Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme(CPRS) DRAFT UPDATED.

[Grays Harbor]

It is our belief that perhaps we should cease "feeding the troll" *coughMANBEARPIGcough* and get on with the debate, minus his extreme and ridiculous "views".

[The Altani Federation]

The Federation, regretfully, cannot support this measure.

While we certainly see the benefits to renewable and non-polluting energy sources, we must note that solar and wind energy are insufficient to power a developed nation unless a strong and self-correcting power grid is also in place, that utilizes effective storage in order to cover situations where wind or solar energy are unavailable. Developing such a power grid is neither cheap nor easy, and may well be beyond the capability of many member states. Your draft does nothing to address that difficulty, essentially placing an unfunded mandate on them.

The Federation is itself in the process of transitioning from our older coal and oil-fueled electric plants to wind, solar, hydropower, geothermal and nuclear energy. We still utilize the older plants on occasion, as backups when other sources fail or in times of peak demand. Depriving us of those backups would also be a significant burden, which this does not address.

Moving to renewable energy is desirable, but not when you force nations to do so with a blunt stick and give them no means to address the hardships such a transition can cause.

-Nikolai Nagashybyuly, Ambassador

[Grays Harbor]

We agree, Nikolai, which is one reason we ourselves are trying to steer the debate to an incentive based tone and not the "mandated punishment if you don't comply or else" tone it carries currently.

[The Altani Federation]

We agree, Nikolai, which is one reason we ourselves are trying to steer the debate to an incentive based tone and not the "mandated punishment if you don't comply or else" tone it carries currently.

Agreed. Perhaps one way to improve this would be for the WA to provide assistance to nations in making the transition to renewable energy sources, and to help with any harmful effects of that transition. However, the cost of that would no doubt make the WA's accountants scream and defenestrate themselves into the fountain.

-N.N. etc.

[Grays Harbor]

We agree, Nikolai, which is one reason we ourselves are trying to steer the debate to an incentive based tone and not the "mandated punishment if you don't comply or else" tone it carries currently.

Agreed. Perhaps one way to improve this would be for the WA to provide assistance to nations in making the transition to renewable energy sources, and to help with any harmful effects of that transition. However, the cost of that would no doubt make the WA's accountants scream and defenestrate themselves into the fountain.

-N.N. etc.

We are not certain how things are done in your nation, but let me assure you that the beancounters in mine start screaming when forced to purchase a new pencil because the one they currently use is less than a millimeter long. So, we have no doubt that WA beancounters are no less tight.

[James Bluntus]

How could I language this?

[Grays Harbor]

We have our staff working on some suggestions. Patience, please, patience.

[James Bluntus]

Okay.

[Manbearpig is real]

It is our belief that perhaps we should cease "feeding the troll" *coughMANBEARPIGcough*

It is not Manbearpigtroll, it is just Man Bear Pig. Don't you understand anything about biology? The Manbearpig is not capable of mating with the troll.

and get on with the debate, minus his extreme and ridiculous "views".

Extreme and ridiculous views? Extreme And Ridiculous Views? Either you believe that global warming is real or you do not. If you believe that it is real then you understand the urgency of the situation. You understand that this is our last chance to save the planet. You understand that half-measures are no better than doing nothing at all. Half measures are just something to make you feel good: "we did our part, we are good people".

If you are unsure that global warming is real then why would you wreck the economy to fix a problem that may or may not even exist?

This is serious business. The choices that will have to be made are not things to be entered into lightly and they will have consequences.

[Grays Harbor]

"We are bored with you now. Good Day to you."

[James Bluntus]

It is our belief that perhaps we should cease "feeding the troll" *coughMANBEARPIGcough*

It is not Manbearpigtroll, it is just Man Bear Pig. Don't you understand anything about biology? The Manbearpig is not capable of mating with the troll.

and get on with the debate, minus his extreme and ridiculous "views".

Extreme and ridiculous views? Extreme And Ridiculous Views? Either you believe that global warming is real or you do not. If you believe that it is real then you understand the urgency of the situation. You understand that this is our last chance to save the planet. You understand that half-measures are no better than doing nothing at all. Half measures are just something to make you feel good: "we did our part, we are good people".

If you are unsure that global warming is real then why would you wreck the economy to fix a problem that may or may not even exist?

This is serious business. The choices that will have to be made are not things to be entered into lightly and they will have consequences.

Please contribute to the debate. This is not a debate about whether Global Warming is real or not. It is about whether something should be done about it. Don't hide behind a puppet either.

[Manbearpig is real]

This is not a debate about whether Global Warming is real or not. It is about whether something should be done about it.

But it should be a debate about that. If it is real then drastic measures need to be taken to combat it. Immediately. If it is not real, or if we are unsure, then how can we justify taking those measures?

[Katganistan]

This is not a debate about whether Global Warming is real or not. It is about whether something should be done about it.

But it should be a debate about that.

However, it is NOT.
Stop threadjacking.

[James Bluntus]

This is not a debate about whether Global Warming is real or not. It is about whether something should be done about it.

But it should be a debate about that. If it is real then drastic measures need to be taken to combat it. Immediately. If it is not real, or if we are unsure, then how can we justify taking those measures?

Exactly. Drastic measures must be taken. That IS what this thread is about. However you are arguing if it is real or not and we know that it is real, otherwise I wouldn't putting this resolution forward. Now I would suggest that you do what Katganistan has told you to do and stop hijacking the debate.

[Rutianas]

CARBON POLLUTION REDUCTION SCHEME

ALARMED that the earth is warming at an increasing rate as a result of greenhouse gases being trapped in the atmosphere.

Okay, great, you've just exempted every nation not residing on Earth. Also, maybe your planet is dealing with greenhouse gases, but what about those that are not?

ALARMED that some nations are not doing anything to reduce their greenhouse gas emissions.

Because these nations are not on Earth and have no problem with greenhouse gas emissions reaching critical levels?

BELIEVES that legislation must be urgently enacted to bring an end to Climate Change.

Hereby enacts the following,

(1) Mandates the shutdown of polluting energy source stations 2 years after the renewable energy plant of the nation's choice has been operation.

What if said nation has no other form of alternative energy available? (OOC: Past Tech nations!) You're forcing them into complete economic downfall if they have no other way to provide energy other than polluting energy sources.

(2) Encourages governments to hand electricity industries to private investors to assist in the change over from polluting energy sources to renewable energy sources.

Why? Some nations have no private investors. Does that mean we're now encouraged to hand electricity industries over to foreign private investors? Forget it.

(3) This resolution does not prohibit public ownership of electricity industries.

Good.

(4) Gives the individual nations the right to choose which renewable energy source they would like to adopt.

Suggestions?

Yeah. There is no one size fits all when it comes to this kind of proposal. What's the point? Really. There's no one planet that everyone is on. There's no reason to force less advanced civilisations to return to the stone age just because they have no way to provide alternative energy. It would be forcing a bad situation on a lot of people. Prove to me that every planet is suffering from global warming, then I'll debate on what needs to be done.

Paula Jenner, Rutianas Ambassador

[James Bluntus]

Prove to me that every planet is suffering from global warming, then I'll debate on what needs to be done.

Paula Jenner, Rutianas Ambassador

With all due respect Paula. As a Mod has said previously. This debate is not about whether climate change is real or not.

Handing over to the private sector is encouraged but it is not compulsory.

Exactly how would I word it, without saying the word. "Earth". Not every single RPer RP's with planets.

Those nations can gain assistance from those nations that are in surplus with electricity supply.

Yours,
Renegade Turnist.

[Grays Harbor]

Prove to me that every planet is suffering from global warming, then I'll debate on what needs to be done.

Paula Jenner, Rutianas Ambassador

With all due respect Paula. As a Mod has said previously. This debate is not about whether climate change is real or not.

Yours,
Renegade Turnist.

Good point. And following that line of reasoning, then it should not be included as part of the text of the proposal.

[James Bluntus]

Prove to me that every planet is suffering from global warming, then I'll debate on what needs to be done.

Paula Jenner, Rutianas Ambassador

With all due respect Paula. As a Mod has said previously. This debate is not about whether climate change is real or not.

Yours,
Renegade Turnist.

Good point. And following that line of reasoning, then it should not be included as part of the text of the proposal.

I wasn't planning to put it in the text of the proposal.

Yours,
Renegade Turnist.

[Krioval]

OOC: I'm not about to debate the reality of RL global warming, but I may challenge the necessity of this proposal by arguing IC that said warming does not warrant an extreme response.

IC:

The Imperial Chiefdom does not find that global climate change poses a sufficient danger to warrant yet another poorly designed environmental proposal that will ultimately affect fewer than one quarter of nations. If anything, we should be promoting new technologies and more efficient means of producing food and manufactured goods, rather than pursuing a program that is essentially punitive. Further, Krioval believes that industrially developing nations should not be forced to bear the brunt of environmental reforms, and that too restrictive legislation may very well threaten the lives of more people than leaving things be while looking for a better solution.

[Lord] Ambassador Darvek Tyvok
Imperial Chiefdom of Krioval

[Tsukasa-chan]

I agree with previous ambassadors in that this proposal needs to move away from taxation and towards encouraging renewable energy sources. The specific wording of such a proposal is still being thought over.

However, I'd like to address a concern I have with the current bill: article 2. You fail to justify exactly how transferring ownership of critical infrastructure to private investors will assist in moving towards renewable energy sources, and I for one am extremely hesitant to do such a thing. As it stands the article reeks of the " the free market will save us" religion-meme that seems to infest so many.

Rin 4
International Ambassador

[Braakland]

While we in Braakland have always preferred to harness the energy of our environment rather than pollute our beautiful vallies with the mining and burning of fossil fuels, we must add our voice to those who say that any proposal attempting to ban whole forms of technology will do far more harm than good, and that if this problem should be adressed by this Assembly - which we are far from certain of - it should only be in the form of encouraging nations to adopt renewable energy sources, and not in punishing nations who cannot.

[Rutianas]

Prove to me that every planet is suffering from global warming, then I'll debate on what needs to be done.

Paula Jenner, Rutianas Ambassador

With all due respect Paula. As a Mod has said previously. This debate is not about whether climate change is real or not.

Yours,
Renegade Turnist.

And of course, you've ignored the rest of my comments. There is no debate on whether climate change is real or not because I'm telling you that within the Imperial Republic, we have no issues of climate change. And I must agree with the Ambassador from Grays Harbor. If it is not part of the debate, it should not be included in the proposal, and it is worded in the proposal as a fact:

BELIEVES that legislation must be urgently enacted to bring an end to Climate Change.

You've stated as a fact that it is real. Debate it. Prove why it's real. Or disprove my other comments. One or the other.

Paula Jenner, Rutianas Ambassador

(OOC: I'm aware that the mods said it wasn't, but I'm pointing out where it could be debated as part of the proposal since you have brought it in as a fact in the proposal. I'm not sure Kat really understood that by not allowing us to debate whether Climate Change is real to the world of NS, that's severely hampered some of our abilities to argue and fight against this proposal. Now, if you want to follow Kat's ruling, then perhaps the comment about Climate Change needs to be removed from the proposal.)

[Maul-5]

Are you sure that the earth is warming at an increasing rate that is our fault? Are you sure it's not;

1. Natural fluctuations.

2. Improper measurements

3. Forged results divulged in email messages between eminent climatologic scientists

?

[Mad Sheep Railgun]

Are you sure that the earth is warming at an increasing rate that is our fault? Are you sure it's not;

1. Natural fluctuations.

2. Improper measurements

3. Forged results divulged in email messages between eminent climatologic scientists

?

Kat said we're not supposed to talk about that.

[Hamandchese]

My nation will suffer an extreme blackouts if our fossil fuel power plants are shut off. We currently hav 3 Nuclear fusion(thats different than fission) and are currently building 2 more. If we had no oil we would have to declare war and invade our neigbhors for fuel.
I believe the change should be gradual and not too quick.