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Scorinators (OOC Discussion)

A battle ground for the sportsmen and women of nations worldwide. [In character]

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North Prarie
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Founded: Nov 04, 2017
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Postby North Prarie » Sun Feb 25, 2018 5:40 pm

NVm, got it. My only question is: How do you determine skill? Should a user submit it? Use the rankings? IDK.
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Free Republics
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Postby Free Republics » Sun Feb 25, 2018 6:11 pm

North Prarie wrote:NVm, got it. My only question is: How do you determine skill? Should a user submit it? Use the rankings? IDK.


If you're hosting the WBC, use the rankings and add RP bonus to them. If you're hosting a tournament with no ranks, start everybody at 0 and enter their RP bonus as their skill (in other words, don't use the "bonus" section of xkoranate unless you're hosting the Olympics) If you're doing a domestic league, set the skill however you want.

If you want to keep randomness under control, set the max skill to whatever the highest rank+bonus currently is.
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Razenthuria
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Postby Razenthuria » Sun Feb 25, 2018 6:30 pm

SO hello, is there a way to edit Xkoranate's Equestrian, eventting - cross country setting for Donkey racing?
I'm like a backwards nation and I have no familiarity with Equestrian irl, I simply want to race donkeys (which aren't as fast as horses) so I can further the meme that is a Nordic-styled African nation.
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Amuaplye
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Postby Amuaplye » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:18 pm

Amuaplye wrote:Every time I try to scorinate a triple jump (Men's and Women's) event on xkoranate, it crashes. Everything goes well, and the once I click the dice button to scorinate, it crashes.


Also, shot put doesn't work either.
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Osarius
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Postby Osarius » Tue Feb 27, 2018 7:59 am

Amuaplye wrote:
Amuaplye wrote:Every time I try to scorinate a triple jump (Men's and Women's) event on xkoranate, it crashes. Everything goes well, and the once I click the dice button to scorinate, it crashes.


Also, shot put doesn't work either.

If other events work fine, my first suggestion would be to download xkoranate again and see if the problem persists. It's possible a few of the event files have gotten corrupted somehow.
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Amuaplye
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Postby Amuaplye » Tue Feb 27, 2018 6:29 pm

Osarius wrote:
Amuaplye wrote:
Also, shot put doesn't work either.

If other events work fine, my first suggestion would be to download xkoranate again and see if the problem persists. It's possible a few of the event files have gotten corrupted somehow.

I've downloaded it onto 2 computers, and they both have the same issue.
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South Toronto
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Founded: Aug 20, 2017
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Postby South Toronto » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:41 am

HI, I've been thinking of making a football tournament but I have no idea how to set skill, and if you use current rankings how would you do that?
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Free Republics
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Postby Free Republics » Sat Mar 03, 2018 10:29 am

South Toronto wrote:HI, I've been thinking of making a football tournament but I have no idea how to set skill, and if you use current rankings how would you do that?


In xkoranate, just set the max skill to whatever the highest rank+bonus is and enter the total directly into skill. Leave the min skill at 0. You can ignore the "bonus" section of xkoranate completely unless you're hosting the Olympics or another multi-sport event.

If you're using SQIS (or any formula based upon SQIS), the max skill doesn't matter. If you're using NSFS, setting the max skill too high causes lots of randomness.
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North Prarie
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Postby North Prarie » Sat Mar 03, 2018 11:08 am

Free Republics wrote:
South Toronto wrote:HI, I've been thinking of making a football tournament but I have no idea how to set skill, and if you use current rankings how would you do that?


In xkoranate, just set the max skill to whatever the highest rank+bonus is and enter the total directly into skill. Leave the min skill at 0. You can ignore the "bonus" section of xkoranate completely unless you're hosting the Olympics or another multi-sport event.

If you're using SQIS (or any formula based upon SQIS), the max skill doesn't matter. If you're using NSFS, setting the max skill too high causes lots of randomness.

Wait, so if the highest rank is 1 (top ranking) plus bonus, would it be 1.75, or 43.75? (43 would be lowest rank besides UR)
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Prarie Classic Baseball Tournament
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Round of 16 at Handball World Cup 20
Women's Hockey Round of 16 at Prescott Winter Olympics 13
Prarie Classic Baseball Tournament Champions

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Darmen
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Postby Darmen » Sat Mar 03, 2018 11:43 am

North Prarie wrote:
Free Republics wrote:
In xkoranate, just set the max skill to whatever the highest rank+bonus is and enter the total directly into skill. Leave the min skill at 0. You can ignore the "bonus" section of xkoranate completely unless you're hosting the Olympics or another multi-sport event.

If you're using SQIS (or any formula based upon SQIS), the max skill doesn't matter. If you're using NSFS, setting the max skill too high causes lots of randomness.

Wait, so if the highest rank is 1 (top ranking) plus bonus, would it be 1.75, or 43.75? (43 would be lowest rank besides UR)

The rank you input into the scoriantor should be the ranking points, not the rank. For instance: Schottia has a rank of 62.74, not 1.
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Champions: CoH 51, CR 13, GCF Test 9, WBC 25, QWC 7 Runners-up: CoH 53, CR 10, GCF Test 11, T20C 2, T20C 4, RLWC 10, WBC 42
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North Prarie
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Postby North Prarie » Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:29 pm

When I copy pasted the table into the [pre] code, it looked weird. Why is this??
North Prarie. Prarie. Proud TSPer. DemSoc.
Hosting Experience
Prarie Classic Baseball Tournament
Copa South Pacifica 1
WPIC 5
Sporting Acheivments
Round of 16 at Handball World Cup 20
Women's Hockey Round of 16 at Prescott Winter Olympics 13
Prarie Classic Baseball Tournament Champions

Prariean Airlines-Pompeii Industries Luxury Cars-Phoenix Luxury Hotels (V2 Coming Soon)-Stonebridge Simbacat International Airport-Embassy Program
SBT BottomLine-President Valieant welcomes first child Pax, Social Democrats gain big wins in Parliament elections, Lions win NPBL, Cavaliers win Prarie Hockey Cup, NPFA announces slow move away from world affairs

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Drawkland
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Postby Drawkland » Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:29 pm

North Prarie wrote:When I copy pasted the table into the [pre] code, it looked weird. Why is this??

What exactly is the "weirdness" you are experiencing?
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North Prarie
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Postby North Prarie » Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:32 pm

Drawkland wrote:
North Prarie wrote:When I copy pasted the table into the [pre] code, it looked weird. Why is this??

What exactly is the "weirdness" you are experiencing?

the tags above the numbers such as W, L, RD, P, are really left, right above the names.
North Prarie. Prarie. Proud TSPer. DemSoc.
Hosting Experience
Prarie Classic Baseball Tournament
Copa South Pacifica 1
WPIC 5
Sporting Acheivments
Round of 16 at Handball World Cup 20
Women's Hockey Round of 16 at Prescott Winter Olympics 13
Prarie Classic Baseball Tournament Champions

Prariean Airlines-Pompeii Industries Luxury Cars-Phoenix Luxury Hotels (V2 Coming Soon)-Stonebridge Simbacat International Airport-Embassy Program
SBT BottomLine-President Valieant welcomes first child Pax, Social Democrats gain big wins in Parliament elections, Lions win NPBL, Cavaliers win Prarie Hockey Cup, NPFA announces slow move away from world affairs

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Drawkland
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Postby Drawkland » Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:36 pm

North Prarie wrote:
Drawkland wrote:What exactly is the "weirdness" you are experiencing?

the tags above the numbers such as W, L, RD, P, are really left, right above the names.

So [pre] tags always count specific amounts of spaces, as you may have noticed. But for the first line, it doesn't count spaces until it reaches the first character, hence why the title line slides over. You can fix this by putting a period or # sign for the first character instead of a space. Well, really, you can use anything, like underlining the whole line, but those make the most sense when seeing a table.
United Dalaran wrote:Goddammit, comrade. I just knew that someday some wild, capitalist, imperialist interstellar empire will swallow our country.

CN on the RMB wrote:drawkland's leader has survived so many assassination attempts that I am fairly certain he is fidel castro in disguise
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Commonwealth of Baker Park
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Postby Commonwealth of Baker Park » Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:46 pm

So, I know we had a discussion in the NSCF discussion thread about getting scoring increased a little bit. I just did a comparison with an 8 team, 10 game setup between the current NSFS_3 and the world bowl formula that was posted there. I used the SQIS as a control. I kept the skill of the teams between 2.5 and 3.3 on a min/max scale of 1-5. I gave all the teams a bonus roughly in an inverse proportion to their skill level and assigned style fairly even between 0 and +3.

SQIS with sudden death
Pld    W   L    PF   PA    Win % 
1 Endover 10 6 4 109 96 0.600
2 Baker Park 10 6 4 150 136 0.600
3 A&M 10 6 4 124 138 0.600
4 OSH 10 5 5 124 140 0.500
5 USL 10 5 5 171 155 0.500
6 UC 10 5 5 267 172 0.500
7 EZR 10 4 6 152 146 0.400
8 COOL 10 3 7 94 208 0.300


I kept the same setting across the board and then used the NSFS_3 with IFAF OT

NSFS-3 with IFAF OT
Pld    W   L    PF   PA    Win % 
1 Endover 10 7 3 215 158 0.700
2 OSH 10 6 4 198 161 0.600
3 EZR 10 6 4 218 141 0.600
4 UC 10 6 4 189 180 0.600
5 USL 10 5 5 187 166 0.500
6 A&M 10 5 5 161 204 0.500
7 Baker Park 10 4 6 161 196 0.400
8 COOL 10 1 9 113 236 0.100


finally I adjusted the the styles a bit to narrow the gap to +1 and +2.4 and cut the bonus for each about 40-60%. I left the skill level the same, but changed the min/max range to 2-4.

Let's just compare the week 1 from the control test and the World Bowl formula test, shall we? :)

week 1--SQIS
A&M 20–10 USL
Baker Park 24–30 UC
COOL 24–9 OSH
EZR 7–10 Endover

week 1--NSFS
A&M 20–27 USL
Baker Park 3–30 UC
COOL 10–20 OSH
EZR 24–13 Endover

week 1--World bowl
Endover 60–34 EZR
Baker Park 89–16 USL
UC 43–40 OSH
COOL 43–35 A&M


not much a difference at all, you see.... :o

here's the final table for another comparison to the other tables

WB with sudden death
Pld    W   L    PF   PA 
1 USL 10 7 3 417 365
2 Endover 10 7 3 313 234
3 A&M 10 6 4 342 317
4 OSH 10 5 5 352 253
5 UC 10 5 5 282 373
6 Baker Park 10 4 6 318 312
7 EZR 10 4 6 309 324
8 COOL 10 2 8 242 397


Yes COOL was meant to be the worst team although I doubled their skill and cut their bonus less than the rest of them for the third go-round. But you'll note how bunched together everyone is, and some of the scores made no sense at all--take a look and compare these 2 scores from week 2 of the WB with the results from the week prior above:

USL 66–29 UC
Endover 56–19 Baker Park




I don't know if this will impress anyone, I did it for my own benefit to see how to to set up parameter for my domestic stuff. But comments and questions are welcome.

EDIT--thanks NK, good looking out...I knew it looked sloppy
Last edited by Commonwealth of Baker Park on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Northwest Kalactin
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Postby Northwest Kalactin » Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:51 pm

Commonwealth of Baker Park wrote:So, I know we had a discussion in the NSCF discussion thread about getting scoring increased a little bit. I just did a comparison with an 8 team, 10 game setup between the current NSFS_3 and the world bowl formula that was posted there. I used the SQIS as a control. I kept the skill of the teams between 2.5 and 3.3 on a min/max scale of 1-5. I gave all the teams a bonus roughly in an inverse proportion to their skill level and assigned style fairly even between 0 and +3.

SQIS with sudden death
Pld W L PF PA Win %
1 Endover 10 6 4 109 96 0.600
2 Baker Park 10 6 4 150 136 0.600
3 A&M 10 6 4 124 138 0.600
4 OSH 10 5 5 124 140 0.500
5 USL 10 5 5 171 155 0.500
6 UC 10 5 5 267 172 0.500
7 EZR 10 4 6 152 146 0.400
8 COOL 10 3 7 94 208 0.300


I kept the same setting across the board and then used the NSFS_3 with IFAF OT

NSFS-3 with IFAF OT
Pld W L PF PA Win %
1 Endover 10 7 3 215 158 0.700
2 OSH 10 6 4 198 161 0.600
3 EZR 10 6 4 218 141 0.600
4 UC 10 6 4 189 180 0.600
5 USL 10 5 5 187 166 0.500
6 A&M 10 5 5 161 204 0.500
7 Baker Park 10 4 6 161 196 0.400
8 COOL 10 1 9 113 236 0.100


finally I adjusted the the styles a bit to narrow the gap to +1 and +2.4 and cut the bonus for each about 40-60%. I left the skill level the same, but changed the min/max range to 2-4.

Let's just compare the week 1 from the control test and the World Bowl formula test, shall we? :)

week 1--SQIS
A&M 20–10 USL
Baker Park 24–30 UC
COOL 24–9 OSH
EZR 7–10 Endover

week 1--NSFS
A&M 20–27 USL
Baker Park 3–30 UC
COOL 10–20 OSH
EZR 24–13 Endover

week 1--World bowl
Endover 60–34 EZR
Baker Park 89–16 USL
UC 43–40 OSH
COOL 43–35 A&M


not much a difference at all, you see.... :o

here's the final table for another comparison to the other tables

WB with sudden death
Pld W L PF PA
1 USL 10 7 3 417 365
2 Endover 10 7 3 313 234
3 A&M 10 6 4 342 317
4 OSH 10 5 5 352 253
5 UC 10 5 5 282 373
6 Baker Park 10 4 6 318 312
7 EZR 10 4 6 309 324
8 COOL 10 2 8 242 397


Yes COOL was meant to be the worst team although I doubled their skill and cut their bonus less than the rest of them for the third go-round. But you'll note how bunched together everyone is, and some of the scores made no sense at all--take a look and compare these 2 scores from week 2 of the WB with the results from the week prior above:

USL 66–29 UC
Endover 56–19 Baker Park




I don't know if this will impress anyone, I did it for my own benefit to see how to to set up parameter for my domestic stuff. But comments and questions are welcome.

Put the tables in [pre] boxes
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Schiltzberg
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Postby Schiltzberg » Sat Mar 31, 2018 11:52 am

Hello, I tried downloading some of these scorinators, but it just downloaded them as zip files, and I do not know how to actually use them from there. Also worth noting, I am using a Chromebook, which might not be capable of doing scorinators.
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Darmen
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Postby Darmen » Sat Mar 31, 2018 12:00 pm

Schiltzberg wrote:Hello, I tried downloading some of these scorinators, but it just downloaded them as zip files, and I do not know how to actually use them from there. Also worth noting, I am using a Chromebook, which might not be capable of doing scorinators.

You'll need to extract the files first.
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President: Alexander Woodrow (REP) | Capital: Scott City | Population: 9.2 mil | Demonym: Darmeni | Trigramme: DAR
Factbook (WIP) | Encylopedia | Domestic Sports Newswire
Champions: CoH 51, CR 13, GCF Test 9, WBC 25, QWC 7 Runners-up: CoH 53, CR 10, GCF Test 11, T20C 2, T20C 4, RLWC 10, WBC 42
Third: CR 20, T20C 10, RLWC 20, R7WC 4, WBC 21, BC 6 Host: CR 9, RUWC 18, RUWC 26, RLWC 12, RLWC 18, BC 6, BC 10, WVE 4

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95X
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Postby 95X » Sat Mar 31, 2018 1:37 pm

Schiltzberg wrote:Hello, I tried downloading some of these scorinators, but it just downloaded them as zip files, and I do not know how to actually use them from there. Also worth noting, I am using a Chromebook, which might not be capable of doing scorinators.
According to Wikipedia, Chromebooks run Chrome OS and I'm unaware of any downloadable scorinator that works with it. (Under other Linux distributions, the source code and the compatible compilers can be downloaded so the program is built from that.) You might be able to use something that's hosted online and/or an online spreadsheet.
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Schiltzberg
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Postby Schiltzberg » Sat Mar 31, 2018 4:43 pm

This may be a dumb question, but it just downloaded as a text file, so how do I open it as an application?
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Free Republics
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Postby Free Republics » Sat Mar 31, 2018 6:22 pm

Schiltzberg wrote:This may be a dumb question, but it just downloaded as a text file, so how do I open it as an application?


If you're asking about the XML files, you have to install them into xkoranate's sports folder (and you'd have to have xkoranate downloaded to do that). If you've downloaded the source code for a scorinator, you'll have to compile it. Xkoranate's source requires Qt and a C++ compiler to be installed before you can compile it (and, with current versions of Qt, you'll have to update some portions of the source code to replace obsolete function calls with newer equivalents).

If you're trying to run Java-based scorinators (such as NSFS or Baseinator), this might work.

95X wrote:
Schiltzberg wrote:Hello, I tried downloading some of these scorinators, but it just downloaded them as zip files, and I do not know how to actually use them from there. Also worth noting, I am using a Chromebook, which might not be capable of doing scorinators.
According to Wikipedia, Chromebooks run Chrome OS and I'm unaware of any downloadable scorinator that works with it. (Under other Linux distributions, the source code and the compatible compilers can be downloaded so the program is built from that.) You might be able to use something that's hosted online and/or an online spreadsheet.


I did a bit of reading about Chrome OS and it looks like it'd be only slightly less difficult to install xkoranate on than it is to install xkoranate on Android. Since Chromebooks have ARM processors, you'd have to actually compile it on one because you can't use a binary compiled for an x86 processor on an ARM processor.

There's also the option of using a public computer to run scorinators. If you're able to access the Internet and use a USB drive on a library or university computer, you should be able to run xkoranate or any other scorinator on such a computer (I don't recommend doing this or anything personal on a K-12 school computer or a workplace computer).




Just as an aside, given how often questions about running scorinators on devices other than PCs come up, I'd actually be interested, I think, in creating a general web-based scorinator with a database, user accounts and all the features you'd need to host tournaments (plus ideally the ability to create the equivalent of xkoranate's XML files) but I wouldn't want to spend money to host it.
Why I left NS Sports
World Cup 85 Champions
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95X
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Postby 95X » Mon Apr 02, 2018 9:08 am

Free Republics wrote:Just as an aside, given how often questions about running scorinators on devices other than PCs come up, I'd actually be interested, I think, in creating a general web-based scorinator with a database, user accounts and all the features you'd need to host tournaments (plus ideally the ability to create the equivalent of xkoranate's XML files) but I wouldn't want to spend money to host it.
It's probably also worth mentioning that the scorinators we have today are the result of those skilled in computer programming being members of the NS Sports community and programming them.

Thanks to a recent domestic league post by New Lusitania and the Algarves, I'm now aware of a site called leaguesimulator.eu; after mentioning it on IRC it was said that it's been known to some for a while but considered limited as far as the programs we're used to go. (I haven't personally tried it, but thought it might be helpful to mention it here.)
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Postby Schiltzberg » Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:39 am

Thank you for your help! Sorry for late response. I'll try and see if I can get it to work.
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Tobiasia
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Postby Tobiasia » Fri Apr 06, 2018 5:46 am

How do you use scorinators?
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Darmen
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Postby Darmen » Fri Apr 06, 2018 8:08 am

Tobiasia wrote:How do you use scorinators?

That depends on which one you are using. For xkoranate, see this. It's for the 0.3.2 version, but it shouldn't be any different with 0.3.3, the current version.
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