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PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:33 pm
by Almajoya
Oppose oppose oppose oppose oppose oppose oppose.

My nation takes great pride in its capital punishment program. It's suggestions like this (and a certain ideological issue) that made us drop out of the WA anyway. We have the right to do what we want with our criminals, and so does every other nation in this multiverse.

We will be using our WA puppet to generate some opposition to this.

As if you needed any more.

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 12:02 am
by New Olwe
Quelesh wrote:
New Olwe wrote:Whereas my nation, ironically enough one that is viewed as good, realizes that a proper execution should take weeks and be broadcast publicly? He's not as evil as me, I tell you. :p


Honored Ambassador, do you mean to imply that your nation engages in the torture of prisoners in violation of WA resolutions #9, Prevention of Torture, and #62, For the Detained and Convicted?


No, I mean to specifically state that our intelligence service does those things, and that in response to the WA's attempts to violate our sovereignty we gave them sovereignty... Olwean Intelligence is now a separate nation, free from WA jurisdiction.

Isabelle Hayes, Olwean Ambassador to the WA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:34 am
by Quelesh
Flibbleites wrote:
Ambridge County wrote:
Provisional Ireland wrote:A government should be better than those they deem criminal. Just because they kill someone doesn't mean you have to kill them back. General population prison is usually a worse punishment, anyway. And to all the nations who are saying "you're just not doing it right, it deters when we [insert intentionally grizzly means of killing someone]", go ahead and keep up your fantasy. Anyway, human rights mandates don't violate national sovereignty. To any nations saying that the right to life is no human (or sentient, if that helps) right, then make your case when there's an argument over the resolution, and vote against it. Anyway, this post is for no desire to argue, just to try to help out the nation who is drafting this resolution.


I think you stated my beliefs on the issue wonderfully. I believe that human rights come over sovereignty. If a nation does not want to be subject to the resolutions of the WA, they are free to resign. Genocide is prohibited, slavery is prohibited; people complained when those resolutions were put up to a vote. But good always trumped evil.

That may be true, but genocide and slavery are issues that can be international in nature, whether or not a nation can execute its criminals is not an international issue.

Bob Flibble
WA Representative


It's as much of an international issue as child labor.

New Olwe wrote:
Quelesh wrote:
New Olwe wrote:Whereas my nation, ironically enough one that is viewed as good, realizes that a proper execution should take weeks and be broadcast publicly? He's not as evil as me, I tell you. :p


Honored Ambassador, do you mean to imply that your nation engages in the torture of prisoners in violation of WA resolutions #9, Prevention of Torture, and #62, For the Detained and Convicted?


No, I mean to specifically state that our intelligence service does those things, and that in response to the WA's attempts to violate our sovereignty we gave them sovereignty... Olwean Intelligence is now a separate nation, free from WA jurisdiction.

Isabelle Hayes, Olwean Ambassador to the WA


OOC: I don't think that would work. A prisoner would still have to be extradited from New Olwe to "Olwean Intelligence" to be tortured by them, which is still a violation of resolution #9 on New Olwe's part. And realistically speaking, any nation in the RL UN that attempted to make such an argument would be widely recognized as being flagrantly in violation of the resolution.

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 3:34 am
by Ilharessa
Quelesh wrote:It's as much of an international issue as child labor.


"We disagree. Whether or not one nation is executing criminals for crimes has no affect on the international community overall and does not require the acceptance of exploitation of people to trade with a nation that does so. Child labor is the opposite of this; in trading with a nation that uses children in dangerous factories, you are knowingly contributing to the suffering and exploitation of people," the ambassadoress said.

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:37 pm
by The Altani Federation
I've never seen anything that needs a swift imposition of the death penalty as much as this proposal does.

The Federation will vehemently oppose this should it ever come to vote. Just because a nation allows the death penalty for certain crimes, as we do, does not make that nation barbaric. The self-righteous "superiority" of those opposed to the death penalty frankly sickens us.

Arjel Khazaran, Deputy Ambassador

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:57 pm
by Philimbesi
"If your nation is executing innocent people then we strongly suggest you stop wasting the time of those who have set up systems to ensure that does not happen and fix your own judicial system."

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:03 pm
by Verzia
NOTING that capital punishment is an abuse of human rights,

RECOGNIZING that discrepancies exist within the capital punishment system to the point where innocent individuals are executed,

RECOGNIZING that capital punishment has not been proven to deter crime,

HEREBY abolishes the act of capital punishment.


The reason why capitol punishment doesn't deter crime is because we don't use it properly. I think anyone who is in organized crime shot be killed, as well as independent drug dealers, we should abolish life bin prison to be honest, we waste money supporting people that hurt the jail systems.

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 4:11 pm
by United Habsburg
From the Offices of the Judiciary of His Grace the Lord Chancellor of the Royal Domain,

It is indeed most unfortunate when an innocent is executed. However, this most regretable occurence does not warrant an abolition of the most appropriate execution of those persons who have commited treason and murder. If this bill wishes to prevent the execution of innocents than it should be a justice reformes act, a checks and balances bill targeting the inappropriate punishment of persons on trial for capital crimes.
It is certainly not the fault of the Emperors most righteous justice if someone is punished incorrectly, it is the administrators of this justice that are at fault. This judiciary desrcibe death as the punishment for Crimes of Treason against His Grace the Emperor and his subjects, both high and petty.
The Lord Chancellor, Charles De Montourt

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:17 pm
by Heartwell
NOTING that capital punishment is an abuse of human rights
Since when capital punishment is an abuse of human rights?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:20 pm
by Grays Harbor
Heartwell wrote:NOTING that capital punishment is an abuse of human rights
Since when capital punishment is an abuse of human rights?


since the proposer declared it to be, and we must all take their word for it like good little sheep. :p

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:59 pm
by Tsukasa-chan
While I find the use of capital punishment somewhat repulsive and the methods discussed in this forum even more so, this Resolution has a slightly lesser chance of being passed than I have of taking an interest in traditional organised sports*. Of course, if you changed the title to "Prevention of Fatal Mistakes in Courts" or something the voting sheeple would be all for it.

* Modern, healthy sports like zero-gravity naked 'wrestling' are more to my taste. ;)

Quelesh wrote:OOC: I don't think that would work. A prisoner would still have to be extradited from New Olwe to "Olwean Intelligence" to be tortured by them, which is still a violation of resolution #9 on New Olwe's part. And realistically speaking, any nation in the RL UN that attempted to make such an argument would be widely recognized as being flagrantly in violation of the resolution.


It would be good for New Olwe to note that their attempts to circumvent GA Resolution #9 are still in violation of Article 4 of said resolution, but I have great faith in their ability to work around that. There's a reason the Community of Mochi Ambassadors has a Creative Linguistics Department.

OOC @Quelesh: Ooh, tread lightly. Bringing up the RL UN tends to set people off, and for good reason: the Compliance Ministry and their army of gnome scribes is the only thing keeping nations from de jure violations of WA resolutions. Of course, feel free to denounce them as violating the spirit of the law.

IC: Oh, and I denounce New Olwe for following the letter and not the spirit of WA Resolutions. A truly despicable crime which I, for one, have never participated in.

Rin 4
International Ambassador

PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 8:53 pm
by Tipsonia
I DO NOT support the draft resolution, the Confederacy rules its peoples out of fear, and one way to construct fear is capital punishment

Also I dont support the World assembly interfering in domestic affairs

PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 8:54 pm
by The Emmerian Unions
Tipsonia wrote:I DO NOT support the draft resolution, the Confederacy rules its peoples out of fear, and one way to construct fear is capital punishment

Also I dont support the World assembly interfering in domestic affairs


Why did you need to dig this up?

PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 8:57 pm
by Tipsonia
The Emmerian Unions wrote:
Tipsonia wrote:I DO NOT support the draft resolution, the Confederacy rules its peoples out of fear, and one way to construct fear is capital punishment

Also I dont support the World assembly interfering in domestic affairs


Why did you need to dig this up?


Dig what up? Im only saying I wouldn't support the resolution because what the confederacy does to its criminals is the Confederacy's own business

PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:00 pm
by The Emmerian Unions
Tipsonia wrote:
The Emmerian Unions wrote:
Tipsonia wrote:I DO NOT support the draft resolution, the Confederacy rules its peoples out of fear, and one way to construct fear is capital punishment

Also I dont support the World assembly interfering in domestic affairs


Why did you need to dig this up?


Dig what up? Im only saying I wouldn't support the resolution because what the confederacy does to its criminals is the Confederacy's own business


The debate was over 9 days ago.