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Help make my proposal legal

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Eublepharis
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Posts: 13
Founded: Jan 10, 2017
Ex-Nation

Help make my proposal legal

Postby Eublepharis » Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:24 am

The General Assembly:

Acknowledges that, while legislation exists for endangered creatures, nothing has been created solely for the benefit of reptiles in the care of humans, which are often neglected and killed.

Classifies a reptile as any creature in the subclasses Squamata (snakes, lizards) and Testudines/Chelonii (turtles, tortoises). This does not include Crocodilia.

Recognizes reptiles as being deserving of basic animal rights as applies to endangered animals.

Creates an international agency responsible for the health and well-being of reptiles as described above.

This agency:

Will have authority to inspect licensed pet dealerships and private residences for abuse and neglect of reptiles.

Abuse and Neglect is described as:
-Withholding proper food, water, heat, light, caging, and Vitamin D3
-Intentionally harming reptiles outside of legal medical treatments
-Leaving the reptile alone without proper food, water, heat, light, caging, and Vitamin D3 for over 7 days

Will have authority to enforce the following guidelines upon pet dealerships found in violation of animal rights:
-Shut down any facilities deemed unethical in their care
-Reacquire any animals found in harsh conditions, and send them to care centers approved by the agency.

Allows future legislation to be placed to further enforce these standards and to protect wild reptiles.


So I posted this as a proposal, and it was deemed illegal because of the clause about the agency. Any ideas to making the proposal legal and actually good?
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Xmara
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Founded: Mar 31, 2014
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Xmara » Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:00 am

Well for starters, do you have a name for your proposal?
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The First German Order
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Founded: Dec 08, 2016
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The First German Order » Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:17 am

OOC: Let me just start off by saying this is ridiculous. A WA agency being able to go into the home of a random citizen in a nation? That's just stupid. Along with that it's the government's job to shutdown businesses, not some WA agency. Also this looks to me like it just makes a committees/agency and nothing more.
Last edited by The First German Order on Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Jar Wattinree
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Founded: Dec 14, 2016
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Jar Wattinree » Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:19 am

What is the agency's name?
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Eublepharis
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Posts: 13
Founded: Jan 10, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Eublepharis » Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:20 pm

The title is "Captive Reptile Protection Act."
I can not make it do an agency, but what should I add instead?

The whole point of the Act is to ensure that reptiles are being treated ethically in captivity.
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Araraukar
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Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Fri Jan 26, 2018 1:28 pm

Eublepharis wrote:The whole point of the Act is to ensure that reptiles are being treated ethically in captivity.

OOC: You're unlikely to be able to get something through that focuses on such a narrow animal group. (Especially with the ridiculous exclusion of crocodiles and snakes.) A more general animal rights/welfare things have been tried, three of them passed and were then repealed. I suggest you read them and especially their repeals to find out why they failed and what to avoid.

Then change the thread title (edit the title of the first post) to have the name of your proposal, and put its name, category and (depending on category) either strength or area of effect in the first post. You can find them and their descriptions in the proposal rules thread.

It's hard to "help make your proposal legal" when we don't know what category you're aiming for.

Proposal rules: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=159348
Passed resolutions: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=30
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Imperium Anglorum
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Founded: Aug 26, 2013
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Postby Imperium Anglorum » Fri Jan 26, 2018 4:58 pm

Araraukar wrote:OOC: You're unlikely to be able to get something through that focuses on such a narrow animal group.

Actually, I think that he should make it apply just to housecats.

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Araraukar
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Fri Jan 26, 2018 5:46 pm

Imperium Anglorum wrote:
Araraukar wrote:OOC: You're unlikely to be able to get something through that focuses on such a narrow animal group.

Actually, I think that he should make it apply just to housecats.

OOC: Trying to get a newbie in trouble? Bad boy, no catnip for you. :P
*pets IA anyway and gives him tuna*
Also, considering the amount of cat-lovers at least here, a cat protection act would have a higher chance of passing, though still being very unlikely...
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Shazbotdom
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Posts: 11126
Founded: Sep 28, 2004
Anarchy

Postby Shazbotdom » Fri Jan 26, 2018 8:20 pm

Ambassador Flabbergast cleared his throat, "I hate to be 'that guy' but, what's the category and strength?"
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Kenmoria
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Founded: Jul 03, 2017
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Postby Kenmoria » Sat Jan 27, 2018 2:11 am

Shazbotdom wrote:Ambassador Flabbergast cleared his throat, "I hate to be 'that guy' but, what's the category and strength?"

The Kenmorian ambassador also stands up, "Hey! I'm always "that guy", don't steal my job. Back on the draft, I see no reason to exclude crocodiles from the list of reptiles."
Last edited by Kenmoria on Sat Jan 27, 2018 2:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Naqil
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Founded: Apr 11, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Naqil » Sat Jan 27, 2018 9:26 am

“True, why are crocodiles excluded?” asks Ixhua. “And what about the tuatara? Not to mention all the other things we could have as exotic pets if our de-extinction program ever gets the funding it asked for. And why does your proposal classify them broadly, instead of just for the purposes of the resolution?”
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Bears Armed
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Founded: Jun 01, 2006
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Bears Armed » Sat Jan 27, 2018 9:42 am

Naqil wrote:“True, why are crocodiles excluded?” asks Ixhua.

OOC: Maybe because they're actually less closely related to the other 'reptiles' than they are to birds?
Last edited by Bears Armed on Sat Jan 27, 2018 9:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Grays Harbor
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Postby Grays Harbor » Sat Jan 27, 2018 9:52 am

Bears Armed wrote:
Naqil wrote:“True, why are crocodiles excluded?” asks Ixhua.

OOC: Maybe because they're actually less closely related to the other 'reptiles' than they are to birds?


Scientific classification
Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Class: Reptilia
Order: Crocodilia
Family: Crocodylidae
Subfamily: Crocodylinae
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Imperium Anglorum
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Postby Imperium Anglorum » Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:16 am

And we have a winner of the GA Science award!

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Bears Armed
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Bears Armed » Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:17 am

Grays Harbor wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:OOC: Maybe because they're actually less closely related to the other 'reptiles' than they are to birds?


Scientific classification
Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Class: Reptilia
Order: Crocodilia
Family: Crocodylidae
Subfamily: Crocodylinae


OOC: You're out of date... unless your source is also counting all of the birds as members of 'Reptilia' too. The scientific consensus nowadays is that the first birds evolved from feathered dinosaurs, quite closely related to the 'maniraptoran' group (such as Velociraptor, which places them in the 'Archosaur' lineage, and Crocodilians are also Archosaurs whereas lizards & snakes [& amphisbaenians] belong to the ["rival"] 'Lepidosaur' lineage instead. The position of the Chelonians (i.e. tortoises & turtles) is still not completely clear, but it's thought now that they probably branched off from the 'Diapsid' reptiles slightly before the main stem of those was split between Archosaurs & Lepidosaurs.
The Confrederated Clans (and other Confrederated Bodys) of the Free Bears of Bears Armed
(includes The Ursine NorthLands) Demonym = Bear[s]; adjective = ‘Urrsish’.
Population = just under 20 million. Economy = only Thriving. Average Life expectancy = c.60 years. If the nation is classified as 'Anarchy' there still is a [strictly limited] national government... and those aren't "biker gangs", they're traditional cross-Clan 'Warrior Societies', generally respected rather than feared.
Author of some GA Resolutions, via Bears Armed Mission; subject of an SC resolution.
Factbook. We have more than 70 MAPS. Visitors' Guide.
The IDU's WA Drafting Room is open to help you.
Author of issues #429, 712, 729, 934, 1120, 1152, 1474, 1521.

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Naqil
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Posts: 173
Founded: Apr 11, 2017
Ex-Nation

Postby Naqil » Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:20 am

((OOC: Yes, birds are reptiles. I don’t get why you’re making a big deal out of this?))
This nation's views do not necessarily coincide with my own. Please assume all statements are IC unless specified otherwise.

The Naqin Ambassador is Ixhua of House Yavuas. She's extremely traditionalist, and is known to have her eye on the Presidency for when President Dratan retires.

Essu Beti is my puppet, in theory. In actuality I use Essu Beti as more or less my default these days even though this account came first.

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The Greater Siriusian Domain
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Founded: Mar 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby The Greater Siriusian Domain » Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:17 pm

OOC: A little advice. Don't focus on making your proposal legal first. Legality doesn't necessarily mean good. Focus on writing a good proposal first, then make it legal.
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Araraukar
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Founded: May 14, 2007
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Araraukar » Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:27 pm

Bears Armed wrote:OOC: Maybe because they're actually less closely related to the other 'reptiles' than they are to birds?

OOC: So now we know why the crocodiles never try to eat the birds that pick bits of past meals out from between their teeth? :P
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Araraukar's RP reality is Modern Tech solarpunk. In IC in the WA.
Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
Apologies for absences, non-COVID health issues leave me with very little energy at times.


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