The World Cup Discussion Thread (OOC, Version IV)

[Drawkland]

Our hosts made no commitment to capping the length of qualifying in their bid and that really concerns me. I sincerely hope that the hosts will resist the urge to foist yet another 20+ matchday trudge on us.

This was addressed elsewhere and Saltstead already knows about their mistake, but I'd like to remind everyone that this (emphasis mine) is factually incorrect: we committed ourselves to avoiding group sizes larger than 10 per group. This is why we proposed 18 group formats in our bid if signups exceeded the 15x10 mark of 152 signups (which has indeed been exceeded).

In that vein, we're currently approaching 170 signups, so me and Newman have decided to try and shoot for 182 signups so we can hit that sweet 18x10 mark. Check our bid thread for more info on that, of course. No need to flood in with number puppets yet of course - we'll see what the numbers are looking at when the BoF is close to concluding.

[Sarzonia]

I have to agree with Kelssek about the public RP bonus issue. The recent AOCAF where that was made public was really offputting because it laid bare what the hosts thought of individual RPs.

I also like the idea of having a penalty for players who don't post a roster. I welcome detailed rosters, but even a barebones roster with names gives people something to work into their RPs.

A point about the double matchdays: we ALREADY used them for a couple of days in WC 85 and I write from experiencing them that I hated them.

Krytenia, with respect, you don't know everything that led me to decide that I would re-consider my participation in the World Cup. I suggest you keep that in mind before you post something like that again.

[Valladares]

The everything thread for the Baptism of Fire is now open for business!

[Liberal Democratic Socialist States]

what if we removed kpb rankings and increase people's chances of winning based on rp?

[Sylestone]

what if we removed kpb rankings and increase people's chances of winning based on rp?

are you talking about the BoF or WC?

[The Royal Kingdom of Quebec]

what if we removed kpb rankings and increase people's chances of winning based on rp?

No.

[Saltstead]

This was addressed elsewhere and [KitKat] already knows about their mistake, …

I indeed misinterpreted the format section and have been (happily!) corrected on the matter.

I maintain that this was not spelled out as clearly as it was in the Krytenia-Delaclava and Krytenia-Legalese bids, but I should have asked Newmanistan and Drawk for clarification during the bidding process and not doing so was a grave mistake on my part. I misinterpreted “We will be looking to work with a structure of 15 groups, because is the ideal way to do it” as “If the number of nations in qualifying is divisible by 15, there will be 15 groups” and that was an unfair assumption to make. If the duo explicitly spelled out their cap somewhere, I missed it and I will preemptively own up to that mistake.

All things considered, I think I owe the hosts a formal apology.

---

A point about the double matchdays: we ALREADY used them for a couple of days in WC 85 and I write from experiencing them that I hated them.

There are a number of factors from the last World Cup that could have easily confounded people’s experience with double matchdays. I know this firsthand: I’ve come in openly sceptical, but have been willing to consider that my experience with double matchdays may have been tainted by the World Cup 85 experience at-large, which (spoiler!) I was no fan of. I’m willing to set aside WC85 and give it another go without WC85’s baggage.

Krytenia, with respect, you don't know everything that led me to decide that I would re-consider my participation in the World Cup. I suggest you keep that in mind before you post something like that again.

Take it from someone who recently lost her seat on the WCC and was consequently unable to vote on the host bidding or the amendment (not that it would have change either result, mind): it’s not worth it. It’s not worth the hit to your rank. If you decide not to be an active participant, so be it; I cannot force you to write things. But withdrawing altogether is a silly decision that only makes you look petulant.

[Recuecn]

First, I wanted to echo what Kelssek said about not being a super big fan of public rp bonus. I don't really mind if hosts want to do it, but it does seem to me like a recipe for drama. Because of that, it's not something I'd be comfortable doing as host, and because of that I wouldn't want it to become one of the things that you have to promise to have a chance at winning a host bid. And in general, not just specifically to public rp bonuses, I think that it's good to minimize format boxes, etc., that need to be ticked for a successful bid. I have opinions on all the different little aspects, but mainly I'm happy to try anything once, so I think it's great that there were so many different options that were put forward this time around, and I hope that continues and that voters remain open to new ideas.

what if we removed kpb rankings and increase people's chances of winning based on rp?

The nations at the top of the KPB ranks have put in a lot of consistent time and effort to get there, so it would be sort of inconsiderate to them to entirely get rid of the KPBs. Plus, having nations of different ranks adds to the realism of the event; in real life, there's not an equal chance for every single country to win the world cup. On NS, things like the way scorinators work and, as you mentioned, rp bonus, make sure that nations who don't have a great rank can still get a lot luckier than they could in real life (as I have, among others). The good news is that if you participate consistently, in just a few cycles, you can easily make your way up the ranks.

Also, there's other tournaments that don't use rank, if you want to try your hand at one where no one has any leg up. The sporting world cup and the Di Bradini cup (two youth tournaments), as well as the wonder cup, don't use rank, only rp bonus and chance. Other tournaments like the IAC may still partially use the KPB ranks or something similar, but have a larger emphasis on rp bonus. So keep an eye out for those tournaments too.

Trying to sort out the balance between the three R's of ns sport—rank, randomness, and rp bonus—is a complicated and ancient science. There's definitely lots of room for debate about what the exact formula for should be, and that still gets talked about a lot obviously, but after years of rping, consensus seems to be that the KPB's are a good idea on the whole.

[Farfadillis]

Might as well put my two cents in (it's mostly opinions; very few arguments):

For the record, I abstained from voting, as I generally do. I was a fan of all 4 bids, though I would've voted for Kry/Legal if the scorinator hadn't been SQIS.

Anyway:

Double scorination every 48 hours
- Makes me more excited to RP for the WCQs, which tbh has been hard for me for years now
- It's more "realistic" as Audio pointed out
- Seriously, what is stopping anyone from RPing as they used to? Just RP the first match on the first day and the second match on the second day if you're so inclined.

Public RP bonus
- I think it's a pretty cool idea and anyone who hosts a tournament with public RP bonus must be very charming, smart, handsome, funny and lovely.
- This might sound naïve, but I (generally) assume good faith from the rest of the community. In that sense, I'd expect public RP bonus to be less a reason for drama and more a tool for us to improve our writing.
- I'm not sure it has quite the potential to become one of those must-include-in-the-bid things, seeing as it seems to kind of have split the community in terms of voting (the KRY/LGL bid got zero second-preference votes, for one).

BAR
- Super, super neat in my opinion. Might need some tweaks, but the idea's great.

Uneven groups
- Very ambivalent towards this.

Roster penalty
- This would've helped me post a few rosters a bit earlier in past cycles, so sure, good idea.

Vilitan plan bids
- I have a feeling this will/should get more common if activity stays at these levels. Hosting this last World Cup, even as part of a Vilitan plan bid, was very, very taxing. This would've made the Tae/EFL bid my second choice if I'd voted.

[Graintfjall]

I did not have a vote but I did follow the process with interest. Despite all of the new ideas, it was the old issue of even groups vs. uneven groups that would have swayed me to vote N/D had I been able. *shrug* That seems entirely more important than bonus point scales or scorination formulas.

edit: It's been pointed out to me the Taeshan et al. bid also committed to equal group sizes, sorry.

[Krytenia]

Krytenia, with respect, you don't know everything that led me to decide that I would re-consider my participation in the World Cup. I suggest you keep that in mind before you post something like that again.

I get that; but considering the entire body of your post was

That's one of the things I had issues with in this bid. Not a fan.

I'm re-considering whether I'm going to participate.

with no qualifying statements or even reasoning aside from "I don't like double-scorination matchdays", you can surely see how people would interpret it.

If you have other reasons, then that's your decision and I can respect that.

If you pull out because of double-scorination matchdays, that is also your decision and I can respect that.

But when you make a potentially salacious (and certainly publicly unqualified) statement, expect it to be countered firmly.

[Zwangzug]

First, I wanted to echo what Kelssek said about not being a super big fan of public rp bonus. I don't really mind if hosts want to do it, but it does seem to me like a recipe for drama. Because of that, it's not something I'd be comfortable doing as host, and because of that I wouldn't want it to become one of the things that you have to promise to have a chance at winning a host bid.

I agree with this, fwiw, that it shouldn't be a common expectation, since hosting is stressful enough already. But at this point, as a relatively uncommon bid feature, I'm okay with it from other hosts--I assume Krytenia and Legalese wouldn't have put it forward if they didn't think their skins were thick enough.

[Newmanistan]

World Cup 86 Announcement

We are getting closer to our magic number of signups. Only four more signups will be accepted before hitting that 182 figure. We could still get a couple more CTE's. This post contains the current list. We're feeling the excitement and intensity picking up now for the World Cup as we enjoy watching the Baptism of Fire nations go at it!

[Valanora]

Went ahead and changed the signups to waitlist only with NewDrawk hitting their magic number.

[Megistos]

what if we removed kpb rankings and increase people's chances of winning based on rp?

I disagree with this option; for one, we'd be seeing matchups like let's say a amazing team like Banjia vs. a newbie team like me (let's say we played each other before). In the game before (with KPB), Banjia would smash my ass up into 1 million pieces (most likely) but now in a game without KPB (let's say no RP bonus or equal) then it'd would equal, which is totally unrealistic. It's like the Bayern vs. Barcelona 8-2, but in the second leg (if there were one. now there isn't because of timing) Barca draw Bayern 0-0 (no offense to the Barca fans, I'm one too. But the team is stinking.) Also, everyone would be almost equal, so newbie's squad ratings would match experienced squad ratings. But this is only talking for the WC. If you are talking about BoF, you got your wish.

[Twicetagram and JYPe]

Quick question: Anyone wanna collab with me for the WC86 RP? I have an idea for a storyline that will intertwine with my WGPC. However, the exact story plot hasn't been decided, so I'm looking to see if anyone could collab with me.
If you're interested you can telegram me or DM me in Discord(I'm twice 2x). Let's suffer through my writers block.

[Twicetagram and JYPe]

Quick question: Anyone wanna collab with me for the WC86 RP? I have an idea for a storyline that will intertwine with my WGPC. However, the exact story plot hasn't been decided, so I'm looking to see if anyone could collab with me.
If you're interested you can telegram me or DM me in Discord(I'm twice 2x). Let's suffer through my writers block.

and with that all my slots are taken

[Twicetagram and JYPe]

So...
We have our BoF 73 winner! Congrats to Graintfjall! Commiserations to Tioguldos, but you made it this far so well done!
Congrats Squidroidia for the well-deserved 3rd place, though the Gothanica Isles were also close!
I hope to meet you guys in the WC86 qualys and maybe get thrashed

[Drawkland]

WORLD CUP 86 HOST ANNOUNCEMENT

Newmanistan and Drawkland are excited to announce that the Qualifying Group Draw for World Cup 86 will be held on Friday, August 28th, at about 9pm EST (1am UTC). The live event will be conducted on the NS Sports Discord, but the results should be posted on the forums immediately after it concludes. We have not yet set a date for MD1, but it won't be too long or too quickly after the draw.

More information will be coming soon!

[The Orion Islands]

Tag.

[Northwest Kalactin]

Tag.

Do not tag threads, they are considered spam per the OSRS. There is a nice bookmark feature you can use instead.

[Grand Quebecois]

WORLD CUP 86 HOST ANNOUNCEMENT

Newmanistan and Drawkland are excited to announce that the Qualifying Group Draw for World Cup 86 will be held on Friday, August 28th, at about 9pm EST (1am UTC). The live event will be conducted on the NS Sports Discord, but the results should be posted on the forums immediately after it concludes. We have not yet set a date for MD1, but it won't be too long or too quickly after the draw.

More information will be coming soon!

Oh hey, that's tonight!
OH SHOOT I HAVE TO BE UP AT 6:45 IN THE MORNING TOMORROW! SLEEP DEPRIVATION IT IS!
(i'm not ranting negatively, i'm just happy that i made it this far. i'll jump out of my bedroom window if i even make it past qualifiers)

[Kandorith]

WORLD CUP 86 HOST ANNOUNCEMENT

Newmanistan and Drawkland are excited to announce that the Qualifying Group Draw for World Cup 86 will be held on Friday, August 28th, at about 9pm EST (1am UTC). The live event will be conducted on the NS Sports Discord, but the results should be posted on the forums immediately after it concludes. We have not yet set a date for MD1, but it won't be too long or too quickly after the draw.

More information will be coming soon!

Oh hey, that's tonight!
OH SHOOT I HAVE TO BE UP AT 6:45 IN THE MORNING TOMORROW! SLEEP DEPRIVATION IT IS!
(i'm not ranting negatively, i'm just happy that i made it this far. i'll jump out of my bedroom window if i even make it past qualifiers)

Wooooo!

[Newmanistan]

The live group draw has been completed on discord, and can be viewed in the RP thread now, as well as the schedule.

[Commonwealth of Baker Park]

The live group draw has been completed on discord, and can be viewed in the RP thread now, as well as the schedule.

I didn't get a chance to point out during the draw, but for the edification of the Right Honorable Member for Newmanistan, while Recu was indeed worthy of your praise as not knowing how to not qualify, there's another nation that is 6 for 6 at this point. (5 for 5 technically) You can ask the co-host if he knows the answer.


Well done to both of you for another entertaining evening.