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[FAILED QUORUM] Ban On Cannibalism Attempt Two

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Libana
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[FAILED QUORUM] Ban On Cannibalism Attempt Two

Postby Libana » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:14 pm

The World Assembly,

Believing that every single form of sapient life is very precious, special, and worthy, which means that it should be held absolutely dear,

Acknowledging that the deceased had once possessed the traits of the living, meaning that they loved and were loved by others who were close to them, and should be respected just like any other person,

Aware that there are various cultures around the world, each with their different customs, beliefs, and ideologies, but also seeing cannibalism and other acts similar to it as unethical and unscrupulous,

Disgusted at the complete lack of moral decency in the individuals who support the eating of the flesh and organs of others, who basically sum up the dead they feast on as nothing more than food,

Defining cannibalism for the purposes of this resolution, as the eating of the flesh or body parts of one's own species, while also clarifying that being a carnivore is not condemned in the sense of eating meat from other animals,

Hereby,

1. Prohibits cannibalism in all member-nations, whether or not it is ritualistic,
    A. Autocannibalism and the presence of lab-grown meat shall not apply and is excused,
    B. If the one who shall be eaten gives solid proof of consent, then the act shall be legal,
    C. Non-sapient organisms do not apply and are excused,
2. Classifies all perpetrators of cannibalism after the passing of this resolution as criminals, meaning that those who have comitted the act prior shall be excused,

3. Urges member-nations to limit and prevent the promotion of cannibalism.
Last edited by Libana on Sat Mar 31, 2018 6:56 am, edited 15 times in total.

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Die PreuBen Kaiserreich
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Postby Die PreuBen Kaiserreich » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:18 pm

I don't see any part of the proposal talking about cultures that have cannibalism as part of said culture/religion.
I might be blind, though.
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Allied Sapients
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Postby Allied Sapients » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:52 pm

This time, are you actually going to answer concerns and questions that people ask about?
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Masurbia
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Postby Masurbia » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:58 pm

Libana wrote:Defining cannibalism for the purposes of this resolution, as the eating of the flesh or body parts of one's own species, while also clarifying that being a carnivore is not condemned in the sense of eating meat from other animals,

Under your definition, animals that sometimes eat eachother, sharks and chimpanzees (yes, chimpanzees), would be considered criminals.
Aware that there are various cultures around the world, each with their different customs, beliefs, and ideologies, but also seeing cannibalism and other acts similar to it as unethical and unscrupulous,

What cultures think this?
Completely prohibits all forms of cannibalism, including autocannibalism, in all member-nations, whether or not it may be ritualistic,

The Uruguayan Air Force Flight 571 crash resulted in the survivors trapped in the Andes mountains for months. To survive they had to eat the dead passengers. Would they be criminals?
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:16 pm

Libana wrote:Defining cannibalism for the purposes of this resolution, as the eating of the flesh or body parts of one's own species, while also clarifying that being a carnivore is not condemned in the sense of eating meat from other animals ... Completely prohibits all forms of cannibalism, including autocannibalism,

OOC: Probably too broad, and would lead to absurdities. For example, a lot of people regularly bite their nails, this might be classed as "autocannibalism". If I accidentally cut my hand with a knife, and there is a little bit of skin hanging off that is likely to catch on something, then I will bite it off and swallow it. Lots of people do that, they don't think anything of it, but what you are proposing here would ban things like that, because it would ridiculously be classified as cannibalism. I like to apply the absurdity test to drafts. I'm afraid, in its current form at least, this draft fails the test.
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

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Kenmoria
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Postby Kenmoria » Sat Mar 10, 2018 1:50 am

"Bolding isn't necessary in proposals, the proposal would be aesthetically by removing it. In addition, the prohibition of self-cannibalism seems overly tyrannical, especially for libertarian nations."
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Arotania
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Postby Arotania » Sat Mar 10, 2018 3:39 am

Allied Sapients wrote:This time, are you actually going to answer concerns and questions that people ask about?


This would be the first question we'd like to see answered too. We brought up the topic of autocannibalism in the last round of discussion because we thought it should be excluded. You never addressed this topic but instead added autocannibalsim to the draft and submitted it, never having addressed inquiries by several embassadors. Do you intend to change this impolite behaviour?

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Libana
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Postby Libana » Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:28 am

Yes, I will start to listen this time.

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Libana
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Postby Libana » Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:35 am

Masurbia wrote:
Libana wrote:Defining cannibalism for the purposes of this resolution, as the eating of the flesh or body parts of one's own species, while also clarifying that being a carnivore is not condemned in the sense of eating meat from other animals,

Under your definition, animals that sometimes eat eachother, sharks and chimpanzees (yes, chimpanzees), would be considered criminals.


I admit that writing this section was weird. How should I reword this?

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Libana
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Postby Libana » Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:22 am

Masurbia wrote:The Uruguayan Air Force Flight 571 crash resulted in the survivors trapped in the Andes mountains for months. To survive they had to eat the dead passengers. Would they be criminals?


You have a good point there! I just added an exception for suspects (2A) to the draft!

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Libana
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Postby Libana » Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:25 am

Arotania wrote:
Allied Sapients wrote:This time, are you actually going to answer concerns and questions that people ask about?


This would be the first question we'd like to see answered too. We brought up the topic of autocannibalism in the last round of discussion because we thought it should be excluded. You never addressed this topic but instead added autocannibalsim to the draft and submitted it, never having addressed inquiries by several embassadors. Do you intend to change this impolite behaviour?


I just made self-cannibalism an exception. It will no longer play a role in anything.

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Libana
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Postby Libana » Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:29 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Libana wrote:Defining cannibalism for the purposes of this resolution, as the eating of the flesh or body parts of one's own species, while also clarifying that being a carnivore is not condemned in the sense of eating meat from other animals ... Completely prohibits all forms of cannibalism, including autocannibalism,

OOC: Probably too broad, and would lead to absurdities. For example, a lot of people regularly bite their nails, this might be classed as "autocannibalism". If I accidentally cut my hand with a knife, and there is a little bit of skin hanging off that is likely to catch on something, then I will bite it off and swallow it. Lots of people do that, they don't think anything of it, but what you are proposing here would ban things like that, because it would ridiculously be classified as cannibalism. I like to apply the absurdity test to drafts. I'm afraid, in its current form at least, this draft fails the test.


I decided to remove self-cannibalism from the draft.

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Allied Sapients
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Postby Allied Sapients » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:01 am

Libana wrote:Yes, I will start to listen this time.


Great. Since you didn’t respond to IC last thread, I’ll ask OOC. Why is this a matter for international law? As long as people aren’t being killed to be eaten, can you provide a justification for banning it that isn’t just the “ick” factor?
The Ambassador of the Confederacy of Allied Sapients is Lirn Jenht Olsh, who is definitely an alien of some sort.

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Libana
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Postby Libana » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:22 am

Allied Sapients wrote:
Libana wrote:Yes, I will start to listen this time.


Great. Since you didn’t respond to IC last thread, I’ll ask OOC. Why is this a matter for international law? As long as people aren’t being killed to be eaten, can you provide a justification for banning it that isn’t just the “ick” factor?


It is not because I necessarily find it disgusting, but rather I find it disrespectful to the dead. I see it as like spitting or stomping on someone's grave. I know it is weird, but I sometimes feel like the dead should be protected too!

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Arotania
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Postby Arotania » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:26 am

We would still like to see topic of lab-grown meat be addressed too.

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Libana
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Postby Libana » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:30 am

Arotania wrote:We would still like to see topic of lab-grown meat be addressed too.


What would you like me to do on it? How should it be addressed? Should it be included or excluded?
Last edited by Libana on Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Allied Sapients
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Postby Allied Sapients » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:33 am

Libana wrote:It is not because I necessarily find it disgusting, but rather I find it disrespectful to the dead. I see it as like spitting or stomping on someone's grave. I know it is weird, but I sometimes feel like the dead should be protected too!


What about circumstances where it’s not disrespect, such as in funerary cannibalism?
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Bears Armed
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Postby Bears Armed » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:34 am

Libana wrote:It is not because I necessarily find it disgusting, but rather I find it disrespectful to the dead. I see it as like spitting or stomping on someone's grave. I know it is weird, but I sometimes feel like the dead should be protected too!

OOC: But what about cultures in which cannibalism is a traditional part of the funerary process, and the deceased not only expected [at least some part of] their remains to be eaten but was was perfectly okay with the idea?
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Industrial West Virginia
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Postby Industrial West Virginia » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:35 am

I would be fine with this, but what if the culture itself accepts this as something you do? If it does and the person inside of the culture is then consenting to it, then what is the problem? It is unethical to the large population of the world, yes. But, if you just realize that people who live in cultures like these often times are consenting to this sort of thing, you will realize there is less of a problem than you think. Maybe add something about consent in to your draft.

Believing that every single form of sapient life is very precious, special, and worthy, which means that it should be held absolutely dear,


This is contradictory to the rest of the draft. Get rid of the sapient part, and then it'll be more accurate since you're obviously going to be banning every type of cannibalism. Unless this is JUST for sapiens in which you need to get rid of

Defining cannibalism for the purposes of this resolution, as the eating of the flesh or body parts of one's own species, while also clarifying that being a carnivore is not condemned in the sense of eating meat from other animals,
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Atlantis Mu and Lemuria
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Postby Atlantis Mu and Lemuria » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:36 am

Why is there any need to make Cannibalism a special crime, if Murder and defiling a corpse are already prohibited in most nations?
What makes cannibalism that special? Not to mention it is quite niche.

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Basbon
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Postby Basbon » Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:34 am

hi

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Ransium
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Postby Ransium » Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:26 am

Basbon wrote:hi


Please review our site rules, particularly with regards to spam: viewtopic.php?p=16394943#p16394943
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Kenmoria
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Postby Kenmoria » Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:43 am

Atlantis Mu and Lemuria wrote:Why is there any need to make Cannibalism a special crime, if Murder and defiling a corpse are already prohibited in most nations?
What makes cannibalism that special? Not to mention it is quite niche.

(OOC:There was still a ban on ritual sacrifice, which is classified under murder.)
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Arotania
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Postby Arotania » Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:10 am

Libana wrote:
Arotania wrote:We would still like to see topic of lab-grown meat be addressed too.


What would you like me to do on it? How should it be addressed? Should it be included or excluded?


According to your own reasoning it should probably be excluded, given that it circumnavigates the whole aspect of disrespect towards the dead.


Bears Armed wrote:
Libana wrote:It is not because I necessarily find it disgusting, but rather I find it disrespectful to the dead. I see it as like spitting or stomping on someone's grave. I know it is weird, but I sometimes feel like the dead should be protected too!

OOC: But what about cultures in which cannibalism is a traditional part of the funerary process, and the deceased not only expected [at least some part of] their remains to be eaten but was was perfectly okay with the idea?


OOC: At least they should probably refrain from eating the brain: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuru_(disease)

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Dirty Americans
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Postby Dirty Americans » Mon Mar 12, 2018 12:54 pm

Libana wrote:Defining cannibalism for the purposes of this resolution, as the eating of the flesh or body parts of one's own species, while also clarifying that being a carnivore is not condemned in the sense of eating meat from other animals,


I think you need to be careful throwing about terms like "species" in a casual manner. The general definition of the term is "a group of living organisms consisting of similar individuals capable of exchanging genes or interbreeding." Now in the complex multiverse we have a number of cases that defy common logic but there you have it; Earth people breeding with Vulcans, "Humans" breeding with "Elves," WerePenguins (what you never heard of a WerePenguin ... oh my how fortunate you are or were because now you just heard of them) not only breeding with "Tourists" - I think that is what they call their national animal - but actually eating them saying that "Tourists are Tasty." Fortunately they are not in the World Assembly - this is a good thing for the World Assembly because the last thing we need is to have Flash Blonde crashing through these doors right about now.
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