DRAFT: Against Unnecessary Food Wastage

[Aclion]

It might help the category but it's a very weak argument. Contrary to what what your parents might have told you, famines are a product of things like war, crop failure or government policy, not people in other countries wasting food.

OOC: Famines are (If you add 'corporate policy' to your list of causes), but food insecurity is a function of food pricing (Through either costs of manufacture which includes losses on wastage or scarcity-induced price increases). Reducing wastage would lower manufacturing costs (Thus lower prices) and would reduce scarcity (Again, lower prices). Unless you contend that there's a famine due to war, crop failure, government policy or corporate policy in the US right now, 15,6 million food insecure households would very much like people to stop wasting food that they could have used.

Bad example. The US is not a WA compliant nation.
WA nations may not allow people to go without adequate nutrition, so inflating the cost of food through waste would just increase the cost of providing people with food.

[Attempted Socialism]

OOC:

OOC: Famines are (If you add 'corporate policy' to your list of causes), but food insecurity is a function of food pricing (Through either costs of manufacture which includes losses on wastage or scarcity-induced price increases). Reducing wastage would lower manufacturing costs (Thus lower prices) and would reduce scarcity (Again, lower prices). Unless you contend that there's a famine due to war, crop failure, government policy or corporate policy in the US right now, 15,6 million food insecure households would very much like people to stop wasting food that they could have used.

Bad example. The US is not a WA compliant nation.
WA nations may not allow people to go without adequate nutrition, so inflating the cost of food through waste would just increase the cost of providing people with food.

The US is an example of a wealthy nation with high amounts of food waste, that does not have a famine, yet still reliably has food-insecurities in 10-15% of households. Less food waste, in this case, would lower food insecurities, loss from waste, or both (Depending on implementation). If the US had a legal obligation (Rather than just an ethical one) to rectify malnutrition, à la WA nations, it would lower the costs of the US government fulfilling that obligation. For a resolution against wasting food, USA seems like an excellent example of how food wastage is bad and ought to be reduced - whether it helps domestic or foreign people.

IC:
"Why is clause four explicitly targeted at donations to foreign countries, while clauses five and six are agnostic on the subject of recepient countries? Why not have all three clauses agnostic on the subject of countries? If a disaster strikes in a domestic area, that would allow NPOs to act there as well as in foreign countries."

[Araraukar]

because I'd also rather eat a cow that ate grass and hay during its lifetime than one that ate something unnatural for its species...

Well all the crops fed to cows are unnatural for them. They ain't gonna be growing corn without humans planting & breeding it.

OOC: Which is exactly what Bears meant and what I was referring to, so, uh, thank you for joining the choir? *tease*

(EDIT: I also learned today that making a vegan b'day cake is very difficult if it also has to be wheatless and soyless...)

OOC: Thought trying to work that out might turn out fun.

OOC: I have like 11 more recipes to try, I'll eventually manage it, but it might not be until next year's b'day. For now baking separate cakes for no-wheat/soy and nothing-from-an-animal people. More leftovers for us omnivores.

OOC: The US is an example of a wealthy nation

OOC: A wealthy nation that doesn't provide universal healthcare, doesn't provide easily-affordable education all the way to a Master's Degree, doesn't care about human rights when they're not its own white protestant (male) population's rights, doesn't think it's wrong to torture people for military intelligence, doesn't care that its legal justice system is a joke for everyone on the planet, and doesn't do a lot of other stuff that would make it a) a good example of a RL wealthy nation, or b) a good example for a GA reference, I'm sorry to say.
*hides from SP, because he's a lawyer-in-training and I know he's got a cat he's not afraid to use*

IC:

"Why is clause four explicitly targeted at donations to foreign countries, while clauses five and six are agnostic on the subject of recepient countries? Why not have all three clauses agnostic on the subject of countries?"

"Agnostic?" Johan asked, confused, while trying to make sense of the notes miss Leveret had left to him concerning this particular draft. "Isn't that word something to do with religion? I'm afraid I don't know anything about religions..."

[Attempted Socialism]

OOC: The US is an example of a wealthy nation

OOC: A wealthy nation that doesn't provide universal healthcare, doesn't provide easily-affordable education all the way to a Master's Degree, doesn't care about human rights when they're not its own white protestant (male) population's rights, doesn't think it's wrong to torture people for military intelligence, doesn't care that its legal justice system is a joke for everyone on the planet, and doesn't do a lot of other stuff that would make it a) a good example of a RL wealthy nation, or b) a good example for a GA reference, I'm sorry to say.
*hides from SP, because he's a lawyer-in-training and I know he's got a cat he's not afraid to use*

OOC: But it is a good example of why famines aren't our sole concern when working to reduce food wastage. Also, my ex-GF have pet mice and I'm not afraid to reference them on an online debate forum!

IC:

IC:

"Why is clause four explicitly targeted at donations to foreign countries, while clauses five and six are agnostic on the subject of recepient countries? Why not have all three clauses agnostic on the subject of countries?"

"Agnostic?" Johan asked, confused, while trying to make sense of the notes miss Leveret had left to him concerning this particular draft. "Isn't that word something to do with religion? I'm afraid I don't know anything about religions..."

"Um," 'MacBeth Illum says, taken by surprise that her oft-over-academised vocabulary has once again limited her communicative capabilities towards individuals lacking her enthusiasm for sesquipedalian loquaciousness, "Without knowledge of, or perhaps indifferent to, in this case. Regardless of intended domestic or foreign recipient..."
An aide gently prods the Ambassador before speaking into the microphone: "Just drop foreign nation part from clause 4. Nationality doesn't matter as long as the food gets to someone who needs it."

[Araraukar]

"Just drop foreign nation part from clause 4. Nationality doesn't matter as long as the food gets to someone who needs it."

OOC: Originally the issue with wanting to do that was that the manufacturers would not want to donate foodstuffs that were going to be cutting into their profits, at least domestically - whereas doing so with foreign nations would be good PR for them and thus make them more likely to want to do it.

Because if people get free food, they don't need to buy food. If you can think of a way out of that vicious circle, I'm all ears.

[Imperium Anglorum]

Argument above is unsupported in marginal differential of PR given differential distribution.

[Araraukar]

Argument above is unsupported in marginal differential of PR given differential distribution.

IC: "Suosittelen kissanruokapurkkietikettien lukemista vessassa istuessa, koska kierrätyastia sattui olemaan siellä ja vessaistunnosta tuli pitempi kuin aiottu, se avataraa maailmankuvaa."

OOC: I'm dying of laughter of what Google Translate makes of that, so I'm leaving the typo in...

[Attempted Socialism]

Argument above is unsupported in marginal differential of PR given differential distribution.

IC: "Suosittelen kissanruokapurkkietikettien lukemista vessassa istuessa, koska kierrätyastia sattui olemaan siellä ja vessaistunnosta tuli pitempi kuin aiottu, se avataraa maailmankuvaa."

OOC: I'm dying of laughter of what Google Translate makes of that, so I'm leaving the typo in...

OOC: I have always held the opinion that Finland could not be a Nordic country, because no way you could say that with a potato in your mouth, no matter how stupidly drunk you get...

"Just drop foreign nation part from clause 4. Nationality doesn't matter as long as the food gets to someone who needs it."

OOC: Originally the issue with wanting to do that was that the manufacturers would not want to donate foodstuffs that were going to be cutting into their profits, at least domestically - whereas doing so with foreign nations would be good PR for them and thus make them more likely to want to do it.

Because if people get free food, they don't need to buy food. If you can think of a way out of that vicious circle, I'm all ears.

Will get back to you with a vicious solution.

[Araraukar]

OOC: I have always held the opinion that Finland could not be a Nordic country, because no way you could say that with a potato in your mouth, no matter how stupidly drunk you get...

OOC: Finnish can be difficult for foreigners but probably not for the reasons you're thinking of (pronunciation). Though at Worldcon 2017 I did spend 10 minutes trying to get someone to understand the difference between "J" (which in English you get from "Y" and the start of "you") and "I" (which in English you get from "E" in "we") at the start of the word (their partner was on my side, though, because their native language wasn't English either), and discovered that unless I'm being careful with pronunciations (which is hard when you're talking in a foreign language with someone whose native language it is, and trying to keep it coherent - pronunciation and grammar take the backseat, and hand gestures are essential), I'm having a hard time keeping "P" and "B" (the latter of which is not native to Finnish and basically only exists on loan words like "banaani" or "baari") from not getting mixed up. (Usually you can tell from the context or the rest of the word, but when trying to talk about PDF text files, I literally had to draw the letters in the air for them.)

[Lex Pacis]

Food wastage is a big shame to the human world. There is enough for everyone's need, but not for everyone's greed.
Being a convinced socialist country, Lex Pacis blames unrestricted consumerism for the problem.

But this is not the moment to discuss the consumption. First we need to solve the problem itself.
Lex Pacis does everything it can to stop food waste. For the day of tomorrow

[Araraukar]

But this is not the moment to discuss the consumption. First we need to solve the problem itself. Lex Pacis does everything it can to stop food waste. For the day of tomorrow

OOC: Exactly how are you going to solve the problem if you're not willing to discuss it?

[Snowman]

Sorry if digging up, but if you are still doing this, your leftovers definition needs some work. All final products are "not processed further." Along the same lines, just because it is not profitable further processed, doesn't mean it's not. Distillers grains is sold from mills, & a lot of people would be mad, AKA Cathleen & corn growers everywhere, if you forced them to give away their business. You'd probably really be killing more people/wasting more food if you submitted this.

[Araraukar]

Sorry if digging up, but if you are still doing this

OOC: I'll try to get back to this later this week, but we'll see. I'll put up a new draft when I have a new draft written up. It won't be written today.

your leftovers definition needs some work. All final products are "not processed further."

So avoiding recursiveness is not possible, then... "Defining manufacturing leftovers as food manufacturing leftovers" just sounds so pointless.

Along the same lines, just because it is not profitable further processed, doesn't mean it's not. Distillers grains is sold from mills, & a lot of people would be mad, AKA Cathleen & corn growers everywhere, if you forced them to give away their business.

I literally don't understand what you mean by any of that (though it might also partially be because I've accrued about 12 hours of sleep debt in the last 4 days and my brain's not quite as quick on the associative leaps as usual). If you're using RL references, please provide links or more explanations?

[Snowman]

Oops, I meant cattle & corn, stupid autocorrect. I don't have a link because it's my life but maybe a wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distillers_grains. It is left over after making stuff for ethanol. The plant sells the leftovers to livestock operations because the left-overs are high in protein.

[He Qixin]

OOC: Hey Araraukar, I just bumped and suddenly realized this draft. Just asking you, is this draft still going to be worked on, or is this closed?

[Araraukar]

OOC: Hey Araraukar, I just bumped and suddenly realized this draft. Just asking you, is this draft still going to be worked on, or is this closed?

OOC: Please don't bump threads that aren't yours. I'll get back to it when I have a new draft written. I don't yet have a new draft written.

Please leave my drafts alone.

[He Qixin 2]

OOC: Hey Araraukar, I just bumped and suddenly realized this draft. Just asking you, is this draft still going to be worked on, or is this closed?

OOC: Please don't bump threads that aren't yours. I'll get back to it when I have a new draft written. I don't yet have a new draft written.

Please leave my drafts alone.

OOC: ok i was just curious