[Draft] Ban on Forced Sterilisation

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Posts: 13592
Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Thu Aug 08, 2019 3:30 am

The Great Boom wrote:Also, 3.a now reads "carry out thorough investigations into their criminal and medical services..."

What is a criminal service? Seems like "criminal and medical services" should just be "sterilizations" unless I'm missing something.

OOC: Criminal service sounds like some kind of criminals-for-hire hotline you can call...
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Marxist Germany
Posts: 959
Founded: Jun 07, 2018
Corporate Bordello

Postby Marxist Germany » Thu Aug 08, 2019 4:46 am

The Great Boom wrote:In response to Araraukar, I think your arguments take my points out of context. My argument revolves only around the question: "is it redundant to specify decriminalization AND punishment?" The only response I've gotten on that issue is that it's to prevent creative compliance, but it obviously doesn't prevent that.

OOC:My most recent proposal that went to vote was defeated because people didn't like being told how to punish criminals.

But that's all irrelevant now. My complaint about redundancy has been addressed by the recent formatting edits. Clause 3 no longer even uses the word criminalize, so this stupid argument is over.

Clause 3 doesn't need to use the word criminalise because it's addressed in a previous clause.

Even after the edits, I think clause 3 is flawed, just for different reasons: 3.a and 3.b aren't related in a satisfactory way.

They are related, 3a requires member states carry thorough investigations whilst 3b requires them to reasonably punish people who carry out illegal sterilisation.
It's not clear if 3.b implies extrajudicial punishment, or can only be applied as a result of the investigations entailed in 3.a.

That's 2b not 3b
Anytime you use subclauses, most reasonable nations will assume that they lead into one another, but since this entire bill is a creative compliance nightmare just by the subject matter, I think it's pretty important to specify that the 3.b punishments are the result of a conviction which stems from the investigations in 3.a

I don't see how this is a creative compliance nightmare. Extradition is a clear term, "don't send your criminals to a country where they do X" is what 2b is saying.

Also, 3.a now reads "carry out thorough investigations into their criminal and medical services..."

What is a criminal service? Seems like "criminal and medical services" should just be "sterilizations" unless I'm missing something.

I will work to fix that issue.
Last edited by Marxist Germany on Thu Aug 08, 2019 4:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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