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Nation States College Football (NSCF) Discussion Thread

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Osarius
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Postby Osarius » Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:44 am

Looks like I need to make some alterations to the standings sheet... hmm

I'll try and make it flexible, so whether we have 40 or 42, the formulas still work.
Might be a delay on that, though. Gonna have to work backwards through my old formulas and whatnot
The Redvale wrote:So I think I have it figured out, but just for clarification, this would be the hosting method that i should use if I'm doing a conference?
1: Input the number one team's skill as the maximum
2: Write down RP bonuses and then add them to the skill section in the scorinator each MD.
3: Every three MDs, add up the last three bonuses and then cut them by half.

Anything I'm missing or anything else I need to know?


1. For MD1, yes. Then it increases every matchday.
It should always match what combined rank + RP the highest ranked team in would have if they'd been awarded max RP bonus every matchday to that point, including degradation

2. This is probably the best way, yes. Keeps everything clear if you need to check something.

3. Not quite. You add up ALL bonus to that point. Equally, when the bonus is degraded, you halve ALL bonus to that point.

The formula to calculate accumulated bonus is something like SUM((MD1*(0.5^n))+(MD2*(0.5^n))+ ... + (MDx*(0.5^n)))
Where MDx is the matchday RP bonus in question, and n is the number of degradation days that have passed after that matchday.

So, for example, on MD7, you would have:
=SUM((MD1*(0.5^2))+(MD2*(0.5^2))+(MD3*(0.5^2))+(MD4*(0.5^1))+(MD5*(0.5^1))+(MD6*(0.5^1))+(MD7*(0.5^0)))

Because:
  • MD1-3 have seen two degradation days since, on MD3 and MD6
  • MD4-6 have seen one, on MD6
  • MD7 hasn't been degraded yet
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Cosumar
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Postby Cosumar » Mon Mar 20, 2017 8:37 am

Osarius wrote:Looks like I need to make some alterations to the standings sheet... hmm

I'll try and make it flexible, so whether we have 40 or 42, the formulas still work.

Alternatively, since we seem to be stuck at 37, we could also go with 36 (barring any more sign-ups) if anyone has a puppet that they would be willing to drop out if they don't plan to RP it.
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Valorem
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Postby Valorem » Mon Mar 20, 2017 6:05 pm

Cosumar wrote:
Osarius wrote:Looks like I need to make some alterations to the standings sheet... hmm

I'll try and make it flexible, so whether we have 40 or 42, the formulas still work.

Alternatively, since we seem to be stuck at 37, we could also go with 36 (barring any more sign-ups) if anyone has a puppet that they would be willing to drop out if they don't plan to RP it.

Would it help if I joined? I might be able to remember to RP it each time.
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Valorem
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Postby Valorem » Mon Mar 20, 2017 6:14 pm

Also, I'll repeat my bowl proposal, but much earlier in the season this time.

Bowl Proposal: The Reiner Bowl
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Candidates: The two bowl-eligible teams with the highest strength-of-schedule that are not in the playoffs or a better bowl.
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Reiner's sports division is interested in hosting an NSCF bowl to advertise its football equipment to other countries in the NSCF. This bowl honors the teams that dealt with the most adversity in the league by selecting based on strength of schedule.
Last edited by Valorem on Mon Mar 20, 2017 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kalalau
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Postby Kalalau » Mon Mar 20, 2017 6:28 pm

Valorem wrote:Also, I'll repeat my bowl proposal, but much earlier in the season this time.

Bowl Proposal: The Reiner Bowl
Sponsored by: Reiner Material Sciences Laboratory
Candidates: The two teams with the highest strength-of-schedule that are not in the playoffs or a better bowl.
Stadium: Hobbs Stadium, capacity 89,500. Located in the Valorem-Meritus Urban District, Valorem's capital and center of tourism. The Urban District has the nation's best public transit system and is the most well-equipped city to handle gameday traffic. Hobbs Stadium is home to the Meritus Eagles, one of Valorem's professional football teams.
Reiner's sports division is interested in hosting an NSCF bowl to advertise its football equipment to other countries in the NSCF. This bowl honors the teams that dealt with the most adversity in the league by selecting based on strength of schedule.


I like this bowl proposal. Facing the highest strength of schedule, however, might actually pit teams at the bottom of their conferences based on how it plays out. Should there be a clause that the teams must be bowl eligible? That is already a clause somewhere in NSCF stuff, but there have been suggestions of teams with the worst record for one (loser) take all.

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Valorem
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Postby Valorem » Mon Mar 20, 2017 6:33 pm

I could edit it to just say "the two bowl eligible teams..." to remove that loophole.
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Osarius
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Postby Osarius » Tue Mar 21, 2017 2:18 am

This just highlighted to me that aside from the pioneer bowl rules, there are no bowl-related clauses in the procedural list -- i.e. there is no codified rule that says teams have to be above 0.450 OSPI to be eligible. Should probably draft something for that and get it added in.

Also, there is a SOS calculation in the standings sheet (need it for OSPI) so I can add that to the seeding list, if it would help.
I've been experimenting with other predictive/ranking metrics too, which I might add for the hell of it.

If we need another sign up to get things moving:

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Kalalau
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Postby Kalalau » Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:36 am

Can I just say thank you to Barunia? That entry should bump down the need for a Cosumarite puppet, and I don't want to face a third team in conference with Cosumar at the helm....said in all respect and completely selfishly for my own self preservation.

Too bad Banija CTEd. Did last time too, and returned about two weeks in. Anybody know how to get ahold of him/her in real life?

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Postby Drawkland » Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:46 am

Kalalau wrote:Can I just say thank you to Barunia? That entry should bump down the need for a Cosumarite puppet, and I don't want to face a third team in conference with Cosumar at the helm....said in all respect and completely selfishly for my own self preservation.

Too bad Banija CTEd. Did last time too, and returned about two weeks in. Anybody know how to get ahold of him/her in real life?

Hey! Don't count me out! Even though historical precedent makes counting me out entirely justified!

And I dunno, I know he was regionmates with Frenline Delpha but I have no clue if they have any RL connections.
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Postby Frenline Delpha » Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:56 am

Drawkland wrote:
Kalalau wrote:Can I just say thank you to Barunia? That entry should bump down the need for a Cosumarite puppet, and I don't want to face a third team in conference with Cosumar at the helm....said in all respect and completely selfishly for my own self preservation.

Too bad Banija CTEd. Did last time too, and returned about two weeks in. Anybody know how to get ahold of him/her in real life?

Hey! Don't count me out! Even though historical precedent makes counting me out entirely justified!

And I dunno, I know he was regionmates with Frenline Delpha but I have no clue if they have any RL connections.

Nope. There are a couple people in that region who live near me, but Banija isn't one of them.
I don't know how long I'll be back, but I just thought I'd stop in and say hi, at least.

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Kalalau
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Postby Kalalau » Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:38 pm

Drawkland wrote:
Kalalau wrote:Can I just say thank you to Barunia? That entry should bump down the need for a Cosumarite puppet, and I don't want to face a third team in conference with Cosumar at the helm....said in all respect and completely selfishly for my own self preservation.

Too bad Banija CTEd. Did last time too, and returned about two weeks in. Anybody know how to get ahold of him/her in real life?

Hey! Don't count me out! Even though historical precedent makes counting me out entirely justified!

And I dunno, I know he was regionmates with Frenline Delpha but I have no clue if they have any RL connections.


My apologies, this was not meant to offend. Not counting you out by any means, but also not sorry that Cosumar doesn't need another entry.

My thinking actually was that your entries would get stronger, and with another Cosumarite school in the mix i didn't think Harbor College would survive the Horizon.

Now is maybe an appropriate time to duscuss this...we've had two or three pretty strong conferences if late, and two or three not as strong. With more teams and probaly two more cinferences, my concern is that this disparity may become worse. Is it worth a discussion on realignment, either of conferences or playoff selection?

Sometimes that happens in real life too. But does the WAC ever make it into the playoffs?

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Postby Drawkland » Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:59 pm

Kalalau wrote:
Drawkland wrote:Hey! Don't count me out! Even though historical precedent makes counting me out entirely justified!

And I dunno, I know he was regionmates with Frenline Delpha but I have no clue if they have any RL connections.


My apologies, this was not meant to offend. Not counting you out by any means, but also not sorry that Cosumar doesn't need another entry.

My thinking actually was that your entries would get stronger, and with another Cosumarite school in the mix i didn't think Harbor College would survive the Horizon.

Now is maybe an appropriate time to duscuss this...we've had two or three pretty strong conferences if late, and two or three not as strong. With more teams and probaly two more cinferences, my concern is that this disparity may become worse. Is it worth a discussion on realignment, either of conferences or playoff selection?

Sometimes that happens in real life too. But does the WAC ever make it into the playoffs?

Don't worry, I'm not actually offended at all. Like I said, you have every reason to not worry about me. I'm much more focused on another college sport going on right now, so it looks like DCU will fall to the wayside again ... oh well. Like I said, one of these days I'll manage to find time to RP a season of NSCF. But this time will likely not be that time. :p
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Cosumar
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Postby Cosumar » Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:09 pm

Kalalau wrote:Now is maybe an appropriate time to duscuss this...we've had two or three pretty strong conferences if late, and two or three not as strong. With more teams and probaly two more cinferences, my concern is that this disparity may become worse. Is it worth a discussion on realignment, either of conferences or playoff selection?

Relevant lines from the NSCF Procedure:

Requests for a change of conference may be made prior to the finalization of the conferences for a season. To prevent abuse, the final decision on these requests will be at the discretion of the Commissioner.

Objections from other returning schools from the same conference should be taken into consideration by the Commissioner.

Change of conference requests will not be granted for schools from the same nation in consecutive seasons. Schools that request a change of conference and are granted that request will be assigned a new conference at random.



So, it seems you DO have the ability to publicly request a formal conference reassignment here. If no one voices a problem with it, I basically would consider Harbor College one of the unaligned new teams when setting up the NSCF 16 conferences.

For similarly selfish reasons, I wouldn't completely mind, though it would be a shame to lose out on some of the rivalry our schools have built up. And there's no guarantee you would get an easier conference. But, as you said, it might be worth it to try to balance things out - especially with two old conferences returning this season.
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Valorem
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Postby Valorem » Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:40 pm

How many teams from Konigsberg's conference are returning this year (can't actually remember what it was called)?
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Kalalau
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Postby Kalalau » Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:17 pm

Cosumar wrote:
Kalalau wrote:Now is maybe an appropriate time to duscuss this...we've had two or three pretty strong conferences if late, and two or three not as strong. With more teams and probaly two more cinferences, my concern is that this disparity may become worse. Is it worth a discussion on realignment, either of conferences or playoff selection?

Relevant lines from the NSCF Procedure:

Requests for a change of conference may be made prior to the finalization of the conferences for a season. To prevent abuse, the final decision on these requests will be at the discretion of the Commissioner.

Objections from other returning schools from the same conference should be taken into consideration by the Commissioner.

Change of conference requests will not be granted for schools from the same nation in consecutive seasons. Schools that request a change of conference and are granted that request will be assigned a new conference at random.



So, it seems you DO have the ability to publicly request a formal conference reassignment here. If no one voices a problem with it, I basically would consider Harbor College one of the unaligned new teams when setting up the NSCF 16 conferences.

For similarly selfish reasons, I wouldn't completely mind, though it would be a shame to lose out on some of the rivalry our schools have built up. And there's no guarantee you would get an easier conference. But, as you said, it might be worth it to try to balance things out - especially with two old conferences returning this season.


Yep, I know the provisions are there. I seriously thought about it before, but I figure sometimes you get a tough draw in real life, and I would certainly miss the in-conference rivalry. Actually, I didn't ask it for my benefit this time. I asked it for the benefit of all; it may be worth a discussion for everybody about whether the entire NSCF would benefit from realignments across the board, or on a large scale.

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Postby Osarius » Fri Mar 24, 2017 4:24 am

I'm generally opposed to conference realignment in principle, but I see the concerns.

I have mixed feelings on the matter, to be honest. I see why some people might feel a need to reshuffle things, but I also see why others would want to retain their rivalries and such. So the problem, in my mind, becomes "how to you reconcile the desires of those two conflicting camps?"

The best way to address the situation is probably to alter the playoff selection rules... I just don't see how to do it without messing up the current balance.

Valorem wrote:How many teams from Konigsberg's conference are returning this year (can't actually remember what it was called)?

Too many, lol. I added conferences to the spreadsheet (temporarily) and Mineral conference has more than six returning teams.
One of the teams returning who didn't participate last season would have to be shunted out, or Redvale's third team goes to a different conference. Can't remember the order of the rules for that off the top of my head. I think I wrote it so new teams always get priority though.

That said, I think there's also a rule about teams going back to their original conference if it was previously suspended and later gets reinstated. With 42 teams, we're back to having all conferences active again... which means Quebs' schools are possibly supposed to be split up now. St Croix weren't always a Woodlands team, but the others always have been, IIRC. Never considered this when I wrote the rules.

...now I'm thinking things are kinda messy so maybe we should just realign everyone anyway haha.
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Valorem
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Postby Valorem » Fri Mar 24, 2017 5:50 am

We could just rely on out of conference games to schedule the old rivalry games, if the restructure doesn't keep the rivals in the same conference. That'd be fine with me, I don't need to play Maris and Castle twice each.
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The united states of Saints
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Postby The united states of Saints » Fri Mar 24, 2017 6:23 am

While I'm fine with the conference I'm in I dont have any problem with realignment. I may lose the rivalries I have, but as Valorem pointed out I could schedule them as Out of Conference matches. Of course I won't always be able to do this because the other school has to agree to the match.

In the end I don't care if we realign I'll just beat everyone anyways :p
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Kalalau
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Postby Kalalau » Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:04 pm

Osarius wrote:
...now I'm thinking things are kinda messy so maybe we should just realign everyone anyway haha.

Yikes, that is messy. I have mixed feelings as well. While I've thought about it for my own team, I have always abstained from actually putting in the request. It would be difficult to endorse on a large scale.

I think it would be really problematic to have third teams moved to separate conferences, where they could then really mess with the playoff seeding. There is definitely the statement about teams should remain with their original conference if/when it comes back. This is problematic as noted when the conference has too many teams. I will second that rivalries are important, but in theory can be scheduled out of conference; if conferences were realigned, though, would there be enough out of conference games to support them?

I didn't mean to open a can of worms...

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Postby NSCF » Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:29 pm

NSCF 16 Everything Thread is up!

I think the conferences worked out fine. Going by the alignment priority order listed in the procedure, the only major change was Valanora's schools (which did not enter last season) being moved to the new Big Eight from their old home in Mineral Conference. Also had to move Qasden's replacement school there. That should help allay some of the concerns about weak expansion conferences as well.
EDIT: But please tell me if you notice any alignment errors! This commish isn't used to such large NSCF fields :p

However, if the community still thinks a complete random re-alignment is something we should consider, please say so - so we can vote on it and redo the conferences before NSCF 16 starts next week.
Last edited by NSCF on Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:34 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby The Redvale » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:15 am

Is it too late to ask for realignment for my own schools or is that only for before the conferences are drawn?
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Postby Frenline Delpha » Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:55 am

I can do the Zephyr Conference again if you want, Cos.
I don't know how long I'll be back, but I just thought I'd stop in and say hi, at least.

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Kalalau
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Postby Kalalau » Sat Mar 25, 2017 11:26 am

Kalalau would like to once again host the Lei Bowl, which typically pits, of non-playoff teams, the best "offense" (as determined by highest average points scored per game, even if RP dictates the team actually scores on defense or special teams) versus the best defense (as determined by lowest average points against per game). Bowls which are already set (Pioneer, Reiner) would take priority over the Lei Bowl if there is a conflict in scheduling.

The Lei Bowl would be played at the Plumeria Garden (Home of Harbor College) in Mosaic, Kalalau.

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Valorem
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Postby Valorem » Sat Mar 25, 2017 11:41 am

Anyone want Konigsberg for its out of conference games? I'd prefer to have at least one at home, but other than that I have no preferences.
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Arcane Level: 0
Influence Type: 7
Special Notes about your civilization: Focused on technology and scientific advancement. Regular use of robotics, fusion power, and directed energy weapons.
Above information compiled using this scale
Economic Left/Right: -3.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.87

Aerospace engineering junior at Mississippi State University, atheist in the Deep South.

User avatar
Drawkland
Senator
 
Posts: 4281
Founded: Aug 27, 2013
Democratic Socialists

Postby Drawkland » Sat Mar 25, 2017 2:53 pm

Valorem wrote:Anyone want Konigsberg for its out of conference games? I'd prefer to have at least one at home, but other than that I have no preferences.

We'll take you at your house any week.
United Dalaran wrote:Goddammit, comrade. I just knew that someday some wild, capitalist, imperialist interstellar empire will swallow our country.

CN on the RMB wrote:drawkland's leader has survived so many assassination attempts that I am fairly certain he is fidel castro in disguise
The INTERSTELLAR EMPIRE of DRAWKLAND
____________________
Founder of Sonnel. Legendary (twice) and Epic. Rule 33.

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