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[DRAFT, OOC] The End of Capitalism & discussions

Where WA members debate how to improve the world, one resolution at a time.
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Imperium Anglorum
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Founded: Aug 26, 2013
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[DRAFT, OOC] The End of Capitalism & discussions

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:55 am

Category: Social Justice
Strength: Mild

The World Assembly,

Believing that the inequities caused by capitalism, where huge amounts of wealth are sequestered in the richest portions of society causes an extreme hazard to national populations by depriving the poor of food, water, and other necessities of life in the name of profits, hereby

1. Creates the World Assembly Central Planning Board, which is granted overarching authority to regulate and control all economic activity with unlimited powers, subject to prior extant legislation, to service the ends of:
  1. ending economic inequality around the world,
  2. ensuring the equitable distribution of resources to all members of society, and
  3. preventing the means of production from falling into the control of a single class in society and
2. Encourages member nations to redistribute wealth to solve wealth and income inequality in their nations.

There are a number of absurd arguments about the Strength, Committee-only, and Optionality rules which this should test and resolve. You will probably want to go to the Legality Challenge thread, because this proposal isn't changing. This is a fully OOC thread.

EDIT: What this thread isn't about is:
  • the ability to debate various subjects in this thread
  • the author's motives for writing this proposal
  • whether the proposal is going to a vote
  • whether the proposal is a joke or not (it isn't, it's a test case)
Those are topics which would then be "Appropriating a thread for a discussion totally unrelated to the original purpose of said thread", as this thread is explicitly not about those topics. This thread is and has been about the proposal as a policy issue, the legality challenge associated (and linked in this post), and its implications on the ruleset.

Part of the original purpose of this thread is provision of a place to discuss the implications that emerge from the legality challenge, which cannot be spoken of in the legality challenge thread, as posts there have to be germane to the legality challenge per se.

EDIT: To be clear, because it apparently isn't clear:

The purpose of this proposal is to act as a test proposal and as the basis for an official query about the GA rules. It deals with the optionality, committee-only, and strength rules. There is disagreement about whether encouragement and recommendation clauses allow a proposal to pass muster through the committee-only rule. This would resolve that. As it is stated as 'Strong', it also helps to resolve a consistent question about Committees themselves: whether or not those committees can have a statistical effect all of their own. Both of these questions were discussed during the GA Rules Consortium [Committee rule thread]. They have been brought up various times in drafting threads since that Consortium, and they are also important questions which consistently dog proposals from new authors that consistently raise disagreements.

Resolution of the issue via the creation of test cases and official queries is precedented. This is the correct forum in which to do so. And resolution of the issues would improve the Assembly by clarifying ambiguities in the ruleset and resolving long-standing disputes.

With that in mind, I would request that people refrain from derailing this thread with immaterial arguments not having to do with this intended purpose.
Last edited by Imperium Anglorum on Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:07 am, edited 17 times in total.

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Kitzerland
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Founded: Sep 22, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Kitzerland » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:56 am

Must we do this?
terrible takes plz ignore

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The Greater Siriusian Domain
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Posts: 920
Founded: Mar 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby The Greater Siriusian Domain » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:57 am

OOC: I think you're off your rocker, IA.
"For a mind so determined to reach the sky, on the wings of a dream!" - Sanctity, Zeppo
This nation's factbook supersedes NS stats and issues, but does not completely replace them. If there is a conflict, the Factbook is correct.

Isentran has been DENOUNCED for proposing legislation that would destroy the economy of the Greater Siriusian Domain
The Greater Siriusian Domain is a borderline Class Z9 Civilization according to this scale

Primary Ambassador: Teran Saber, Male Siriusian. Snarky, slightly arrogant.
Substitute Ambassador: Ra'lingth, Male En'gari. Speaks with emphasized "s" sounds.

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Setgavarius
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Founded: Mar 21, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Setgavarius » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:57 am

Image
As a WA member (another country) I know this is probably nuts as a resolution but I admire it all the same!
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UKCS
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Founded: Oct 04, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby UKCS » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:58 am

The Greater Siriusian Domain wrote:OOC: I think you're off your rocker, IA.

He is my regional delegate. Help.
Please.
I am female. Refer to me as a female, please. Call me Megan.
☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭
Any semblance of the old nation(s) no longer exists. This new nation is approximately 260 years after the last update to the former incarnation of this account. It was physically painful to delete all those factbooks....

Authoritarian socialist, British, and damned proud of it. The SNP are traitors, don't be fooled.

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Switzo-Polish Republic
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Founded: Sep 18, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Switzo-Polish Republic » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:59 am

I feel you bro!

No taking over the damn businesses
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Lord Dominator
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Founded: Dec 22, 2016
Right-wing Utopia

Postby Lord Dominator » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:59 am

OOC: So is this going for a ruling on ideological ban, or whether the 'Encourages' is enough to prevent committee only (if there isn't already precedent on this)?

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The Greater Siriusian Domain
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Founded: Mar 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby The Greater Siriusian Domain » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:59 am

UKCS wrote:
The Greater Siriusian Domain wrote:OOC: I think you're off your rocker, IA.

He is my regional delegate. Help.
Please.


OOC: I wish I could, but I don't have that kind of power.
"For a mind so determined to reach the sky, on the wings of a dream!" - Sanctity, Zeppo
This nation's factbook supersedes NS stats and issues, but does not completely replace them. If there is a conflict, the Factbook is correct.

Isentran has been DENOUNCED for proposing legislation that would destroy the economy of the Greater Siriusian Domain
The Greater Siriusian Domain is a borderline Class Z9 Civilization according to this scale

Primary Ambassador: Teran Saber, Male Siriusian. Snarky, slightly arrogant.
Substitute Ambassador: Ra'lingth, Male En'gari. Speaks with emphasized "s" sounds.

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UKCS
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Posts: 838
Founded: Oct 04, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby UKCS » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:01 am

The Greater Siriusian Domain wrote:
UKCS wrote:He is my regional delegate. Help.
Please.


OOC: I wish I could, but I don't have that kind of power.

Thanks anyway. Just at least send me some kind of spoon to chisel my way out.
I am female. Refer to me as a female, please. Call me Megan.
☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭☭
Any semblance of the old nation(s) no longer exists. This new nation is approximately 260 years after the last update to the former incarnation of this account. It was physically painful to delete all those factbooks....

Authoritarian socialist, British, and damned proud of it. The SNP are traitors, don't be fooled.

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United Democratic Christian States
Minister
 
Posts: 2009
Founded: Sep 29, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby United Democratic Christian States » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:06 am

*Scanning for secularism*

*None found*

And what if the majority of that country WANTS capatilism?

Should we destroy said will?

If it's the will of the people for socialism let socialism in. If not, then Socialism shouldn't take root.

This is coming from a non-WA member mixed economist.
Call me Greg (my IRL name) or UDCS. Whichever works best for you.

"[28] He said to them: 'You are well aware that it is against our law for a Jew to associate with or visit a Gentile. But God has shown me that I should not call anyone impure or unclean.' "
-Acts 10:28

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Wealthatonia
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Posts: 212
Founded: Sep 19, 2016
Capitalist Paradise

Postby Wealthatonia » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:09 am

This proposal is made from shrews jealous of the success of other nations. Socialism and Communism only start because a poor wretch couldn't succeed and blamed it on others
Wealthatonian Ambassador JP Rockefeller

"Fine dining, grand buffets, and money used as napkins as far as the eye can see.

Gold-topped everything for Wealthatonia" what New Scaiva and Horshenwurst thinks the average meal is like in our nation

_[' ]_
(-_Q) If you support Capitalism put this in your Signature!

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The Canadian North-West
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Founded: Jun 29, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby The Canadian North-West » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:12 am

This resolution kind of goes against the guidelines of the world assembly...
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United Democratic Christian States
Minister
 
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Founded: Sep 29, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby United Democratic Christian States » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:12 am

Wealthatonia wrote:This proposal is made from shrews jealous of the success of other nations. Socialism and Communism only start because a poor wretch couldn't succeed and blamed it on others

Sadly this is where the left is correct.

Not everyone is given a fair chance in ANY society that doesn't force equal distribution of pay.
The rich will always abuse the poor if left unchecked.

That's why regulations, social safety nets and taxes on the rich aren't as bad as people say.
Call me Greg (my IRL name) or UDCS. Whichever works best for you.

"[28] He said to them: 'You are well aware that it is against our law for a Jew to associate with or visit a Gentile. But God has shown me that I should not call anyone impure or unclean.' "
-Acts 10:28

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Wealthatonia
Envoy
 
Posts: 212
Founded: Sep 19, 2016
Capitalist Paradise

Postby Wealthatonia » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:15 am

United Democratic Christian States wrote:
Wealthatonia wrote:This proposal is made from shrews jealous of the success of other nations. Socialism and Communism only start because a poor wretch couldn't succeed and blamed it on others

Sadly this is where the left is correct.

Not everyone is given a fair chance in ANY society that doesn't force equal distribution of pay.
The rich will always abuse the poor if left unchecked.

That's why regulations, social safety nets and taxes on the rich aren't as bad as people say.


This is exactly what a person who has given up and blames others would say
Wealthatonian Ambassador JP Rockefeller

"Fine dining, grand buffets, and money used as napkins as far as the eye can see.

Gold-topped everything for Wealthatonia" what New Scaiva and Horshenwurst thinks the average meal is like in our nation

_[' ]_
(-_Q) If you support Capitalism put this in your Signature!

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United Democratic Christian States
Minister
 
Posts: 2009
Founded: Sep 29, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby United Democratic Christian States » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:23 am

Wealthatonia wrote:
United Democratic Christian States wrote:Sadly this is where the left is correct.

Not everyone is given a fair chance in ANY society that doesn't force equal distribution of pay.
The rich will always abuse the poor if left unchecked.

That's why regulations, social safety nets and taxes on the rich aren't as bad as people say.


This is exactly what a person who has given up and blames others would say

Alright let's say capatilism does take full root.

Soon without regulations, a monopoly is formed in the bread industry.

The CEO of that company now has the power to control the price of bread.

The CEO in turn raises the price of bread to $100 a loaf.

The few who can pay this actually over pay so much that the company still profits even more than before keeping investors happy.

And if u need more proof, play a game of monopoly....it was invented to show the broken nature of Capatilism.
Call me Greg (my IRL name) or UDCS. Whichever works best for you.

"[28] He said to them: 'You are well aware that it is against our law for a Jew to associate with or visit a Gentile. But God has shown me that I should not call anyone impure or unclean.' "
-Acts 10:28

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Frostnia
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Posts: 272
Founded: Aug 06, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Frostnia » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:36 am

Imperium Anglorum wrote:Category: Social Justice
Strength: Mild

The World Assembly,

Believing that the inequities caused by capitalism, where huge amounts of wealth are sequestered in the richest portions of society causes an extreme hazard to national populations by depriving the poor of food, water, and other necessities of life in the name of profits, hereby

1. Creates the World Assembly Central Planning Board, which is granted overarching authority to regulate and control all economic activity with unlimited powers, subject to prior extant legislation, to service the ends of:
  1. ending economic inequality around the world,
  2. ensuring the equitable distribution of resources to all members of society, and
  3. preventing the means of production from falling into the control of a single class in society;

2. Encourages member nations redistribute wealth to solve wealth and income inequality in their nations.

There are a number of absurd arguments about the Strength, Committee-only, and Optionality rules which this should test and resolve. You will probably want to go to the Legality Challenge thread, because this proposal isn't changing. This is a fully OOC drafting thread.


You're crazy.
MT nation composed of people from every nation with a current Antarctic base. NS stats somewhat apply (despite them being generally stupid). I would use my factbooks but I'm lazy and haven't gotten around to it yet.

Antarctica is a pretty "cool" place.
I'm not sorry

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Wealthatonia
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Posts: 212
Founded: Sep 19, 2016
Capitalist Paradise

Postby Wealthatonia » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:40 am

United Democratic Christian States wrote:
Wealthatonia wrote:
This is exactly what a person who has given up and blames others would say

Alright let's say capatilism does take full root.

Soon without regulations, a monopoly is formed in the bread industry.

The CEO of that company now has the power to control the price of bread.

The CEO in turn raises the price of bread to $100 a loaf.

The few who can pay this actually over pay so much that the company still profits even more than before keeping investors happy.

And if u need more proof, play a game of monopoly....it was invented to show the broken nature of Capatilism.


Wealthatonia does not have monopolies, it's bad for buisness when a company can release flawed products because of a lack of competition

Monopoly is merely a board game intended to bring fun to players.
Wealthatonian Ambassador JP Rockefeller

"Fine dining, grand buffets, and money used as napkins as far as the eye can see.

Gold-topped everything for Wealthatonia" what New Scaiva and Horshenwurst thinks the average meal is like in our nation

_[' ]_
(-_Q) If you support Capitalism put this in your Signature!

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Bananaistan
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Posts: 3518
Founded: Apr 20, 2012
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Bananaistan » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:41 am

Kitzerland wrote:Must we do this?


Yes. The unreasonable reinterpretation of the long established norms of the interpretation of GA resolutions needs to be stopped. I commend IA for these efforts.
Last edited by Bananaistan on Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
Delegation of the People's Republic of Bananaistan to the World Assembly
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Kitzerland
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Founded: Sep 22, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Kitzerland » Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:43 am

Bananaistan wrote:
Kitzerland wrote:Must we do this?


Yes. The unreasonable reinterpretation of the long established norms of the interpretation of GA resolutions needs to be stopped. I commend IA for these efforts.

Alright then.
terrible takes plz ignore

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United Democratic Christian States
Minister
 
Posts: 2009
Founded: Sep 29, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Separated thoughts so it flowed better

Postby United Democratic Christian States » Wed Apr 12, 2017 12:08 pm

Wealthatonia wrote:
United Democratic Christian States wrote:Alright let's say capatilism does take full root.

Soon without regulations, a monopoly is formed in the bread industry.

The CEO of that company now has the power to control the price of bread.

The CEO in turn raises the price of bread to $100 a loaf.

The few who can pay this actually over pay so much that the company still profits even more than before keeping investors happy.

And if u need more proof, play a game of monopoly....it was invented to show the broken nature of Capatilism.


Wealthatonia does not have monopolies, it's bad for buisness when a company can release flawed products because of a lack of competition

Monopoly is merely a board game intended to bring fun to players.

Then what u have is a regulation.....

Therefor you are literally helping the poor. And hurting the rich.

___________________________

Or so you thought...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monopoly_(game)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_George

^person mentioned in the very first paragraph
Last edited by United Democratic Christian States on Wed Apr 12, 2017 12:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Call me Greg (my IRL name) or UDCS. Whichever works best for you.

"[28] He said to them: 'You are well aware that it is against our law for a Jew to associate with or visit a Gentile. But God has shown me that I should not call anyone impure or unclean.' "
-Acts 10:28

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Excidium Planetis
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Founded: May 01, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Excidium Planetis » Wed Apr 12, 2017 12:14 pm

What the fuck is an OOC draft?
Current Ambassador: Adelia Meritt
Ex-Ambassador: Cornelia Schultz, author of GA#355 and GA#368.
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United Democratic Christian States
Minister
 
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Founded: Sep 29, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby United Democratic Christian States » Wed Apr 12, 2017 12:15 pm

Excidium Planetis wrote:What the fuck is an OOC draft?

Im not a WA member so I don't know....

Did the WA become a role play or something XD?
Call me Greg (my IRL name) or UDCS. Whichever works best for you.

"[28] He said to them: 'You are well aware that it is against our law for a Jew to associate with or visit a Gentile. But God has shown me that I should not call anyone impure or unclean.' "
-Acts 10:28

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Excidium Planetis
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Founded: May 01, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Excidium Planetis » Wed Apr 12, 2017 12:22 pm

United Democratic Christian States wrote:
Excidium Planetis wrote:What the fuck is an OOC draft?

Im not a WA member so I don't know....

Did the WA become a role play or something XD?


The WA has always been a roleplay forum. All other drafting threads are In Character, and you will find people debating In Character.
Current Ambassador: Adelia Meritt
Ex-Ambassador: Cornelia Schultz, author of GA#355 and GA#368.
#MakeLegislationFunnyAgain
Singaporean Transhumans wrote:You didn't know about Excidium? The greatest space nomads in the NS multiverse with a healthy dose (read: over 9000 percent) of realism?
Saveyou Island wrote:"Warmest welcomes to the Assembly, ambassador. You'll soon learn to hate everyone here."
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Digital Network Defence is pretty meh
Tier 9 nation, according to my index.Made of nomadic fleets.


News: AI wins Dawn Fleet election for High Counselor.

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Imperium Anglorum
GA Secretariat
 
Posts: 12664
Founded: Aug 26, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Imperium Anglorum » Wed Apr 12, 2017 12:31 pm

Excidium Planetis wrote:What the fuck is an OOC draft?

It's an idea proposed by Gruenberg a few months ago, as he wanted to find some way to separate OOC from in-character debate, seeing the lack thereof as one of the primary problems in the Assembly. However it is, as this proposal is basically a test proposal, it basically will deal entirely with ruleset implications, which are necessarily outside of the scope of in-character debate.

Author: 1 SC and 56+ GA resolutions
Maintainer: GA Passed Resolutions
Developer: Communiqué and InfoEurope
GenSec (24 Dec 2021 –); posts not official unless so indicated
Delegate for Europe
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Ideological Bulwark 285, WALL delegate
Twice-commended toxic villainous globalist kittehs

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Wealthatonia
Envoy
 
Posts: 212
Founded: Sep 19, 2016
Capitalist Paradise

Postby Wealthatonia » Wed Apr 12, 2017 12:35 pm

United Democratic Christian States wrote:
Wealthatonia wrote:
Wealthatonia does not have monopolies, it's bad for buisness when a company can release flawed products because of a lack of competition

Monopoly is merely a board game intended to bring fun to players.

Then what u have is a regulation.....

Therefor you are literally helping the poor. And hurting the rich.

___________________________

Or so you thought...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monopoly_(game)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_George

^person mentioned in the very first paragraph


Ambassador Rockefeller just rolls his eyes. "I hope the stock market resolution passes, we'll gladly buy stock in you.
Wealthatonian Ambassador JP Rockefeller

"Fine dining, grand buffets, and money used as napkins as far as the eye can see.

Gold-topped everything for Wealthatonia" what New Scaiva and Horshenwurst thinks the average meal is like in our nation

_[' ]_
(-_Q) If you support Capitalism put this in your Signature!

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