"Intentions do not matter in legalese. Words do. What is intended and what is written can mean two different things."
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by Canton Empire » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:29 pm
by Imperium Anglorum » Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:31 pm
Whovian Tardisia wrote:"I'm amazed nobody spotted it in the drafting process as an issue."
by Wallenburg » Fri Dec 09, 2016 8:34 pm
Canton Empire wrote:Wallenburg wrote:"Ah. Well, in that case, your interpretation carries far less weight. Wallenburg will be more reasonable, and interpret it as intended by its author."
"Intentions do not matter in legalese. Words do. What is intended and what is written can mean two different things."
by Excidium Planetis » Fri Dec 09, 2016 10:25 pm
Canton Empire wrote:Calladan wrote:
Except don't you need to have some proof of brain activity or capability of independent thought to be sapient? Something that sets us apart from rocks and water and dirt and politicians and so on?
No, because of the way the clause is worded. The "regardless of biological status" part means that if you can prove it was sapient, it is still considered alive, regardless of being what we would consider dead
Singaporean Transhumans wrote:You didn't know about Excidium? The greatest space nomads in the NS multiverse with a healthy dose (read: over 9000 percent) of realism?
Saveyou Island wrote:"Warmest welcomes to the Assembly, ambassador. You'll soon learn to hate everyone here."
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Digital Network Defence is pretty meh
News: AI wins Dawn Fleet election for High Counselor.
by Separatist Peoples » Sat Dec 10, 2016 6:08 am
Canton Empire wrote:Wallenburg wrote:"Ah. Well, in that case, your interpretation carries far less weight. Wallenburg will be more reasonable, and interpret it as intended by its author."
"Intentions do not matter in legalese. Words do. What is intended and what is written can mean two different things."
by Calladan » Sat Dec 10, 2016 6:52 am
Separatist Peoples wrote:Canton Empire wrote:"Intentions do not matter in legalese. Words do. What is intended and what is written can mean two different things."
"That is a bloody lie. Intent of the law is necessary in interpreting the letter of the law."
OOC: That is untrue and demonstrates a lack of awareness of how the law works. Intent of the law is absolutely critical in interpreting the letter of the law.
by Separatist Peoples » Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:36 am
Calladan wrote:Separatist Peoples wrote:"That is a bloody lie. Intent of the law is necessary in interpreting the letter of the law."
OOC: That is untrue and demonstrates a lack of awareness of how the law works. Intent of the law is absolutely critical in interpreting the letter of the law.
(ooc - I am not entirely sure that is true. There was a case in the UK this week where the letter of the law prevented the intent of the law from being pursued in the courts - a view that most people think was utter nonsense, complete bollocks and somewhat of a travesty of justice. And when I say most people, I mean "I think most people" )
by Aclion » Sat Dec 10, 2016 8:18 am
Canton Empire wrote:Wallenburg wrote:"Ah. Well, in that case, your interpretation carries far less weight. Wallenburg will be more reasonable, and interpret it as intended by its author."
"Intentions do not matter in legalese. Words do. What is intended and what is written can mean two different things."
by Imperium Anglorum » Sat Dec 10, 2016 8:35 am
Aclion wrote:Canton Empire wrote:"Intentions do not matter in legalese. Words do. What is intended and what is written can mean two different things."
OOC: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Originalism
by Excidium Planetis » Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:40 am
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Aclion wrote:OOC: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Originalism
OOC: The WA actually follows something called strict textualism.
Singaporean Transhumans wrote:You didn't know about Excidium? The greatest space nomads in the NS multiverse with a healthy dose (read: over 9000 percent) of realism?
Saveyou Island wrote:"Warmest welcomes to the Assembly, ambassador. You'll soon learn to hate everyone here."
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Digital Network Defence is pretty meh
News: AI wins Dawn Fleet election for High Counselor.
by Imperium Anglorum » Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:45 am
by Separatist Peoples » Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:47 am
by Canton Empire » Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:20 am
by Excidium Planetis » Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:23 am
Singaporean Transhumans wrote:You didn't know about Excidium? The greatest space nomads in the NS multiverse with a healthy dose (read: over 9000 percent) of realism?
Saveyou Island wrote:"Warmest welcomes to the Assembly, ambassador. You'll soon learn to hate everyone here."
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Digital Network Defence is pretty meh
News: AI wins Dawn Fleet election for High Counselor.
by Separatist Peoples » Sat Dec 10, 2016 2:57 pm
by Excidium Planetis » Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:56 pm
Singaporean Transhumans wrote:You didn't know about Excidium? The greatest space nomads in the NS multiverse with a healthy dose (read: over 9000 percent) of realism?
Saveyou Island wrote:"Warmest welcomes to the Assembly, ambassador. You'll soon learn to hate everyone here."
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Digital Network Defence is pretty meh
News: AI wins Dawn Fleet election for High Counselor.
by Bears Armed » Sun Dec 11, 2016 5:44 am
OOC:Excidium Planetis wrote:2) Apparently we are expected to make challenges against our own proposals before submitting them now, especially when they are at risk of falling afoul of the rules (like Honest Mistake)
3) Better to do that than get dinged for Honest Mistake.
by Separatist Peoples » Sun Dec 11, 2016 6:19 am
Excidium Planetis wrote:
Why not?
1) This was exactly what Gruenberg did.
2) Apparently we are expected to make challenges against our own proposals before submitting them now, especially when they are at risk of falling afoul of the rules (like Honest Mistake)
3) Better to do that than get dinged for Honest Mistake.
by Excidium Planetis » Sun Dec 11, 2016 2:00 pm
Separatist Peoples wrote:Excidium Planetis wrote:
Why not?
1) This was exactly what Gruenberg did.
2) Apparently we are expected to make challenges against our own proposals before submitting them now, especially when they are at risk of falling afoul of the rules (like Honest Mistake)
3) Better to do that than get dinged for Honest Mistake.
1. Gruen put us in a bind. We are in no such bind here, and we don't want to be forced into ruling on a hypothetical again. Please, don't do this.
2. Its that or let somebody else do it. Or let GenSec do it. This is easier all around.
3. Honest Mistake violations have no punitive penalty.
Bears Armed wrote:2/. If it's genuinely an Honest Mistake then you generally don't get "dinged": the proposal is deleted from the list, but no 'warning' ensues.
Singaporean Transhumans wrote:You didn't know about Excidium? The greatest space nomads in the NS multiverse with a healthy dose (read: over 9000 percent) of realism?
Saveyou Island wrote:"Warmest welcomes to the Assembly, ambassador. You'll soon learn to hate everyone here."
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Digital Network Defence is pretty meh
News: AI wins Dawn Fleet election for High Counselor.
by States of Glory WA Office » Sun Dec 11, 2016 4:12 pm
Excidium Planetis wrote:Separatist Peoples wrote:3. Honest Mistake violations have no punitive penalty.Bears Armed wrote:2/. If it's genuinely an Honest Mistake then you generally don't get "dinged": the proposal is deleted from the list, but no 'warning' ensues.
How do you know this? This isn't in the rules. The rules just say that you get warned for illegal proposals.
by Excidium Planetis » Mon Dec 12, 2016 1:24 am
Singaporean Transhumans wrote:You didn't know about Excidium? The greatest space nomads in the NS multiverse with a healthy dose (read: over 9000 percent) of realism?
Saveyou Island wrote:"Warmest welcomes to the Assembly, ambassador. You'll soon learn to hate everyone here."
Imperium Anglorum wrote:Digital Network Defence is pretty meh
News: AI wins Dawn Fleet election for High Counselor.
by Imperium Anglorum » Mon Dec 12, 2016 7:07 am
Excidium Planetis wrote:States of Glory WA Office wrote:OOC: Seriously? You think that the Mods haven't briefed them on the fine details regarding the rules?
Fine details concerning the rules? Why should there be such things? The rules are supposed to be publicly accessible, there aren't supposed to be hidden "fine details" that only the mods and those they have chosen to brief on such know.
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