporate Bordello

Postby Wayneactia » Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:09 am

How is this not covered by The Charter of Civil Rights?

In particular Article 1C "All inhabitants of member states have the right not to be and indeed must not be discriminated against on grounds including sex, race, ethnicity, nationality, skin color, language, economic or cultural background, physical or mental disability or condition, religion or belief system, sexual orientation or sexual identity, or any other arbitrarily assigned and reductive categorisation which may be used for the purposes of discrimination, except for compelling practical purposes, such as hiring only female staff to work with battered women who have sought refuge from their abuser".

User avatar
Sierra Lyricalia
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 3368
Founded: Nov 29, 2008
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Sierra Lyricalia » Sat Aug 31, 2019 9:28 am

Wayneactia wrote:How is this not covered by The Charter of Civil Rights?

In particular Article 1C "All inhabitants of member states have the right not to be and indeed must not be discriminated against on grounds including sex, race, ethnicity, nationality, skin color, language, economic or cultural background, physical or mental disability or condition, religion or belief system, sexual orientation or sexual identity, or any other arbitrarily assigned and reductive categorisation which may be used for the purposes of discrimination, except for compelling practical purposes, such as hiring only female staff to work with battered women who have sought refuge from their abuser".


OOC: Part of me wants to say it's totally obvious that (say) the United States Senate under the influence of one Joseph McCarthy would consider keeping Communists out of any remotely influential job to be a "compelling practical purpose." That would make this structurally equivalent to e.g. GAR #457, preventing a member state from using the CPP exemption to mask otherwise illegal discrimination.

I'd want my colleagues to weigh in, I think.
Principal-Agent, Anarchy; Squadron Admiral, The Red Fleet
Stephanie Athena Zakalwe
Author: 354 GA / Issues 436, 451, 724
S.L. Ambassador to the World Assembly
Tech Level: Complicated (or not: 7/0/6 i.e. 12) / RP Details
Leonid Berkman Pavonis,
Ideological Deviant, MT Army stooge, & "red [who] do[es]n't read" (various)
Ambassador-At-Large
Illustrious Bum #279



User avatar
Separatist Peoples
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 14398
Founded: Feb 17, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Separatist Peoples » Sat Aug 31, 2019 11:15 am

Sierra Lyricalia wrote:
Wayneactia wrote:How is this not covered by The Charter of Civil Rights?

In particular Article 1C "All inhabitants of member states have the right not to be and indeed must not be discriminated against on grounds including sex, race, ethnicity, nationality, skin color, language, economic or cultural background, physical or mental disability or condition, religion or belief system, sexual orientation or sexual identity, or any other arbitrarily assigned and reductive categorisation which may be used for the purposes of discrimination, except for compelling practical purposes, such as hiring only female staff to work with battered women who have sought refuge from their abuser".


OOC: Part of me wants to say it's totally obvious that (say) the United States Senate under the influence of one Joseph McCarthy would consider keeping Communists out of any remotely influential job to be a "compelling practical purpose." That would make this structurally equivalent to e.g. GAR #457, preventing a member state from using the CPP exemption to mask otherwise illegal discrimination.

I'd want my colleagues to weigh in, I think.


OOC: I'd say there is a difference between discrimination under procedural or unrelated substantive law and making something overtly illegal. Criminal law is, by definition, discriminatory, albeit not invidiously so. I've always read CoCR to apply to the improper use of an arbitrary and capricious category in a manner that applies nondiscriminatory law in a discriminatory manner. After all, one can make a compelling practical argument for making a great deal of action illegal, but rarely can make the same for applying those laws indiscriminately.

His Worshipfulness Lord GA Secretariat,
Authority on All Existence,
Globalist Dog,
Dark Psychic Vampire, and
Chief Populist Elitist!


User avatar
Aclion
Senator
 
Posts: 4326
Founded: Apr 12, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Aclion » Sat Aug 31, 2019 11:30 am

Wayneactia wrote:How is this not covered by The Charter of Civil Rights?

In particular Article 1C "All inhabitants of member states have the right not to be and indeed must not be discriminated against on grounds including sex, race, ethnicity, nationality, skin color, language, economic or cultural background, physical or mental disability or condition, religion or belief system, sexual orientation or sexual identity, or any other arbitrarily assigned and reductive categorisation which may be used for the purposes of discrimination, except for compelling practical purposes, such as hiring only female staff to work with battered women who have sought refuge from their abuser".

See: Genociding People Who Disagree With Me Preventing Child Abuse
A free society rests on four boxes: The soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, and the ammo box.
XKI: Recruiter, TITO Knight
TEP: WA Executive Staff member
Forest: Cartographer
Oatland: Caesar, Cartographer

It is the citizen's duty to understand which box to use, and when.

User avatar
Imperium Anglorum
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8885
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Sat Aug 31, 2019 10:09 pm

Taking advice from Sanct on the WA Discord, I'm not going to be budging the strength back down to Mild.

Author: 1 SC and 28 GA resolutions
Maintainer: GA Passed Resolutions
Developer: Communiqué and InfoEurope
Delegate for Europe
Out-of-character unless marked otherwise
Ideological Bulwark 285, WALL delegate
Dastardly villain providing free services to the community sans remuneration

User avatar
Jocospor
Diplomat
 
Posts: 618
Founded: Nov 24, 2015
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Jocospor » Sat Aug 31, 2019 10:49 pm

Imperium Anglorum wrote:Taking advice from Sanct on the WA Discord, I'm not going to be budging the strength back down to Mild.

OOC: Hang on, who's actually running the show here? Here I was actually believing this resolution wasn't yet another instance of collusion between the WA Elite and the General Secretariats, masterminded in those dark Discord channels. Damn :(
HAIL THE CONFEDERATION!
CONFEDERATION OF CORRUPT DICTATORS | OFFICE OF THE VICEROY | DELEGATE'S OFFICE
JOCOSPOR | FOREIGN AFFAIRS OFFICE


"Destroy democracy. End degeneracy. Love your Emperor. Thou shalt know no fear."
- Farland Macmillan, Grand High Direktor of the Empire, addressing the 3rd Imperial Cabinet

(All posts IC unless marked otherwise)

User avatar
Sierra Lyricalia
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 3368
Founded: Nov 29, 2008
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Sierra Lyricalia » Sat Aug 31, 2019 11:05 pm

Jocospor wrote:
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Taking advice from Sanct on the WA Discord, I'm not going to be budging the strength back down to Mild.

OOC: Hang on, who's actually running the show here? Here I was actually believing this resolution wasn't yet another instance of collusion between the WA Elite and the General Secretariats, masterminded in those dark Discord channels. Damn :(


Jokes go in the Joke Proposal thread.

Although now I look at it, it's not much of a proposal, either... So I dunno where exactly you should shove this, but it ain't here. Please find a more suitable thread to air your tedious imaginary grievances (I haven't been in II in just about forever...); or if you're somehow serious about them, take them to Moderation.
Principal-Agent, Anarchy; Squadron Admiral, The Red Fleet
Stephanie Athena Zakalwe
Author: 354 GA / Issues 436, 451, 724
S.L. Ambassador to the World Assembly
Tech Level: Complicated (or not: 7/0/6 i.e. 12) / RP Details
Leonid Berkman Pavonis,
Ideological Deviant, MT Army stooge, & "red [who] do[es]n't read" (various)
Ambassador-At-Large
Illustrious Bum #279



User avatar
Imperium Anglorum
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8885
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Sun Sep 01, 2019 12:47 am

Bully that I take advice on statistical categorisation from an Issues editor.

Author: 1 SC and 28 GA resolutions
Maintainer: GA Passed Resolutions
Developer: Communiqué and InfoEurope
Delegate for Europe
Out-of-character unless marked otherwise
Ideological Bulwark 285, WALL delegate
Dastardly villain providing free services to the community sans remuneration

User avatar
Separatist Peoples
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 14398
Founded: Feb 17, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Separatist Peoples » Sun Sep 01, 2019 6:48 am

Jocospor wrote:
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Taking advice from Sanct on the WA Discord, I'm not going to be budging the strength back down to Mild.

OOC: Hang on, who's actually running the show here? Here I was actually believing this resolution wasn't yet another instance of collusion between the WA Elite and the General Secretariats, masterminded in those dark Discord channels. Damn :(

Ooc: neither IA nor Sanctaria are GenSec members. You're really going with the Throw Shit At The Wall strategy with this conspiracy, aren't you?

His Worshipfulness Lord GA Secretariat,
Authority on All Existence,
Globalist Dog,
Dark Psychic Vampire, and
Chief Populist Elitist!


User avatar
Sanctaria
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 7349
Founded: Sep 12, 2008
New York Times Democracy

Postby Sanctaria » Sun Sep 01, 2019 7:01 am

Separatist Peoples wrote:
Jocospor wrote:OOC: Hang on, who's actually running the show here? Here I was actually believing this resolution wasn't yet another instance of collusion between the WA Elite and the General Secretariats, masterminded in those dark Discord channels. Damn :(

Ooc: neither IA nor Sanctaria are GenSec members. You're really going with the Throw Shit At The Wall strategy with this conspiracy, aren't you?

I haven't written or passed a WA resolution in about 5 years either, I hardly think I qualify as "WA Elite" either. I gave my advice on strength based on my knowledge of the stats. It's up to both IA and GenSec if they want to follow that advice, though I would note GenSec rarely do. Hardly a conspiracy.
Divine Federation of Sanctaria

Ideological Bulwark #258
Member of UNOG

Dr. Katherine Saunders ORD DSJ, Sanctarian Ambassador to the World Assembly
Author of:
GA#109 GA#133 GA#176 GA#201 GA#222 GA#297
Frisbeeteria wrote:Do people not realize that moderators can tell when someone is wanking?

Luna Amore wrote:Sanc is always watching. Ever vigilant.

User avatar
Potted Plants United
Diplomat
 
Posts: 888
Founded: Jan 14, 2013
Democratic Socialists

Postby Potted Plants United » Mon Sep 02, 2019 4:33 am

Imperium Anglorum wrote:Taking advice from Sanct on the WA Discord, I'm not going to be budging the strength back down to Mild.

OOC: Could one of you post the reasoning here for everyone to see, so that it doesn't look like just being stubborn for the sake of stubbornity?
This nation is a plant-based hivemind.
My main nation is Araraukar.
Separatist Peoples wrote:"NOPENOPENOPENOPENOPENOPENOPENOPE!"
- Mr. Bell, when introduced to PPU's newest moving plant

User avatar
Sanctaria
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 7349
Founded: Sep 12, 2008
New York Times Democracy

Postby Sanctaria » Mon Sep 02, 2019 7:17 am

Potted Plants United wrote:
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Taking advice from Sanct on the WA Discord, I'm not going to be budging the strength back down to Mild.

OOC: Could one of you post the reasoning here for everyone to see, so that it doesn't look like just being stubborn for the sake of stubbornity?

It really wasn't anything formal. It was basically me saying "I'd have it as significant, not mild".

Really that's based on the actual stats for mild, significant, strong, and what an IE would code for an equivalent issue, but scaled to the World Assembly.
Divine Federation of Sanctaria

Ideological Bulwark #258
Member of UNOG

Dr. Katherine Saunders ORD DSJ, Sanctarian Ambassador to the World Assembly
Author of:
GA#109 GA#133 GA#176 GA#201 GA#222 GA#297
Frisbeeteria wrote:Do people not realize that moderators can tell when someone is wanking?

Luna Amore wrote:Sanc is always watching. Ever vigilant.

User avatar
Araraukar
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13737
Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Tue Sep 03, 2019 4:59 am

Sanctaria wrote:
Potted Plants United wrote:OOC: Could one of you post the reasoning here for everyone to see, so that it doesn't look like just being stubborn for the sake of stubbornity?

It really wasn't anything formal. It was basically me saying "I'd have it as significant, not mild".

Really that's based on the actual stats for mild, significant, strong, and what an IE would code for an equivalent issue, but scaled to the World Assembly.

OOC: So what exactly does this DO, from your POV, if it was an issue instead of a resolution proposal?
- Linda Äyrämäki, acting ambassador in the absence of miss Leveret
Araraukar's RP reality is Modern Tech solarpunk.

Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
Araraukar wrote:
Blueflarst wrote:a cosmopolitan hammer
United Massachusetts wrote:Can we all call ourselves "cosmopolitan hammers"?
Us cosmopolitan hammers
Can teach some manners
Often sorely lacking
Hence us attacking
Silly GA spammers

User avatar
Imperium Anglorum
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8885
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Tue Sep 03, 2019 8:52 am

Presumably it advances civil rights in a significant fashion. The NS site statisticians are generally mum on their rationales.

Author: 1 SC and 28 GA resolutions
Maintainer: GA Passed Resolutions
Developer: Communiqué and InfoEurope
Delegate for Europe
Out-of-character unless marked otherwise
Ideological Bulwark 285, WALL delegate
Dastardly villain providing free services to the community sans remuneration

User avatar
Bananaistan
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 2246
Founded: Apr 20, 2012
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Bananaistan » Tue Sep 03, 2019 9:41 am

OOC: Significant is fine IMO. Mild would be too. I've zero interest in assessing a "how long is a piece of string?" type question.
Delegation of the People's Republic of Bananaistan to the World Assembly
Head of delegation and the Permanent Representative: Comrade Ambassador Theodorus "Ted" Hornwood
General Assistant and Head of Security: Comrade Watchman Brian of Tarth
There was the Pope and John F. Kennedy and Jack Charlton and the three of them were staring me in the face.

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General Assembly

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Maowi, Separatist Peoples, The Great Kingdom of Naples

Advertisement

Remove ads